DUST Search - No Place for the Medium Frames [1.8 QQ]

Rusty Shallows wrote:

Scheneighnay McBob wrote:

Foundation Seldon wrote:

The Robot Devil wrote:

Charlotte O'Dell wrote:

Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea.

They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization.

Ding ding ding!

In no way does the addition of specializations and (slight) nerfing of other equipment somehow make the other equipment not worth using on anything other than the specialized frame. Cmon guys, quit the hyperbole.

People on the forums always exaggerate everything and cause widespread panic about something they wouldn't even notice otherwise in game.

It's always this bad.

Looks more like they are trying to sweep something under the rug.

Doing the neck-beard thing I can see why the Equipment nerfing was done but this Faction Logi locking was the wrong approach. It should have been small universal bonuses with another small or moderate bump in a specialization.

This isn't going to hurt my Winmatar Medic so much as it will everyone else who doesn't have the Frame skill at five or uses another race. Hopefully the Devs will eventually see this. A good first draft but the produce is going to need some serious polishing.

" ..- -.- --. I wish I remembered morse code so I wasn't typing random letters" - Malleus Malificorum

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Charlotte O'Dell Sooper Speshul Ponee Fors 2150	Posted - 2014.03.15 16:54:00 - [1] - Quote CQC is will be dominated by heavies. Open battlefields will be dominated by tanks. Anywhere else will be the hunting grounds for imvisible scouts. Where does the medium frame fit in, here? Logis can only run one type of equipment, really. Assaults are confined to one type of weapon and their bonus is laughable compared to the commandos. It's funny how 1.8 is going to be the exact opposite of most of Uprising. The niche roles will get their revenge, but I still want a good balance. Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. Assaults should be better than they are. Honestly, they should have a damage bonus, too that is 1% less/level than the commandos. I feel their hp regen and speed make up for this. Charlotte O'Dell is the highest level unicorn!
The Robot Devil Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1955	Posted - 2014.03.15 17:24:00 - [2] - Quote Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. "One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production." Raoul Duke
Croned Gallente Federation 634	Posted - 2014.03.15 17:31:00 - [3] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. Can you provide a link to where they said that all equipment stats do not go down on a logi? Last time I checked, the logi class only gets an equipment CPU/PG bonus, and depending on the race they only get a bonus on one type of equipment that makes it equivalent to 1.7 stats Son of a plasma cannon! TTK of the Weapons
Foundation Seldon Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 556	Posted - 2014.03.15 17:36:00 - [4] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. Ding ding ding! In no way does the addition of specializations and (slight) nerfing of other equipment somehow make the other equipment not worth using on anything other than the specialized frame. Cmon guys, quit the hyperbole. Saga v. Methana Balance
The Robot Devil Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1956	Posted - 2014.03.15 17:39:00 - [5] - Quote Croned wrote: The Robot Devil wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. Can you provide a link to where they said that all equipment stats do not go down on a logi? Last time I checked, the logi class only gets an equipment CPU/PG bonus, and depending on the race they only get a bonus on one type of equipment that makes it equivalent to 1.7 stats When compared to how the other suits perform with the equipment and all being on the same level in 1.8. In 1.8 the baseline stats for all equipment (not including the cloak) are the same until put on that races suit and then it receives a bonus. Being in a logi suit in 1.8 will enhance one equipment type per race, the other equipment stats do not change up or down. Punishment would be that if I put an uplink on my Min logi it would do less than the stats and it doesn't do that, it stays the same. They are trying to balance the role of logi and how equipment performs. "One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production." Raoul Duke
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 7543	Posted - 2014.03.15 17:44:00 - [6] - Quote Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis can only run one type of equipment, really. Assaults are confined to one type of weapon and their bonus is laughable compared to the commandos. Fallacy You don't have to take advantage of the racial bonuses to make the specializations worth it. All logis are still getting 25% reduction to equipment fitting costs and its not like repair tools don't work if you're not Minmatar or something. SImilarly Assaults still get that 25% reduction to weapon fitting costs, if you want to say armor tank with a rail rifle there's nothing stopping you from putting one on a Gallente or Amarr assault suit. The only bonus you really need to take advantage of is the class bonus, the racial bonuses are if you want to be extremely specialized but its not like those are the only viable fits. "You're not even Aero, you're just Aero's friend."
Charlotte O'Dell Sooper Speshul Ponee Fors 2152	Posted - 2014.03.15 17:46:00 - [7] - Quote i just got logi raped......well...LOGIS SUCK! STOP REVIVING AND REPPING PEOPLE, YOU TROLL! Lemme get my 2 mil! Death to logis! Charlotte O'Dell is the highest level unicorn!
Proto Annihilator Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 144	Posted - 2014.03.15 17:54:00 - [8] - Quote Foundation Seldon wrote: The Robot Devil wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. Ding ding ding! In no way does the addition of specializations and (slight) nerfing of other equipment somehow make the other equipment not worth using on anything other than the specialized frame. Cmon guys, quit the hyperbole. have you seen the equipment nerfs?
Sgt Buttscratch Condotta Rouvenor 2007	Posted - 2014.03.15 17:55:00 - [9] - Quote I was looking at the gaI assault stats.. just disappointing. I don't want to be forced to run AR due to my suit. People cry when you say heavies shouldn'tweild light weapons due to their dilusional thought of what diversity is, 1.8 is narrowing choices down, trying to force players into roles, rather than rewarding players for playing a role. I stick my weiner in two buns and and then give it the gas Sour cream from my spleen into Levi jeans
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 4635	Posted - 2014.03.15 17:59:00 - [10] - Quote The only two medium frames that will be horrible will be the Minmatar Assault and Caldari Assault. Just terrible. The Caldari because of the crappy bonus, (reload bonus? No!) and the Minmatar Assault will be terrible because it is actually being nerfed in 1.8. Taco Cat backwards is still Taco Cat

Foundation Seldon Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 556	Posted - 2014.03.15 18:02:00 - [11] - Quote Proto Annihilator wrote: Foundation Seldon wrote: The Robot Devil wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. Ding ding ding! In no way does the addition of specializations and (slight) nerfing of other equipment somehow make the other equipment not worth using on anything other than the specialized frame. Cmon guys, quit the hyperbole. have you seen the equipment nerfs? Uplinks will still be good, Nanite Injectors will still be good, Repair Tools will still be good. The only piece of equipment that was heavily nerfed was the Scanner. Saga v. Methana Balance
Proto Annihilator Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 145	Posted - 2014.03.15 18:07:00 - [12] - Quote Foundation Seldon wrote: Proto Annihilator wrote: Foundation Seldon wrote: The Robot Devil wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. Ding ding ding! In no way does the addition of specializations and (slight) nerfing of other equipment somehow make the other equipment not worth using on anything other than the specialized frame. Cmon guys, quit the hyperbole. have you seen the equipment nerfs? Uplinks will still be good, Nanite Injectors will still be good, Repair Tools will still be good. The only piece of equipment that was heavily nerfed was the Scanner. on a specialized suit they will perform as good as they do now. Every other suit will take a hit. I don't care much but at least know the facts when you come to argue.
Warbot Titan X Badge of Blood 13	Posted - 2014.03.15 18:09:00 - [13] - Quote I don't think it'll be much of a problem. From what I understand is that each race has it's own bonus on their piece of equipment. I do feel ya man. We are so use to not having any racial equipment bonuses, but we will prevail and adapt to changes. Closed Beta Veteran - Badge of Blood
Foundation Seldon Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 556	Posted - 2014.03.15 18:20:00 - [14] - Quote Proto Annihilator wrote: on a specialized suit they will perform as good as they do now. Every other suit will take a hit. I don't care much but at least know the facts when you come to argue. Derp. I never said that their stats weren't lowered, only that their new stats don't make them suddenly useless on the field for the non specialized suits. As I said, new stats or old stat - the Uplinks, Nanite Injectors, and Repair Tools are still going to be extremely useful tools and that the only piece of equipment that was heavily nerfed was the scanner. It's because I know the facts that I'm not going around on the forums claiming that logis are only going to be able to effectively use one piece of equipment. Do you understand what I'm saying now? Saga v. Methana Balance
HYENAKILLER X Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 666	Posted - 2014.03.15 18:21:00 - [15] - Quote Charlotte O'Dell wrote: CQC is will be dominated by heavies. Open battlefields will be dominated by tanks. Anywhere else will be the hunting grounds for imvisible scouts. Where does the medium frame fit in, here? Logis can only run one type of equipment, really. Assaults are confined to one type of weapon and their bonus is laughable compared to the commandos. It's funny how 1.8 is going to be the exact opposite of most of Uprising. The niche roles will get their revenge, but I still want a good balance. Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. Assaults should be better than they are. Honestly, they should have a damage bonus, too that is 1% less/level than the commandos. I feel their hp regen and speed make up for this. Lol@op. Ill run my assault like a scout, be undetectable and wreak havok....like ive been doing all along. its the player, not the game. Also I can still fit 900 hp on my assault. There is plenty of room for medium suits. Im not from new eden. I dont need back up, political power or support. I, unlike you dont fear nuetral territory.
Magnus Amadeuss Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 537	Posted - 2014.03.15 18:33:00 - [16] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: Croned wrote: The Robot Devil wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. Can you provide a link to where they said that all equipment stats do not go down on a logi? Last time I checked, the logi class only gets an equipment CPU/PG bonus, and depending on the race they only get a bonus on one type of equipment that makes it equivalent to 1.7 stats When compared to how the other suits perform with the equipment and all being on the same level in 1.8. In 1.8 the baseline stats for all equipment (not including the cloak) are the same until put on that races suit and then it receives a bonus. Being in a logi suit in 1.8 will enhance one equipment type per race, the other equipment stats do not change up or down. Punishment would be that if I put an uplink on my Min logi it would do less than the stats and it doesn't do that, it stays the same. They are trying to balance the role of logi and how equipment performs. You will still get a massive reduction to the required CPU/PG for any type of equipment, serving the purpose of a logi. Look, new eden as a whole mostly has item that are not exceptional without a bonus, dust has been the odd child out for a while. I am presonally very happy that CCP is doing this. It makes each logi unique, and it also makes the logis as a whole more valuable. As far as the assault suits, yes I totally agree, they should nerf all weapons by 10-15% and then give the assaults a 10-15% bonus to their racial weapon. Once again, it will promote variety, reflect the essentials of new eden, and give assaults a unique but valuable role. While there is no better place to be wealthy than the Gallente Federation, there is no hell worse for the poor either.
Gavr1Io Pr1nc1p 69	Posted - 2014.03.15 18:53:00 - [17] - Quote if they just added in the 1% RoF skill, they'd be good Kills-Archduke Ferdinand Balance!
Booby Tuesdays Ahrendee Mercenaries General Tso's Alliance 422	Posted - 2014.03.15 19:29:00 - [18] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. The sad thing is that two of the racial logis ARE getting punished. If I am Amarr, I can run all of my equipment slots with uplinks and they will all be badass. If I am Caldari, I can run all my equipment slots with nanohives, and they will all be badass. If I am Gallente, am I really going to run more than 1 or 2 scanners? I personally run Minmatar, am I going to run 4 freaking rep tools? Nope. Huge advantage to the Cal and Amarr Logis. Huge nerf to the Min logi, and a slight nerf to the Gal logi. If you win the rat race, you're still a rat.
Rizlax Yazzax Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 92	Posted - 2014.03.15 19:31:00 - [19] - Quote Charlotte O'Dell wrote: i just got logi raped......well...LOGIS SUCK! STOP REVIVING AND REPPING PEOPLE, YOU TROLL! Lemme get my 2 mil! Death to logis! +1. Made me laugh, I don't know why. On topic afraid to say I agree with the others. I'll be running Gallente for the scans, but I'll still be using a needle and repper. If not more so as the scanner will be more situational but a vital tool nonetheless.
Scheneighnay McBob Endless Hatred Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 4361	Posted - 2014.03.15 19:40:00 - [20] - Quote Learn your role. I am your scan error.

Scheneighnay McBob Endless Hatred Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 4362	Posted - 2014.03.15 19:42:00 - [21] - Quote Foundation Seldon wrote: The Robot Devil wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. Ding ding ding! In no way does the addition of specializations and (slight) nerfing of other equipment somehow make the other equipment not worth using on anything other than the specialized frame. Cmon guys, quit the hyperbole. People on the forums always exaggerate everything and cause widespread panic about something they wouldn't even notice otherwise in game. It's always this bad. I am your scan error.
Murt Lesp Hydra's Wraiths 37	Posted - 2014.03.15 19:48:00 - [22] - Quote Honestly, every race has the same issue so no one is becoming op (at least not without trial and error) A Minmatar Logi with a dual healing rep tool with increased range and rate will make his squad far more effective than before. Plus he'll have 3 more equipment slots to use so he'll have an uplink, a needle, and a hive if he fits properly. Racial bonuses are just that: BONUSES they add to roles that are specialized but mixing and matching is all part of the game. Some day I'll see an Amarr Sentinel with a Plasma cannon and flaylock pistol and who's shield tanking. Crazy, but unique as the game should be It's time for MILLITA MONTH!!!
Rizlax Yazzax Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 92	Posted - 2014.03.15 19:49:00 - [23] - Quote Booby Tuesdays wrote: The Robot Devil wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. The sad thing is that two of the racial logis ARE getting punished. If I am Amarr, I can run all of my equipment slots with uplinks and they will all be badass. If I am Caldari, I can run all my equipment slots with nanohives, and they will all be badass. If I am Gallente, am I really going to run more than 1 or 2 scanners? I personally run Minmatar, am I going to run 4 freaking rep tools? Nope. Huge advantage to the Cal and Amarr Logis. Huge nerf to the Min logi, and a slight nerf to the Gal logi. What?! Am I........did he just......ummmmm. I'm too stoned for this crazy talk.
Funkmaster Whale 0uter.Heaven 1509	Posted - 2014.03.15 19:54:00 - [24] - Quote WTF? No room for Medium Frames? Dude, if you seriously think Assaults and Logis are not gonna have a role you must be either (a) bad, (b) awful, (c) absoltuely terrible, or (d) all of the above. Seriously, L2P before posting nonsense like this. This game isn't Rock-Paper-Scissors. Heavy suits will die just as often to scouts as scouts to heavies, as much as heavies to assaults and logis to heavies. There's this little thing called "skill". I know you've been a vet for a long time Charlotte, but all I've ever seen from you is QQ on the forums and never anything to back it up in game. Let me play you the song of my people!
Nocturnal Soul Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2323	Posted - 2014.03.15 20:00:00 - [25] - Quote POW POW POW^ SHOTS FIRED!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Its alright everyone, no need to worry it's just an Amarr scout :(
Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 3054	Posted - 2014.03.15 20:19:00 - [26] - Quote It will mean Amar and Caldari Logis will be the suits to wear. Fit a couple pure uplink ADV suits and a couple pure hive fits to lay out equipment as you did before. Then make an Amar fitting with rep tool, needle, and scanner. It will be far more survivable than the squishy Minmitar so you'll actually get more healing done before you die. Make it Gallente if you want to pay for a third racial suit so you can scan better. You can be nearly as effective in 1.8 as before with just another 5m SP investment.
Kristoff Atruin Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 1853	Posted - 2014.03.15 20:21:00 - [27] - Quote The fitting cost reduction is a huge buff to the logistics role. It means that for equipment you don't have a bonus to you can cram in a higher level version than an assault or scout can while not gimping your tank or weapon. It means that logistics suits are the best at using any kind of equipment, and they're the absolute best with one particular kind of gear. I'm still going to run Minmatar logi, and I'm still going to be dropping hives and racking up my +10s. Between these changes and the higher TTK it might finally mean I can focus mostly on logi work. This also means that overall, equipment spam won't be as much of a dominant tactic. In particular with uplinks. The slower spawn times will mean you can't be absurdly aggressive with the placement, because you can't rely on the guys spawning to keep it alive. This is going to have a pretty big impact on the pace and feel of the game, and I think it's going to be a lot of fun.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8256	Posted - 2014.03.15 20:23:00 - [28] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. Which is a bad idea which leads to imbalances. In EVE all logistics class vessels have the same ship and role bonuses which make them better at the logistics role in general not specific niche aspects of it. " ..- -.- --. I wish I remembered morse code so I wasn't typing random letters" - Malleus Malificorum
Rusty Shallows 1122	Posted - 2014.03.15 20:30:00 - [29] - Quote Scheneighnay McBob wrote: Foundation Seldon wrote: The Robot Devil wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. Ding ding ding! In no way does the addition of specializations and (slight) nerfing of other equipment somehow make the other equipment not worth using on anything other than the specialized frame. Cmon guys, quit the hyperbole. People on the forums always exaggerate everything and cause widespread panic about something they wouldn't even notice otherwise in game. It's always this bad. Looks more like they are trying to sweep something under the rug. Doing the neck-beard thing I can see why the Equipment nerfing was done but this Faction Logi locking was the wrong approach. It should have been small universal bonuses with another small or moderate bump in a specialization. This isn't going to hurt my Winmatar Medic so much as it will everyone else who doesn't have the Frame skill at five or uses another race. Hopefully the Devs will eventually see this. A good first draft but the produce is going to need some serious polishing. Here, have some candy and a Like. :-) Forums > Game
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8257	Posted - 2014.03.15 20:36:00 - [30] - Quote Rusty Shallows wrote: Scheneighnay McBob wrote: Foundation Seldon wrote: The Robot Devil wrote: Charlotte O'Dell wrote: Logis should not be punished for running other equipment types. Reconsider how much of a nerf equipment is getting. This much of a nerf is not warranted, but the bonuses are a good idea. They are not punished for carrying different equipment types they are rewarded for using their races equipment. The stats of the equipment doesn't go down when on a logi so it isn't a punishment but the stats for certain equipment goes up and that is the reward for specialization. Ding ding ding! In no way does the addition of specializations and (slight) nerfing of other equipment somehow make the other equipment not worth using on anything other than the specialized frame. Cmon guys, quit the hyperbole. People on the forums always exaggerate everything and cause widespread panic about something they wouldn't even notice otherwise in game. It's always this bad. Looks more like they are trying to sweep something under the rug. Doing the neck-beard thing I can see why the Equipment nerfing was done but this Faction Logi locking was the wrong approach. It should have been small universal bonuses with another small or moderate bump in a specialization. This isn't going to hurt my Winmatar Medic so much as it will everyone else who doesn't have the Frame skill at five or uses another race. Hopefully the Devs will eventually see this. A good first draft but the produce is going to need some serious polishing. Sorry I take issue with you using the term Winmatar. They joined the Amarr militia recently.....just saying.... " ..- -.- --. I wish I remembered morse code so I wasn't typing random letters" - Malleus Malificorum



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