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Reasonable RE fix

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TheD1CK Dead Man's Game 799	Posted - 2014.02.27 19:20:00 - [1] - Quote So more players are equiping RE's and ruining peoples day - HAV users... QQ I died to them they're OP (even though CCP has reduced effectiveness since 1.7) - Proto stompers... QQ I was too busy farming MLT gear to notice the RE trap, they're OP It gets a bit boring that guys target the one thing stopping them from not dying in some games But less on the issues more on the fixes ... Add a bonus to the Explosive skill that increase DMG out-put from Explosives While at the same time reducing DMG across tiers so that at L5 Explosives RE's perform as they are now, but at L1 they would be less effective .... This rewards the investment, stops guys spamming basic remotes, as they won't be As effective until you hit L5 Explosives..... My posts may not ever be perfect but I try to look at the situation from both sides And this fix benefits everyone, unlike the tankers asking for their bane to be nerfed Plasma Cannons performs its suppresion/area denial role perfectly Pity dust players only perform one role - slaying
ALPHA DECRIPTER Dragon-Empire 780	Posted - 2014.02.27 20:10:00 - [2] - Quote Huh, nothing gets removed and a skill gains value. Reasonable compromise. I have recently specced into REs to help fend off the tanker noobs (and mess with the tanker vets) and I have to say that something like this would have to wait until tanks are re-balanced. Scout Tactician Dance puppets, DANCE!
God Hates Lags Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 898	Posted - 2014.02.27 20:21:00 - [3] - Quote As a heavy, I don't mind dying to remote explosives when they're well placed and people lure me into them. Honestly I should have known better and they played well. What I do mind is that anyone can rush a heavy with remotes, throw them as they're being shot to bits, then detonate them while dead. This is not skill, it's a free kill, more than a free kill if players are in a tight cluster. All I want is a fix that bug that let's players blow remotes when they're dead. Doubles ISK
Awry Barux Ametat Security Amarr Empire 1241	Posted - 2014.02.27 20:33:00 - [4] - Quote Alternately, what if all REs have a base capacity of 1, and the skill increased the number carried by 1 per level excluding the first? While basic REs should be, and are, worse than the boundless ones, nerfing the damage is going to make them all but useless without proto, and that's also not how it should work. By changing the capacity we can cut down on spam while keeping them useful at STD.
killertojo42 Sardaukar Merc Guild 27	Posted - 2014.02.27 20:42:00 - [5] - Quote Honestly just remove letting guys detonate REs while dead, i'm a rapid assault guy and almost no RE user has killed me while still breathing, this isn't call of duty with dead man's switch and , last stand, dead is dead When walking on the battlefield i stand alone
Hagintora Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 243	Posted - 2014.02.27 20:59:00 - [6] - Quote killertojo42 wrote: Honestly just remove letting guys detonate REs while dead, i'm a rapid assault guy and almost no RE user has killed me while still breathing, this isn't call of duty with dead man's switch and , last stand, dead is dead If he can be revived, he's not dead. If he can be revived, he's still a threat. If he's dead, he can't activate RE's. If he's dead, he can't be revived. There is adifference between a downed Clone, and a dead Clone.
killertojo42 Sardaukar Merc Guild 28	Posted - 2014.02.27 21:02:00 - [7] - Quote Then a downed clone needs an animated as proof of life so i know to continue shooting which i will do When walking on the battlefield i stand alone
Hagintora Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 243	Posted - 2014.02.27 21:05:00 - [8] - Quote killertojo42 wrote: Then a downed clone needs an animated as proof of life so i know to continue shooting which i will do This I would agree with
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game 801	Posted - 2014.02.27 21:06:00 - [9] - Quote Awry Barux wrote: Alternately, what if all REs have a base capacity of 1, and the skill increased the number carried by 1 per level excluding the first? While basic REs should be, and are, worse than the boundless ones, nerfing the damage is going to make them all but useless without proto, and that's also not how it should work. By changing the capacity we can cut down on spam while keeping them useful at STD. I like that idea, but what I suggested would only effect players with minimal SP in RE The bonus would make STD RE deal higher damage with skills invested... But either of these can idea's can provide a solution to RE QQ Plasma Cannon performs its suppresion/area denial role perfectly Pity dust players only perform one role - slaying
Awry Barux Ametat Security Amarr Empire 1246	Posted - 2014.02.27 21:09:00 - [10] - Quote TheD1CK wrote: Awry Barux wrote: Alternately, what if all REs have a base capacity of 1, and the skill increased the number carried by 1 per level excluding the first? While basic REs should be, and are, worse than the boundless ones, nerfing the damage is going to make them all but useless without proto, and that's also not how it should work. By changing the capacity we can cut down on spam while keeping them useful at STD. I like that idea, but what I suggested would only effect players with minimal SP in RE The bonus would make STD RE deal higher damage with skills invested... But either of these can idea's can provide a solution to RE QQ Sorry, I was unclear- what I meant is that it would make them useless without level 5 skill. No other item in the game works that way. Everything should be clearly useful at standard level with only 1 rank in the skill- not as good, but definitely useful.

Hagintora Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 245	Posted - 2014.02.27 21:10:00 - [11] - Quote TheD1CK wrote: Awry Barux wrote: Alternately, what if all REs have a base capacity of 1, and the skill increased the number carried by 1 per level excluding the first? While basic REs should be, and are, worse than the boundless ones, nerfing the damage is going to make them all but useless without proto, and that's also not how it should work. By changing the capacity we can cut down on spam while keeping them useful at STD. I like that idea, but what I suggested would only effect players with minimal SP in RE The bonus would make STD RE deal higher damage with skills invested... But either of these can idea's can provide a solution to RE QQ You could always do both. Have the Explosives Skill increase DMG, and the Demolitions Skill increase capacity.
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game 801	Posted - 2014.02.27 21:15:00 - [12] - Quote Hagintora wrote: TheD1CK wrote: Awry Barux wrote: Alternately, what if all REs have a base capacity of 1, and the skill increased the number carried by 1 per level excluding the first? While basic REs should be, and are, worse than the boundless ones, nerfing the damage is going to make them all but useless without proto, and that's also not how it should work. By changing the capacity we can cut down on spam while keeping them useful at STD. I like that idea, but what I suggested would only effect players with minimal SP in RE The bonus would make STD RE deal higher damage with skills invested... But either of these can idea's can provide a solution to RE QQ You could always do both. Have the Explosives Skill increase DMG, and the Demolitions Skill increase capacity. Indeed Plasma Cannon performs its suppresion/area denial role perfectly Pity dust players only perform one role - slaying
killertojo42 Sardaukar Merc Guild 28	Posted - 2014.02.27 21:18:00 - [13] - Quote The biggest thing REs need is a decrease in blast radius, i need to look but REs have nearly as much if not more explosive range than locus grenades, they're also a concussive and not fragmentation device, decrease range but not power and it becomesa sspecialized demolitions device When walking on the battlefield i stand alone
Hagintora Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 247	Posted - 2014.02.27 21:27:00 - [14] - Quote killertojo42 wrote: The biggest thing REs need is a decrease in blast radius, i need to look but REs have nearly as much if not more explosive range than locus grenades, they're also a concussive and not fragmentation device, decrease range but not power and it becomesa sspecialized demolitions device RE's have a 5m blast radius. It's the same size, STD to PRO. Locus 'Nades are 5m at Militia/STD, and increase to 7.5 at PRO,
killertojo42 Sardaukar Merc Guild 28	Posted - 2014.02.27 21:38:00 - [15] - Quote Hagintora wrote: killertojo42 wrote: The biggest thing REs need is a decrease in blast radius, i need to look but REs have nearly as much if not more explosive range than locus grenades, they're also a concussive and not fragmentation device, decrease range but not power and it becomesa sspecialized demolitions device RE's have a 5m blast radius. It's the same size, STD to PRO. Locus 'Nades are 5m at Militia/STD, and increase to 7.5 at PRO, Thankyou, that's my point, that shows a basic problem i think we can all agree on When walking on the battlefield i stand alone
killertojo42 Sardaukar Merc Guild 28	Posted - 2014.02.27 21:54:00 - [16] - Quote I think decreasing REs to a 2 meter blast radius would cause it to be more specialized and make it take actual skill to kill clones with When walking on the battlefield i stand alone
Hagintora Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 250	Posted - 2014.02.27 21:56:00 - [17] - Quote OK, taking the suggestions made into account, I propose this: Reduce base damage to RE's to 1200. Explosives Skill will increase damage by 5% per lvl, giving us a 1500 maximum at lvl 5. Demolitions Skill will increase carrying capacity by 1 at lvl 3, and again at lvl 5. STD RE's will have a base carrying capacity of 1 (3 with max skills), and a blast radius of 3m. ADV will have a base carrying capacity of 2 (4 with max skills), and a blast radius of 4m. PRO will have a base carrying capacity of 3 (5 with max skills), and a blast radius of 5m. What say you?
killertojo42 Sardaukar Merc Guild 29	Posted - 2014.02.27 22:03:00 - [18] - Quote I completely agree on this, plus i believe the proto should aalways be OP When walking on the battlefield i stand alone
Summ Dude Direct Action Resources 261	Posted - 2014.02.27 22:28:00 - [19] - Quote God Hates Lags wrote: As a heavy, I don't mind dying to remote explosives when they're well placed and people lure me into them. Honestly I should have known better and they played well. What I do mind is that anyone can rush a heavy with remotes, throw them as they're being shot to bits, then detonate them while dead. This is not skill, it's a free kill, more than a free kill if players are in a tight cluster. All I want is a fix that bug that let's players blow remotes when they're dead. All of the +1s to this. Detonation after death and frisbee tossing most definitely need to be removed. I also wouldn't mind seeing a longer arming time on REs, to solidify their role as traps to be set, not grenades to be flung. Not just a laymen, but the laymen. Winn Summ and lose Summ.
killertojo42 Sardaukar Merc Guild 30	Posted - 2014.02.27 22:32:00 - [20] - Quote I agree, they aren't grenades and that's why i first want that blast radius decreased, we also all know the detonation after death needs to be removed When walking on the battlefield i stand alone

TheD1CK Dead Man's Game 809	Posted - 2014.02.27 23:04:00 - [21] - Quote Hagintora wrote: OK, taking the suggestions made into account, I propose this: Reduce base damage to RE's to 1200. Explosives Skill will increase damage by 5% per lvl, giving us a 1500 maximum at lvl 5. Demolitions Skill will increase carrying capacity by 1 at lvl 3, and again at lvl 5. STD RE's will have a base carrying capacity of 1 (3 with max skills), and a blast radius of 3m. ADV will have a base carrying capacity of 2 (4 with max skills), and a blast radius of 4m. PRO will have a base carrying capacity of 3 (5 with max skills), and a blast radius of 5m. What say you? I concur Plasma Cannon performs its suppresion/area denial role perfectly Pity dust players only perform one role - slaying
Royalgiedro Nor Clan Combat Logistics 7	Posted - 2014.02.28 00:26:00 - [22] - Quote Hagintora wrote: OK, taking the suggestions made into account, I propose this: Reduce base damage to RE's to 1200. Explosives Skill will increase damage by 5% per lvl, giving us a 1500 maximum at lvl 5. Demolitions Skill will increase carrying capacity by 1 at lvl 3, and again at lvl 5. STD RE's will have a base carrying capacity of 1 (3 with max skills), and a blast radius of 3m. ADV will have a base carrying capacity of 2 (4 with max skills), and a blast radius of 4m. PRO will have a base carrying capacity of 3 (5 with max skills), and a blast radius of 5m. What say you? all I would add to that is that they should have to be on the ground/wall for 3seconds before they can be detonated. That way people have a chance to kill the clone before they detonate while dying.
Yeeeuuuupppp KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 127	Posted - 2014.02.28 00:47:00 - [23] - Quote Or leave them alone and force people to look out.. Like snipers on Manus Peak My Minnie is friendly.. don't worry, I don't bite. I slash. Novice incubus pilot. Feel the wrath of my troll.
Hagintora Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 254	Posted - 2014.02.28 01:07:00 - [24] - Quote People are still going to have to be cautious, and have good situational awareness, but this also makes 2 skills something more than just SP dumps. It also gives us RE users a reason to carry higher tier RE's. Once you've capped you skills, there won't be that much difference to what we have right now, it's gonna take people a little longer to get there is all.
TheEnd762 SVER True Blood General Tso's Alliance 436	Posted - 2014.02.28 01:12:00 - [25] - Quote No one has ever detonated an RE after death, only when they're incapacitated.
Galvan Nized Deep Space Republic 700	Posted - 2014.02.28 01:34:00 - [26] - Quote Don't change REs, they are fine. Who is complaining about these in any regard except after downed? You limit the number you can carry, bye bye any chances for AV with them. I shouldn't have to fully skill to have a chance to kill a tank. There is already a reason to go proto: you carry more, have more active, and quicker activation. The dead man switch is odd, if it was intentional say so, if not get rid of it. The only real time you can death charge is when you know your opponent is just standing there. Don't back yourselves into corners and you'll never die to a death charge.
Racro 01 Arifistan 501st Knights of Leanbox INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS 175	Posted - 2014.02.28 01:54:00 - [27] - Quote make all explosives deal 1500 damage. and limit carrying capaicty to 1. currently i have noticed for RE that it is std alows to carry 3 and arm 3 adv is carry 3 and arm 4 (if you check the stats it shows how many cna be active) proto is carry 3 and arm 5(notice the trend with the tiers here?) also as you go up in tiers thier damge increases from 1500,1650,1750 respecitvley. (roughly)
killertojo42 Sardaukar Merc Guild 33	Posted - 2014.02.28 16:05:00 - [28] - Quote Well there's too many ways to change REs without destroying them, dropping the blast radius as i said would make them a skill weapon over being a spam weapon When walking on the battlefield i stand alone
Lightning Bolt2 Binary Mercs 405	Posted - 2014.02.28 18:19:00 - [29] - Quote Hagintora wrote: OK, taking the suggestions made into account, I propose this: Reduce base damage to RE's to 1200. Explosives Skill will increase damage by 5% per lvl, giving us a 1500 maximum at lvl 5. Demolitions Skill will increase carrying capacity by 1 at lvl 3, and again at lvl 5. STD RE's will have a base carrying capacity of 1 (3 with max skills), and a blast radius of 3m. ADV will have a base carrying capacity of 2 (4 with max skills), and a blast radius of 4m. PRO will have a base carrying capacity of 3 (5 with max skills), and a blast radius of 5m. What say you? +1 good fix, it will reduce spam alot! (and those specialized to kill tanks arn't effected) Favorite gear: Duct-tape and Butter knives
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game 819	Posted - 2014.02.28 19:22:00 - [30] - Quote feel free to link this thread when further RE edits are proposed There have been some good suggestions here, thanks Plasma Cannon performs its suppresion/area denial role perfectly Pity dust players only perform one role - slaying

Hagintora Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 261	Posted - 2014.03.01 07:45:00 - [31] - Quote Galvan Nized wrote: Don't change REs, they are fine. Who is complaining about these in any regard except after downed? You limit the number you can carry, bye bye any chances for AV with them. I shouldn't have to fully skill to have a chance to kill a tank. There is already a reason to go proto: you carry more, have more active, and quicker activation. The dead man switch is odd, if it was intentional say so, if not get rid of it. The only real time you can death charge is when you know your opponent is just standing there. Don't back yourselves into corners and you'll never die to a death charge. I understand where you're coming from in regards to AV, but I don't think you're looking the big picture. What's going to happen to the effectiveness of the RE when ADV and PRO tanks roll off the line? Do you really think that 3 or 4 RE's are going to take those down? The proposed idea at least gives RE users a chance against these higher tier HAV's, and keeps them as a viable (if dangerous) AV option. Yes, newer players, or those just starting to pick up the Demolitions Skill will be limited in capacity, but that just means they'll be focusing on the anti-personnel aspect of it's use. As they skill further in, they can start to take on bigger targets, and earn bigger rewards. But, as with most other things in this game, it is something that must be earned.
bogeyman m Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 128	Posted - 2014.03.02 05:28:00 - [32] - Quote killertojo42 wrote: Then a downed clone needs an animated as proof of life so i know to continue shooting which i will do Although no animation, currently your reticle will change colour if the clone is still revivable.
bogeyman m Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 128	Posted - 2014.03.02 05:33:00 - [33] - Quote Hagintora wrote: OK, taking the suggestions made into account, I propose this: Reduce base damage to RE's to 1200. Explosives Skill will increase damage by 5% per lvl, giving us a 1500 maximum at lvl 5. Demolitions Skill will increase carrying capacity by 1 at lvl 3, and again at lvl 5. STD RE's will have a base carrying capacity of 1 (3 with max skills), and a blast radius of 3m. ADV will have a base carrying capacity of 2 (4 with max skills), and a blast radius of 4m. PRO will have a base carrying capacity of 3 (5 with max skills), and a blast radius of 5m. What say you? Agreed... Plus reduce their throwing distance. REs should be placed or dropped, not thrown like Frisbees... That's what grenades are for.
Hagintora Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 269	Posted - 2014.03.02 07:03:00 - [34] - Quote RE's seem to have the same issues as the other equipment types do (hives, uplinks). Sometimes when you deploy them they just drop at your feet, and other times they seem to have a 3-4 meter range. Sometimes they hit the ground and stop, and other times they seem to slide accross the ground as if on ice. No one complains about uplinks and hives, because they can't kill you, but next time you play, watch how these two behave. I will say right now that the "frisbee RE" problem I see people complain about is an equipment deployment problem. Fix how equipment is deployed, and you fix RE's.
Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Interstellar Murder of Crows 1793	Posted - 2014.03.02 07:52:00 - [35] - Quote Hagintora wrote: killertojo42 wrote: Then a downed clone needs an animated as proof of life so i know to continue shooting which i will do This I would agree with Pay more attention, the sight stays red if they're still there. Keep shooting til white. EDIT: Also, working as intended, the recent heavy spam is what is the cause of this. REs are good AI and AV weapons, though with 1.8 around the corner and the new suits, they will become less of a threat. Praise St. Arzad and Pass the Nanohives Karin Midular, gone, never forgotten Closed Beta Bittervet Bomber
abarkrishna WarRavens 324	Posted - 2014.03.02 08:03:00 - [36] - Quote Something killed me it's OP! Nerf it hard! No you kill this blueberry hacking the CRU we are camping. I already killed the last 2. When will they learn!
Draco Cerberus BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 791	Posted - 2014.03.02 15:14:00 - [37] - Quote The biggest thing REs need is a bigger blast radius and reduced online time, oh and maybe a free slushie with every use and a ginormous magnet that will pull maddys from across the field to them so that they can then be exploded in close proximity to the maddy... They work fine and fixing them is simple, more damage for higher levels, at proto it should only take one RE to blow up a tank. LogiGod earns his pips
Draco Cerberus BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 791	Posted - 2014.03.02 15:17:00 - [38] - Quote bogeyman m wrote: Hagintora wrote: OK, taking the suggestions made into account, I propose this: Reduce base damage to RE's to 1200. Explosives Skill will increase damage by 5% per lvl, giving us a 1500 maximum at lvl 5. Demolitions Skill will increase carrying capacity by 1 at lvl 3, and again at lvl 5. STD RE's will have a base carrying capacity of 1 (3 with max skills), and a blast radius of 3m. ADV will have a base carrying capacity of 2 (4 with max skills), and a blast radius of 4m. PRO will have a base carrying capacity of 3 (5 with max skills), and a blast radius of 5m. What say you? Agreed... Plus reduce their throwing distance. REs should be placed or dropped, not thrown like Frisbees... That's what grenades are for. An RE is flat and has a perfect surface and surface area to fly like a frisbee, stop chasing me and I will stop throwing them and place them at your feet instead. LogiGod earns his pips
axis alpha Red Star. EoN. 239	Posted - 2014.03.02 16:43:00 - [39] - Quote Man just when I thought cry babies had nothing else to cry about.... Show me war. Show me pestilence. Show me the blood red hands of retribution.
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game 869	Posted - 2014.03.02 23:27:00 - [40] - Quote I'm not complaining..... What I am asking for is a valid reason to run higher tier RE Because atm with how they function, any tier will almost do the same job ... And I will also point out at the beginning of 1.7, a HAV took 3 RE's job done Since then there has been an un-mentioned 'nerf' by CCP as that no longer works Maybe guys are fitting better tanks, but I don't think so as this is even the case with MLT HAV Plasma Cannon performs its suppresion/area denial role perfectly Pity dust players only perform one role - slaying

General12912 Gallente Marine Corps 76	Posted - 2014.03.03 05:09:00 - [41] - Quote there is nothing wrong with RE's aside from that pesky bug where it can be activated while incapacitated (really CCP??). RE's traps are actually pretty risky to use. especially during the laggy fights. sometimes you only have the time to activate them mili-second before you are dead, as its difficult to switch to equipment mid-firefight. just be more aware of your surroundings, and if youare in a firefight and your opponent turns into a corner mid-fight, sometimes its best if you disengage and not fall for the trap he/she is baiting you into. i have been on both sides of the coin. i use RE's but i also have outsmarted other RE users. Just keep your calm even in a fightand your head will be more aware of stuff like RE traps. i think RE users are acually getting relly creative and finding other uses for them. it used to be people only used them to booby-trap cannons/objectives. now we see LAV's even being set to blow at the touch of a button. smart idea actually. Assault Gk.0 Gallente Federation Patriot General of the Gallente Marine Corps. Look us up if you want to join.
Draco Cerberus BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 798	Posted - 2014.03.04 14:06:00 - [42] - Quote TheD1CK wrote: I'm not complaining..... What I am asking for is a valid reason to run higher tier RE Because atm with how they function, any tier will almost do the same job ... And I will also point out at the beginning of 1.7, a HAV took 3 RE's job done Since then there has been an un-mentioned 'nerf' by CCP as that no longer works Maybe guys are fitting better tanks, but I don't think so as this is even the case with MLT HAV I've been noticing this as well, but 3 to take a tank down? The damage from both the basic variant and the advanced are the same, it should really progress to higher damage levels for higher meta of gear in this case. That or better throw range, afixed to a hover disc etc. LogiGod earns his pips


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