DUST Search - Amarr Scout -30hp with same speed as Gallente is better scout.

Vespasian Andendare wrote:

I don't know where you guys are coming up with this logic that Amarr are about speed. They never have been. They never will be. Amarr are about thick brick tanks on slow ships. Speed order in Eve is Minmatar > Gallente > Caldari > Amarr. Amarr philosophy is about sustain. In Eve that's accomplished through bonuses to capacitor, armor damage resistances and enough lows to fit a solid buffer tank. Dust accomplishes this trick with many lows for a thick armor tank and enough stamina (and stam regen) to be able to sprint longer/farther, making up some of the loss of innate speed the plates give you.

Although, I think it's cute that you cherry picked the Interceptors to make your speed argument. Anyone who has ever played Eve knows that Amarr ships are armor tanked, which reduces speed. They have a very low-slot-heavy allocation, so the speed is there to make up for the fact that Interceptors are supposed to be fast, and yet Amarr should fit armor plates that'll slow you down. So, really, before you go cherry pick the "perfect" example of something that really doesn't apply, do your research first.

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Vespasian Andendare Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 678	Posted - 2014.03.19 20:36:00 - [61] - Quote I don't know where you guys are coming up with this logic that Amarr are about speed. They never have been. They never will be. Amarr are about thick brick tanks on slow ships. Speed order in Eve is Minmatar > Gallente > Caldari > Amarr. Amarr philosophy is about sustain. In Eve that's accomplished through bonuses to capacitor, armor damage resistances and enough lows to fit a solid buffer tank. Dust accomplishes this trick with many lows for a thick armor tank and enough stamina (and stam regen) to be able to sprint longer/farther, making up some of the loss of innate speed the plates give you. Although, I think it's cute that you cherry picked the Interceptors to make your speed argument. Anyone who has ever played Eve knows that Amarr ships are armor tanked, which reduces speed. They have a very low-slot-heavy allocation, so the speed is there to make up for the fact that Interceptors are supposed to be fast, and yet Amarr should fit armor plates that'll slow you down. So, really, before you go cherry pick the "perfect" example of something that really doesn't apply, do your research first. >> Play Dust 514 FREE! Sign up for exclusive gear today! <<
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 3840	Posted - 2014.03.19 21:29:00 - [62] - Quote Vespasian Andendare wrote: I don't know where you guys are coming up with this logic that Amarr are about speed. They never have been. They never will be. Amarr are about thick brick tanks on slow ships. Speed order in Eve is Minmatar > Gallente > Caldari > Amarr. Amarr philosophy is about sustain. In Eve that's accomplished through bonuses to capacitor, armor damage resistances and enough lows to fit a solid buffer tank. Dust accomplishes this trick with many lows for a thick armor tank and enough stamina (and stam regen) to be able to sprint longer/farther, making up some of the loss of innate speed the plates give you. Although, I think it's cute that you cherry picked the Interceptors to make your speed argument. Anyone who has ever played Eve knows that Amarr ships are armor tanked, which reduces speed. They have a very low-slot-heavy allocation, so the speed is there to make up for the fact that Interceptors are supposed to be fast, and yet Amarr should fit armor plates that'll slow you down. So, really, before you go cherry pick the "perfect" example of something that really doesn't apply, do your research first. You completely missed the point of that. The point of the interceptor example isn't that "Amarr is always 2nd fastest". It's that when choosing to accomplish a role about speed (in this case, interceptor), they don't pile on armor "just because" Amarr love armor. Basically, it's about the fact that the Amarr aren't so stupid as to make their "fast ships" slow just to adhere to some racial tendency concept that only makes sense in the context of a game as opposed to an actual culture. I think it's "cute" that you mention the armor-tanking as if that really happens with interceptors. You'll note most Amarr Interceptor fits don't pile on extra armor (or if they do, it's not enough to alter the rankings I mentioned). So, not "all Amarr ships are fast", but "Amarr doesn't make its speed ship slow with extra armor just because lol-armor." You then have to ask what the intended role of scouts is. Let's quote CCP: Quote: The Light Frames are the fastest suits in the game, finding themselves at home flanking, harassing and generally causing mayhem on the battlefield. Except this patently false given that at least one of the suits (the Amarr specifically) is slower than one of the Assault frames. Dren and Templar equipment stats, wrong since release.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8409	Posted - 2014.03.19 21:36:00 - [63] - Quote I want to throw out there that the Amarr have some of the fastest ships in new eden in specific roles...sure the general Amarr ship is rather slow, but we do have some insanely fast ships. " ..- -.- --. I wish I remembered morse code so I wasn't typing random letters" - Malleus Malificorum
Western Ways Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic 32	Posted - 2014.03.19 22:08:00 - [64] - Quote Zeylon Rho wrote: With the new Assault suit stats. Released, we can see the speed difference remains intact. The Minmatar Assault is FASTER than the Amarr Scout. It's also interesting to note in contrast tat the fastest Commando (Minmatar) is still much slower than the slowest Logi (Amarr) (by a factor of about 7%. The logi enjoys a nice .3 m/s speed advantage on the Commando, while the Amarr SCOUT is fukcing slower than the Minmatar Assault. If any role is supposed to enjoy a comfortable speed advantage over the next role, it's the SCOUT. I understand why the speed bothers you but the minassault is only marginally faster than the amar scout, it has 35 less armor and 55 more ehp at base levels. I stacked some complex ferroscale plates and complex extenders on an amarr scout and a minassault, the scout had more ehp, better regen, similar speed and a smaller hitbox. it's better at assaulting than the minmatar assault suit. I think the amarr scout should be faster too, but lets not act like it isn't better than the minmatar assault.
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 3840	Posted - 2014.03.19 23:30:00 - [65] - Quote Western Ways wrote: Zeylon Rho wrote: With the new Assault suit stats. Released, we can see the speed difference remains intact. The Minmatar Assault is FASTER than the Amarr Scout. It's also interesting to note in contrast tat the fastest Commando (Minmatar) is still much slower than the slowest Logi (Amarr) (by a factor of about 7%. The logi enjoys a nice .3 m/s speed advantage on the Commando, while the Amarr SCOUT is fukcing slower than the Minmatar Assault. If any role is supposed to enjoy a comfortable speed advantage over the next role, it's the SCOUT. I understand why the speed bothers you but the minassault is only marginally faster than the amar scout, it has 35 less armor and 55 more ehp at base levels. I stacked some complex ferroscale plates and complex extenders on an amarr scout and a minassault, the scout had more ehp, better regen, similar speed and a smaller hitbox. it's better at assaulting than the minmatar assault suit. I think the amarr scout should be faster too, but lets not act like it isn't better than the minmatar assault. I'd be curious to see how you built that with complex ferroscale/extenders such that the Minmatar somehow came out with less Ehp. Amarr Scout: 60 shields 170 armor 2H 4L at PRO Minmatar Assault: 150 shields 135 armor 5H 2L at PRO With Dropsuit Shield/Armor Upgrades maxed: Ak.0 = 287.5 Mk.0 = 356.25 That's without any modules.... continuing: Add 5 Shield Extenders to the Mk.0: 66 hp + 10% hp from max extender skill x 5 = 363 Add 2 Ferroscale Plates to the Mk.0: 75 hp + 10% hp from max plate skill x 2 = 165 Total: 528 from modules Add 2 Shield Extenders to the Ak.0 66 hp + 10% hp from max extender skill x 2 = 145.2 Add 4 Ferroscale Plates to the Ak.0: 75 hp + 10% hp from max plate skill x 4 = 330 Total: 475.2 Add those hp to the base to get the total with stacked ferroscale plates and complex extenders: Mk. 0: 884 eHP Ak. 0: 763 eHP That puts the eHP difference with ferro/extenders at 121 hp in the Minmatar's favor (about 2 complex shield extenders). That said, I think the Minmatar Assault SHOULD have more hp than the Amarr suit, that was precisely the original point - roles. The problem isn't the marginal speed edge, it's that they're practically the same speed and there's no differentiation in terms of speed between the much tankier assault suit and the scout suit. The Scout suit should have fewer hp AND be faster. Dren and Templar equipment stats, wrong since release.
Western Ways Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic 32	Posted - 2014.03.19 23:53:00 - [66] - Quote @Zeylon Rho I could only fit 2 complex extenders and 3 basic extenders on the minassault due to cpu/pg requirements I didn't go too in depth iirc Minassault 2 complex extenders + 3 basic extenders and 2 ferroscale plates With a CR, Flaylock and re's all proto Amarr scout 2 complex extenders + 4 ferroscale plates same weapon loadout with no cloak The ehp difference wasn't by a large margin but the scout did beat out the minnie assault.


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