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IRON PATRIOT 1 Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 94	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:44:00 - [61] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: Spectral Clone wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Spectral Clone wrote: 1: Fix TTK. 2: Remove/nerf dmg mods into the ground. 3: Buff utility mods. = WIN. Is the problem. Damage mods are just as valid as any HP mod, regen mod etc'. Or, if every weapon would overheat, the dmg mods should have a severe penalty to overheat, like 50% faster heat buildup. But this is far into the future... Damage mod penalties are not severe enough in this game. 3 comp dmg mods plus maxed proficiency gives you close to 40% dmg increase. If that's not ridiculous I don't know what is. No it gives you exactly 26.4% damage increase from 3 complex damage mods. Plus the 15% you get from proficiency lvl 5 duh. So that's 41.4% dmg increase.
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 6333	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:45:00 - [62] - Quote IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: Cat Merc wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: I'm not trying to make the caldari the master do all race but I'm specced into code breakers and don't use them. I brick tank and use dampeners I'm not a support player I'm a slayer. I agree if range and precision amps were buffed would you agree to remove them? No. I want options. If I want a damage suit I can have it. BTW, if you actually do the math, damage mods < shield extenders. Your math means nothing in this game. Did you calculate missed shots, headshot bonuses or latency issues? In this case shield modules are EVEN better! They can't miss Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 6333	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:46:00 - [63] - Quote IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: No it gives you exactly 26.4% damage increase from 3 complex damage mods. Plus the 15% you get from proficiency lvl 5 duh. So that's 41.4% dmg increase.[/quote] Then it's not really the damage mods. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
Logi Bro Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 2911	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:46:00 - [64] - Quote Here's a scenario. Let's say there are two players: Player A and Player B. Both players have the same weapon, and we will assume that weapon does 100 DPS for the sake of round numbers. The only difference between the two is that Player A equipped a complex damage mod. and player B equipped a complex shield extender. We will assume they started with a base health of 100 each also for the sake of round numbers. Player A and Player B both open fire on each other at the same time: who dies first? Player A is doing 110 DPS vs a 173 eHP (66 shield extender + 10% skill bonus) enemy. Player B is doing 100 DPS vs a 100 eHP enemy. Player A would kill Player B in 1.572... seconds. Player B would kill Player A in 1 second. So basically, damage mods aren't as good as you seem to think they are. There would be an even larger disparity between the two if you consider that each damage mod suffers from stacking penalties, while HP modules do not, and then an even LARGER disparity if I used a complex armor plate as an example instead. Let's say that Player B equipped a complex armor plate instead. Player A is doing 110 DPS to a 248 eHP (135 plate + 10% skill bonus) enemy Player B is doing 100 DPS to a 100 eHP enemy Player A would kill Player B in 2.54... seconds. Player B would kill Player A in one second. Look at that! The player with the plate kills the player with the damage mod more than twice as quickly! Shield Recommendations
Kane Fyea 2605	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:47:00 - [65] - Quote IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: Spectral Clone wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Is the problem. Damage mods are just as valid as any HP mod, regen mod etc'. Or, if every weapon would overheat, the dmg mods should have a severe penalty to overheat, like 50% faster heat buildup. But this is far into the future... Damage mod penalties are not severe enough in this game. 3 comp dmg mods plus maxed proficiency gives you close to 40% dmg increase. If that's not ridiculous I don't know what is. No it gives you exactly 26.4% damage increase from 3 complex damage mods. Plus the 15% you get from proficiency lvl 5 duh. So that's 41.4% dmg increase. I personally think prof needs to be removed/changed. That skill creates more imbalances then damage mods ever have.
Kaius Coriolanus Gothic Wars Consortium 11	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:47:00 - [66] - Quote Quote: Yelhsa Jin-Mao wrote: I hope you get cancer for even suggesting CCP remove my 3 militia damage mod BPOs. Why are you using militia? Why?!
Knight Solitaire Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 122	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:47:00 - [67] - Quote Spectral Clone wrote: MLT dmg mod: 2% STD dmg mod: 2% Adv dmg mod: 4% Pro dmg mod 6% No. STD / MLT Damage Mod: 3% Damage Increase, 5% Increase in CPU Usage of effected weapon ADV Damage Mod: 5%, 6% Increase in CPU Usage of effected weapon PRO Damage Mod: 10%, 9% Increase in CPU Usage of effected Weapon Corp: Fatal Absolution Alliance: General Tso's Alliance
Ludvig Enraga KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 881	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:48:00 - [68] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Knight Solitaire wrote: While we're on the topic of moving / removing modules, should Codebreakers not be a high-slot module? No, the hacking skill to the Minmatar Logi now and.the Minmatar Scout in 1.8, as well as the code breaker skill, would totally break hacking. We would literally see parties of two Minmatar Scouts traversing the Map hacking objectives in less than 5 seconds. No, just no. If you aren't willing to give up armor for hacking abilities, then you don't need them. Excellent point. As a min Scout I am already planning on running with a code breaker and fully maxed hacking - 75% bonus if there is no stacking penalty. If you move hacking to high slot I'll prob stack all highs with the module and use lows for speed. At some point hacking will become so fast on these suits that it will totally break the game. Hacking will be over by the time anyone realizes that it has started - so no chance at intercepting. Even counter strategies would not work well - if you leave a sentinel or w/e to guard an objective a scout will still sneak up on them and back stab them- so objectives will become a one sided trap favoring min scouts too dam much. PLC, NK, Scout - before 1.8. That's right, I stack that OP Sh!t.
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 6333	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:48:00 - [69] - Quote Logi Bro wrote: Here's a scenario. Let's say there are two players: Player A and Player B. Both players have the same weapon, and we will assume that weapon does 100 DPS for the sake of round numbers. The only difference between the two is that Player A equipped a complex damage mod. and player B equipped a complex shield extender. We will assume they started with a base health of 100 each also for the sake of round numbers. Player A and Player B both open fire on each other at the same time: who dies first? Player A is doing 110 DPS vs a 173 eHP (66 shield extender + 10% skill bonus) enemy. Player B is doing 100 DPS vs a 100 eHP enemy. Player A would kill Player B in 1.572... seconds. Player B would kill Player A in 1 second. So basically, damage mods aren't as good as you seem to think they are. There would be an even larger disparity between the two if you consider that each damage mod suffers from stacking penalties, while HP modules do not, and then an even LARGER disparity if I used a complex armor plate as an example instead. Let's say that Player B equipped a complex armor plate instead. Player A is doing 110 DPS to a 248 eHP (135 plate + 10% skill bonus) enemy Player B is doing 100 DPS to a 100 eHP enemy Player A would kill Player B in 2.54... seconds. Player B would kill Player A in one second. Look at that! The player with the plate kills the player with the damage mod more than twice as quickly! And that's assuming perfect accuracy. Damage mods can miss, shield extenders cannot. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 6337	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:49:00 - [70] - Quote Knight Solitaire wrote: Spectral Clone wrote: MLT dmg mod: 2% STD dmg mod: 2% Adv dmg mod: 4% Pro dmg mod 6% No. STD / MLT Damage Mod: 3% Damage Increase, 5% Increase in CPU Usage of effected weapon ADV Damage Mod: 5%, 6% Increase in CPU Usage of effected weapon PRO Damage Mod: 10%, 9% Increase in CPU Usage of effected Weapon Why not just increase the CPU usage of the module itself then? Why make it complicated? Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos

IRON PATRIOT 1 Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 94	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:50:00 - [71] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: No it gives you exactly 26.4% damage increase from 3 complex damage mods. Plus the 15% you get from proficiency lvl 5 duh. So that's 41.4% dmg increase. Then it's not really the damage mods.[/quote] How not if your getting more dmg increase from dmg mods than proficiency which cost more sp to skill into.
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 6337	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:51:00 - [72] - Quote IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Someone wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: No it gives you exactly 26.4% damage increase from 3 complex damage mods. Plus the 15% you get from proficiency lvl 5 duh. So that's 41.4% dmg increase. Then it's not really the damage mods. How not if your getting more dmg increase from dmg mods than proficiency which cost more sp to skill into. The damage mods cost you CPU/PG as well as slots you could use for more HP. (Which is more effective) You lose 217 shield HP Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
BAD FURRY SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 447	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:52:00 - [73] - Quote IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: What? That's like saying armor mods are redundant for shield tankers. I means that Dual tanking would be the only acceptable play style for the Gallante Assault. That is very boring and wrong on multiple levels. If this is how everyone plays this game then ccp needs to remove every module except for shield extenders, armor plates, and damage mods end of story. no sorry no CCP will never remove dmg mods at all ! CCP has make some players unhappy with the new pach keep in mined this is the 1st of its kind it,s NOT to be to ez a 4 yr with a steel rod impaled into its forehead can play it ! most players use dmg mods because this is how ccp wants the game they don't want a run out the door run back in side because the other team cant kill you fast anuff do to your tank on your drop suit ! game play is all about Mostly about doing lots of DPS / DMG to the other guy to kill him fast vs,s the game play of halo of running around ech other till some ones shields drop ! CCP wants to see you loses your good stuff and see you work for it back with new stuff they dont want players building up tons of rely good stuff because it takes so long to kill someone do to low dmg and hi tank game play ! you can even say why not add better dmg putting out guns and i will say how will the new player kill you then if your killing him now in less then 10 rounds and he has no way to kill you under a clip . this is why we have dmg mods this is why shield tanking is less then armor tanking . this is why you can died as soon as you are hit in the game . because ccp wants it this way ! a fast pased game where risk vs your skill vs other player skill = you live or die your reward ! and you will DIE !!! YOU WILL LOSES THAT NICE GUN / FITTING !....unless its a bpo.. Yes i am a Undead Hell Wolf ... nice to meat you!
IRON PATRIOT 1 Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 94	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:52:00 - [74] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Logi Bro wrote: Here's a scenario. Let's say there are two players: Player A and Player B. Both players have the same weapon, and we will assume that weapon does 100 DPS for the sake of round numbers. The only difference between the two is that Player A equipped a complex damage mod. and player B equipped a complex shield extender. We will assume they started with a base health of 100 each also for the sake of round numbers. Player A and Player B both open fire on each other at the same time: who dies first? Player A is doing 110 DPS vs a 173 eHP (66 shield extender + 10% skill bonus) enemy. Player B is doing 100 DPS vs a 100 eHP enemy. Player A would kill Player B in 1.572... seconds. Player B would kill Player A in 1 second. So basically, damage mods aren't as good as you seem to think they are. There would be an even larger disparity between the two if you consider that each damage mod suffers from stacking penalties, while HP modules do not, and then an even LARGER disparity if I used a complex armor plate as an example instead. Let's say that Player B equipped a complex armor plate instead. Player A is doing 110 DPS to a 248 eHP (135 plate + 10% skill bonus) enemy Player B is doing 100 DPS to a 100 eHP enemy Player A would kill Player B in 2.54... seconds. Player B would kill Player A in one second. Look at that! The player with the plate kills the player with the damage mod more than twice as quickly! And that's assuming perfect accuracy. Damage mods can miss, shield extenders cannot. Thankyou like I said math means nothing in this game.
Lynn Beck Granite Mercenary Division Top Men. 705	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:52:00 - [75] - Quote Replace them with: Heat sink- increases RoF of Laser weaponry- high slot Gyrostabilazer-increases RoF and effective range of Projectile weaponry- low slot Magnetic Field Stabilizer- increases RoF and damage of Hybrid weaponry- low slot These would help racially symmetrical fittings, such as Smg/Acr on a min assault. Edit- what these would actually modify are simply examples, as you would think a Heat Sink would decrease OH. Under 28db Officially nerfproof (predicting CR nerf February '14) Selling SP: 10k SP per 100k ISK.
Logi Bro Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 2912	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:53:00 - [76] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: And that's assuming perfect accuracy. Damage mods can miss, shield extenders cannot. That logic is a little confusing to me. Let's put it this way: we assume that both players are of equal skill, so they both miss the same amount of shots. The thing is, every shot that the player with the damage mod misses means more of a loss to that player than every shot fired by the player with the extender. Shield Recommendations
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 6337	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:53:00 - [77] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: Replace them with: Heat sink- increases RoF of Laser weaponry- high slot Gyrostabilazer-increases RoF and effective range of Projectile weaponry- low slot Magnetic Field Stabilizer- increases RoF and damage of Hybrid weaponry- low slot These would help racially symmetrical fittings, such as Smg/Acr on a min assault. "Magnetic Field Stabilizer- increases RoF and damage of Hybrid weaponry- low slot" Completely leaves out Gallente. GG Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 13016	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:54:00 - [78] - Quote Removing damage mods would only buff armor tankers even more. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 6337	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:54:00 - [79] - Quote Logi Bro wrote: Cat Merc wrote: And that's assuming perfect accuracy. Damage mods can miss, shield extenders cannot. That logic is a little confusing to me. Let's put it this way: we assume that both players are of equal skill, so they both miss the same amount of shots. The thing is, every shot that the player with the damage mod misses means more of a loss to that player than every shot fired by the player with the extender. What I mean by that is that shield extenders will defend you 100% of the time. Damage mods are only effective as much as your accuracy. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
PO0KY Virtual Syndicate 58	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:55:00 - [80] - Quote I'm pretty much in favor of anything that will increase TTK.

Logi Bro Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 2912	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:55:00 - [81] - Quote IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: Thankyou like I said math means nothing in this game. Lol, I like that you haven't directly responded to any of my posts yet. Are you allergic to logic? Math means EVERYTHING in this game, this is the FPS version of Spreadsheets in Space, ffs. Shield Recommendations
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 6337	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:55:00 - [82] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Removing damage mods would only buff armor tankers even more. Wait wat Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
IRON PATRIOT 1 Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 94	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:56:00 - [83] - Quote BAD FURRY wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: What? That's like saying armor mods are redundant for shield tankers. I means that Dual tanking would be the only acceptable play style for the Gallante Assault. That is very boring and wrong on multiple levels. If this is how everyone plays this game then ccp needs to remove every module except for shield extenders, armor plates, and damage mods end of story. no sorry no CCP will never remove dmg mods at all ! CCP has make some players unhappy with the new pach keep in mined this is the 1st of its kind it,s NOT to be to ez a 4 yr with a steel rod impaled into its forehead can play it ! most players use dmg mods because this is how ccp wants the game they don't want a run out the door run back in side because the other team cant kill you fast anuff do to your tank on your drop suit ! game play is all about Mostly about doing lots of DPS / DMG to the other guy to kill him fast vs,s the game play of halo of running around ech other till some ones shields drop ! CCP wants to see you loses your good stuff and see you work for it back with new stuff they dont want players building up tons of rely good stuff because it takes so long to kill someone do to low dmg and hi tank game play ! you can even say why not add better dmg putting out guns and i will say how will the new player kill you then if your killing him now in less then 10 rounds and he has no way to kill you under a clip . this is why we have dmg mods this is why shield tanking is less then armor tanking . this is why you can died as soon as you are hit in the game . because ccp wants it this way ! a fast pased game where risk vs your skill vs other player skill = you live or die your reward ! and you will DIE !!! YOU WILL LOSES THAT NICE GUN / FITTING !....unless its a bpo.. I see no difference in ttk when it comes to militia and proto gear honestly. If I'm in proto suit and a guy in militia gets the drop on he can kill me if he is good.
Kane Fyea 2605	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:56:00 - [84] - Quote IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: Cat Merc wrote: IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: Plus the 15% you get from proficiency lvl 5 duh. So that's 41.4% dmg increase. Then it's not really the damage mods. How not if your getting more dmg increase from dmg mods than proficiency which cost more sp to skill into. Because with prof you get a damage bonus with no downside besides it needing SP. (But come on who wouldn't spend some SP to get pretty much a free damage mod with no penalty. Also did I mention it doesn't take a module slot) While with damage mods they have to take a module slot, have the highest fitting requirements of modules, cost more then any other modules (ISK wise), and has a stacking penalty which makes stacking anymore then 3 a waste of a module slot. Oh and you have to sacrifice tank to get damage.
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 6337	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:56:00 - [85] - Quote IRON PATRIOT 1 wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Logi Bro wrote: Here's a scenario. Let's say there are two players: Player A and Player B. Both players have the same weapon, and we will assume that weapon does 100 DPS for the sake of round numbers. The only difference between the two is that Player A equipped a complex damage mod. and player B equipped a complex shield extender. We will assume they started with a base health of 100 each also for the sake of round numbers. Player A and Player B both open fire on each other at the same time: who dies first? Player A is doing 110 DPS vs a 173 eHP (66 shield extender + 10% skill bonus) enemy. Player B is doing 100 DPS vs a 100 eHP enemy. Player A would kill Player B in 1.572... seconds. Player B would kill Player A in 1 second. So basically, damage mods aren't as good as you seem to think they are. There would be an even larger disparity between the two if you consider that each damage mod suffers from stacking penalties, while HP modules do not, and then an even LARGER disparity if I used a complex armor plate as an example instead. Let's say that Player B equipped a complex armor plate instead. Player A is doing 110 DPS to a 248 eHP (135 plate + 10% skill bonus) enemy Player B is doing 100 DPS to a 100 eHP enemy Player A would kill Player B in 2.54... seconds. Player B would kill Player A in one second. Look at that! The player with the plate kills the player with the damage mod more than twice as quickly! And that's assuming perfect accuracy. Damage mods can miss, shield extenders cannot. Thankyou like I said math means nothing in this game. I was actually reinforcing his point. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
Lynn Beck Granite Mercenary Division Top Men. 705	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:57:00 - [86] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Lynn Beck wrote: Replace them with: Heat sink- increases RoF of Laser weaponry- high slot Gyrostabilazer-increases RoF and effective range of Projectile weaponry- low slot Magnetic Field Stabilizer- increases RoF and damage of Hybrid weaponry- low slot These would help racially symmetrical fittings, such as Smg/Acr on a min assault. "Magnetic Field Stabilizer- increases RoF and damage of Hybrid weaponry- low slot" Completely leaves out Gallente. GG Sorry. We could also leave Eve out of this and make another damage mod for gallente, seeing as their bonuses only apply to their own weaponry. Plasma Field Stabilizer- increases Effective range, increases RoF. High slot. Under 28db Officially nerfproof (predicting CR nerf February '14) Selling SP: 10k SP per 100k ISK.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 6808	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:58:00 - [87] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Removing damage mods would only buff armor tankers even more. Hardly. Damage buffs are currently ruining this game. No FPS shooter should allow a player to have a more powerful gun in terms of direct damage model balanced against how many high slots they have. How would loosing damage modules buff the Armour Tanker class? It would only allow us to take more utility module.....I fail to see this as a bad thing. It wouldn't be so bad is weapons modules affected weapon statistics like stability, maybe tentatively RoF, Reload speed, etc. "Just know that though our enemies may only #YOLO, through God's grace we can #YOLF at his side." - Disciple of Kesha
Logi Bro Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 2914	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:59:00 - [88] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Removing damage mods would only buff armor tankers even more. Wait wat I think he means that they would have no choice but to shield tank, and as we both know, shield extenders are better than dmg mods, so they would be more powerful. Shield Recommendations
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 6345	Posted - 2014.02.09 19:59:00 - [89] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Lynn Beck wrote: Replace them with: Heat sink- increases RoF of Laser weaponry- high slot Gyrostabilazer-increases RoF and effective range of Projectile weaponry- low slot Magnetic Field Stabilizer- increases RoF and damage of Hybrid weaponry- low slot These would help racially symmetrical fittings, such as Smg/Acr on a min assault. "Magnetic Field Stabilizer- increases RoF and damage of Hybrid weaponry- low slot" Completely leaves out Gallente. GG Sorry. We could also leave Eve out of this and make another damage mod for gallente, seeing as their bonuses only apply to their own weaponry. Plasma Field Stabilizer- increases Effective range, increases RoF. High slot. I would actually prefer if damage mods were split into two types: Anti shield damage mods and anti armor damage mods. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
Quil Evrything Triple Terrors 924	Posted - 2014.02.09 20:00:00 - [90] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Only if range amps would give you +150%, and moved to high slots. a curse on you! I want shields AND range mods!



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