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Aeon Amadi
Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance
4819
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Posted - 2014.02.08 11:23:00 -
[31] - Quote
Wasn't that they borrowed from that particular thread. The reduction to weaponry PG/CPU was something that the community generally thought was a good idea and was proposed quite a bit. Assault suits hallmark on their versatility and this kind of change does just that.
Useful Links
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I-Shayz-I
I-----I
2219
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Posted - 2014.02.08 11:31:00 -
[32] - Quote
OMG MINMATAR ASSAULT BONUS.
Assault Mass drivers with 13 round clips, standard ones with 11 round clips YESSSS Oh and that bonus to my Assault Combat Rifle...This can't be real.
Links:
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I make logistics videos!
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
6222
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Posted - 2014.02.08 11:34:00 -
[33] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:MINA Longstrike wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:MINA Longstrike wrote:Honestly I'd love to see gallente get +10% armor repairer efficacy per level - basic reps will fiction like adv with proto assault skill, adv will function like proto, and proto is "don't let this guy out of your sight ever", it really fits the races close quarters doctrine and would potentially let an assault run around with 2 reppers, 3 plates and a shotgun and have it be really viable.
I mean ideally the dropsuit skill should make every suit you wear in that category do what it does better - the current s outs and future scouts are like this, the future logis are very much like this as are the future heavies... Some of the assaults just seem a little left behind.
I love the minmatar bonuses, I love the amarr bonuses, the caldari and gallente need a bit of work. How about 5% instead? That's what the current Amarr Logi gets, I don't know why you think it should be doubled just because its an assault suit. Current logi also gets +1hp/sec on top of that, without that it amounts to about 2.5hp/sec if you're running 2 proto reps The Gallente Assault is probably getting +3hp/s, not quite 5, but still respectable. +50% efficacy for a module, any module, is a bit much. It's getting 2hp/s.
And compared to 25% to plates or shields, 25% on armor repairs would be rather bad.
Remember, the net gain has to be good, it doesn't matter how big the bonus is.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
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Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
4429
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Posted - 2014.02.08 11:36:00 -
[34] - Quote
Gallente Assault bonus makes them MUCH better at long range with minimal benefit to CQC. Caldari Assault bonus makes them slightly better at CQC with almost no benefit at range.
GG CCP. |
Oswald Rehnquist
1225
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Posted - 2014.02.08 11:37:00 -
[35] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Wasn't that they borrowed from that particular thread. The reduction to weaponry PG/CPU was something that the community generally thought was a good idea and was proposed quite a bit. Assault suits hallmark on their versatility and this kind of change does just that.
While true, if you look at the individual racials though, you'd notice that it is very similar to what was just put out now
Below 28 dB
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Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
2003
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Posted - 2014.02.08 11:39:00 -
[36] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:MINA Longstrike wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:MINA Longstrike wrote:Honestly I'd love to see gallente get +10% armor repairer efficacy per level - basic reps will fiction like adv with proto assault skill, adv will function like proto, and proto is "don't let this guy out of your sight ever", it really fits the races close quarters doctrine and would potentially let an assault run around with 2 reppers, 3 plates and a shotgun and have it be really viable.
I mean ideally the dropsuit skill should make every suit you wear in that category do what it does better - the current s outs and future scouts are like this, the future logis are very much like this as are the future heavies... Some of the assaults just seem a little left behind.
I love the minmatar bonuses, I love the amarr bonuses, the caldari and gallente need a bit of work. How about 5% instead? That's what the current Amarr Logi gets, I don't know why you think it should be doubled just because its an assault suit. Current logi also gets +1hp/sec on top of that, without that it amounts to about 2.5hp/sec if you're running 2 proto reps The Gallente Assault is probably getting +3hp/s, not quite 5, but still respectable. +50% efficacy for a module, any module, is a bit much. It's getting 2hp/s. And compared to 25% to plates or shields, 25% on armor repairs would be rather bad. Remember, the net gain has to be good, it doesn't matter how big the bonus is. Scouts had 50% increase to scan range, and yet the net gain was just 5 meters. Soo, yeah. The Amarr Logi bonus is good though. I use Armor Repairers all the time because of it. An enhanced repper almost becomes a complex repper because of it.
Fizzer94 // Forum Warrior Operation II
MAG ~ Seryi Volk Executive Response
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
6222
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Posted - 2014.02.08 11:40:00 -
[37] - Quote
Oswald Rehnquist wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:Wasn't that they borrowed from that particular thread. The reduction to weaponry PG/CPU was something that the community generally thought was a good idea and was proposed quite a bit. Assault suits hallmark on their versatility and this kind of change does just that. While true, if you look at the individual racials though, you'd notice that it is very similar to what was just put out now Very similar, but not quite the same.
Notice how the reload speed bonus on the Caldari assault was higher, and how it had an extra bonus to ammo capacity.
Notice how the Gallente assault is getting a ROF bonus.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
6222
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Posted - 2014.02.08 11:41:00 -
[38] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote: The Amarr Logi bonus is good though. I use Armor Repairers all the time because of it. An enhanced repper almost becomes a complex repper because of it.
3 * 1.25 = 3.75. Yeah, not even close.
I would throw out the Gallente Assault suit on the spot if that was the bonus it got, and switched to either the Gallente scout, or Minnie/Amarr assault.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
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Oswald Rehnquist
1225
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Posted - 2014.02.08 11:43:00 -
[39] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Oswald Rehnquist wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:Wasn't that they borrowed from that particular thread. The reduction to weaponry PG/CPU was something that the community generally thought was a good idea and was proposed quite a bit. Assault suits hallmark on their versatility and this kind of change does just that. While true, if you look at the individual racials though, you'd notice that it is very similar to what was just put out now Very similar, but not quite the same. Notice how the reload speed bonus on the Caldari assault was higher, and how it had an extra bonus to ammo capacity. Notice how the Gallente assault is getting a ROF bonus.
I understand, CCP follows about 3/4s of what the community threads ask for, same with the scouts and the logi threads that happened way back.
edit:
though at one point it was just a reload bonus, it has updated since then, multiple times
Below 28 dB
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
6222
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Posted - 2014.02.08 11:46:00 -
[40] - Quote
Oswald Rehnquist wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Oswald Rehnquist wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:Wasn't that they borrowed from that particular thread. The reduction to weaponry PG/CPU was something that the community generally thought was a good idea and was proposed quite a bit. Assault suits hallmark on their versatility and this kind of change does just that. While true, if you look at the individual racials though, you'd notice that it is very similar to what was just put out now Very similar, but not quite the same. Notice how the reload speed bonus on the Caldari assault was higher, and how it had an extra bonus to ammo capacity. Notice how the Gallente assault is getting a ROF bonus. I understand, CCP follows about 3/4s of what the community threads ask for, same with the scouts and the logi threads that happened way back. edit: though at one point it was just a reload bonus, it has updated since then, multiple times Yes. I actually have kagehoshi in a skype group and we discussed this. He changed it from our feedback.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
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Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
2003
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Posted - 2014.02.08 11:49:00 -
[41] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote: The Amarr Logi bonus is good though. I use Armor Repairers all the time because of it. An enhanced repper almost becomes a complex repper because of it.
3 * 1.25 = 3.75. Yeah, not even close. I would throw out the Gallente Assault suit on the spot if that was the bonus it got, and switched to either the Gallente scout, or Minnie/Amarr assault. You forgot the Armor Repair Skill. It ends up being 4.6875hp/s, add the +2 it will probably get (for some reason I thought it would be +3, because I thought the scout got +5. I'm dumb sometimes too!), and you get a total of 6.6875hp/s, that's good. A complex repper will put the rep rate up to 9.81hp/s, a rep rate any assault would envy.
Fizzer94 // Forum Warrior Operation II
MAG ~ Seryi Volk Executive Response
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
6222
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Posted - 2014.02.08 11:52:00 -
[42] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote: The Amarr Logi bonus is good though. I use Armor Repairers all the time because of it. An enhanced repper almost becomes a complex repper because of it.
3 * 1.25 = 3.75. Yeah, not even close. I would throw out the Gallente Assault suit on the spot if that was the bonus it got, and switched to either the Gallente scout, or Minnie/Amarr assault. You forgot the Armor Repair Skill. It ends up being 4.6875hp/s, add the +2 it will probably get (for some reason I thought it would be +3, because I thought the scout got +5. I'm dumb sometimes too!), and you get a total of 6.6875hp/s, that's good. A complex repper will put the rep rate up to 9.81hp/s, a rep rate any assault would envy. And with a 50% bonus it would be 10.75hp/s.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
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Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
2003
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Posted - 2014.02.08 12:00:00 -
[43] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote: The Amarr Logi bonus is good though. I use Armor Repairers all the time because of it. An enhanced repper almost becomes a complex repper because of it.
3 * 1.25 = 3.75. Yeah, not even close. I would throw out the Gallente Assault suit on the spot if that was the bonus it got, and switched to either the Gallente scout, or Minnie/Amarr assault. You forgot the Armor Repair Skill. It ends up being 4.6875hp/s, add the +2 it will probably get (for some reason I thought it would be +3, because I thought the scout got +5. I'm dumb sometimes too!), and you get a total of 6.6875hp/s, that's good. A complex repper will put the rep rate up to 9.81hp/s, a rep rate any assault would envy. And with a 50% bonus it would be 10.75hp/s. 11.375hp/s actually.
2 passive. + (5GÇó1.25GÇó1.5)= 9.375 = 11.375hp/s
With 2 complex armor repairers, that bonus would give a massive repair rate of 20.75hp/s
Fizzer94 // Forum Warrior Operation II
MAG ~ Seryi Volk Executive Response
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
6223
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Posted - 2014.02.08 12:09:00 -
[44] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote: The Amarr Logi bonus is good though. I use Armor Repairers all the time because of it. An enhanced repper almost becomes a complex repper because of it.
3 * 1.25 = 3.75. Yeah, not even close. I would throw out the Gallente Assault suit on the spot if that was the bonus it got, and switched to either the Gallente scout, or Minnie/Amarr assault. You forgot the Armor Repair Skill. It ends up being 4.6875hp/s, add the +2 it will probably get (for some reason I thought it would be +3, because I thought the scout got +5. I'm dumb sometimes too!), and you get a total of 6.6875hp/s, that's good. A complex repper will put the rep rate up to 9.81hp/s, a rep rate any assault would envy. And with a 50% bonus it would be 10.75hp/s. 11.375hp/s actually. 2 passive. + (5GÇó1.25GÇó1.5)= 9.375 = 11.375hp/s With 2 complex armor repairers, that bonus would give a massive repair rate of 20.75hp/s vs 14.5 without it.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
1850
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Posted - 2014.02.08 12:11:00 -
[45] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:And the only good bonuses are the Amarr and Minmatar. Gallente - Shotgun is the only one who can benefit from this bonus. AR is already pretty damn accurate, plasmacannonlol. Caldari - I've said it before and I'll say it again, reloading at long range is a non issue. You have all the time in the world. These two bonuses are so insubstantive that I'm considering moving to Gallente scouts. And before anyone says anything, do the math, scouts are going to be amazing combat units.
Amarr weapons are mostly held back by heat issues, if they have that removed, they're god like and nothing can stop their weaponry. Minmatar weapons are mostly held back by small clips. The bonuses fix that. (AND explosive spam is going to happen) Gallente weapons are far from being held back by dispersion. Caldari weapons have no need for fast reloads at the distances they operate at. The bonuses: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1813024#post1813024
the Gallente bonus is the worst and the Caldari bonus makes rail weapons even better in CQC rofl (smashing my head on the ground in a nger)
those bonuses would actually work 100% better if they were switched.
I think for the Gallente 3% rof and 3% clip increase (69 AR bullets) would suit the gun.
For the Caldari probably a 5% kick reduction WHILE IN ADS not when hip firing.
Armor and Shields are not the same!
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Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
2003
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Posted - 2014.02.08 12:12:00 -
[46] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote: 11.375hp/s actually.
2 passive. + (5GÇó1.25GÇó1.5)= 9.375 = 11.375hp/s
With 2 complex armor repairers, that bonus would give a massive repair rate of 20.75hp/s
vs 14.5 without it. 17.625. Jeez man, get yo' math right.
Fizzer94 // Forum Warrior Operation II
MAG ~ Seryi Volk Executive Response
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
6223
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Posted - 2014.02.08 12:19:00 -
[47] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote: 11.375hp/s actually.
2 passive. + (5GÇó1.25GÇó1.5)= 9.375 = 11.375hp/s
With 2 complex armor repairers, that bonus would give a massive repair rate of 20.75hp/s
vs 14.5 without it. 17.625. Jeez man, get yo' math right. 6.25 * 2 + 2.
6.25 = Complex armor rep + 25% bonus from skill.
How the **** is that wrong.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
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Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
2004
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Posted - 2014.02.08 12:24:00 -
[48] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote: 11.375hp/s actually.
2 passive. + (5GÇó1.25GÇó1.5)= 9.375 = 11.375hp/s
With 2 complex armor repairers, that bonus would give a massive repair rate of 20.75hp/s
vs 14.5 without it. 17.625. Jeez man, get yo' math right. 6.25 * 2 + 2. 6.25 = Complex armor rep + 25% bonus from skill. How the **** is that wrong. What are we arguing about? I don't think we're on the same page here. I'm advocating a +5% Armor Repair Module Efficacy per level, and I believe you are advoacing a +10% per level bonus. I'm putting out numbers that the +5% bonus would give...
Fizzer94 // Forum Warrior Operation II
MAG ~ Seryi Volk Executive Response
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
6223
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Posted - 2014.02.08 12:37:00 -
[49] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote: 11.375hp/s actually.
2 passive. + (5GÇó1.25GÇó1.5)= 9.375 = 11.375hp/s
With 2 complex armor repairers, that bonus would give a massive repair rate of 20.75hp/s
vs 14.5 without it. 17.625. Jeez man, get yo' math right. 6.25 * 2 + 2. 6.25 = Complex armor rep + 25% bonus from skill. How the **** is that wrong. What are we arguing about? I don't think we're on the same page here. I'm advocating a +5% Armor Repair Module Efficacy per level, and I believe you are advoacing a +10% per level bonus. I'm putting out numbers that the +5% bonus would give... I'm saying that the 5% bonus would have such a tiny net effect that it would be a bad skill. With TWO complex armor reps, the net effect is an extra 3~ hp/s.
That's assuming max skills too.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
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Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
2004
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Posted - 2014.02.08 12:41:00 -
[50] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote: What are we arguing about? I don't think we're on the same page here. I'm advocating a +5% Armor Repair Module Efficacy per level, and I believe you are advoacing a +10% per level bonus. I'm putting out numbers that the +5% bonus would give...
I'm saying that the 5% bonus would have such a tiny net effect that it would be a bad skill. With TWO complex armor reps, the net effect is an extra 3~ hp/s. That's assuming max skills too. But with 10% you get +6.25 Armor Reps with two. That a whole extra complex module just for having two reppers. 10% is too high, 7% might be the right number if you think 5 is too low.
Fizzer94 // Forum Warrior Operation II
MAG ~ Seryi Volk Executive Response
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
6223
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Posted - 2014.02.08 12:44:00 -
[51] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Fizzer94 wrote: What are we arguing about? I don't think we're on the same page here. I'm advocating a +5% Armor Repair Module Efficacy per level, and I believe you are advoacing a +10% per level bonus. I'm putting out numbers that the +5% bonus would give...
I'm saying that the 5% bonus would have such a tiny net effect that it would be a bad skill. With TWO complex armor reps, the net effect is an extra 3~ hp/s. That's assuming max skills too. But with 10% you get +6.25 Armor Reps with two. That a whole extra complex module just for having two reppers. 10% is too high, 7% might be the right number if you think 5 is too low. VoV
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
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Ashelia Skybrooke
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
18
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Posted - 2014.02.08 12:52:00 -
[52] - Quote
I'm suddenly SUPER glad I didn't skill into Caldari assault all of the sudden. This character is built to tank the hell out of shields sooo.... Caldari heavy it is! |
Broonfondle Majikthies
Dogs of War Gaming Zero-Day
807
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Posted - 2014.02.08 13:02:00 -
[53] - Quote
I don't know..
I don't use the RR (so ignore if you feel this makes my opinion invalid) but from what I've seen one of the main ways I've countered a RR user is forcing them to expend their ammo and taking them out on the reload. Also bear in mind the rifle is getting a reduction so you will likely be reloading more often.
As for the dispersion. To me that will make all the Gal tech incredible hipfire weapons - perfect for their playstyle to cover distance and then gun down enemies at close range. Without the need to ADS they can strafe faster and be more deadly up close and perhaps even mid range.
"...where Bylothgar the Ill-postured was made King of the People With No Name But Decent Footwear"
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
6223
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Posted - 2014.02.08 13:06:00 -
[54] - Quote
Broonfondle Majikthies wrote:I don't know..
I don't use the RR (so ignore if you feel this makes my opinion invalid) but from what I've seen one of the main ways I've countered a RR user is forcing them to expend their ammo and taking them out on the reload. Also bear in mind the rifle is getting a reduction so you will likely be reloading more often.
As for the dispersion. To me that will make all the Gal tech incredible hipfire weapons - perfect for their playstyle to cover distance and then gun down enemies at close range. Without the need to ADS they can strafe faster and be more deadly up close and perhaps even mid range.
Uhh... Exactly three Gallente weapons will be affected by it. One will barely see any effect. The other isn't even released yet.
The third already has such a tight hip fire it's pointless.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
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RuckingFetard
Better Hide R Die
699
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Posted - 2014.02.08 13:15:00 -
[55] - Quote
MINA Longstrike wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:MINA Longstrike wrote:Honestly I'd love to see gallente get +10% armor repairer efficacy per level - basic reps will fiction like adv with proto assault skill, adv will function like proto, and proto is "don't let this guy out of your sight ever", it really fits the races close quarters doctrine and would potentially let an assault run around with 2 reppers, 3 plates and a shotgun and have it be really viable.
I mean ideally the dropsuit skill should make every suit you wear in that category do what it does better - the current s outs and future scouts are like this, the future logis are very much like this as are the future heavies... Some of the assaults just seem a little left behind.
I love the minmatar bonuses, I love the amarr bonuses, the caldari and gallente need a bit of work. How about 5% instead? That's what the current Amarr Logi gets, I don't know why you think it should be doubled just because its an assault suit. Current logi also gets +1hp/sec on top of that, without that it amounts to about 2.5hp/sec if you're running 2 proto reps The more I think of it, the more I believe that assaults should get bonus to their race's weapons, rather than bonuses to modules and the like
Running pure shield tanked Caldari 'cuz me a hippy
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Chunky Munkey
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
3072
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Posted - 2014.02.08 13:22:00 -
[56] - Quote
I was only just coming to terms with the heat reduction on my Amarr suit being removed. Now it's back!?
But that Caldari bonus is bogus. It's only going be useful at the ranges Rail Rifles are already too effective at.
No.
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Squagga
The State Protectorate
173
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Posted - 2014.02.08 14:01:00 -
[57] - Quote
I like where Cat went with this. So what racial bonuses do people want? As always I would like a bigger cod piecee
Reloading, the silent killer.
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Jaysyn Larrisen
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
734
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Posted - 2014.02.08 14:32:00 -
[58] - Quote
Nice thread, guys.
No issue with Amarr or Minmatar - the directly shore up a drawback to their racial weapons.
The Gallente bonus is a nice try, maybe a bit off the mark, to highlight CQC strength of their playstyle...I would recommend a slight ROF and dispersion buff.
The Caldari bonus is waaay bad; it doesn't address either the racial playstyle or rail weapon drawbacks. Recommendation is to have a 7% reduction in rail tech weapon charges time per level. This is on par with the Amarr and Mini bonuses.
"Endless money forms the sinews of War." - Cicero
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Neo Rinzler
Commando Perkone Caldari State
9
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Posted - 2014.02.08 14:36:00 -
[59] - Quote
Broonfondle Majikthies wrote:I don't know..
I don't use the RR (so ignore if you feel this makes my opinion invalid) but from what I've seen one of the main ways I've countered a RR user is forcing them to expend their ammo and taking them out on the reload. Also bear in mind the rifle is getting a reduction so you will likely be reloading more often.
As for the dispersion. To me that will make all the Gal tech incredible hipfire weapons - perfect for their playstyle to cover distance and then gun down enemies at close range. Without the need to ADS they can strafe faster and be more deadly up close and perhaps even mid range.
ROF/Range increase would be a much better bonus ... RR already have a reload speed reduction as a skill in the RR tree and therefore the benefit is extremely minor and compared to the other bonuses especially the Amarrian bonus it is extremely UP ... |
Squagga
The State Protectorate
174
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Posted - 2014.02.08 14:37:00 -
[60] - Quote
Ashelia Skybrooke wrote:I'm suddenly SUPER glad I didn't skill into Caldari assault all of the sudden. This character is built to tank the hell out of shields sooo.... Caldari heavy it is!
What .. what the .. CCP is turning our own people against us!
Reloading, the silent killer.
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