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[Request] Multiple Character ISK Farming

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Glass Zeraki The Phoenix Federation 9	Posted - 2014.02.04 16:56:00 - [1] - Quote Alright let me explain what I mean. Some players in this game have multiple PSN accounts. They create 3 new characters on Dust with each of their PSN accounts. Each new character starts out with 250,000 ISK, right? So they just transfer that money to their main Dust character and then delete the new ones. Wash, rinse, and repeat. It's an exploit, to be sure. One solution a friend of mine came up with is for there to be a minimum amount of ISK you can transfer between characters. Say 500,000 ISK. It would make exploiters have to actaully play with those new characters to earn enough to transfer, which would in theory discourage them to do it. Any other ideas to stop this exploit?
Michael Epic The Neutral Zone 254	Posted - 2014.02.04 17:39:00 - [2] - Quote What's the point in stopping it? What does it hurt? Name one negative thing about it..... Does it affect you in battle? No. Because the weapons used are earned and upgraded in SP by grinding it out. Factional Warfare makes us go practically bankrupt because it doesn't pay isk and duvolle's and rail rifles and combat rifles and the like are expensive. Proto suits are expensive...hell, everything is expensive for what's paid in pubs. So what does it hurt? The more serious problem is the vets who go into the battle academy with new characters and stomp the hell out of new players and turn them off from expanding the player base. Why don't you pick that to complain about? The isk farming exploit is one of the only things in this game that is totally fair to every single person. Anyone can do it....and everyone can do it. So honestly...I don't see the problem. If you don't like it, don't do it....but don't use your bias to rain on everyone else's parade. EDIT: oh yeah and that wouldn't discourage users from doing it....because you get into the battle academy, go 46/4 and get paid 300,000 isk so that doubles what you start with....messing with the isk farming would increase the battle academy stomping and double the problem of losing potential new players.
Glass Zeraki The Phoenix Federation 9	Posted - 2014.02.04 18:00:00 - [3] - Quote Sigh...the people that do this are manipulating the game to their advantage and are gaining ISK in a way that was never intended. Secondly, this could be game-breaking when the player market opens. Put simply, you should only be able to earn ISK by actually playing the game, which means participating in battles.
Michael Epic The Neutral Zone 255	Posted - 2014.02.04 18:28:00 - [4] - Quote Glass Zeraki wrote: Sigh...the people that do this are manipulating the game to their advantage and are gaining ISK in a way that was never intended. Secondly, this could be game-breaking when the player market opens. Put simply, you should only be able to earn ISK by actually playing the game, which means participating in battles. You seriously think that CCP isn't smart enough to realize this would have happened? You don't think they sat down in a meeting room to decide new features to add to the game and when "Give Money" came up they didn't assume that the isk farming of new accounts would happen? Why do you think the "Give Money" feature was even added? In a game that is so cutthroat and played by such petty people that they redline snipe you WITH A TANK or camp you at a CRU or anything else...what? People are gonna grind it out in starter fittings or low tier gear and when you come along pissing and moaning that you're out of money for proto suits they're gonna be like aw poor baby here's 10,000,00 isk buddy daddy make it better? I doubt it. The "Give Money" feature was created and implemented in the game as an unspoken way around the money troubles. They can't come right out and say it....because that's no bueno, but its the only thing that makes sense. So no one is manipulating a thing, holmes. They're using the tools that are available to create what they need. If I laid out in front of you enough metal and tools to create a canopener forged by hand and you made the coolest can opener ever...how would you feel if I came along and told you that you're manipulating the world and you're cheating a company by not buying their can opener....wouldn't that sound outlandish and ridiculous to you? Case and point.
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 1850	Posted - 2014.02.04 18:32:00 - [5] - Quote 250k ISK really isn't that much. It's like 1-2 battles, it's hardly worth the time to do it. "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Forum Warrior lv.1 Amarr victor!
Michael Epic The Neutral Zone 255	Posted - 2014.02.04 18:42:00 - [6] - Quote John Demonsbane wrote: 250k ISK really isn't that much. It's like 1-2 battles, it's hardly worth the time to do it. One battle = 15-18 minutes (search time, loading time, que time, play time, ending time, loading back to merc quarters time) 150-250k isk. One account = 6 minutes start to finish, making characters, loading screens, dumping isk, ect 750,000isk 6, 12, 18 = 750,000 x 3 = 2.25 million isk in the same amount of time as one battle. Yeah, sorry holmes lol but you're as wrong as wrong can possibly be.
Michael Epic The Neutral Zone 255	Posted - 2014.02.04 18:58:00 - [7] - Quote Also....HELLO!? Aurum. Lets say its someones birthday and they get $500 from relatives and they spend it all on PSN cards and get all the best stuff 1,000 times over and stomp you with it...should we outlaw aurum? That wasn't earned in battle and is a "manipulation" of the system by your method of thinking. They aren't participating in battles to get that stuff...so what says you about that? EXACT SAME PRINCIPAL.
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6710	Posted - 2014.02.04 19:20:00 - [8] - Quote In Eve Online, it is a highly-bannable offense to create alts for the purpose of transferring the starter ISK to the main and then deleting the characters to start all over. This is because of the overall impact it has on the secondary market in Eve Online. Keep in mind that the secondary market will be coming to Dust as well and Dust will also one day get involved in industry since both economics and industry go hand and hand. Of course, many of us know that PC has ISK-making problems can cause an economic imbalance which is why we expect PC to get fixed long before the secondary market arrives. Eve players have been caught by CCP doing the exploit and have had their ISK forcibly confiscated while on some more severe instances banned at the same time. If CCP does this to Eve, it stands to reason that they will also do the same in Dust. If there is no policy right now against it in Dust, then expect one very soon as more people bring this up to the front page of many issues. Even if it is allowed, it's highly inefficient as people previously pointed out. The return for doing the exploit is not worth the investment that needs to be put into it. You have to create a new PSN account which requires it's own unique email account (Eve Online allows you to share the same email for separate accounts), then you have to take the time to create a character, and then transfer the ISK. If you don't want to make too many accounts, you'll have to wait 10 hours before biomassing each alt once the "terminate" command is given (24 hours in Eve Online). Overall, it's just better to actually play the game since you get more ISK that way anyways. Like I said, if there is currently no policy set against this exploit in Dust then expect one very soon. Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Jackof All-Trades The Black Renaissance 435	Posted - 2014.02.04 19:20:00 - [9] - Quote Make ISK Non-transferable till you're out of academy. Okay, done, next. "Pulvis et umbra sums." We are but dust and shadow GÇò Horace, The Odes of Horace \ Omni-Specialist / Focus: Gallente
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6710	Posted - 2014.02.04 19:22:00 - [10] - Quote Jackof All-Trades wrote: Make ISK Non-transferable till you're out of academy. Okay, done, next. Alternative Idea: CCP should utilize their security team to track and analyze these types of ISK transactions and use that instead to ban the player and confiscate the ISK like they do in Eve Online. They have been doing this for 11 years to track bot users and illegal RMT (real-money trade) operations in Eve. They can even find and link two seemingly unrelated accounts together via the ISK transaction history alone. They have complex algorithms for this. Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*

Disaster Fox The Neutral Zone 1	Posted - 2014.02.04 19:29:00 - [11] - Quote I don't feel like this is a manipulation or an exploit....its just a byproduct of an implemented feature. I feel like you're all wrong but Michael is right (what up michael?) that in the time it takes to do 1 skirmish or domination you can bank 2.25 million isk I'd rather do that, honestly than grind it out for measly isk in pubs
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6710	Posted - 2014.02.04 19:32:00 - [12] - Quote Disaster Fox wrote: I don't feel like this is a manipulation or an exploit....its just a byproduct of an implemented feature. I feel like you're all wrong but Michael is right (what up michael?) that in the time it takes to do 1 skirmish or domination you can bank 2.25 million isk I'd rather do that, honestly than grind it out for measly isk in pubs I'm not wrong about Eve Online. If you do this in Eve, you'll see that ISK disappear into the black hole of no return as CCP goes into your wallet and takes away the amount of money you farmed from your alts in this manner. I expect CCP to do the same with Dust if they haven't already. Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Disaster Fox The Neutral Zone 1	Posted - 2014.02.04 19:37:00 - [13] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Disaster Fox wrote: I don't feel like this is a manipulation or an exploit....its just a byproduct of an implemented feature. I feel like you're all wrong but Michael is right (what up michael?) that in the time it takes to do 1 skirmish or domination you can bank 2.25 million isk I'd rather do that, honestly than grind it out for measly isk in pubs I'm not wrong about Eve Online. If you do this in Eve, you'll see that ISK disappear into the black hole of no return as CCP goes into your wallet and takes away the amount of money you farmed from your alts in this manner. I expect CCP to do the same with Dust if they haven't already. I didn't mean about EVE. I don't play EVE so I don't know but to my understanding isn't it $15 a month to play EVE? So if you make alt accts using alt emails for the 14 day trial just to make isk, isn't that effectively stealing from the company by not paying to play their game? Anyone would do that for you playing their game that costs money for free because then there goes jobs and the budget to develop and maintain the game. Dust is free...cost nothing to play it, don't think that's the same thing. At least it doesn't seem like the same thing.
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6711	Posted - 2014.02.04 19:44:00 - [14] - Quote Disaster Fox wrote: Dust is free...cost nothing to play it, don't think that's the same thing. At least it doesn't seem like the same thing. You're correct on the difference between Dust and Eve. However, Eve Online's economy will one day merge with that of Dust and that will affect everyone on both sides. Therefore it makes sense to establish the same policy about this issue in Dust like they do in Eve. Notice that the key part of this issue is the economy. Dust doesn't have one yet, but it will soon and when it comes it will be impacted by this exploit. PS: Don't underestimate the genius of the inhabitants of New Eden. If there is an exploit, they will find it and "exploit it". Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Disaster Fox The Neutral Zone 1	Posted - 2014.02.04 19:55:00 - [15] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Disaster Fox wrote: Dust is free...cost nothing to play it, don't think that's the same thing. At least it doesn't seem like the same thing. You're correct on the difference between Dust and Eve. However, Eve Online's economy will one day merge with that of Dust and that will affect everyone on both sides. Therefore it makes sense to establish the same policy about this issue in Dust like they do in Eve. Notice that the key part of this issue is the economy. Dust doesn't have one yet, but it will soon and when it comes it will be impacted by this exploit. PS: Don't underestimate the genius of the inhabitants of New Eden. If there is an exploit, they will find it and "exploit it". In my opinion if they did impact that feature/glitch/manipulation when further combining Eve and Dust, that would make perfect sense but the game would need balance and tanks would need not to rule the battlefield any longer driving so fast and all of the other problems. There would need to be isk making modes for infantry only, team deathmatch style....as of now it is not fair to try to make any isk when you get protostomped by nyan san/chan and lose 10x what you make unless you AFK and take the joystick every few minutes. So before someone strips away or complains about the only real way to make money in this game and restock things, they need to first fix all the things that cause people to do that in the first place.
Michael Epic The Neutral Zone 256	Posted - 2014.02.04 20:00:00 - [16] - Quote So....THIS IS WHAT THE FOX SAYS!? (sorry bro, couldn't resist lol) I actually agree with you though haha if they fix the need to farm isk with multiple characters by fixing the balance problems then people might stop doing that so much...idk, I'm not them.
Spartan MK420 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 181	Posted - 2014.02.04 20:16:00 - [17] - Quote it's a waste of time doing this. iId rather just mow down some proto's in my dren heavy suit with a rail rifle. Much more fun, and satisfying. Official Unofficial D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N team mascot.
Galvan Nized Deep Space Republic 580	Posted - 2014.02.04 20:33:00 - [18] - Quote Disaster Fox wrote: I don't feel like this is a manipulation or an exploit....its just a byproduct of an implemented feature. I feel like you're all wrong but Michael is right (what up michael?) that in the time it takes to do 1 skirmish or domination you can bank 2.25 million isk I'd rather do that, honestly than grind it out for measly isk in pubs While possible, you do have to delete a character and that takes 10 hours. So you might do this twice a day. Now that does add up but if CCP doesn't notice an account deleting all of its characters twice a day then they are pretty thick skulled. Giving money leaves a nice trail. Just think if you had another few PS3s, you could make 100s of Millions every day doing nothing.
Emperor1349 Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 9	Posted - 2014.02.04 20:42:00 - [19] - Quote What the hell is isk? Are you trying to tell me i can buy stuff to use besides the starter suits? R.I.P Mag - SVER
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 1854	Posted - 2014.02.04 20:48:00 - [20] - Quote Michael Epic wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: 250k ISK really isn't that much. It's like 1-2 battles, it's hardly worth the time to do it. One battle = 15-18 minutes (search time, loading time, que time, play time, ending time, loading back to merc quarters time) 150-250k isk. One account = 6 minutes start to finish, making characters, loading screens, dumping isk, ect 750,000isk 6, 12, 18 = 750,000 x 3 = 2.25 million isk in the same amount of time as one battle. Yeah, sorry holmes lol but you're as wrong as wrong can possibly be. That sounds awfully fast to make a PSN, open dust, make 3 chars, and dump the isk in 6 minutes. Sounds like you know a little too much about this.... hmm.... "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Forum Warrior lv.1 Amarr victor!

Sylwester Dziewiecki Interregnum. 260	Posted - 2014.02.04 21:01:00 - [21] - Quote This is trial account limitations in EVE: https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Trial_account_limitations I think that we need to have some kind of stasis period of time for new Dust characters that prevent them to transfer money between characters. It can not be limited by amount of WP, because it will force them to grid Academy, and it may be harmful for real new players. I think that 7days in with character can not: transfer money to other players, and transfer corporation money to other players, is enough to prevent exploiting this this 'new character' thing. I'm here since may 2012, my EVE alter ego is Nosum Hseebnrido.
Michael Epic The Neutral Zone 257	Posted - 2014.02.04 21:11:00 - [22] - Quote John Demonsbane wrote: Michael Epic wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: 250k ISK really isn't that much. It's like 1-2 battles, it's hardly worth the time to do it. One battle = 15-18 minutes (search time, loading time, que time, play time, ending time, loading back to merc quarters time) 150-250k isk. One account = 6 minutes start to finish, making characters, loading screens, dumping isk, ect 750,000isk 6, 12, 18 = 750,000 x 3 = 2.25 million isk in the same amount of time as one battle. Yeah, sorry holmes lol but you're as wrong as wrong can possibly be. That sounds awfully fast to make a PSN, open dust, make 3 chars, and dump the isk in 6 minutes. Sounds like you know a little too much about this.... hmm.... Dude, you don't need a valid email address to get a psn...you can literally type whatever into it and once you add an account and make the psn...you have them indefinitely. So yeah..start to finish, 6 minutes. Its actually more like 5 minutes 40 seconds especially if you use a keyboard. Your PS3 can hold up to 16 accounts, so 15 besides your main gaming account.


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