Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Orin the Freak
The Solecism of Limitation
689
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 19:27:00 -
[1] - Quote
My complaint about what I've seen so far from 1.8 stats (yes, I know they are "flexible", thats why I'm posting this) are that Gallente and Caldari are getting the royal treatment, and Minmatar and (to a lesser extent) Amarr are getting shat on.
Allow me to elaborate a bit.
Gallente is getting the old (current) passive armor rep for every suit.
G Heavies get the most popular resistances (Rail Rifles, anything Minmatar), and they are going to have 4 lows, which are easily the most versatile slot in the game!
G Scouts have 3 passive armor reps, and the lowest scan profile amongst scout suits, which is a HUGE deal.
G logis, if the rumors are to be believed, are getting enhanced scanning abilities, to pick up anything BUT G-scouts, or highly-gimped other scouts (due to having to use multiple complex dampeners)
Caldari have that ridiculous heavy with the 1 second shield charge delay!
Now... Minmatar Heavy gets resistances to all the scrambler rifle spam, and blaster rifles, of which you might see one or two per game. Not to mention, the negligible 20 point speed increase, which is paid for by about 90 less EHP, and will be completely negated when you consider Gallente's 4 lows for KinCats/armor mods. Minmatar at proto level get 3/2 H/L which is a serious disadvantage.
Then theres the Minmatar scout, which is inferior in almost every way to the Gallente. Something just screams unfair about all this Gallente love. Personally, I feel the current bonuses are good enough. Why take away logi's passive armor rep, and give it to ONLY the Gallente, but in ALL their suits?
Truthfully, if CCP were to not include the scan profile bonuses to gallente, OR, make that the scout bonus, instead of, or alongside the stupid cloak stuff, then I would have few complaints about the scouts.
I'd like to see some serious tweaking to the entire gallente lineup. it seems all the other races are getting relatively "situational" bonuses, like melee damage or repair tools, or nanohives, where Gallente are getting bonuses towards the most powerful piece of equipment on the field, the scanner!
Seems to me like a conspiracy! :P (but seriously, in the interest of ballance and fairness, please re-evaluate the Gallente's scanner bonuses, and the Minmatar speed to EHP ratio!) |
Atiim
Living Like Larry Schwag
3890
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 19:31:00 -
[2] - Quote
...
Next On To-Do List:
Particle Cannons
|
Master Smurf
Nos Nothi
41
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 19:37:00 -
[3] - Quote
Preach!!!
I would be fine reading other interpretations of the new suits but just looking at things, Gallente look to be sitting pretty.
"Shine bright like a diamond"
|
Vapor Forseti
THE-TITANS
17
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 19:39:00 -
[4] - Quote
Their ARs are terrible now. Might as well make up for it.
The Captain of THE-TITANS and proud Militia Pub Stomper.
|
CLONE117
planetary retaliation organisation ACME Holding Conglomerate
602
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 19:42:00 -
[5] - Quote
a 1 second recharge delay for the caldari heavy?
that should be changed to 3-4. depending on how much shielding its going to have.
edit: depending on how much armor and shield recharge rate of the caldari heavy.. |
Ghost Kaisar
Titans of Phoenix Legacy Rising
2263
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 19:42:00 -
[6] - Quote
G Heavies won't have a resistance to Nova Knives.
Just sayin. A full charge swipe will seriously wound a G heavy (within around 200 eHP of life), and another quick slash will kill him.
G scouts having a 3 hp/s is nice, but in no way OP.
G Logi's will still have a hell of a time scanning scouts. My scout can run 1 complex damp, and will be almost undetectable while cloaked (exceptions being the Gal Logi Focused)
Cal Heavy needs that 1 second depleted. It's a shield heavy. Shields can't be repped, and a Cal Heavy without shields is a dead heavy. Also gives them a bit of protection from fluxes.
As for the Gal Scout being better than the M Scout (or other scouts), just remember this. They all have their own unique strengths now. They can be versatile, but overall, it is moot to compare them.
Nothing says "F**K YOU!" like a direct Flaylock to the face.
Minmatar. In Rust we trust.
|
shaman oga
Nexus Balusa Horizon
1389
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 19:45:00 -
[7] - Quote
Generally have a lot of lows helps, but it depends on your playstyle. Caldari scout will be a real pain in the ass, quick HP regen and passive scan help him. Minnie scout with the bonus on hacking are good too, they are also faster than other scouts. Heavies are more or less balanced between each other, caldari is more self sustaining, minmatar is a mobile heavy, gallente and amarr are more for point defense and they need a logi, commando.
How many class have you played?
1.8 it's so secret that nobody know what will be in it, even after patch notes...
|
Ghost Kaisar
Titans of Phoenix Legacy Rising
2264
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 19:51:00 -
[8] - Quote
CLONE117 wrote:a 1 second recharge delay for the caldari heavy?
that should be changed to 3-4. depending on how much shielding its going to have.
Here is a Cal Sentinel with 3x Complex Shields, 1x Complex Recharger, and 1x Complex Regulator.
874 Shields, 487 Armor ( 1361eHP)
44.5 hp/s Shield Recharge.
2.9s Delay. 1.09s Depleted.
It also still has 199 CPU and 53 PG leftover.
You're welcome.
This thing can take 700 points of damage, and recover from that in ~18.5s WITHOUT a Logi.
Nothing says "F**K YOU!" like a direct Flaylock to the face.
Minmatar. In Rust we trust.
|
Scheneighnay McBob
Learning Coalition College
3680
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 19:52:00 -
[9] - Quote
Minmatar sentinel: resistance to shotguns and plasma cannons, which I assure you will be far more common with cloaking. Minmatar Scout: Extra knife damage is awesome, and high hacking speed is incredibly useful.
Also if you put 3 reps on a gallente scout, you are a massive dumbass.
I am your scan error.
|
Orin the Freak
The Solecism of Limitation
689
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 19:56:00 -
[10] - Quote
I have played all the classes to some extent, but most fluent with logi.
At any rate, I was looking into going into a new class after 1.8 hit.
also, Ghost Kaisar, G logis will not have a hell of a time scanning scouts. Unless, said scout uses almost all his lows for complex dampeners. However, Gal scouts won't have to waste a slot on a complex dampener, OR a repper. They get both as a bonus for using Gallente suits. all the other suits will need roughly 3 damps to stop all but the best scanners. That leaves no room for any KinCats or anything else.
It's too early to declare it OP, but I can tell it's going to be the most useful scout, as all of it's bonuses are relevant in EVERY battle. Melee damage bonus is nothing if you use guns. The hack speed is nice, but you're a scout... if you stop moving for 2 seconds, you're dead. All the other scouts have bonuses that help them at all times. Minmatar is the only scout with bonuses that are situation-dependent. Why not the hack speed, and a bonus to drugs? (kincats and the like) |
|
CLONE117
planetary retaliation organisation ACME Holding Conglomerate
602
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 19:57:00 -
[11] - Quote
44.5 shield recharge when the amarr heavy gets 17.
i wonder how much more hp this is with dropsuit armor and shield upgrades maxed.
it takes a round 30secs to a minute to rep 600 shields an the armarr suits. this is going to be 2x faster than that. |
Master Smurf
Nos Nothi
42
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:00:00 -
[12] - Quote
Where I differ from Ghost
If you arent going to HP tank your scout, A gallente scout looks great as it can fit all the good stuff and can always be at full strength without help. Given its bonuses it really is a good lone wolf imo
I dont see how you guys are downplaying the rep.
A scout is never going to be in a sustained fight. It isnt for that. It allows them to constantly recharge between engagements without having to seek rep or supply depot. Its essentially a 5th low slot.
I used to run a basic reactive sometimes and it came in handy and that was 1 hp/s. When you need to evade and jump off ledges that little can come in handy if you are already hurt. You also know you can go into each engagement fully charged.
Couple that with their dampening and range and also since Scouts get another equipment spot they may be able to forego a compact hive and get more ammo because they dont need hp
Its a great bonus to have innately.
"Shine bright like a diamond"
|
Medic 1879
Forsaken Immortals Top Men.
1646
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:01:00 -
[13] - Quote
Gallente heavies getting a passive 1hp/s armour rep is hardly going to be game breaking.
Lead Diplomat for Forsaken Immortals.
|
Orin the Freak
The Solecism of Limitation
690
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:01:00 -
[14] - Quote
Scheneighnay McBob wrote:Minmatar sentinel: resistance to shotguns and plasma cannons, which I assure you will be far more common with cloaking. Minmatar Scout: Extra knife damage is awesome, and high hacking speed is incredibly useful.
Also if you put 3 reps on a gallente scout, you are a massive dumbass.
I think you misunderstood about the passive armor rep. It's inherent to the suit. read the post https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=136370&find=unread
Gallente Scouts get a passive, built in 3 armor rep. Much like how currently logi's have passive armor rep.
no modules required. |
GLOBAL RAGE
Consolidated Dust
15
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:02:00 -
[15] - Quote
I think Caldari are getting weaker, assault are losing 5% recharge bonus, and the adv. logi is gimped with the cpu penalty. the Cal heavy's only ranged weapon will be an RR, using an HMG will be suicide. Flux grenades will be flying and equipment ie nano's will have a 1 minute life span. |
Orin the Freak
The Solecism of Limitation
690
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:09:00 -
[16] - Quote
Medic 1879 wrote:Gallente heavies getting a passive 1hp/s armour rep is hardly going to be game breaking.
Then why is it there in the first place? Currently passive armor rep is for EVERY logi.
taking that away, and saying "now if you want this, you're going to have to spec into gallente" is just .. bad.
That said, I understand Gal are supposed to be the armor masters in DUST.
So I will grant them that. BUT...
Armor, AND scan proficiency? Scanners are, and will continue to be the single MOST USED equipment on the battlefield. I see maybe one knifer in every 2 to 3 games, sometimes they have a friend.
I dunno, I just think Minmatar is getting boned. particularly when it comes to scouts. Hacking speed is nice, but only if I'm hacking. completely useless in ambush, or any future mode where hacking isn't useful.
but all the other racials are useful in any mode. how is this balanced? |
Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
5927
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:09:00 -
[17] - Quote
Amarr are getting their eHP difference increased (+50HP instead of +30HP), and are getting their slot back. They're keeping their high stamina.
And the only downside is slower speed. I'm sorry but I don't see how it's bad.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
|
Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
5927
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:11:00 -
[18] - Quote
Orin the Freak wrote:Medic 1879 wrote:Gallente heavies getting a passive 1hp/s armour rep is hardly going to be game breaking. Then why is it there in the first place? Currently passive armor rep is for EVERY logi. taking that away, and saying "now if you want this, you're going to have to spec into gallente" is just .. bad. That said, I understand Gal are supposed to be the armor masters in DUST. So I will grant them that. BUT... Armor, AND scan proficiency? Scanners are, and will continue to be the single MOST USED equipment on the battlefield. I see maybe one knifer in every 2 to 3 games, sometimes they have a friend. I dunno, I just think Minmatar is getting boned. particularly when it comes to scouts. Hacking speed is nice, but only if I'm hacking. completely useless in ambush, or any future mode where hacking isn't useful. but all the other racials are useful in any mode. how is this balanced? Scanners have been nerfed hard. There are no longer 360 spins, and the target visiblity time vs recharge time has been tweaked, so it rechargers for three times the scan duration.
And Gallente aren't armor masters, Gallente are Armor REGENERATION masters. Amarr are armor eHP masters, and they're being turned into that in 1.8.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
|
Ghermard-ol Dizeriois
Maphia Clan Corporation
111
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:12:00 -
[19] - Quote
IMO all Caldari suits should benefit of a smaller shield recharge delay, not only the Heavy. Unless CCP removes Flux grenades of course.
If you are an hacker, a cheater o a glitcher, you deserve death. In real life.
|
Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
5927
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:12:00 -
[20] - Quote
GLOBAL RAGE wrote:I think Caldari are getting weaker, assault are losing 5% recharge bonus, and the adv. logi is gimped with the cpu penalty. the Cal heavy's only ranged weapon will be an RR, using an HMG will be suicide. Flux grenades will be flying and equipment ie nano's will have a 1 minute life span. Caldari heavy recharge rate: 30hp/s. Caldari scout recharge rate: 50hp/s Caldari Assault propable recharge rate: 40hp/s
Current Caldari assault + Recharge bonus = 31hp/s.
Caldari heavies have a 1 second depleted recharge time, which means that even though fluxes will be flying around, they will start recharging uber quickly.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
|
|
Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
1726
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:13:00 -
[21] - Quote
Ok let me clarify some things for you.
"Gallente is getting the old (current) passive armor rep for every suit." 1 HP/second for Gallente Heavy. That will take 8 minutes, 45 seconds to completely rep with no modules or HP skills. It's a token bonus that does effectively nothing. This is not a skill that goes up per level, Gallente heavies get this 1HP passive rep and that's it.
3hp/second for Gallente scouts. Considering limited slots and resources, this is so they don't fall behind the Caldari and Minmatar scouts in terms of HP regeneration. Considering how fast shield recharge is? 3hp/second is quite crappy in comparison.
"G Heavies get the most popular resistances (Rail Rifles, anything Minmatar), and they are going to have 4 lows, which are easily the most versatile slot in the game!"
So when a ton of people roll Gallente Sentinel, do you think people will continue to use RR and CR as much when the G Sentinel is resisting their damage? No. People will use a different damage type that does more damage. The Sentinels in a way encourage diversity of damage type.
G Sentinels also have the lowest damage output of any Sentinel with only 1 high slot.
"G Scouts have 3 passive armor reps, and the lowest scan profile amongst scout suits, which is a HUGE deal."
Gallente's role is typically scanning and other targeting electronics, this is similar to how it is in EVE. Gallente suits are simply going to always be the best at scanning and avoiding being scanned. In exchange they give up other advantages that other scouts get such as stamina and better cloaking abilities. Is it a valuable bonus? Of course, but it doesn't mean its the ONLY good one.
"G logis, if the rumors are to be believed, are getting enhanced scanning abilities, to pick up anything BUT G-scouts, or highly-gimped other scouts (due to having to use multiple complex dampeners)"
Again, Gallente are always going to be the best with scanning. However in order to gain this ability they sacrifice other support roles such as armor repair, uplink efficacy, and nanohives. Useful, but not the only useful bonus.
"Caldari have that ridiculous heavy with the 1 second shield charge delay!"
It's a 4 second delay, 1 second depletion delay. Dev already stated that the 1 second part was a typo. Chill out.
"Now... Minmatar Heavy gets resistances to all the scrambler rifle spam, and blaster rifles, of which you might see one or two per game. Not to mention, the negligible 20 point speed increase, which is paid for by about 90 less EHP, and will be completely negated when you consider Gallente's 4 lows for KinCats/armor mods. Minmatar at proto level get 3/2 H/L which is a serious disadvantage."
Higher sprint speed with 2 low modules for armor/speed mods and then a shitload of damage with 3 highs? Minmatar will be fast, hard hitting Sentinels that will require a different kind of playstyle than other Sentinels but is valid nonetheless.
1.8 Sentinels
Damage Efficiency
Effective HP
|
Orin the Freak
The Solecism of Limitation
690
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:14:00 -
[22] - Quote
Yes, scanners are getting a much needed nerf. Yet they will still be the most used, and useful piece of equipment on the battlefield. |
Alena Ventrallis
The Neutral Zone
502
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:14:00 -
[23] - Quote
Ghost Kaisar wrote:CLONE117 wrote:a 1 second recharge delay for the caldari heavy?
that should be changed to 3-4. depending on how much shielding its going to have. Here is a Cal Sentinel with 3x Complex Shields, 1x Complex Recharger, and 1x Complex Regulator. 874 Shields, 487 Armor ( 1361eHP) 44.5 hp/s Shield Recharge. 2.9s Delay. 1.09s Depleted. It also still has 199 CPU and 53 PG leftover. You're welcome. This thing can take 700 points of damage, and recover from that in ~18.5s WITHOUT a Logi. Because there is NO Logi for shields.
Give me a shield rep tool, and I'll say your argument holds water. Til then, I say keep the recharge rates. |
Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
5927
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:15:00 -
[24] - Quote
Ghermard-ol Dizeriois wrote:IMO all Caldari suits should benefit of a smaller shield recharge delay, not only the Heavy. Unless CCP removes Flux grenades of course.
I love how people whine about Flux grenades when in reality they have no use on anything smaller than a heavy. Locus grenades do so much damage that no medium frame shields can take the blow. A flux would do around the same damage.
Flux grenades are mainly AV, anti heavy and anti equipment.
Everything else Core Locus is better.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
|
Joel II X
Dah Gods O Bacon
643
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:16:00 -
[25] - Quote
Minmatar gets hacking bonus in scout. That's cool. |
Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
5927
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:16:00 -
[26] - Quote
Orin the Freak wrote:Yes, scanners are getting a much needed nerf. Yet they will still be the most used, and useful piece of equipment on the battlefield. Doubt it, their nerf is very heavy, I don't think scanners will be a "MUST HAVE" anymore.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
|
Cody Sietz
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
2075
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:19:00 -
[27] - Quote
Master Smurf wrote:Preach!!!
I would be fine reading other interpretations of the new suits but just looking at things, Gallente look to be sitting pretty. Well, the scout in General was bad, be it Minmatar or Gallente. Though the GalScout may be our next FotM.
The Gallente heavy gets the LEAST dmg output.
And the Gallente Assault has been crappy since it came out(I went into it as soon as it was introduced)
Gallente Logi will still be broken in 1.8
"I do agree with you there though. shudders"
-Arkena Wyrnspire
|
DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
10339
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:21:00 -
[28] - Quote
One race to rule them all
Videos / Fiction
Closed Beta Vet; Incubus Pilot
|
Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
5929
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:23:00 -
[29] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:One race to rule them all To be fair, we were underpowered as **** during Uprising release, so even if Gallente do become FOTM for a bit, it's about time :P
/me is just kidding, don't take it too seriously butthurt people
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
Tuna > Tacos
|
Orin the Freak
The Solecism of Limitation
690
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 20:23:00 -
[30] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:Ok let me clarify some things for you.
"Gallente is getting the old (current) passive armor rep for every suit." 1 HP/second for Gallente Heavy. That will take 8 minutes, 45 seconds to completely rep with no modules or HP skills. It's a token bonus that does effectively nothing. This is not a skill that goes up per level, Gallente heavies get this 1HP passive rep and that's it.
3hp/second for Gallente scouts. Considering limited slots and resources, this is so they don't fall behind the Caldari and Minmatar scouts in terms of HP regeneration. Considering how fast shield recharge is? 3hp/second is quite crappy in comparison.
"G Heavies get the most popular resistances (Rail Rifles, anything Minmatar), and they are going to have 4 lows, which are easily the most versatile slot in the game!"
So when a ton of people roll Gallente Sentinel, do you think people will continue to use RR and CR as much when the G Sentinel is resisting their damage? No. People will use a different damage type that does more damage. The Sentinels in a way encourage diversity of damage type.
G Sentinels also have the lowest damage output of any Sentinel with only 1 high slot.
"G Scouts have 3 passive armor reps, and the lowest scan profile amongst scout suits, which is a HUGE deal."
Gallente's role is typically scanning and other targeting electronics, this is similar to how it is in EVE. Gallente suits are simply going to always be the best at scanning and avoiding being scanned. In exchange they give up other advantages that other scouts get such as stamina and better cloaking abilities. Is it a valuable bonus? Of course, but it doesn't mean its the ONLY good one.
"G logis, if the rumors are to be believed, are getting enhanced scanning abilities, to pick up anything BUT G-scouts, or highly-gimped other scouts (due to having to use multiple complex dampeners)"
Again, Gallente are always going to be the best with scanning. However in order to gain this ability they sacrifice other support roles such as armor repair, uplink efficacy, and nanohives. Useful, but not the only useful bonus.
"Caldari have that ridiculous heavy with the 1 second shield charge delay!"
It's a 4 second delay, 1 second depletion delay. Dev already stated that the 1 second part was a typo. Chill out.
"Now... Minmatar Heavy gets resistances to all the scrambler rifle spam, and blaster rifles, of which you might see one or two per game. Not to mention, the negligible 20 point speed increase, which is paid for by about 90 less EHP, and will be completely negated when you consider Gallente's 4 lows for KinCats/armor mods. Minmatar at proto level get 3/2 H/L which is a serious disadvantage."
Higher sprint speed with 2 low modules for armor/speed mods and then a shitload of damage with 3 highs? Minmatar will be fast, hard hitting Sentinels that will require a different kind of playstyle than other Sentinels but is valid nonetheless.
"not the only useful one", no, just the MOST useful one.
Minmatar, hard hitting? not as hard hitting as the caldari. Fast? by 20 points, which, when you consider the scale (405 vs. 385), that's hardly anything. I daresay it's negligible. the drop in EHP, and the less popular resistances are going to make the Minmatar heavy obsolete. Why run a minmatar heavy when you could run an assault suit with a rail rifle and run faster, with maybe couple hundred less EHP. if speed is that important.
it almost seems as if you're contradicting me just to be contradictory. at least when you try to shrug off passive armor rep, and scan proficiencies as "not the only useful" when it's fair to say those are THE MOST useful bonuses. |
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |