Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
222
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:08:00 -
[1] - Quote
The CPU to Pg usage in my opinion is imbalanced. CCP said that the cloak would be CPU intensive, however at the rate of 1 pg is worth about 4.7-5.2 cpu on a proto dropsuit, the Pg level is actually higher than cpu, and I can foresee this as causing massive problems for scouts trying to fit it, as most biotic modules for scouts, which is our life blood, are extremely pg intensive, not to mention shields and ferroscales. The Pg costs for the cloak need to be lowered for them to be able to be fitted on scouts who want to use shield modules or kincats, and perhaps raise the cpu cost if you beleive that it is too easy to fit on other suits. Currently, I probably wont even be able to fit the cloak on my minja, due to its low pg levels and high pg demands of the cloak. Please fellow scouts, recognize this problem and assist me in this.
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
|
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
12526
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:11:00 -
[2] - Quote
First lesson all the best omni-soldiers learn quickly.
No suit no matter how much you wish it so; cannot do everything at the same time.
CPM 0 Secretary
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist
\\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
|
Pete B
Blood Unit 13 Zero-Day
86
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:12:00 -
[3] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:The CPU to Pg usage in my opinion is imbalanced. CCP said that the cloak would be CPU intensive, however at the rate of 1 pg is worth about 4.7-5.2 cpu on a proto dropsuit, the Pg level is actually higher than cpu, and I can foresee this as causing massive problems for scouts trying to fit it, as most biotic modules for scouts, which is our life blood, are extremely pg intensive, not to mention shields and ferroscales. The Pg costs for the cloak need to be lowered for them to be able to be fitted on scouts who want to use shield modules or kincats, and perhaps raise the cpu cost if you beleive that it is too easy to fit on other suits. Currently, I probably wont even be able to fit the cloak on my minja, due to its low pg levels and high pg demands of the cloak. Please fellow scouts, recognize this problem and assist me in this.
What is the new scout bonus? |
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
222
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:13:00 -
[4] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:First lesson all the best omni-soldiers learn quickly.
No suit no matter how much you wish it so; cannot do everything at the same time.
This is true, however, I beleive that it is a reasonable request that if i run an adv specialist shotgun, and a basic SMG that I should be able to fit full proto modules and at least an adv cloak, with a stable active scanner, with my fittings skills maxed. This, however is not the case.
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
|
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
222
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:15:00 -
[5] - Quote
Pete B wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:The CPU to Pg usage in my opinion is imbalanced. CCP said that the cloak would be CPU intensive, however at the rate of 1 pg is worth about 4.7-5.2 cpu on a proto dropsuit, the Pg level is actually higher than cpu, and I can foresee this as causing massive problems for scouts trying to fit it, as most biotic modules for scouts, which is our life blood, are extremely pg intensive, not to mention shields and ferroscales. The Pg costs for the cloak need to be lowered for them to be able to be fitted on scouts who want to use shield modules or kincats, and perhaps raise the cpu cost if you beleive that it is too easy to fit on other suits. Currently, I probably wont even be able to fit the cloak on my minja, due to its low pg levels and high pg demands of the cloak. Please fellow scouts, recognize this problem and assist me in this. What is the new scout bonus?
I did take that into account, however it is not enough for the pg usage of the cloak. Cpu usage is fine, but the pg usage is far to high to be usable by scouts who want to be able to sprint fast.
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
|
Clyffton Donovan
Death Firm. Canis Eliminatus Operatives
79
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:16:00 -
[6] - Quote
I think this is absolutely perfect. It keeps it out of the hands of slayer logis and causes scouts(who get the reduction bonus) to build their suits around the cloak, not the REs or weapon.
Director / Combat Medic
Zulu Squad Leader
Invictus Maneo~ "I Remain Unvanquished"
|
True Adamance
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
6122
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:17:00 -
[7] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:First lesson all the best omni-soldiers learn quickly.
No suit no matter how much you wish it so; cannot do everything at the same time.
Indeed.
I consider it a matter of tossing up on how I run my scout between.
Tank, Scan Dampening, Biotics, and Visual Dampening.
I can do 2 on my Amarr A/1 when it is released, at any one time.
"My Faith in you is absolute; my sword is Yours, My God, and Your will guides me now and for all eternity."
|
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
222
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:20:00 -
[8] - Quote
This is my dream fitting with skills maxed out on my minmitar scout. k5 specialist shotgun-8 pg (I beleive) Submachine gun-3 pg 3x Complex Shield extenders-33 pg total 1x Complex profile dampener-0 pg (thankfully) 2xComplex kinetic catalyzers-30 pg total Stable active scanner-6 pg This comes out to a total of 80 pg already, which is the amount a minmitar scout has at maxed out fitting skills Cloak- now unfittable
EDIT: Is it a reasonable request to fit these said items, and a cloak?
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
|
Scott Knight
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
20
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:27:00 -
[9] - Quote
I don't think you should be able to have your dream fitting. The cloak still needs to be balanced. |
Broonfondle Majikthies
Dogs of War Gaming Zero-Day
767
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:28:00 -
[10] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Pete B wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:The CPU to Pg usage in my opinion is imbalanced. CCP said that the cloak would be CPU intensive, however at the rate of 1 pg is worth about 4.7-5.2 cpu on a proto dropsuit, the Pg level is actually higher than cpu, and I can foresee this as causing massive problems for scouts trying to fit it, as most biotic modules for scouts, which is our life blood, are extremely pg intensive, not to mention shields and ferroscales. The Pg costs for the cloak need to be lowered for them to be able to be fitted on scouts who want to use shield modules or kincats, and perhaps raise the cpu cost if you beleive that it is too easy to fit on other suits. Currently, I probably wont even be able to fit the cloak on my minja, due to its low pg levels and high pg demands of the cloak. Please fellow scouts, recognize this problem and assist me in this. What is the new scout bonus? I did take that into account, however it is not enough for the pg usage of the cloak. Cpu usage is fine, but the pg usage is far to high to be usable by scouts who want to be able to sprint fast. Really? I theory crafted a few of my current fits with the cloak and it was quite reasonable. and I tend to overestimate to account for my usual stupidity. I may have to add another level of engineering at some point but it certainly is passable. Also I think a lot of scouts will be running a dampener / range amplifiers, which currently has no PG usage. Then again, in terms of mobility I prefer Cardiac Regs over Kin Cats. Also depending on the 'shimmer' I think it may be best to move slower - our vision, despite our ability to see colour, is still quite movement orientated so a faster object is easier to track at range
"...where Bylothgar the Ill-postured was made King of the People With No Name But Decent Footwear"
|
|
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
222
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:28:00 -
[11] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:First lesson all the best omni-soldiers learn quickly.
No suit no matter how much you wish it so; cannot do everything at the same time.
Also, I dont think i'm trying to do everything by having 3 of the weakest type of hp module in the game so i dont get 2 shotted by a railrifle, a non-proto specialist weapon, a basic sidearm, and 2 prototype sprint enhancers. It is all built around one goal- staying fast, and mobile in combat, while being able to move quickly between encounters. No disrespect intended, I just think that this type of build that the minmitar scout was designed for should be encouraged and not impossible to attain.
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
|
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
222
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:29:00 -
[12] - Quote
Scott Knight wrote:I don't think you should be able to have your dream fitting. The cloak still needs to be balanced.
True, but on my scout, I won't even be able to run a basic cloak, with a maxed out scout skill.
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
|
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
222
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:30:00 -
[13] - Quote
Broonfondle Majikthies wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Pete B wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:The CPU to Pg usage in my opinion is imbalanced. CCP said that the cloak would be CPU intensive, however at the rate of 1 pg is worth about 4.7-5.2 cpu on a proto dropsuit, the Pg level is actually higher than cpu, and I can foresee this as causing massive problems for scouts trying to fit it, as most biotic modules for scouts, which is our life blood, are extremely pg intensive, not to mention shields and ferroscales. The Pg costs for the cloak need to be lowered for them to be able to be fitted on scouts who want to use shield modules or kincats, and perhaps raise the cpu cost if you beleive that it is too easy to fit on other suits. Currently, I probably wont even be able to fit the cloak on my minja, due to its low pg levels and high pg demands of the cloak. Please fellow scouts, recognize this problem and assist me in this. What is the new scout bonus? I did take that into account, however it is not enough for the pg usage of the cloak. Cpu usage is fine, but the pg usage is far to high to be usable by scouts who want to be able to sprint fast. Really? I theory crafted a few of my current fits with the cloak and it was quite reasonable. and I tend to overestimate to account for my usual stupidity. I may have to add another level of engineering at some point but it certainly is passable. Also I think a lot of scouts will be running a dampener / range amplifiers, which currently has no PG usage. Then again, in terms of mobility I prefer Cardiac Regs over Kin Cats. Also depending on the 'shimmer' I think it may be best to move slower - our vision, despite our ability to see colour, is still quite movement orientated so a faster object is easier to track at range
Read my post about my ability to fit modules if i use basic/adv specialist weaponry, along with even a basic cloak. EDIT: try to replace the scanner with a basic cloak:not enough pg. Basic cloak pg=8.75 at maxed out scout skill.
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
|
KING CHECKMATE
Ametat Security Amarr Empire
3980
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:33:00 -
[14] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:The CPU to Pg usage in my opinion is imbalanced. CCP said that the cloak would be CPU intensive, however at the rate of 1 pg is worth about 4.7-5.2 cpu on a proto dropsuit, the Pg level is actually higher than cpu, and I can foresee this as causing massive problems for scouts trying to fit it, as most biotic modules for scouts, which is our life blood, are extremely pg intensive, not to mention shields and ferroscales. The Pg costs for the cloak need to be lowered for them to be able to be fitted on scouts who want to use shield modules or kincats, and perhaps raise the cpu cost if you beleive that it is too easy to fit on other suits. Currently, I probably wont even be able to fit the cloak on my minja, due to its low pg levels and high pg demands of the cloak. Please fellow scouts, recognize this problem and assist me in this.
The new scout bonus is 15% reduction to this 'cloaks' CPU and PG per level. (Reference HERE ) Thats 75% at level 5. Scouts will have to pay 25 CPU instead of 100 and 17 PG instead of 70 PG. The ones who are F*ed are , well, everyone else that is not a scout and would like to abuse the cloak... There ARE ways around this, like using CPU and PG enhancers at the cost for tank ,but well, to each their madness....
GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
|
Scout Registry
Nos Nothi
971
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:33:00 -
[15] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:This is my dream fitting with skills maxed out on my minmitar scout. k5 specialist shotgun-8 pg (I beleive) Submachine gun-3 pg 3x Complex Shield extenders-33 pg total 1x Complex profile dampener-0 pg (thankfully) 2xComplex kinetic catalyzers-30 pg total Stable active scanner-6 pg This comes out to a total of 80 pg already, which is the amount a minmitar scout has at maxed out fitting skills Cloak- now unfittable EDIT: Is it a reasonable request to fit these said items, and a cloak?
I personally don't a Shotgun Scout should find it easy to Shield Tank, Speed Tank and Profile Tank (?) simultaneously.
If you wish to be speedy and durable, don't run cloak. If you to invisible, trade some of your speed and/or durability. Asking for everything all the time is kinda like asking to be a GalLogi.
I very much appreciate the approach CCP has taken in limiting Scout "OP Potential" through CPU and PG. This affords us much more flexibility in our design choices than would the formerly proposed reduction/limitation of slots. |
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
222
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:33:00 -
[16] - Quote
Please dont make me have to spec into gallente to have a viable scout...ill be very sad, as i just recently got m scout level 4 and shield extenders 5...
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
|
KING CHECKMATE
Ametat Security Amarr Empire
3980
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:34:00 -
[17] - Quote
please people , READ.... LOL
GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
|
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
222
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:37:00 -
[18] - Quote
Scout Registry wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:This is my dream fitting with skills maxed out on my minmitar scout. k5 specialist shotgun-8 pg (I beleive) Submachine gun-3 pg 3x Complex Shield extenders-33 pg total 1x Complex profile dampener-0 pg (thankfully) 2xComplex kinetic catalyzers-30 pg total Stable active scanner-6 pg This comes out to a total of 80 pg already, which is the amount a minmitar scout has at maxed out fitting skills Cloak- now unfittable EDIT: Is it a reasonable request to fit these said items, and a cloak? I personally don't a Shotgun Scout should find it easy to Shield Tank, Speed Tank and Profile Tank (?) simultaneously. If you wish to be speedy and durable, don't run cloak. If you to invisible, trade some of your speed and/or durability. Asking for everything all the time is kinda like asking to be a GalLogi. I very much appreciate the approach CCP has taken in limiting Scout "OP Potential" through CPU and PG. This affords us much more flexibility in our design choices than would the formerly proposed reduction/limitation of slots. The profile dampener is to put me under proto scanners, I know nothing other than speed tanking, its all im good at. Please at least let the minja have a buff in pg or something . Right now, Im going to just have to spec into gallente so i can shield, armor, speed, and profile tank with no sacrifices...
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
|
Teilka Darkmist
56
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:38:00 -
[19] - Quote
First, PG and CPU aren't related to each other, there is no ratio of PG to CPU.
Second, Cloak should take loads of PG, it makes you invisible, that should be an enormous power drain.
When I play as a sniper, I'm more likely to be nearer to the opponents redline than my own.
|
Scout Registry
Nos Nothi
971
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:45:00 -
[20] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:The profile dampener is to put me under proto scanners, I know nothing other than speed tanking, its all im good at. Please at least let the minja have a buff in pg or something . Right now, Im going to just have to spec into gallente so i can shield, armor, speed, and profile tank with no sacrifices...
Don't be sad, brother. Just downgrade your KinCat or swap it out for a PG extender. Trading a little land speed for whatever tactical advantage cloak affords very well may be a fair trade. If not, f*ck cloak and stick to cover. You know the drill :-)
CPU/PG restrictions are good for Scouts in the long run. Restrictions will be what keep away the EZ Mode masses. |
|
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
223
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:47:00 -
[21] - Quote
Gallente max pg=74x1.3=96.2 minmitar max pg=62x1.3=80.6 Gallente fitting same weapons=11 pg 3x kincats=45 pg 1x shield=11 1x damage=9 1x ferroscale=IDK stable scanner=6 pg claok=8.75 pg total=90.75+ferroscale pg And now the gallente outruns the minmitar scout, has same profile dampening, a negligible amount of hp less, better scan, can fit a cloak, and the minmitar gets left in the dust..... i might as well delete my character now, as there is nothing to look forward to...
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
|
KING CHECKMATE
Ametat Security Amarr Empire
3980
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:47:00 -
[22] - Quote
Scout Registry wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:The profile dampener is to put me under proto scanners, I know nothing other than speed tanking, its all im good at. Please at least let the minja have a buff in pg or something . Right now, Im going to just have to spec into gallente so i can shield, armor, speed, and profile tank with no sacrifices... Don't be sad, brother. Just downgrade your KinCat or swap it out for a PG extender. Trading a little land speed for whatever tactical advantage cloak affords very well may be a fair trade. If not, f*ck cloak and stick to cover. You know the drill :-) CPU/PG restrictions are good for Scouts in the long run. These will be what keep away the EZ Mode masses. I hope.
Scouts wont have to do any sacrifice to equip cloaks , WTH is everybody talking about here? This thread is full of crazy people seriously....
On other notes. The minmatar is always the one that has problems fitting stuff XD
GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
|
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
TRA1LBLAZERS
225
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:49:00 -
[23] - Quote
Teilka Darkmist wrote:First, PG and CPU aren't related to each other, there is no ratio of PG to CPU.
Second, Cloak should take loads of PG, it makes you invisible, that should be an enormous power drain.
Please dont comment if you dont know what you are talking about. At proto level, for every 1 pg a suit has, there is an average of about 4.7-5.2 cpu for that 1 pg. That is my ratio that i refer to, and use that to judge worth.
Yes, I did kill Archduke Ferdinand. I used my nova knives.
https://dust514.com/recruit/k3vMnb/
|
Quil Evrything
Triple Terrors
797
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:55:00 -
[24] - Quote
Clyffton Donovan wrote:I think this is absolutely perfect. It keeps it out of the hands of slayer logis
it does? my calculations seem to indicate otherwise:
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1753101#post1753101
|
Kelc Ct'elpem
Nos Nothi
53
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 23:57:00 -
[25] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:This is my dream fitting with skills maxed out on my minmitar scout. k5 specialist shotgun-8 pg (I beleive) Submachine gun-3 pg 3x Complex Shield extenders-33 pg total 1x Complex profile dampener-0 pg (thankfully) 2xComplex kinetic catalyzers-30 pg total Stable active scanner-6 pg This comes out to a total of 80 pg already, which is the amount a minmitar scout has at maxed out fitting skills Cloak- now unfittable EDIT: Is it a reasonable request to fit these said items, and a cloak? Fitting out a Min scout has never been easy Drop tank and you can fit cloak. That would be reasonable. Balancing out fittings is part of how the game remains balanced. When fittings become unbalanced then we see issues. Logi Slayers are an example, room to fit in all capacities creates imbalance.
I hold a Doctorate in Destruction and a Degree in Debris
Minja Explosives Expert.
|
Scout Registry
Nos Nothi
974
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 00:00:00 -
[26] - Quote
I recall reading that there would a relationship between Scan Profile and Cloak Field Strength. I expect that a cloaked Logi at 50 dB would look quite different from a cloaked Scout at 20 dB. Like a fat man in a little coat :-) |
KING CHECKMATE
Ametat Security Amarr Empire
3982
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 00:03:00 -
[27] - Quote
Scout Registry wrote:I recall reading that there would a relationship between Scan Profile and Cloak Field Strength. I expect that a cloaked Logi at 50 dB would look quite different from a cloaked Scout at 20 dB. Like a fat man in a little coat :-)
Thats what you would expect, but the truth is, MEd frames and Maybe even some commandos are going to use cloaks as perfected Profile Dampening Modules.
of course, im not even against this considering how expensive they are, well at least, the proto cloaks. BUT lets be reasonable, the ADV is more than enough. 60 duration 30 recharge. PERFECT.
GIVE ME A RESPEC CCP.
|
Kelc Ct'elpem
Nos Nothi
54
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 00:06:00 -
[28] - Quote
Scout Registry wrote:I recall reading that there would a relationship between Scan Profile and Cloak Field Strength. I expect that a cloaked Logi at 50 dB would look quite different from a cloaked Scout at 20 dB. Like a fat man in a little coat :-) Though I think this is mor Commando in a Little CoatGǪ enjoy
I hold a Doctorate in Destruction and a Degree in Debris
Minja Explosives Expert.
|
Teilka Darkmist
57
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 00:13:00 -
[29] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Teilka Darkmist wrote:First, PG and CPU aren't related to each other, there is no ratio of PG to CPU.
Second, Cloak should take loads of PG, it makes you invisible, that should be an enormous power drain. Please dont comment if you dont know what you are talking about. At proto level, for every 1 pg a suit has, there is an average of about 4.7-5.2 cpu for that 1 pg. That is my ratio that i refer to, and use that to judge worth.
Just because you can take a very limited set of data and see a pattern, doesn't mean that one is there. Power does not create CPU. Try changing the PSU in a PC to one that puts out more power and see if that makes any difference to the CPU at all.
Also, dropsuit PG and CPU levels have no correlation to module PG and CPU levels. One is output, what is produced by the systems in the suit and the other is input, what is needed for that item to work.
When I play as a sniper, I'm more likely to be nearer to the opponents redline than my own.
|
Son-Of A-Gun
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
1022
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 00:24:00 -
[30] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Pete B wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:The CPU to Pg usage in my opinion is imbalanced. CCP said that the cloak would be CPU intensive, however at the rate of 1 pg is worth about 4.7-5.2 cpu on a proto dropsuit, the Pg level is actually higher than cpu, and I can foresee this as causing massive problems for scouts trying to fit it, as most biotic modules for scouts, which is our life blood, are extremely pg intensive, not to mention shields and ferroscales. The Pg costs for the cloak need to be lowered for them to be able to be fitted on scouts who want to use shield modules or kincats, and perhaps raise the cpu cost if you beleive that it is too easy to fit on other suits. Currently, I probably wont even be able to fit the cloak on my minja, due to its low pg levels and high pg demands of the cloak. Please fellow scouts, recognize this problem and assist me in this. What is the new scout bonus? I did take that into account, however it is not enough for the pg usage of the cloak. Cpu usage is fine, but the pg usage is far to high to be usable by scouts who want to be able to sprint fast.
On my Gallente scout, to fit the proto cloak and the rest of the suit the way I wanted it, I had to sub my complex kin cat for a CPU enhanced. I think that the CPU should be decreased and the PG should be increased (not really I'm fine with the CPU chip ).
Your post was terrible. So little detail. What close are you trying to fit. What is the CPU/PG overage/underage? Did you check the others scout suit fitting cost, other than the Minja, be for you decided that you would go ahead and speak for "all scouts"?
Come on man.
{:)}{3GÇó>
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |