DUST Search - Rail Rifle needs a longer spool up time because it can be bypassed

stlcarlos989 wrote:

NAV HIV wrote:

stlcarlos989 wrote:

NAV HIV wrote:

stlcarlos989 wrote:

Walk around with a rail rifle while constantly tapping the trigger as soon as you engage an enemy just hold it and you will begin firing instantly with no spool up time. The spool up time is supposed to be the balancing factor for the rail rifle in CQC but since since it can be easily bypassed CCP you need to rebalance it.

I hate making this "exploit" or whatever you want to call it more common in pubs (already prevalent in PC) but it has to be abused for CCP to react.

What would you say about the Range on Combat Rifles then ?! 50-70m Kalakiota RR gets owned by Ishukone or Boundless CR...

I agree CR needs an effective range reduction but the Rail Rifle still beats everything except the sniper rifle at 80+ meters

Not a Viziam... Lol

Thats another weapon which happens to be the most OP gun in the game since no one seems to realize that it has a higher base damage then the TAC AR and the TAC ARs old RoF plus the ability take out out all the shields of any suit with one charge shot then it take just a couple of single shots to finish any armor since you'll be doing 87 damage to armor with prof 5 and a couple of damage mods.

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stlcarlos989 SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1022	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:11:00 - [1] - Quote Walk around with a rail rifle while constantly tapping the trigger as soon as you engage an enemy just hold it and you will begin firing instantly with no spool up time. The spool up time is supposed to be the balancing factor for the rail rifle in CQC but since since it can be easily bypassed CCP you need to rebalance it. I hate making this "exploit" or whatever you want to call it more common in pubs (already prevalent in PC) but it has to be abused for CCP to react. STB Director, #1 in Warpoints E3 Closed Beta Build, Water Pipe Aficionado
steadyhand amarr Bragian Order Amarr Empire 2187	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:26:00 - [2] - Quote ... I dont see that as an exploit as it requires you to always remember to tap the trigger. Otherwise starting the spool before you ran round the courner is also exploiting. Or taping the spool while waiting for someone to break cover...i could go on "i dont care about you or your goals, just show me the dam isk" winner of EU squad cup GOGO power rangers
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 3487	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:32:00 - [3] - Quote The spool up time was only implemented to keep people from using it as a tactical rifle. My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Anarchide, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior
stlcarlos989 SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1022	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:34:00 - [4] - Quote steadyhand amarr wrote: ... I dont see that as an exploit as it requires you to always remember to tap the trigger. Otherwise starting the spool before you ran round the courner is also exploiting. Or taping the spool while waiting for someone to break cover...i could go on Its not hard to remember to do so, if CCP thinks this is ok then why have a spool up time it the first place? STB Director, #1 in Warpoints E3 Closed Beta Build, Water Pipe Aficionado
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 5842	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:36:00 - [5] - Quote You don't even need to bypass it. It's shorter than the human reaction time, if you play with that in mind it won't bother you at all. I don't remember if I was ever killed because of the spool up. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
Sir Petersen Valhalla Nord 483	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:36:00 - [6] - Quote The Rail Rifle needs a lot of things and all of those things are related to nerf. My Channel : Valhalla South
Korvin Lomont 499	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:40:00 - [7] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: You don't even need to bypass it. It's shorter than the human reaction time, if you play with that in mind it won't bother you at all. I don't remember if I was ever killed because of the spool up. On my first day with the RR I didn't even noticed the spool up time at all... Maybe CCP should start balancing by numbers and not by broken or easy to bypass gaming mechanics...
Lt Royal Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2607	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:40:00 - [8] - Quote No it won't change anything; anyone who uses the Rail Rifle in CQC knows that you have to pre-fire before that red knocks around the corner. Increasing spool time only means theyGÇÖll be pre-firing earlier. Gÿ£GÿàGÿP Subdreddit Recruitment Video Gÿ£GÿàGÿP
Operative 1171 Aajli Bragian Order Amarr Empire 1092	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:41:00 - [9] - Quote stlcarlos989 wrote: steadyhand amarr wrote: ... I dont see that as an exploit as it requires you to always remember to tap the trigger. Otherwise starting the spool before you ran round the courner is also exploiting. Or taping the spool while waiting for someone to break cover...i could go on Its not hard to remember to do so, if CCP thinks this is ok then why have a spool up time it the first place? Rail tech is Caldari tech is long range. RR too good in CQ. Not what the balance factor is supposed to be. Lore breaking and no reason to use the other weapons if the RR does just as good in CQ. That is all. Rommel, you magnificent bastard, I read your book!
NAV HIV The Generals General Tso's Alliance 856	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:46:00 - [10] - Quote stlcarlos989 wrote: Walk around with a rail rifle while constantly tapping the trigger as soon as you engage an enemy just hold it and you will begin firing instantly with no spool up time. The spool up time is supposed to be the balancing factor for the rail rifle in CQC but since since it can be easily bypassed CCP you need to rebalance it. I hate making this "exploit" or whatever you want to call it more common in pubs (already prevalent in PC) but it has to be abused for CCP to react. What would you say about the Range on Combat Rifles then ?! 50-70m Kalakiota RR gets owned by Ishukone or Boundless CR...

NAV HIV The Generals General Tso's Alliance 856	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:50:00 - [11] - Quote Operative 1171 Aajli wrote: stlcarlos989 wrote: steadyhand amarr wrote: ... I dont see that as an exploit as it requires you to always remember to tap the trigger. Otherwise starting the spool before you ran round the courner is also exploiting. Or taping the spool while waiting for someone to break cover...i could go on Its not hard to remember to do so, if CCP thinks this is ok then why have a spool up time it the first place? Rail tech is Caldari tech is long range. RR too good in CQ. Not what the balance factor is supposed to be. Lore breaking and no reason to use the other weapons if the RR does just as good in CQ. That is all. Well a Kalakiota RR may survive against an AR or CR if the user is wearing a Sentinel suit... But other than that, it's a NO... Over 750 RPM on 1 and over 1000 RPM on the other...
stlcarlos989 SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1022	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:50:00 - [12] - Quote NAV HIV wrote: stlcarlos989 wrote: Walk around with a rail rifle while constantly tapping the trigger as soon as you engage an enemy just hold it and you will begin firing instantly with no spool up time. The spool up time is supposed to be the balancing factor for the rail rifle in CQC but since since it can be easily bypassed CCP you need to rebalance it. I hate making this "exploit" or whatever you want to call it more common in pubs (already prevalent in PC) but it has to be abused for CCP to react. What would you say about the Range on Combat Rifles then ?! 50-70m Kalakiota RR gets owned by Ishukone or Boundless CR... I agree CR needs an effective range reduction but the Rail Rifle still beats everything except the sniper rifle at 80+ meters STB Director, #1 in Warpoints E3 Closed Beta Build, Water Pipe Aficionado
NAV HIV The Generals General Tso's Alliance 856	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:53:00 - [13] - Quote stlcarlos989 wrote: NAV HIV wrote: stlcarlos989 wrote: Walk around with a rail rifle while constantly tapping the trigger as soon as you engage an enemy just hold it and you will begin firing instantly with no spool up time. The spool up time is supposed to be the balancing factor for the rail rifle in CQC but since since it can be easily bypassed CCP you need to rebalance it. I hate making this "exploit" or whatever you want to call it more common in pubs (already prevalent in PC) but it has to be abused for CCP to react. What would you say about the Range on Combat Rifles then ?! 50-70m Kalakiota RR gets owned by Ishukone or Boundless CR... I agree CR needs an effective range reduction but the Rail Rifle still beats everything except the sniper rifle at 80+ meters Not a Viziam...
stlcarlos989 SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1022	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:01:00 - [14] - Quote NAV HIV wrote: stlcarlos989 wrote: NAV HIV wrote: stlcarlos989 wrote: Walk around with a rail rifle while constantly tapping the trigger as soon as you engage an enemy just hold it and you will begin firing instantly with no spool up time. The spool up time is supposed to be the balancing factor for the rail rifle in CQC but since since it can be easily bypassed CCP you need to rebalance it. I hate making this "exploit" or whatever you want to call it more common in pubs (already prevalent in PC) but it has to be abused for CCP to react. What would you say about the Range on Combat Rifles then ?! 50-70m Kalakiota RR gets owned by Ishukone or Boundless CR... I agree CR needs an effective range reduction but the Rail Rifle still beats everything except the sniper rifle at 80+ meters Not a Viziam... Thats another weapon which happens to be the most OP gun in the game since no one seems to realize that it has a higher base damage then the TAC AR and the TAC ARs old RoF plus the ability take out out all the shields of any suit with one charge shot then it take just a couple of single shots to finish any armor since you'll be doing 85+ damage to armor with prof 5 and a couple of damage mods. STB Director, #1 in Warpoints E3 Closed Beta Build, Water Pipe Aficionado
stlcarlos989 SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1022	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:02:00 - [15] - Quote Just some DPS stats all with proficiency 5 Six Kin CR = 533.6 DPS Kaalakiota RR = 535.2 DPS Carthum ASCR = 535.8 DPS Duvolle AR = 537.6 DPS Ishukone ARR = 542.7 DPS That .25s spool up time should be equal about ~133+ damage in the first second giving it a disadvantage in CQC but with the ability to bypass it at all times so easily it has just as good DPS if not better then all the other rifles plus more range then all of them. Where is the disadvantage to the Rail Rifle? STB Director, #1 in Warpoints E3 Closed Beta Build, Water Pipe Aficionado
DUST Fiend OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 10286	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:10:00 - [16] - Quote Sir Petersen wrote: The Rail Rifle needs a lot of things and all of those things are related to nerf. Videos / Fiction Closed Beta Vet; Incubus Pilot
Korvin Lomont 500	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:10:00 - [17] - Quote stlcarlos989 wrote: Just some DPS stats all with proficiency 5 Six Kin CR = 533.6 DPS Kaalakiota RR = 535.2 DPS Carthum ASCR = 535.8 DPS Duvolle AR = 537.6 DPS Ishukone ARR = 542.7 DPS That .25s spool up time should be equal about ~133+ damage in the first second giving it a disadvantage in CQC but with the ability to bypass it at all times so easily it has just as good DPS if not better then all the other rifles plus more range then all of them. Where is the disadvantage to the Rail Rifle? Well we were tellin that to CCP since the first numbers leaked or were presented but until now nobody listened or cared. Thats why you see the RR so often in the killfeed. Its just sad that the new weapons directly outshine the old ones by a good margin :/
Cody Sietz Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2070	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:12:00 - [18] - Quote steadyhand amarr wrote: ... I dont see that as an exploit as it requires you to always remember to tap the trigger. Otherwise starting the spool before you ran round the courner is also exploiting. Or taping the spool while waiting for someone to break cover...i could go on It's not, it's just not enough of a drawback. Adding a extra .25 of a sec would balance this. "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
calisk galern BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 1674	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:17:00 - [19] - Quote I see 8 RR to each CR, makes me sad because the CR is such a fun gun =/
ReGnYuM Escrow Removal and Acquisition 1955	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:19:00 - [20] - Quote RR needs the spread of the current TAR Official Imperfect Title: Supreme Leader of the Endless Sunset I Slay, for thy Empress Do you even PC... Brah

devonus durga P.L.A.N. B 179	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:20:00 - [21] - Quote stlcarlos989 wrote: Just some DPS stats all with proficiency 5 Six Kin CR = 533.6 DPS Kaalakiota RR = 535.2 DPS Carthum ASCR = 535.8 DPS Duvolle AR = 537.6 DPS Ishukone ARR = 542.7 DPS That .25s spool up time should be equal about ~133+ damage in the first second giving it a disadvantage in CQC but with the ability to bypass it at all times so easily it has just as good DPS if not better then all the other rifles plus more range then all of them. Where is the disadvantage to the Rail Rifle? The other big issue is the rails damage per clip. They lose some damage at the start of the engagement but gain a lot MRE before they have to reload. On the basic its something like an extra 360 damage per magazine/clip over the Ar. I'm sure its worse on assault RR variants. Newbiest newberry to ever spawn a 12 page Debate
Soldner VonKuechle SAM-MIK 285	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:31:00 - [22] - Quote The amount of times I die during the spool up is far more than I'd like to admit, But it's usual mid bunny hopping firefight and I have to reset my aim. The pre fire - constant spooling thing isn't an exploit, it's figuring out how to maximize the eff-you of your gun, kinda like the guysthat can burst their standard CRs to fire like fully autos, without using a modded controller (you know who you are) Ill agree that the top end damage of the RR is stupid good, 3 bolts with a kalak and some poor militia scrub is dead. That does need to be addressed and lowered, and yes I use the rail only now. ... I've waited a dam year for it, ill ride that thing into the ground. Also I don't know what matches you guys are playing that you only see rails, But the pubs/factionals I've been doing actually have pretty good diversity. PC must be different. Something witty here. How DOES one get a cat into a dropsuit?
Alternate Insano Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 2	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:41:00 - [23] - Quote The spool up time isn't the only issue with the rail rifle. It's range and damage are ridiculously unbalanced. I can stand toe to toe in my Amarr Heavy advanced armor, with shield and armor upgrades at level 3 each, shooting my M82 HMG at a similar level Logi suit carrying a basic rail rifle and I lose every time. EVERY time. How can this possible be explained away? A couple of us actually staged a fire fight and it doesn't matter what we did, the outcome is always the same. Rail rifle wins. I made an acct for my son and set up a rail rifle heavy, and it's just ridiculous. That alt is so OP. My boy is 7 and can go 10-18 kills per match.
NAV HIV The Generals General Tso's Alliance 856	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:46:00 - [24] - Quote stlcarlos989 wrote: NAV HIV wrote: stlcarlos989 wrote: NAV HIV wrote: stlcarlos989 wrote: Walk around with a rail rifle while constantly tapping the trigger as soon as you engage an enemy just hold it and you will begin firing instantly with no spool up time. The spool up time is supposed to be the balancing factor for the rail rifle in CQC but since since it can be easily bypassed CCP you need to rebalance it. I hate making this "exploit" or whatever you want to call it more common in pubs (already prevalent in PC) but it has to be abused for CCP to react. What would you say about the Range on Combat Rifles then ?! 50-70m Kalakiota RR gets owned by Ishukone or Boundless CR... I agree CR needs an effective range reduction but the Rail Rifle still beats everything except the sniper rifle at 80+ meters Not a Viziam... Thats another weapon which happens to be the most OP gun in the game since no one seems to realize that it has a higher base damage then the TAC AR and the TAC ARs old RoF plus the ability take out out all the shields of any suit with one charge shot then it take just a couple of single shots to finish any armor since you'll be doing 87 damage to armor with prof 5 and a couple of damage mods. Yes i use that with Assault ak0 sometimes and i know how it feels. You can hold the charge shot and release it on some poor sap lol
Sinboto Simmons SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 4151	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:47:00 - [25] - Quote It's a rifle sir, don't hold your breath, did you see how long it took for the AR to be balanced? Sinboto - The True Blood Minja Forum Warrior level 4 STB-Infantry (Demolition)
Scheneighnay McBob Learning Coalition College 3661	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:51:00 - [26] - Quote The rail rifle is completely broken. Unless you have really high RR operation, the recoil makes it only useable at short range, where it isn't meant to be used. We used to have a time machine
NAV HIV The Generals General Tso's Alliance 856	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:51:00 - [27] - Quote Sinboto Simmons wrote: It's a rifle sir, don't hold your breath, did you see how long it took for the AR to be balanced? Yup till SCR, CR and RR dropped... So from that theory i guess we need to wait for the next SCR, RR or CR equivalent
steadyhand amarr Bragian Order Amarr Empire 2189	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:54:00 - [28] - Quote stlcarlos989 wrote: steadyhand amarr wrote: ... I dont see that as an exploit as it requires you to always remember to tap the trigger. Otherwise starting the spool before you ran round the courner is also exploiting. Or taping the spool while waiting for someone to break cover...i could go on Its not hard to remember to do so, if CCP thinks this is ok then why have a spool up time it the first place? Are we just ignoring applied logic and forword thinking in this thread. The spool is to prevent snap fireing. While its easy to do you still have to remeber to do it and plenty of players wont. PC is ment for the BEST players so if i had a guy who was not doing it i would kick him from my pc squad. The RR is outclassed by the AR CC and shotgun in CQC its not CCP fault that u cant aim and track. I would say most rifiles are good where they are. Pretty much everyone bar PC players use the WRONG gun for their playstyle or simply suck and make up BS excuses "i dont care about you or your goals, just show me the dam isk" winner of EU squad cup GOGO power rangers
stlcarlos989 SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1028	Posted - 2014.01.23 16:00:00 - [29] - Quote steadyhand amarr wrote: stlcarlos989 wrote: steadyhand amarr wrote: ... I dont see that as an exploit as it requires you to always remember to tap the trigger. Otherwise starting the spool before you ran round the courner is also exploiting. Or taping the spool while waiting for someone to break cover...i could go on Its not hard to remember to do so, if CCP thinks this is ok then why have a spool up time it the first place? Are we just ignoring applied logic and forword thinking in this thread. The spool is to prevent snap fireing. While its easy to do you still have to remeber to do it and plenty of players wont. PC is ment for the BEST players so if i had a guy who was not doing it i would kick him from my pc squad. The RR is outclassed by the AR CC and shotgun in CQC its not CCP fault that u cant aim and track. I would say most rifiles are good where they are. Pretty much everyone bar PC players use the WRONG gun for their playstyle or simply suck and make up BS excuses Really, hard to remember lol? Play a few game just tapping it constantly and it becomes habit, yes its a smart tactic to use to get an advantage in CQC, but it still doesn't mean it isn't a broken game mechanic. Lol if you're saying I can't track and aim you obviously haven't taken part in much PC. STB Director, #1 in Warpoints E3 Closed Beta Build, Water Pipe Aficionado
CLONE117 planetary retaliation organisation ACME Holding Conglomerate 593	Posted - 2014.01.23 16:10:00 - [30] - Quote the rail rifle 3 shotting?... well it can easily get the power of a large blaster turret. with the addition of some extra damage mods maybe proficiency maxed. and while using the proto version. well almost. maybe be a few points short. still it was longer range than it 2. and better mobility and can move in an out of small structures. i have some very quick reaction times. it needs to be fast when using nothing but core skill specced mlt suits when going up against higher tiered fits. and at the same time im using my gek or mlt ar. sometimes a std. or an hmg on heavy. the many times ive gone up against the oh so common cr and rail rifle. i will either die. or limp away with next to no hp left. then die to a different player using the same guns. i have yet to find an effective counter to these guns. other than a large blaster turret/mlt tank. but even with that they would have an easy time avoiding me. because the tank wont fit into those small doorways or hallways. and cant climb stars either. asides from that im not sure if the shootting while getting incapacitated glitch has been fixed yet. because its happened to me with both of thoseguns.



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