DUST Search - Someone counter this argument on Amarr Scout bonus

Kelrie Nae'bre wrote:

Iron Wolf Saber wrote:

...

This leaves Amarr to use the other following low slot bonuses to synergize stamina, max stamina, max speed, cpu, grid, armor plate efficiency.

Max speed is not going to get touched due to technical reasons of the engine and it is by far one of of the heaviest weighed stat (hence stacking penalties, and low overall available multiplier bonuses). Speed is almost nearly a multiplier to the defensive score (instead of an additive) due to compounding effects for a player to choosing when to disengage from a fight. While scouts are supposed to excel at this over any other suit, it mustn't be the sole option of combat. Eve Online which didn't have the technical problems did have an oversight on speed once and took many patches to destroy it. Essentially one battleship in the game became the fastest ship of all other ships, so fast to the point nobody could reliably engage it for more than a second and when combined with high alpha strike weapons it nearly was impossible to kill while he wove into fleet formations and soloed the entire group.

With that we have armor plate efficency, while this would work it would be unscout like, and threatens to role stomp on the assaults.

CPU/PG? worst bonus ever if its the only one of the class with it.

High Slot bonuses? ignore the suit cannot support nor synergize with it and would be considered a nerf.

Max Stamina and Recovery are the only two left for Amarr which makes more sense considering amarr have some of the best energy systems in the game. Maybe if there were other modules that consumed stamina would there be far more value in this like super jumps, slides and other evasive maneuvers.

Here's what I got from all this...

Speed is nearly a multiplier to the defensive score...

I'm glad you admit this and you're aware of how much this matters

Scouts are supposed to excel at this over any other suit...

also true, speed is meant to be the larger factor with a scout, as opposed to ehp, etc.

Max speed can't be changed for technical reasons...

So, this speed discrepancy between the Amarr as a "scout" and the assaults can't be rectified? That... seems to present some balance issues, but lets continue.

Armor plates would be unscout-like.

I agree, because a scout would be a half-assed tank at best with the low starting ehp, and tanking isn't meant to be their role

..threatens to role-stomp the assaults

Any buff large enough to make a difference would role stomp, and any too small would just make them a crappier assault. That makes sense I think.

isn't

if there were other modules that consumed stamina there might be more value

This an admission of the limited value of a stamina bonus, and yes, if there were more things that used stamina it might be more useful.

It sounds like you're basically saying the Amarr scout is screwed on speed, but they can't threaten the arena of assaults (which already trample on the Amarr scout's domain). Stamina is the only thing that makes sense, and maybe some day it'll be made useful after they add a bunch of features they haven't even intimated at being in development.


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Nikea Nei Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 70	Posted - 2014.01.21 20:59:00 - [1] - Quote Kelrie Nae'bre wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: ... This leaves Amarr to use the other following low slot bonuses to synergize stamina, max stamina, max speed, cpu, grid, armor plate efficiency. Max speed is not going to get touched due to technical reasons of the engine and it is by far one of of the heaviest weighed stat (hence stacking penalties, and low overall available multiplier bonuses). Speed is almost nearly a multiplier to the defensive score (instead of an additive) due to compounding effects for a player to choosing when to disengage from a fight. While scouts are supposed to excel at this over any other suit, it mustn't be the sole option of combat. Eve Online which didn't have the technical problems did have an oversight on speed once and took many patches to destroy it. Essentially one battleship in the game became the fastest ship of all other ships, so fast to the point nobody could reliably engage it for more than a second and when combined with high alpha strike weapons it nearly was impossible to kill while he wove into fleet formations and soloed the entire group. With that we have armor plate efficency, while this would work it would be unscout like, and threatens to role stomp on the assaults. CPU/PG? worst bonus ever if its the only one of the class with it. High Slot bonuses? ignore the suit cannot support nor synergize with it and would be considered a nerf. Max Stamina and Recovery are the only two left for Amarr which makes more sense considering amarr have some of the best energy systems in the game. Maybe if there were other modules that consumed stamina would there be far more value in this like super jumps, slides and other evasive maneuvers. Here's what I got from all this... Speed is nearly a multiplier to the defensive score... -I'm glad you admit this and you're aware of how much this matters Scouts are supposed to excel at this over any other suit... -also true, speed is meant to be the larger factor with a scout, as opposed to ehp, etc. Unfortunately, the base speed of the Amarr scout is slower than a Minmatar assault, which means the Amarr scout doesn't have that "advantage" to the extent of other scouts. Max speed can't be changed for technical reasons... -So, this speed discrepancy between the Amarr as a "scout" and the assaults can't be rectified? That... seems to present some balance issues, but lets continue. Armor plates would be unscout-like. - I agree, because a scout would be a half-assed tank at best with the low starting ehp, and tanking isn't meant to be their role ..threatens to role-stomp the assaults -Any buff large enough to make a difference would role stomp, and any too small would just make them a crappier assault. That makes sense I think. There's a problem here. Speed is THE scout thing, but the fact Minmatar assault has as much/more than the Amarr scout isn't considered role-stomping? Is that role-stomp just considered "Ok" because "technical reasons". You've admitted that the speed is nearly a multiplier to defense and it's the "scout's" thing. If the fastest assault suit has the speed advantage on the speed suit out of the box AND the hp advantage... what exactly is left? if there were other modules that consumed stamina there might be more value -This an admission of the limited value of a stamina bonus, and yes, if there were more things that used stamina it might be more useful. Of course, there AREN'T more things that use stamina. It sounds like you're basically saying the Amarr scout is screwed on speed, but they can't threaten the arena of assaults (which already trample on the Amarr scout's domain). Stamina is the only thing that makes sense, and maybe some day it'll be made useful after they add a bunch of features they haven't even intimated at being in development. Yeah. Even with a stamina bonus, the Amarr scout's speed gimp will make it the worst scout. Movement speed while strafing, etc. will have a larger impact on encounters than any other bonuses. Stamina doesn't mean the scout can completely avoid encounters, and a sniping role that wouldn't involve direct encounters is better served by the tank to absorb countersniping fire than stamina/profile.