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KingBabar
The Rainbow Effect
1621
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Posted - 2014.01.09 09:42:00 -
[1] - Quote
This goes IF they implement the New Galente Logi bonus.
The Math suggest that when scanned by a "standard" proto scanner, a medium frame needs 3 dampeners to avoid it, same goes for scouts, except the Galente which comes With a build in one.
I fear that this cost of staying dampened is too much. We're talking about 280 Points of armor if you have the 3 PG needed for 3 basic armor plates....
I predict a massive player migration from other logi suits over to the Galente. Which self respecting PC team will go in without one or more of these "scout sniffers"? Not many.
The end result of this may be that most players won't bother With the stealth game at all and instead we'll be back to 2 months ago were as good as all the relevant players did the max DPS/Tank thing. And everybody will know exactly were the enemy team is at all times, leading to blob vs blob gameplay mostly.
There are off course uncertainties such as how the cloacking will work, will you emitt the same DB when the cloak is activated?
This is all mostly speculations off corse.
With this I hope CCP see a potential killer of the stealth game, I hope they have a plan for this or take a second look at it.
http://s1286.photobucket.com/user/KingBabar/media/BannerKingbabarcopy.png.html
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Korvin Lomont
United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION
442
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Posted - 2014.01.09 09:53:00 -
[2] - Quote
KingBabar wrote:This goes IF they implement the New Galente Logi bonus.
The Math suggest that when scanned by a "standard" proto scanner, a medium frame needs 3 dampeners to avoid it, same goes for scouts, except the Galente which comes With a build in one.
I fear that this cost of staying dampened is too much. We're talking about 280 Points of armor if you have the 3 PG needed for 3 basic armor plates....
I predict a massive player migration from other logi suits over to the Galente. Which self respecting PC team will go in without one or more of these "scout sniffers"? Not many.
The end result of this may be that most players won't bother With the stealth game at all and instead we'll be back to 2 months ago were as good as all the relevant players did the max DPS/Tank thing. And everybody will know exactly were the enemy team is at all times, leading to blob vs blob gameplay mostly.
There are off course uncertainties such as how the cloacking will work, will you emitt the same DB when the cloak is activated?
This is all mostly speculations off corse.
With this I hope CCP see a potential killer of the stealth game, I hope they have a plan for this or take a second look at it.
Hmm I see your point, but there were also hints about suit changes, also the new assault bonusses will surely attract a lot of the "slayer logis" and the minmatar bonus is also quite handy in a PC. But all in all this is just crystal balling...
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R F Gyro
Clones 4u
911
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Posted - 2014.01.09 10:16:00 -
[3] - Quote
I kind of like the idea of teams having dedicated sniffers/scanners that can detect the stealthies. There would be a nice side-game of stealthies sneaking around trying to keep out of range of the one or two sniffers on the other team.
RF Gyro: 12.5% damage bonus; 10.5% rate of fire bonus
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Rei Shepard
The Rainbow Effect
1381
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Posted - 2014.01.09 10:29:00 -
[4] - Quote
I really hate the current scanner system, everyone at all times know where you are "if" you have someone in your team running one, so ofcourse everyone runs one, except those that want some quality solo time.
I mean does a team of 6 really need to know where the 1 guy is at all times?
Wouldnt it have been easier to just left it at the previous system with squad vision and with eyes instead of red chevrons stuffed down your throat.
I am fine with a moderate scanner that could get a 50% chance to scan a suit without modules and go from there with addition of modules, it goes down...
But the current aproach of ...
You have been scanned You have been scanned You have been scanned You have been scanned You have been scanned You have been scanned
Through an entire match is well ...just stupid with the scanner spam, hell why do we even have scanners when all they do is light you up 99.9% of the time ?
Ofcourse KBM cant properly use the scanner due to the equipment wheel not working properly since Uprising, so by the time you get a scanner out, 20 seconds have passed.
A scanner should be something you need to use in a dangerous situation to get a tactical advantage, not spam the **** out of it to have a WallHack 24/7.
Winner of the EU Squad Cup
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
"Accuracy"
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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1463
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Posted - 2014.01.09 10:36:00 -
[5] - Quote
Rei Shepard wrote:A scanner should be something you need to use in a dangerous situation to get a tactical advantage, not spam the **** out of it to have a WallHack 24/7. This. The scanner should have a really long recharge time (like 30+ seconds).
Make the scan instant as well, so you can't spin around with it. Maybe decrease the quantum scanners scan time as well.
Doing that I don't see a problem with scanners being powerful.
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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Rei Shepard
The Rainbow Effect
1381
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Posted - 2014.01.09 10:53:00 -
[6] - Quote
Bendtner92 wrote:Rei Shepard wrote:A scanner should be something you need to use in a dangerous situation to get a tactical advantage, not spam the **** out of it to have a WallHack 24/7. This. The scanner should have a really long recharge time (like 30+ seconds). Make the scan instant as well, so you can't spin around with it. Maybe decrease the quantum scanners scan time as well. Doing that I don't see a problem with scanners being powerful.
Now that would sound like an actual Scanner, instead of the Spammer we have :p
Winner of the EU Squad Cup
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
"Accuracy"
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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
1513
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Posted - 2014.01.09 11:05:00 -
[7] - Quote
KingBabar wrote:This goes IF they implement the New Galente Logi bonus.
The Math suggest that when scanned by a "standard" proto scanner, a medium frame needs 3 dampeners to avoid it, same goes for scouts, except the Galente which comes With a build in one.
I fear that this cost of staying dampened is too much. We're talking about 280 Points of armor if you have the 3 PG needed for 3 basic armor plates....
I predict a massive player migration from other logi suits over to the Galente. Which self respecting PC team will go in without one or more of these "scout sniffers"? Not many.
The end result of this may be that most players won't bother With the stealth game at all and instead we'll be back to 2 months ago were as good as all the relevant players did the max DPS/Tank thing. And everybody will know exactly were the enemy team is at all times, leading to blob vs blob gameplay mostly.
There are off course uncertainties such as how the cloacking will work, will you emitt the same DB when the cloak is activated?
This is all mostly speculations off corse.
With this I hope CCP see a potential killer of the stealth game, I hope they have a plan for this or take a second look at it.
As a Gallentr Logistics and a stealth player I can tell you that the Gallentr bonus is extremely OP against stealth players. Even as of right now stealth game play is extremely one sided towards the scanner. It only takes one scanner to scan a suit but for the most part it takes more than 2 dampener to hide that is extremely unfair. I myself am moving out of the Logistics line, logistics got the short end of the stick when Assaults where giving the Gank/Tank capabilities which really turns it into the Jack of All Trades better than Most suits. |
R F Gyro
Clones 4u
911
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Posted - 2014.01.09 11:06:00 -
[8] - Quote
Bendtner92 wrote:This. The scanner should have a really long recharge time (like 30+ seconds).
Make the scan instant as well, so you can't spin around with it. Maybe decrease the quantum scanners scan time as well.
Doing that I don't see a problem with scanners being powerful. Yep, like this. While the scan should be instant, there should be a short pause while it "processes" the results before displaying it though.
RF Gyro: 12.5% damage bonus; 10.5% rate of fire bonus
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KingBabar
The Rainbow Effect
1621
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Posted - 2014.01.09 11:22:00 -
[9] - Quote
@ Rei and Benthner
Well, I think its quite balanced as it is right now. A scout suit needs 1 dampener to stay hidden and the medium frames need 2.
So I have to make a choice, more armor or totally invisible?
Like that dom game we played yesterday, granted, I played "smart" for once, actually defending the objective instead of going on a wannabee killspree, I was loocking down approaches With REs, playing careful etc. Going up against you, 13ear, and some more AE players, how often do you think a scrub like me goes 25-1 vs that kind of opponents?
Its never happened before.
When its me and 13ear straight up in a 1 vs 1 he'd take me out 8 out of 10 times, same With Rei. That game I killed 13ear 3 times I believe, he didn't get me at all. And thats hardly surprising, I knew exactly were he was at all times, he couldn't see me. Get shot in the back much?
So Yeah, the "You have been scanned" Message is annoying when you get it all the time. On the other hand, getting the "Scan attempt prevented" Message every 5 second is equally satisfying...
Using 2 low slots for tank or stealth is OK IMO.
With the New Galente suit we're talking about using 3 low slots, seems a tad excessive no?
http://s1286.photobucket.com/user/KingBabar/media/BannerKingbabarcopy.png.html
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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1468
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Posted - 2014.01.09 11:32:00 -
[10] - Quote
@King.
Yeah, I agree that the current situation of Scouts needing one and Mediums two damps to avoid non-focused scanners is okay.
I also don't think there's necessarily a problem with the Gallente Logi getting a more poweful scanner and thus being able to pretty much scan everything IF, and only IF, the changes I proposed earlier or something similar are made. Because I don't think scanners, even a Gallente Logi one, would be OP or anything in that case.
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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Rei Shepard
The Rainbow Effect
1384
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Posted - 2014.01.09 11:38:00 -
[11] - Quote
KingBabar wrote:@ Rei and Benthner
Well, I think its quite balanced as it is right now. A scout suit needs 1 dampener to stay hidden and the medium frames need 2.
So I have to make a choice, more armor or totally invisible?
Like that dom game we played yesterday, granted, I played "smart" for once, actually defending the objective instead of going on a wannabee killspree, I was loocking down approaches With REs, playing careful etc. Going up against you, 13ear, and some more AE players, how often do you think a scrub like me goes 25-1 vs that kind of opponents?
Its never happened before.
When its me and 13ear straight up in a 1 vs 1 he'd take me out 8 out of 10 times, same With Rei. That game I killed 13ear 3 times I believe, he didn't get me at all. And thats hardly surprising, I knew exactly were he was at all times, he couldn't see me. Get shot in the back much?
So Yeah, the "You have been scanned" Message is annoying when you get it all the time. On the other hand, getting the "Scan attempt prevented" Message every 5 second is equally satisfying...
Using 2 low slots for tank or stealth is OK IMO.
With the New Galente suit we're talking about using 3 low slots, seems a tad excessive no?
Can we like forget about that game /cough i think it was my worst game ever lol
Lemme count my deaths for a second, i still remember them vividly :p 5x RE's to the face 3x shot in the back 1x shot in the face 2x Grenade to the face
Though about 2 slots, it is quite allot if your suit has only 3 slots, if i had 4 or 5 it would be ok, but having to spend 2 slots on not being visible on scanners means at any other time if they see you out in the open or see you first, yer gonna be dead if your suit isnt shield tanked.
Winner of the EU Squad Cup
"Go Go Power Rangers!"
"Accuracy"
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Sana Rayya
WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL Top Men.
702
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Posted - 2014.01.09 13:00:00 -
[12] - Quote
Check your math again. With the Gal Logi bonus, their proto scans will be at 21dB, so you'll need FIVE complex dampeners on a medium suit to avoid it. Meaning that medium suits basically have no chance at stealth with Gal Logis on the other side, if this goes through.
Scanning precision is at a good balance right now, but this one change will ruin stealth game entirely, for both scouts and mediums (scouts will need 2x complex to avoid 21dB scans). |
KingBabar
The Rainbow Effect
1622
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Posted - 2014.01.09 13:08:00 -
[13] - Quote
Sana Rayya wrote:Check your math again. With the Gal Logi bonus, their proto scans will be at 21dB, so you'll need FIVE complex dampeners on a medium suit to avoid it. Meaning that medium suits basically have no chance at stealth with Gal Logis on the other side, if this goes through.
Scanning precision is at a good balance right now, but this one change will ruin stealth game entirely, for both scouts and mediums (scouts will need 2x complex to avoid 21dB scans).
Yeah I didn't actually do the Math myself on this one.
Assuming what you say is true then even more backing for my point. I actually tried out a fit With 3 complex dampeners on my Caldari logi yesterday, just to sort of mentally prepare myself. Then again, needing even more than 3 damps and you can definately toss the entire stealth game out the window, in that case I'd definately go tank and gank....
@ Rei.
I know, I'm glad I was on the defending team....
http://s1286.photobucket.com/user/KingBabar/media/BannerKingbabarcopy.png.html
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