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Sana Rayya
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Posted - 2014.01.07 13:28:00 -
[1] - Quote
Repost from another thread:
CCP will kill stealth tanking for anyone except scouts with these changes. Proto Gallente Logis will now have 21dB precision using the previous 28dB scanners, and their scans will be 50% longer. Medium frames will need FIVE dampeners to avoid proto scans from a Gal Logi. Scouts will need two complex dampeners.
If you thought scanning was bad in 1.7, wait till these changes go into effect.
CCP are a bunch of idiots.
And LOL at the people who think that Gal Logis will downgrade their scanners to basic after these changes. That's too funny. |
Sana Rayya
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Posted - 2014.01.07 13:38:00 -
[2] - Quote
Even if these changes are implemented, let's also not forget that CCP is trying to "figure out" how to deal with equipment spam. How they do that may be a direct nerf to the bonuses for Amarr and Caldari logis, whereas Minmatar and Gallente (the most OP suit right now) will be unaffected. |
Sana Rayya
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Posted - 2014.01.07 13:53:00 -
[3] - Quote
Minmatar bonus is actually pretty nice - you'll get 88 HP/s on the Lai Dai from 48m away, on two targets. You can easily heal front liners without exposing yourself to significant danger. The WP earnings from that will be huge.
Gal Logi bonus takes the cake though. It has the potential to completely ruin stealth tanking for everyone except proto scouts with proto dampeners. |
Sana Rayya
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Posted - 2014.01.07 14:03:00 -
[4] - Quote
Reav Hannari wrote:Sana Rayya wrote:CCP are a bunch of idiots. You see one small part of potentially sweeping changes and have to get nasty about it. With all the changes to equipment bonuses did it ever cross your mind that they might be changing equipment at the same time?
I really hope they do, because as it stands, things look very grim for scouts and stealth tankers. |
Sana Rayya
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Posted - 2014.01.07 14:14:00 -
[5] - Quote
They should change the Gal scanner precision buff to a range buff instead. Problem solved and stealth tanking is still viable. |
Sana Rayya
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Posted - 2014.01.07 14:45:00 -
[6] - Quote
Asha Starwind wrote:Sana Rayya wrote:They should change the Gal scanner precision buff to a range buff instead. Problem solved and stealth tanking is still viable.
Edit: Actually it should be 10% to range and 5% to scan duration, per level. that's just gamebreaking
No, it isn't. Nearly everyone uses the Quantum scanners anyway, so that's an extra 50m and 4sec on the Advanced, and 6.25sec on the Duvolle Quantum. If you used the Credron Flux Scanner, you'd get an extra 100m and have a slight edge in dropping OBs. Due to its long cooldown time, it isn't good for much else.
The point being, at least you could still hide from these scanners by using two complex dampeners. It's more balanced to have one side with longer range/longer duration scanners and still be able to hide from them, than to give them longer duration scanners with such a high precision that you can't hide from them no matter what you do. |
Sana Rayya
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Posted - 2014.01.07 15:07:00 -
[7] - Quote
shaman oga wrote:Gal bonus is not that good after all.
I mean, it doesn't change your life, with an ADV scanner you will pick 90% of players, scan duration is good enough, scanner recharge is fast, so you can spam another scan before the effect of the firts goes away.
As a Gal Logi, why would I use an Adv scanner (getting me 27dB) and perhaps let some people dodge my scans when I can use a proto scanner (21db) and pick up EVERYONE? The difference between the two is only ISK and 8 CPU, which will really be 6 CPU considering the equipment fitting bonus. Also, longer scans from the Duvolle Quantum mean less time spent scanning (i.e. vulnerable) and more time with my gun out.
Mark me; if equipment stays the same and these changes go into effect, you can guarantee that stealth tanking will be dead if a Gal Logi is scanning on the other side. Everyone will run high HP suits and everyone will be perma-scanned. Lower HP ADV suits won't have an edge by way of the element of surprise anymore, so things will turn into a high HP slugfest where whichever side pulls the most proto first, wins. Kind of like ambush games against Nyain San. |
Sana Rayya
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Posted - 2014.01.07 15:29:00 -
[8] - Quote
Asha Starwind wrote:
Yeah, what but what about the 2-3 guys standing next you or me who lights up like a Christmas tree because they aren't dampened or can't get under the threshold in the first place, they wouldn't specifically that I'm there but definitely know which direction my squad/team is coming from. I'd doubt the OB dropped on top of us is not going to kill me simply because I'm dampened.
You're forgetting the range is a radius, and everyone who uses a scanner spins around like a cracked out ballerina every time they scan. So it's an extra 100m and 200m of scan range, how many letters could you scan simultaneously? Would the enemy team even be able to approach if they weren't already being hunted down?
Okay, give the 5% to range and the 10% to duration, if that's what you want. I don't particularly see a problem in buffing range, simply because outside of orbitals and sniping, most engagements will happen within 100m anyway, at which point scanners from both teams would be just as effective range-wise.
The main issue I have is in buffing the scan precision. This would be a huge mistake. We should have the option of being able to dodge scans by sacrificing some HP by using 2 complex dampeners. This option shouldn't be taken away just because a super-scanning Gal Logi is on the other side.
Before anyone brings up the Duvolle Focused Scanner, let me reiterate that this scanner is a POS due to its long scan time (5 sec where you can't use your weapon), short light up time (5 sec after your scan ends), and long cooldown time (33 seconds between consecutive scans). Those are its drawbacks. A 21dB scanner with a 2 sec scan time, 31 seconds of light up, and 17 sec between consecutive scans would be ridiculously OP. It's a scanner that only proto scouts can hide from (with 2 complex dampeners) and everyone else is perma-scanned. |
Sana Rayya
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Posted - 2014.01.07 15:34:00 -
[9] - Quote
shaman oga wrote:
Compared to the other bonus it sucks, i can perma scan enemies now, what will change?
If i have to scan 2 times now then i will scan 1, but that's not a great effort for everyone with a scanner.
You can't perma-scan everyone. It's possible for medium frames and easy for scouts to dodge 28dB scans, and perma-scanning with the Duvolle Focused requires three to four people in your squad using this scanner and coordinating their scans.
If this buff goes through, for all intents and purposes, no one will be able to hide from your 28dB (now 21dB) proto, spammable scanners. This will make a big difference in gameplay.
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Sana Rayya
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Posted - 2014.01.07 16:29:00 -
[10] - Quote
ratamaq doc wrote:
I've advocated scanners and dampeners since the tactnet change, but this change will flip even me. Every suit if mine has at least 1 complex dampener and I have a set of 2. I sacrifice HP for invisibility and am successful most of the time for it. This will COMPLETLY break that, unless the stats for the scanner itself is changed to where it needs a full proto GalLogi with a proto scanner to hit 28 db, which I think would be acceptable to keep damp tanking viable.
I was thinking that, but that would mean proto scanners in the hands of non-Gal Logis would have something like 37dB. Way too easy to get under.
Instead of use one dampener if they have advanced scans, or two dampeners if they have proto scans, it'll be use one dampener if there are no Gal Logis, and two dampeners if there is one. It's a definite nerf to scanners on anyone except the Gal Logi, and the team/squad with the Gal Logi will always have an unfair advantage scanning wise.
I think that the current balance in scan profiles/scanning is pretty good right now. The only change I would make is to reduce scout base profile from 45dB to 40dB, which would allow them to dodge 28dB proto scans from the passive proto profile dampening skills alone. |
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Sana Rayya
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Posted - 2014.01.07 16:44:00 -
[11] - Quote
If these bonuses do go through, I'll enjoy spamming 50% more nades and REs from my Cal Logi's nanohives :D |
Sana Rayya
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Posted - 2014.01.07 16:59:00 -
[12] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:
The Amarr Logi bonus is just as bad. We are THE slowest medium frame suits on the battlefield, but they give us a bonust to uplinks? We also have less PG than the other logis, and uplinks are PG hungry. Looks like I won't be utilizing my racial bonus. This could be a problem with the Amarr only having 1 equipment.
I dunno. Drop uplinks as you advance, and defend those uplinks, or use a LAV (read TANK in 1.7) and deploy as many as you can. I think Amarr logis with proto uplinks will now get all the points from spawns, since their basic uplinks will now be proto speeds (5 sec), and their proto uplinks will be insane speeds (2-2.5 sec). |
Sana Rayya
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Posted - 2014.01.07 21:25:00 -
[13] - Quote
I think 1.8 will be the nail in the coffin for me. So until then, I'll be pubstomping in full proto to burn away all my ISK. Who's with me?!? Cores and REs for everyone! |
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