DUST Search - Shield Repair

Kane Fyea wrote:

Galvan Nized wrote:

Kane Fyea wrote:

Mike Ox Bigger wrote:

Kane Fyea wrote:

Also rep hives are horribly easy to get rid of. (Ever heard of flux grenades?)

Smart players stand out in front of their hives. There are ways around it but there isn't an equal for the shield. You're listing off ways to combat things that armor has that shield doesn't. My point is that shield should have these things as well.

Ye thats because:
1. You have natural repair and rechargers. Armor has reactive plates (Which are useless pretty much) and armor repairers which can only rep at 5 hp/s while you can already get over 50 hp/s regen.

2. Armor repairing hives force the person to be stationary and can be easily destroyed. This reinforces armors role of stand there and take the damage while shields are come in do damage run and regen.

3. Shield repair tools would be cool although I highly doubt anyone would use them because you can easily alpha through shields thanks to their low HP making the repair pretty useless for shields especially considering that shields already regen quickly. So that would = low rewards while doing it for armor would give much higher rewards making the shield one not worth the risk.

You talk about balance in the regen but how about in EHP? Or in PG/CPU cost?

What suit reps shields at 50 hp/s? Oh yea none.

Ever heard of the shield delay?

All armor tankers have shields so they benefit from them since they all naturally rep...apparently at 50 hp/s Roll

Shield tankers have no inherent armor rep unless you a logi or minnie (minnie bonus is 1) so you can work them down.

People would use a shield rep tool because repping from 0 shields could take 30s.

Low EHP is one of shields weaknesses. Shields are meant for hit and run playstyles (Meaning go in do damage run and recharge.) and armor tankers are tank and gank (Meaning you are supposed to sit there and take damage and regen after the fight at a very slow rate. Rep hives reinforce this role. )

Ever heard of regulators? Those reduce the delay.

Armor tankers shields can be taken out within 1-2 shots of any rifle, have a huge delay, and horrible recharge. Also have you heard of rechargers and energizers? You know those things that increase your shield recharge. If you armor tank with a shield suit you're doing it wrong and if you shield tank with an armor suit you're still doing it wrong. Also it's not hard to equip a basic armor repairer for the tiny amount of armor you have.

Also I never said shields don't need a buff but they don't need rep hives and rep tools. Also they don't need a very big buff either. Also one of the biggest reasons why shields aren't awesome is because of the low TTK. CCP needs to raise the TTK to make shields work good again.

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Galvan Nized Deep Space Republic 495	Posted - 2014.01.03 00:15:00 - [31] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Mike Ox Bigger wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Also rep hives are horribly easy to get rid of. (Ever heard of flux grenades?) Smart players stand out in front of their hives. There are ways around it but there isn't an equal for the shield. You're listing off ways to combat things that armor has that shield doesn't. My point is that shield should have these things as well. Ye thats because: 1. You have natural repair and rechargers. Armor has reactive plates (Which are useless pretty much) and armor repairers which can only rep at 5 hp/s while you can already get over 50 hp/s regen. 2. Armor repairing hives force the person to be stationary and can be easily destroyed. This reinforces armors role of stand there and take the damage while shields are come in do damage run and regen. 3. Shield repair tools would be cool although I highly doubt anyone would use them because you can easily alpha through shields thanks to their low HP making the repair pretty useless for shields especially considering that shields already regen quickly. So that would = low rewards while doing it for armor would give much higher rewards making the shield one not worth the risk. You talk about balance in the regen but how about in EHP? Or in PG/CPU cost? What suit reps shields at 50 hp/s? Oh yea none. Ever heard of the shield delay? All armor tankers have shields so they benefit from them since they all naturally rep...apparently at 50 hp/s Shield tankers have no inherent armor rep unless you a logi or minnie (minnie bonus is 1) so you can work them down. People would use a shield rep tool because repping from 0 shields could take 30s.
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2540	Posted - 2014.01.03 00:28:00 - [32] - Quote Galvan Nized wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Mike Ox Bigger wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Also rep hives are horribly easy to get rid of. (Ever heard of flux grenades?) Smart players stand out in front of their hives. There are ways around it but there isn't an equal for the shield. You're listing off ways to combat things that armor has that shield doesn't. My point is that shield should have these things as well. Ye thats because: 1. You have natural repair and rechargers. Armor has reactive plates (Which are useless pretty much) and armor repairers which can only rep at 5 hp/s while you can already get over 50 hp/s regen. 2. Armor repairing hives force the person to be stationary and can be easily destroyed. This reinforces armors role of stand there and take the damage while shields are come in do damage run and regen. 3. Shield repair tools would be cool although I highly doubt anyone would use them because you can easily alpha through shields thanks to their low HP making the repair pretty useless for shields especially considering that shields already regen quickly. So that would = low rewards while doing it for armor would give much higher rewards making the shield one not worth the risk. You talk about balance in the regen but how about in EHP? Or in PG/CPU cost? What suit reps shields at 50 hp/s? Oh yea none. Ever heard of the shield delay? All armor tankers have shields so they benefit from them since they all naturally rep...apparently at 50 hp/s Shield tankers have no inherent armor rep unless you a logi or minnie (minnie bonus is 1) so you can work them down. People would use a shield rep tool because repping from 0 shields could take 30s. Low EHP is one of shields weaknesses. Shields are meant for hit and run playstyles (Meaning go in do damage run and recharge.) and armor tankers are tank and gank (Meaning you are supposed to sit there and take damage and regen after the fight at a very slow rate. Rep hives reinforce this role. ) Ever heard of regulators? Those reduce the delay. Armor tankers shields can be taken out within 1-2 shots of any rifle, have a huge delay, and horrible recharge. Also have you heard of rechargers and energizers? You know those things that increase your shield recharge. If you armor tank with a shield suit you're doing it wrong and if you shield tank with an armor suit you're still doing it wrong. Also it's not hard to equip a basic armor repairer for the tiny amount of armor you have. Also I never said shields don't need a buff but they don't need rep hives and rep tools. Also they don't need a very big buff either. Also one of the biggest reasons why shields aren't awesome is because of the low TTK. CCP needs to raise the TTK to make shields work good again.
Beck Weathers Ghosts of Dawn General Tso's Alliance 220	Posted - 2014.01.03 00:39:00 - [33] - Quote I aprove of this message, and and to all you people saying armor tanking is balanced to shields, all i can say is shield "hit and run" play style is completely negated by the super low TTK, you will almost NEVER make it back to cover to get your shields regend, yet armor can regen while being shot and also have rep nanohives and Core repaire tools. Shields need a repair took aswell ,tho it should rep like only 2/5 as much as armor liekly.
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2541	Posted - 2014.01.03 00:41:00 - [34] - Quote Beck Weathers wrote: I aprove of this message, and and to all you people saying armor tanking is balanced to shields, all i can say is shield "hit and run" play style is completely negated by the super low TTK, you will almost NEVER make it back to cover to get your shields regend, yet armor can regen while being shot and also have rep nanohives and Core repaire tools. Shields need a repair took aswell ,tho it should rep like only 2/5 as much as armor liekly. The TTK is the issue. There's no reason to waste developers time on equipment that won't be used after the TTK is fixed. Also shields do need a small buff but the TTK is really the biggest issue with shields right now.
Galvan Nized Deep Space Republic 495	Posted - 2014.01.03 01:27:00 - [35] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Galvan Nized wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Mike Ox Bigger wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Also rep hives are horribly easy to get rid of. (Ever heard of flux grenades?) Smart players stand out in front of their hives. There are ways around it but there isn't an equal for the shield. You're listing off ways to combat things that armor has that shield doesn't. My point is that shield should have these things as well. Ye thats because: 1. You have natural repair and rechargers. Armor has reactive plates (Which are useless pretty much) and armor repairers which can only rep at 5 hp/s while you can already get over 50 hp/s regen. 2. Armor repairing hives force the person to be stationary and can be easily destroyed. This reinforces armors role of stand there and take the damage while shields are come in do damage run and regen. 3. Shield repair tools would be cool although I highly doubt anyone would use them because you can easily alpha through shields thanks to their low HP making the repair pretty useless for shields especially considering that shields already regen quickly. So that would = low rewards while doing it for armor would give much higher rewards making the shield one not worth the risk. You talk about balance in the regen but how about in EHP? Or in PG/CPU cost? What suit reps shields at 50 hp/s? Oh yea none. Ever heard of the shield delay? All armor tankers have shields so they benefit from them since they all naturally rep...apparently at 50 hp/s Shield tankers have no inherent armor rep unless you a logi or minnie (minnie bonus is 1) so you can work them down. People would use a shield rep tool because repping from 0 shields could take 30s. Low EHP is one of shields weaknesses. Shields are meant for hit and run playstyles (Meaning go in do damage run and recharge.) and armor tankers are tank and gank (Meaning you are supposed to sit there and take damage and regen after the fight at a very slow rate. Rep hives reinforce this role. ) Ever heard of regulators? Those reduce the delay. Armor tankers shields can be taken out within 1-2 shots of any rifle, have a huge delay, and horrible recharge. Also have you heard of rechargers and energizers? You know those things that increase your shield recharge. If you armor tank with a shield suit you're doing it wrong and if you shield tank with an armor suit you're still doing it wrong. Also it's not hard to equip a basic armor repairer for the tiny amount of armor you have. Also I never said shields don't need a buff but they don't need rep hives and rep tools. Also they don't need a very big buff either. Also one of the biggest reasons why shields aren't awesome is because of the low TTK. CCP needs to raise the TTK to make shields work good again. Regulators may make up the penalty from your extenders but you gain nothing unless you run more than 1. Which is possible. Plus they are CPU intensive so to run more than 1 with extenders you must throw on a CPU mod. Rechargers and energizers are worthless because the advantage comes at huge CPU cost (more than double that of an armor plate). Shield gets maybe 60% faster recharge with an energizer but that all only yields a recharge of 40 on a caldari assault. At least armor plates are worthwhile from each tier, and they get variants. Shields scale terribly and are barely with it at Pro. I'm not saying rep tools need to give hp to shields, I would prefer if they would "jumpstart" shields. This still leaves armor with the advantage in rep tools but shields at least are worth healing.
ANON Cerberus Tiny Toons 22	Posted - 2014.01.15 03:11:00 - [36] - Quote I am here to push the agenda and DEMAND we get shield repair tools. In EVE you have both and they are both fully supported. Is there a specific reason we dont have shield repair tools? Or is it just a case of CCP getting around to making them? We NEED shield repair tools now more than ever. ESPECIALLY if we are going to get shield heavies. Not only that - right now armour tanking has all the benefits of repair hives as well as dedicated logistics repair tools.
Reav Hannari Red Rock Outriders 2581	Posted - 2014.01.15 04:11:00 - [37] - Quote For racial parity we should have shield transporters and hives. Caldari heavies with massive shield buffers and shield logistics at their back should be a scary thing. Fast moving Matari commandos with equally fast moving logistics should have their lesser buffers quickly repaired as they assault enemy positions. Remote shield repair should cut the recharge delays but there should still be a window of opportunity to hit armor. // Venge Captain // Matari Logistics / Scout / Pilot // @ReesNoturana
GET ATMESON Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 231	Posted - 2014.01.15 04:49:00 - [38] - Quote Mike Ox Bigger wrote: Armor tanking owns not just because of the ability to tank and gank but they have repair hives and rep tools while shield does not. Why not throw in some hives that boost shield or have some sort of tool to boost shield? Would go a long way in evening out things a bit. That and nerf tanks all to hell. BUT shields can self repair. Use energizers might help you out. Stacking EHP and hope that they use a "sheild repair" wont happen anytime soon. Armor nanohives need a nerf due to spam of them. Open Beta Fed 16th 2013. Scout fix + Heavy suits + Heavy guns = soonGäó
Ydubbs81 RND Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 2269	Posted - 2014.01.15 06:08:00 - [39] - Quote Mike Ox Bigger wrote: Armor tanking owns not just because of the ability to tank and gank but they have repair hives and rep tools while shield does not. Why not throw in some hives that boost shield or have some sort of tool to boost shield? Would go a long way in evening out things a bit. That and nerf tanks all to hell. I agree with you man weRideNDie2getha since 2010
Faunher Ivory Vanguard 73	Posted - 2014.01.15 06:28:00 - [40] - Quote Shields are in an absolutely **** position right now. They can not get near the solid hp that armor can per/pg and per/cpu, and the uprising shield regen patch further crippled shields. Armor on the other hand has tremendous hp potential, can reach fairly high passive armor regen (if fitted properly), and has the option to receive external support from multiple sources. You may argue that shields have rechargers and the like, but they are highly ineffective because in the highs it is reducing your slots for extenders, and in the lows the cpu cost is absolutely ridiculous given the minute difference the modules make. Though you can not really argue about tanking, as any suit bar heavies die within 1.5 seconds. The real problem with tank right now (shield and armor both) is the low TTK.

jerrmy12 kahoalii The Phoenix Federation 378	Posted - 2014.01.15 06:36:00 - [41] - Quote BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: Mike Ox Bigger wrote: BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: Shield reharger + Shield Regulator So basically you think that's even with armor repair modules, having a repper on your back, and standing on a hive? you are right. since shields have extenders as highs and regulators as lows, then armor should also have plates as lows and reps as highs, right? only logically makes sense no? also, armor makes you slower and it requires the same slot to use cardiacs kinetics if you want to neutralize the speed as a SCR user, I understand how difficult it is to fight through armor, but there are more weapons aimed at killing armor than shields Scr = shield, rail rifle/combat rifle = armor. Shield: Ar Scr Scp Rr All do too much to shields Closed beta vet I use a tablet so beware of typos
KGB Sleep Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 638	Posted - 2014.01.15 06:36:00 - [42] - Quote Shields used to be glorious. My general opinion of shields now. "Because beer, that's why."
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 459	Posted - 2014.01.15 09:01:00 - [43] - Quote Mike Ox Bigger wrote: Armor tanking owns not just because of the ability to tank and gank but they have repair hives and rep tools while shield does not. Why not throw in some hives that boost shield or have some sort of tool to boost shield? Would go a long way in evening out things a bit. That and nerf tanks all to hell. Well I could live with a repair tool that reps ond boost shields but if you don't know the advantages of shield over armor...
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 459	Posted - 2014.01.15 09:02:00 - [44] - Quote jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote: BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: Mike Ox Bigger wrote: BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: Shield reharger + Shield Regulator So basically you think that's even with armor repair modules, having a repper on your back, and standing on a hive? you are right. since shields have extenders as highs and regulators as lows, then armor should also have plates as lows and reps as highs, right? only logically makes sense no? also, armor makes you slower and it requires the same slot to use cardiacs kinetics if you want to neutralize the speed as a SCR user, I understand how difficult it is to fight through armor, but there are more weapons aimed at killing armor than shields Scr = shield, rail rifle/combat rifle = armor. Shield: Ar Scr Scp Rr All do too much to shields The RR does more damage to armor...and less to shields...
jerrmy12 kahoalii The Phoenix Federation 379	Posted - 2014.01.15 09:05:00 - [45] - Quote Korvin Lomont wrote: jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote: BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: Mike Ox Bigger wrote: BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: Shield reharger + Shield Regulator So basically you think that's even with armor repair modules, having a repper on your back, and standing on a hive? you are right. since shields have extenders as highs and regulators as lows, then armor should also have plates as lows and reps as highs, right? only logically makes sense no? also, armor makes you slower and it requires the same slot to use cardiacs kinetics if you want to neutralize the speed as a SCR user, I understand how difficult it is to fight through armor, but there are more weapons aimed at killing armor than shields Scr = shield, rail rifle/combat rifle = armor. Shield: Ar Scr Scp Rr All do too much to shields The RR does more damage to armor...and less to shields... Basicly, not, shields get melted by everything Closed beta vet I use a tablet so beware of typos
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution Covert Intervention 4032	Posted - 2014.01.15 09:06:00 - [46] - Quote So many god awful ideas and poor understanding in this thread. Perfect example of the kind of people not to listen to.
Sinboto Simmons SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 4026	Posted - 2014.01.15 09:08:00 - [47] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: Mike Ox Bigger wrote: Jason Pearson wrote: Nah. You're Gallente scum your opinion doesn't matter. I'm a Caldari loyalist and I approve this message I'm Matari and I think shields are ***. Sinboto - The True Blood Minja* Forum Warrior level 4 STB-Infantry (Demolition)
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 459	Posted - 2014.01.15 09:09:00 - [48] - Quote jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote: Basicly, not, shields get melted by everything With the current TTK everything gets melted fast nevertheless the RR does 90% to shields and 110% to armor
jerrmy12 kahoalii The Phoenix Federation 379	Posted - 2014.01.15 09:12:00 - [49] - Quote Korvin Lomont wrote: jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote: Basicly, not, shields get melted by everything With the current TTK everything gets melted fast nevertheless the RR does 90% to shields and 110% to armor I melt 400 shields faster than 350 armor Closed beta vet I use a tablet so beware of typos
Justicar Karnellia Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 567	Posted - 2014.01.15 09:16:00 - [50] - Quote Well I think armor had so long been the underdog, now the pendulum has swung the other way and balance must be re-established. Of course shields used to be great in open beta - they'd self heal, few weapons were optimised to kill them, they'd have low fitting costs... but now with more weapons being released and now suit parity approaching, armor does have a definitive advantage. First of all, there are so many modules that repair armour, as well as nanohives that repair armour (not to mention repair tools). The other notable advantage is that damage modules take up high slots, so armor can have the best of both worlds - high repair rate, high ehp and high damage output while shields must have sacrifice one of these elements. I think CCP will balance it out in due time once they see people leaning towards armour suits. One of the current balancing factors is weapons like the railgun which really tear through armor.

Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 459	Posted - 2014.01.15 09:18:00 - [51] - Quote jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote: Korvin Lomont wrote: jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote: Basicly, not, shields get melted by everything With the current TTK everything gets melted fast nevertheless the RR does 90% to shields and 110% to armor I melt 400 shields faster than 350 armor With what weapon? As I said the RR has a bonus to amor like any hybrid rail weapon. And the difference between 400 HP shield and 350 Armor is roughly one bullet from the RR so I guess the difference is hardly noticeable...
Horizen Kenpachi TACTICAL STRIKE ELITE 92	Posted - 2014.01.15 09:32:00 - [52] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Mejt0 wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Mike Ox Bigger wrote: BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: Shield reharger + Shield Regulator So basically you think that's even with armor repair modules, having a repper on your back, and standing on a hive? To do that it requires teamwork so yea. Teamwork is OP. Everyone knows this. You can alone do it all Really you can repair yourself with a repair tool? I didn't know that. Also rep hives are horribly easy to get rid of. (Ever heard of flux grenades?) Logi lavs could repair the driver i did it loads shield and armour depending what transporter it was eq with Hit me with your nerf bat.
DeathwindRising ROGUE SPADES 201	Posted - 2014.01.15 09:43:00 - [53] - Quote i think itd be great if we got a peice of equipment that when activated, removes the shield delay entirely and allows your shields to recharge continueously and even when taking damage. give it a 45 second cooldown and a 20 second duration. and you can only fit one per suit. this is different than simply making it rep shields at 100 hp/s as it only reps you with your suits shield recharge. low shield recharge wouldnt really benefit from it but a high shield recharge suit would. or... a shield hardener for dropsuits. 30% reduction to damage for some amount of time. with a cooldown afterwards
Echoist Fenrir's Wolves Zero-Day 115	Posted - 2014.01.15 12:16:00 - [54] - Quote Mike Ox Bigger wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: To do that it requires teamwork so yea. Teamwork is OP. Everyone knows this. The repper yeah but it takes nothing to load up on armor and stand inside of a hive and what's that? I got room for two damage mods too.. True but by having to rely on the nanohive that person is restricting themselves to a very small area. You then have three options flux and destroy the nanohive then eliminate the person, completely avoid his area, or use a longer ranged gun and pick him off slowly. Actually there's a fourth use teamwork to rush and flank him. Stop being stubborn and think outside the box. Noobasaures: "Rawr" Laser Rifle Specialist, Rail Rifles... Lol fail Be safe, be orca safe.
ANON Cerberus Tiny Toons 26	Posted - 2014.01.15 17:53:00 - [55] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: So many god awful ideas and poor understanding in this thread. Perfect example of the kind of people not to listen to. Please point to the god awful ideas. I am interested to see your take on this?
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 714	Posted - 2014.01.15 19:03:00 - [56] - Quote Significantly buff shield recharge rate and recharge delay


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