DUST Search - Should the Cloak be a Module, Equipment Slot, or a Light Weapon. Discuss.

Garrett Blacknova wrote:

Korvin Lomont wrote:

Garrett Blacknova wrote:

Equipment.

Insane CPU and maybe PG cost.

CPU cost (and PG if relevant) massively reduced on Scout suits.

If your suit comes with an equipment slot, you CAN put a Cloak on it, but unless you're a Scout, that's probably ALL you can have.

Well insane CPU is a bit tricky as the scout has the lowest CPU rating of all suits(apart from the commando). So a medium frame will still be able to fit that equipment without beeing hindered so much as mediums have at 50 CPU more than scouts.

If you look at the current skill bonusses the highest is 10% per level (and I highly doubt scouts will get 10% bonus to CPU and PG for cloaking devices 5% is more realistic). So even if the cloaking device will need 100CPU a medium can fit this thing rather comfortabel and will still be able to run in a valid fit.

PG on the other hand would work better as scouts PG values are much closer to the assault PG rating. So a module with moderate CPU and higher PG could work better when scouts get a huge CPU/PG bonus...

Nope. More like EVE with 95% or more CPU reduction.

You can literally fit it on a Scout normally or fit ONLY the cloak on another suit.

They've been talking about having a massive difference in fitting of cloaks on Scout suits compared with other suit types.

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Ghost Kaisar Kinsho Swords Caldari State 1221	Posted - 2013.12.18 07:02:00 - [1] - Quote Go ahead and discuss it here Mollerz and Quil. I MADE THIS FOR YOU Minmatar Faction Warfare: Let's get Organized
Kasote Denzara A Vulture 1384	Posted - 2013.12.18 07:04:00 - [2] - Quote Doesn't matter to me. Commando does all (except grenades). "Go ahead and dual tank. My Commando dual ganks." -Kasote Denzara You can find me in Gallente's FW. I smell of freedom.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 4216	Posted - 2013.12.18 07:09:00 - [3] - Quote Equipment. Insane CPU and maybe PG cost. CPU cost (and PG if relevant) massively reduced on Scout suits. If your suit comes with an equipment slot, you CAN put a Cloak on it, but unless you're a Scout, that's probably ALL you can have.
Broonfondle Majikthies Bannana Boat Corp Relentless Heroes Alliance 612	Posted - 2013.12.18 07:11:00 - [4] - Quote Honestly I have mixed feelings where the Cloak should go. I think logically it should be a low slot to make it harder for you to be both invisible AND stay off scanners "...where Bylothgar the Ill-postured was made King of the People With No Name But Decent Footwear"
Mossellia Delt Militaires Sans Jeux 791	Posted - 2013.12.18 07:11:00 - [5] - Quote Made my own thread about this but i'll say it again Create active mod slots Give logi's zero give assaults 1 at proto give heavies 1 at ADV, 2 at proto give scouts 1 at std, 2 at adv, 3 at proto active mods can have cloaking, speed boosts, jump boosts, armour/shield hardners, teleport (jump drives) ect in them. Create 3rd fitting requirement - apart from CPU/PG, Active mods are run off of this. Parody Dust 514 Lyrics Vote for Delt
The Robot Devil Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 1333	Posted - 2013.12.18 07:11:00 - [6] - Quote Just like the active scanner except you have to hold the trigger the entire time and when the trigger is released the timer starts. 3 second recalibrating time before weapons can be used and a 10 second cool down time. Skills change speed while deployed and cool down. Scouts have a small bonus and special ops having better bonuses that change the recalibration time and cool down time. No running while cloaked to keep it from being op except for maybe a covert class of suits thats role was a fast traveling cloak. No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride.
The Robot Devil Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 1333	Posted - 2013.12.18 07:14:00 - [7] - Quote Garrett Blacknova wrote: Equipment. Insane CPU and maybe PG cost. CPU cost (and PG if relevant) massively reduced on Scout suits. If your suit comes with an equipment slot, you CAN put a Cloak on it, but unless you're a Scout, that's probably ALL you can have. Or make the cloak so useless that it is only used to hide and move slowly. Only special op suits should have weapons close to decloak. What would be the point of a cloak on a heavy if he couldn't use his weapon for 3-5 seconds? No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride.
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 1291	Posted - 2013.12.18 07:20:00 - [8] - Quote If it was an equipment then the galogi would use it best. Just my two isk "The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources..." Albert Einstein
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 4216	Posted - 2013.12.18 07:21:00 - [9] - Quote Mossellia Delt wrote: Create 3rd fitting requirement - apart from CPU/PG, Active mods are run off of this. Call it "capacitor". Give it a max value which modules require to be fitted, and a recharge rate which influences how long they can run for.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1516	Posted - 2013.12.18 07:30:00 - [10] - Quote Ghost Kaisar wrote: Go ahead and discuss it here Mollerz and Quil. I MADE THIS FOR YOU Light weapon Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.

Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 4216	Posted - 2013.12.18 07:38:00 - [11] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: Or make the cloak so useless that it is only used to hide and move slowly. Only special op suits should have weapons close to decloak. What would be the point of a cloak on a heavy if he couldn't use his weapon for 3-5 seconds? They've confirmed there will be a "shimmer" effect which gets more pronounced when you move, and that there will be a Scout-exclusive buff reducing this effect. Slow movement unless you're running the Scout or a black ops Light Frame suit. Also, if it's equipment, you can't be holding a gun AND your cloak at the same time, it's one or the other, so you can't shoot while cloaked, there's a delay between disengaging the cloak and starting to fire.
abarkrishna WarRavens 180	Posted - 2013.12.18 08:10:00 - [12] - Quote They have already said that first off it will have a high pg/cpu cost. They also said that scouts would be getting a bonus specifically to this. Another thing they had mentioned would be that it will not only be a visual cloak but it will work as a profile dampener as well. I imagine what will happen is that it will be an equipment or low powered slot. Because it will act as a profile dampener scouts will no longer have to sacrifice as many slots on an almost worthless module. I highly disagree with any suggestion that would have any class lose a light weapon. That is so unbalanced the idea is just stupid. For scouts specifically they already have very little health. If you only allow them to have a pistol or SMG you will lose an already quickly fading player base. As an equipment piece I assume it would work kind of like a scanner where you activate it and it stays engaged for a set amount of time. Not allowing people to use a weapon while cloaked is also a very bad idea. It would make the cloak pointless as you would not be able to stealthily assassinate any targets. No you kill this blueberry hacking the CRU we are camping. I already killed the last 2. When will they learn!
Ghost Kaisar Kinsho Swords Caldari State 1223	Posted - 2013.12.18 08:15:00 - [13] - Quote abarkrishna wrote: They have already said that first off it will have a high pg/cpu cost. They also said that scouts would be getting a bonus specifically to this. Another thing they had mentioned would be that it will not only be a visual cloak but it will work as a profile dampener as well. I imagine what will happen is that it will be an equipment or low powered slot. Because it will act as a profile dampener scouts will no longer have to sacrifice as many slots on an almost worthless module. I highly disagree with any suggestion that would have any class lose a light weapon. That is so unbalanced the idea is just stupid. For scouts specifically they already have very little health. If you only allow them to have a pistol or SMG you will lose an already quickly fading player base. As an equipment piece I assume it would work kind of like a scanner where you activate it and it stays engaged for a set amount of time. Not allowing people to use a weapon while cloaked is also a very bad idea. It would make the cloak pointless as you would not be able to stealthily assassinate any targets. I just made this thread to get the two guys on the Scouts Killboard over here. They keep going back and forth, and we want them to take it elsewhere. Working as intended. They are nowhere to be found...... But yeah, the light weapon idea is stupid. Minmatar Faction Warfare: Let's get Organized
GET ATMESON Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 192	Posted - 2013.12.18 09:10:00 - [14] - Quote only scouts should have this and it should be a high slot. Why cant a heavy hide? You guys are all greedy and want it on your suits what about heavys. Yet again no love for the fat boys. Heavys only have 2 heavy guns. Please dont turn the NERF bat on them. Give heavys more suits or guns soonGäó
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 370	Posted - 2013.12.18 09:27:00 - [15] - Quote Garrett Blacknova wrote: Equipment. Insane CPU and maybe PG cost. CPU cost (and PG if relevant) massively reduced on Scout suits. If your suit comes with an equipment slot, you CAN put a Cloak on it, but unless you're a Scout, that's probably ALL you can have. Well insane CPU is a bit tricky as the scout has the lowest CPU rating of all suits(apart from the commando). So a medium frame will still be able to fit that equipment without beeing hindered so much as mediums have at 50 CPU more than scouts. If you look at the current skill bonusses the highest is 10% per level (and I highly doubt scouts will get 10% bonus to CPU and PG for cloaking devices 5% is more realistic). So even if the cloaking device will need 100CPU a medium can fit this thing rather comfortabel and will still be able to run in a valid fit. PG on the other hand would work better as scouts PG values are much closer to the assault PG rating. So a module with moderate CPU and higher PG could work better when scouts get a huge CPU/PG bonus...
Drifter MAGGOT KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 130	Posted - 2013.12.18 09:30:00 - [16] - Quote Ghost Kaisar wrote: Go ahead and discuss it here Mollerz and Quil. I MADE THIS FOR YOU Depends on if they have a militia variant.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 4218	Posted - 2013.12.18 09:31:00 - [17] - Quote Korvin Lomont wrote: Garrett Blacknova wrote: Equipment. Insane CPU and maybe PG cost. CPU cost (and PG if relevant) massively reduced on Scout suits. If your suit comes with an equipment slot, you CAN put a Cloak on it, but unless you're a Scout, that's probably ALL you can have. Well insane CPU is a bit tricky as the scout has the lowest CPU rating of all suits(apart from the commando). So a medium frame will still be able to fit that equipment without beeing hindered so much as mediums have at 50 CPU more than scouts. If you look at the current skill bonusses the highest is 10% per level (and I highly doubt scouts will get 10% bonus to CPU and PG for cloaking devices 5% is more realistic). So even if the cloaking device will need 100CPU a medium can fit this thing rather comfortabel and will still be able to run in a valid fit. PG on the other hand would work better as scouts PG values are much closer to the assault PG rating. So a module with moderate CPU and higher PG could work better when scouts get a huge CPU/PG bonus... Nope. More like EVE with 95% or more CPU reduction. You can literally fit it on a Scout normally or fit ONLY the cloak on another suit. They've been talking about having a massive difference in fitting of cloaks on Scout suits compared with other suit types.
Galvan Nized Deep Space Republic 400	Posted - 2013.12.18 09:38:00 - [18] - Quote I like it in the grenade slot. I dislike it in the equipment slot because the wheel is cumbersome. Also logis get a bonus to equipment and should not have an easier time putting on a cloak. The grenade slot makes for easy activation with L2 and still allows access to weapons/equipment (not necessarily meaning you can use them while cloaked but have access to them). Also not having grenades makes for a nice negative to cloaks. Also think the nade slot makes a nice active mod slot because of the quick activation and it's limitation of 1.
MINA Longstrike 2Shitz 1Giggle 173	Posted - 2013.12.18 09:45:00 - [19] - Quote Mossellia Delt wrote: Made my own thread about this but i'll say it again Create active mod slots Give logi's zero give assaults 1 at proto give heavies 1 at ADV, 2 at proto give scouts 1 at std, 2 at adv, 3 at proto active mods can have cloaking, speed boosts, jump boosts, armour/shield hardners, teleport (jump drives) ect in them. Create 3rd fitting requirement - apart from CPU/PG, Active mods are run off of this. I like the idea, but I'd like it better if assaults got 1 across all tiers, heavy got 1 at basic and adv, 2 at proto. scout I think I'm fine with as most people try to go straight to adv with it just to get decent pg/cpu out of them.
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1967	Posted - 2013.12.18 10:09:00 - [20] - Quote If it was a module slot, you'd have to program new mechanics in to prevent shooting/aiming/arming/using equipment whilst cloaked. No one in their right mind would use a cloak instead of a weapon - that's about as stupid as making logis have rep tools as their weapon! Equipment is the most logical choice but will require scouts to be given an extra equipment slot to be able to actually use it and do scoutly things, otherwise it will be next to useless. Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.

Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 370	Posted - 2013.12.18 10:36:00 - [21] - Quote Garrett Blacknova wrote: Korvin Lomont wrote: Garrett Blacknova wrote: Equipment. Insane CPU and maybe PG cost. CPU cost (and PG if relevant) massively reduced on Scout suits. If your suit comes with an equipment slot, you CAN put a Cloak on it, but unless you're a Scout, that's probably ALL you can have. Well insane CPU is a bit tricky as the scout has the lowest CPU rating of all suits(apart from the commando). So a medium frame will still be able to fit that equipment without beeing hindered so much as mediums have at 50 CPU more than scouts. If you look at the current skill bonusses the highest is 10% per level (and I highly doubt scouts will get 10% bonus to CPU and PG for cloaking devices 5% is more realistic). So even if the cloaking device will need 100CPU a medium can fit this thing rather comfortabel and will still be able to run in a valid fit. PG on the other hand would work better as scouts PG values are much closer to the assault PG rating. So a module with moderate CPU and higher PG could work better when scouts get a huge CPU/PG bonus... Nope. More like EVE with 95% or more CPU reduction. You can literally fit it on a Scout normally or fit ONLY the cloak on another suit. They've been talking about having a massive difference in fitting of cloaks on Scout suits compared with other suit types. Yes I know I am just a little afraid that their intention of a massive reduction would come down to something like 5 to 10% per level and even with this bonus Assaults would cry OP ^^
Midas Fool Black Phoenix Mercenaries 263	Posted - 2013.12.18 10:52:00 - [22] - Quote Mossellia Delt wrote: Made my own thread about this but i'll say it again Create active mod slots Give logi's zero give assaults 1 at proto give heavies 1 at ADV, 2 at proto give scouts 1 at std, 2 at adv, 3 at proto active mods can have cloaking, speed boosts, jump boosts, armour/shield hardners, teleport (jump drives) ect in them. Create 3rd fitting requirement - apart from CPU/PG, Active mods are run off of this. This. Make this a separate post. If you have already do it again. Django Quik wrote: No one in their right mind would use a cloak instead of a weapon - that's about as stupid as making logis have rep tools as their weapon! Why not? I've often wanted a rep tool instead of a weapon for my logis. If it is made a light weapon, scouts will still have Scrambler Pistols, SMGs and Nova Knives to kill with, and if it was a sidearm then they could fit whatever they pleased. For best results press R1 repeatedly. Consult your doctor if your erection persists for more than four hours.
shaman oga Nexus Balusa Horizon 1182	Posted - 2013.12.18 10:55:00 - [23] - Quote It should be a module, but scout should have a form of it, built in their suits. "Just another piece of duct tape" Drugs for mercs
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1967	Posted - 2013.12.18 11:22:00 - [24] - Quote I'll just repost this from the scout registry: Django Quik wrote: I can't believe we're still discussing what slot cloaks will be in! CCP constantly refers to them as equipment. IWS dropped in here recently to allude to some very special equipment that will greatly improve the life of scouts. Weapons go in weapon slots - nothing that is not a weapon should ever go there. Likewise grenades go in grenade slots. Modules would need total recoding for active modules to be added to dropsuits. (descriptions have never ever been updated, so are zero evidence of future or even current intentions) CCP have never ever said anything against the idea of giving scouts an extra equipment slot, so that is not necessarily off the cards, like someone said earlier. CCP has said that the CPU usage will be MASSIVE with scouts getting an equally huge reduction - if a cloak takes 400CPU and and we get a 95% reduction, we will pretty much be the only viable cloaking suits. Pretty sure CCP said you won't be able to shoot cloaked in one of the dev blogs describing it. Tell me people - IFF we get an extra equipment slot, what would be the drawbacks to having cloaks as equipment? Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
Daxxis KANNAH Distinct Covert Initiative 539	Posted - 2013.12.18 14:11:00 - [25] - Quote shaman oga wrote: It should be a module, but scout should have a form of it, built in their suits. Always thought this. Scouts built in would be better than the module for others and would improve each level so Lv1 > Basic cloak, Lv3 > Enhanced cloak, Lv5 > Complex cloak. On the op: Cloak as equipment - Use it for set period of time - Short cooldown Only breaks when switched off or time runs out. Obviously you have to switch off to shoot Cant be broken by scanners visually but can reveal location on tacnet (no chevron on hud) Higher cloaks increase duration or reduce cooldown Cloak as module - Can stay activated indefinitely - Long cooldown Breaks when you sprint, shoot, hack, use installations. You can jump or drop off ledges and remained cloaked. Higher scanners break cloak Higher cloaks obviously beat lower scanners and decrease cooldown
knight guard fury The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 103	Posted - 2013.12.18 14:12:00 - [26] - Quote . In Rust We Trust, true to the Republic, Kherokior warrior
Krom Ganesh Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 948	Posted - 2013.12.18 14:17:00 - [27] - Quote Mossellia Delt wrote: Made my own thread about this but i'll say it again Create active mod slots Give logi's zero give assaults 1 at proto give heavies 1 at ADV, 2 at proto give scouts 1 at std, 2 at adv, 3 at proto active mods can have cloaking, speed boosts, jump boosts, armour/shield hardners, teleport (jump drives) ect in them. Create 3rd fitting requirement - apart from CPU/PG, Active mods are run off of this. ^ This. Though I say we should let the active mods cost CPU/PG. Also, logis should get one as well. In addition, each class should receive an additional bonus towards fitting active mods that mesh with their intended role. Light - Biotic mods Scout - E-War mods (cloaking, tacnet/iff jammer, etc.) Medium - Rapid regen mods? (deactivated by damage though) Assault - Damage booster Logi - Heavy - Sentinel - Shield and armor hardeners Commando - !
Quil Evrything Triple Terrors 572	Posted - 2013.12.18 15:25:00 - [28] - Quote Thoughts on the possibilities for cloak location. First off... it seems impossible they're going to make it an "always on", passive type module. That rules out both the "built into suits" option, and also the high/low slot option. grenade slot interesting. but seems a bit unlikely. Also, leaves the door open for new wave of "cloaked assault logi". As if the existing brick-tank-assault logi werent bad enough equipment slot This would ** off soo many scouts, since we couldnt use cloak and use uplinks. Also, has logi problem. EQ, with scouts get special extra eq slot Would make scouts relatively happy. At the same time, seems really, really unlikely. CCP hates scouts too much to make that happen, methinks Also, has logi problem. light weapon slot** Would make non-scouts not complain so much about cloaks. Would also stop logis using it, and thus eliminate the "cloaked assault logi" threat. Would also leave most scouts quite happy, since using sidearms as primary weapon is quite common for scouts.
Roy Ventus Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance 733	Posted - 2013.12.18 15:33:00 - [29] - Quote Either make new slots for active modules OR just use the equipment slot. Being forced to hold onto a piece of equipment makes it less OP. "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." Roy Ventus
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 671	Posted - 2013.12.18 15:34:00 - [30] - Quote Make it use 100 CPU then give scouts a 80% fitting bonus



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