DUST Search - EVE Dev Blog: Orbital Strikes

Flyingconejo wrote:

CCP Nullarbor wrote:

It may be too much, but we will keep a close eye on it.

We are considering removing the warbarge strike in PC as well. The problem is that it then only allows orbitals for people in alliances. We are discussing with the CPM ways in which we could open up orbital support to EVE pilots outside of an alliance which we think would solve this problem, then we can remove the warbarge strikes from PC as well.

This would then tie neatly into our plans for planetary conquest becoming more involved with EVE.

Warbarge strikes should never have existed in this game. They have always been easily farmed and exploited, and give a great reward for very low effort. For me, they are like a COD killstreak reward, and don't fit at all with the rest of the game design, where everything has a cost. (I got a strike? Nice, free kills just for pressing a button!).

But if they have to stay, I can understand them being in pubs as a placeholder for the real orbital strikes, but wargarge strikes certainly have no place in PC. The team using an orbital strike has to make the effort of coordinating with an EVE player, and that same player has to risk his money and his ship, and stay in the same place for 20-40 minutes. What effort does the team using warbarge strikes have to do? No effort at all.

I understand you guys wanting to give unaligned corps a chance to compete against corps with EVE support, but allowing both kind of strikes to coexist in this way is just na+»ve. Were you tired of people complaining about FG spam, MD spam and Core Locus spam? That will be nothing compared to the QQ from the Orbital+Warbarge strike spam that is coming.

I have no easy answer for your dilemma about corps not in an alliance. But allowing both kind of strikes to the same team in their present form sounds to me like the worst kind of solution, sorry. Eliminating warbarge strikes completely from PC would be a better solution, and short of that, increasing their WP cost, or deactivating them for teams with EVE support, or forcing a team to buy some kind of Warbarge Strike ammo previous to the battle, etc... Any of this would be better than what we have now in 1.7.

I really hope you find a better way soon. Good luck.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 8 post(s)
Sinboto Simmons SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 2826	Posted - 2013.12.05 23:37:00 - [31] - Quote Projectile ammo that kills things? Sinboto - The True Blood Minja Forum Warrior level 2 STB-Infantry (Demolition)
nor asha Turbo Bros inc. 51	Posted - 2013.12.06 01:25:00 - [32] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Absolute Idiom II wrote: Question for a dev!: I'd much prefer that the satellite became active on the overview for the entire time that a dust battle is active, not only when an EVE pilot is on grid. That way, FW pilots could roam for battles, or pick up random opportunities to help out. Or pirates can lay in wait for said FW pilots. Did you consider this option? Any reason you chose not to do so? The satellite going global is to indicate that someone is on grid with it, to indicate to roaming FW pilot they can get a fight there. We are discussing other ways for FW pilots to discover ongoing battles. That doesn't make any sense, other sites don't drop off the overview while no one is in them... No one will fly to them and thus no roaming pilots will know anything is going on it system. Becuase if you don't make a big shiny "FLY HERE" button no one will do it.... You're close CCP, keep thinking this one through .... please... If a DUST or EVE player is on a district it should light up. plus if they don't stay lit after an eve player leaves what's to stop the friendly militia from keeping a scout at the gates and warping off the district while reds are in system so the reds don't see the fight? They warp back once the other side leaves.
Poonmunch Sanguis Defense Syndicate 621	Posted - 2013.12.06 01:44:00 - [33] - Quote Do the EVE guys get to watch a satisfying short movie sequence that shows the bombardment hitting (from the POV of a ground-pounder)? It might be some nice eye candy for them to see their shots landing and the bodies flying. As a sniper I love sitting back and watching OBs. Munch What if the hokey pokey really is what it's all about?
nor asha Turbo Bros inc. 51	Posted - 2013.12.06 02:22:00 - [34] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Absolute Idiom II wrote: Also: If the eve pilot gets forced to temporarily disconnect from the district they lose the ability to continue to talk to their team. Could you not allow any pilots to remain connected to the chat until the end of the match? Yes if you disconnect you lose comms.[/quote ] Are we at least going to get local chat switched so dust players can bad mouth eve players and vise versa? Please? Like even if no beacon is up at least we can yell in local "hey help us! at this district!" if we see friendlies in system... [quote=Poonmunch]Do the EVE guys get to watch a satisfying short movie sequence that shows the bombardment hitting (from the POV of a ground-pounder)? It might be some nice eye candy for them to see their shots landing and the bodies flying. As a sniper I love sitting back and watching OBs. Munch sadly that would super to accomplish on PS4, but as the PS3 isn't going to last 10 years I assume that one day this should be very possible.
Aero Yassavi PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3716	Posted - 2013.12.06 05:45:00 - [35] - Quote I still strongly believe that orbital strikes should be earned per individual ship and not per satellite, so if more than one person was connected to the satellite than they could both earn their own orbital strikes instead of only one of them getting to fire. To me, that'd increase the involvement and connection between the two games much more. At the very least, it would be interesting to try it this way for just one weekend and collect some statistics (since there is no way we can test it on the test servers). Amarr faithful, join PIE Inc, the oldest EVE/Dust Amarr loyal corporation! Amarr Victor!
Terra Thesis HDYLTA Defiant Legacy 387	Posted - 2013.12.06 06:35:00 - [36] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: I still strongly believe that orbital strikes should be earned per individual ship and not per satellite, so if more than one person was connected to the satellite than they could both earn their own orbital strikes instead of only one of them getting to fire. To me, that'd increase the involvement and connection between the two games much more. At the very least, it would be interesting to try it this way for just one weekend and collect some statistics (since there is no way we can test it on the test servers). pretty sure the interaction that would lead to is a few destroyers glassing the everliving snot out of the district every other game. although i support a heavily DR version of this, where some arbitrarily large fleet in the sky could push down the time to strike to a theoretical minimum, say 1 per min. HDYLTA - Freedom Delivered
Sinboto Simmons SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 2837	Posted - 2013.12.06 06:37:00 - [37] - Quote Beren Hurin wrote: Terra Thesis wrote: really excited about this patch!! when can minmatar get some alternate strike ammo? at least laser has a niche. afaik tactical emp s is completely unusable. I've been flying catalysts but I'm really itching to get back in my thrasher. Considering FF is now on, the tactical EMP, might be some of the safest rounds to use especially combined with the new anti armor weapons. Strip the shields then melt the armor. I never thought of it that way Sinboto - The True Blood Minja Forum Warrior level 2 STB-Infantry (Demolition)
DeathwindRising ROGUE SPADES 139	Posted - 2013.12.06 08:33:00 - [38] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Absolute Idiom II wrote: Question for a dev!: I'd much prefer that the satellite became active on the overview for the entire time that a dust battle is active, not only when an EVE pilot is on grid. That way, FW pilots could roam for battles, or pick up random opportunities to help out. Or pirates can lay in wait for said FW pilots. Did you consider this option? Any reason you chose not to do so? The satellite going global is to indicate that someone is on grid with it, to indicate to roaming FW pilot they can get a fight there. We are discussing other ways for FW pilots to discover ongoing battles. what about adding active FW battles to the star map? that way anyone in a militia could simply look up the active battles for their faction the same way we use the DED to look for complexes on the star map? actually it'd probably end more like the members in fleet tool that shows you all the systems you have fleet mates in. would that be possible? and then you could add it to the militia tab while in a station.
Aero Yassavi PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3721	Posted - 2013.12.06 08:42:00 - [39] - Quote Terra Thesis wrote: Aero Yassavi wrote: I still strongly believe that orbital strikes should be earned per individual ship and not per satellite, so if more than one person was connected to the satellite than they could both earn their own orbital strikes instead of only one of them getting to fire. To me, that'd increase the involvement and connection between the two games much more. At the very least, it would be interesting to try it this way for just one weekend and collect some statistics (since there is no way we can test it on the test servers). pretty sure the interaction that would lead to is a few destroyers glassing the everliving snot out of the district every other game. although i support a heavily DR version of this, where some arbitrarily large fleet in the sky could push down the time to strike to a theoretical minimum, say 1 per min. But that is only what you think, not what will necessarily happen. Remember that all it takes to stop the timer is one enemy ship to get in radius of the satellite. Yes you can get rather large fleets just to blast the planet to hell, but is it worth that risk? There's a lot of things you have to consider. Ultimately I believe it'll lead to better gameplay, but opinions aside it should at least be reconsidered and better yet tested. Amarr faithful, join PIE Inc, the oldest EVE/Dust Amarr loyal corporation! Amarr Victor!
low genius The Sound Of Freedom Renegade Alliance 957	Posted - 2013.12.06 09:45:00 - [40] - Quote if I had anything to qq about scout-related I would do it here.

Terra Thesis HDYLTA Defiant Legacy 387	Posted - 2013.12.06 14:57:00 - [41] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: But that is only what you think, not what will necessarily happen. Remember that all it takes to stop the timer is one enemy ship to get in radius of the satellite. Yes you can get rather large fleets just to blast the planet to hell, but is it worth that risk? There's a lot of things you have to consider. Ultimately I believe it'll lead to better gameplay, but opinions aside it should at least be reconsidered and better yet tested. our opinions are the only thing we have here, aren't they? it would put too much control into the eve side. dust matches would primarily be determined by the outcome in space. how many eve fw fights last for the duration of a typical 15-20m dust match? that's the percentage of dust matches that will be fun for the guys the ground. and it's a very low number. the rest of the time, dust tactics, strategy, gear, and sp won't matter. no one will want to stick around to play orbital roulette. it'll be a bunch of 1 person squads calling in orbitals onto a few masochistic red dots in free suits. HDYLTA - Freedom Delivered
Mass Heals Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 138	Posted - 2013.12.06 15:20:00 - [42] - Quote Can we still gain 2500 WP to drop an EvE orbital? From Dust dev blog I understood that we still can earn a OB, but from the Eve Dev blog it seemed to me that it can only be achieved from EvE pilots 3 min wait.

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 3192	Posted - 2013.12.08 12:48:00 - [43] - Quote Mass Heals wrote: Can we still gain 2500 WP to drop an EvE orbital? From Dust dev blog I understood that we still can earn a OB, but from the Eve Dev blog it seemed to me that it can only be achieved from EvE pilots 3 min wait. No, the only way to earn an EVE orbital will be to capture the satellite. Warbarge strikes can still be unlocked through warpoints but these are no longer available in faction warfare, only public contracts and planetary conquest. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Aeon Amadi A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S. Renegade Alliance 4050	Posted - 2013.12.08 18:24:00 - [44] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Mass Heals wrote: Can we still gain 2500 WP to drop an EvE orbital? From Dust dev blog I understood that we still can earn a OB, but from the Eve Dev blog it seemed to me that it can only be achieved from EvE pilots 3 min wait. No, the only way to earn an EVE orbital will be to capture the satellite. Warbarge strikes can still be unlocked through warpoints but these are no longer available in faction warfare, only public contracts and planetary conquest. Incoming Warbarge/Eve simultaneous strikes. I like this already. forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m= (Frames)1544109 (Advertisement)1556863 (Packs)1570030 (Lag Hunt) 1570201
Eris Ernaga State Patriots 880	Posted - 2013.12.10 01:31:00 - [45] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: Once your pilot has secured the satellite and dropped the strike whats the cooldown until the next time he can drop a strike? I never caught that. 3 minutes. That might actually be less orbitals then we can drop, currently with three organized squads each earning about 2 - 3 war points per squad. If so this mean it goes from 6 - 9 orbitals in a game to around 4 - 5 orbitals in a game and this is only if the EVE pilot is having it easy up there are not encountering any enemys. Also the squad leader wont be able to earn his orbital and fire it'll take him knowing the EVE pilot just for him to be able to use an orbital now. *Closed Beta Vet* State Patriots public - State Patriots - join for Caldari and Amarr factional warfare.
1st Lieutenant Tiberius 0uter.Heaven Proficiency V. 665	Posted - 2013.12.10 02:06:00 - [46] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Mass Heals wrote: Can we still gain 2500 WP to drop an EvE orbital? From Dust dev blog I understood that we still can earn a OB, but from the Eve Dev blog it seemed to me that it can only be achieved from EvE pilots 3 min wait. No, the only way to earn an EVE orbital will be to capture the satellite. Warbarge strikes can still be unlocked through warpoints but these are no longer available in faction warfare, only public contracts and planetary conquest. Will this system be live for Planetary Conquest as well or just Factional Warfare? Please clarify: Will we be able to get an OB from the WarBarge with 2500WP AND every 3 minutes from an EVE pilot controlling the satellite? The Sinwarden

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 3197	Posted - 2013.12.10 09:40:00 - [47] - Quote 1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Mass Heals wrote: Can we still gain 2500 WP to drop an EvE orbital? From Dust dev blog I understood that we still can earn a OB, but from the Eve Dev blog it seemed to me that it can only be achieved from EvE pilots 3 min wait. No, the only way to earn an EVE orbital will be to capture the satellite. Warbarge strikes can still be unlocked through warpoints but these are no longer available in faction warfare, only public contracts and planetary conquest. Will this system be live for Planetary Conquest as well or just Factional Warfare? Please clarify: In Planetary Conquest battles will we be able to get an OB from the WarBarge with 2500WP AND every 3 minutes from an EVE pilot controlling the satellite? Yes both. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Flyingconejo KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 337	Posted - 2013.12.10 11:08:00 - [48] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: 1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote: [quote=CCP Nullarbor][quote=Mass Heals] Please clarify: In Planetary Conquest battles will we be able to get an OB from the WarBarge with 2500WP AND every 3 minutes from an EVE pilot controlling the satellite? Yes both. And does that really sound all right to you? Because we are talking about maybe between 9-11 combined Orbital and Warbarge strikes for the team that controls the beacon in a PC match. Some teams that are really good or that just get a lot of WP will get more for sure. You know, when people was asking for you to fix the camping Forge Guns in the high ground, they did not have this in mind. Whoever thought of this should be ashamed. PD: And the clone pack count is still 120 clones against 10 Orbital Strikes per battle. Good luck to any new corp wanting to join PC.

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 3200	Posted - 2013.12.10 11:24:00 - [49] - Quote Flyingconejo wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: 1st Lieutenant Tiberius wrote: [quote=CCP Nullarbor][quote=Mass Heals] Please clarify: In Planetary Conquest battles will we be able to get an OB from the WarBarge with 2500WP AND every 3 minutes from an EVE pilot controlling the satellite? Yes both. And does that really sound all right to you? Because we are talking about maybe between 9-11 combined Orbital and Warbarge strikes for the team that controls the beacon in a PC match. Some teams that are really good or that just get a lot of WP will get more for sure. You know, when people was asking for you to fix the camping Forge Guns in the high ground, they did not have this in mind. Whoever thought of this should be ashamed. PD: And the clone pack count is still 120 clones against 10 Orbital Strikes per battle. Good luck to any new corp wanting to join PC. It may be too much, but we will keep a close eye on it. We are considering removing the warbarge strike in PC as well. The problem is that it then only allows orbitals for people in alliances. We are discussing with the CPM ways in which we could open up orbital support to EVE pilots outside of an alliance which we think would solve this problem, then we can remove the warbarge strikes from PC as well. This would then tie neatly into our plans for planetary conquest becoming more involved with EVE. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

HowDidThatTaste Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 4134	Posted - 2013.12.10 11:33:00 - [50] - Quote Please please please tell us you are making headway on the game breaking LAG in PC! So many battles have been one by orbitals so this will certainly introduce a new tactic that will have to be considered as a game changer .

1st Lieutenant Tiberius 0uter.Heaven Proficiency V. 666	Posted - 2013.12.10 11:36:00 - [51] - Quote HowDidThatTaste wrote: Please please please tell us you are making headway on the game breaking LAG in PC! So many battles have been one by orbitals so this will certainly introduce a new tactic that will have to be considered as a game changer . Seconded Please make PC actually fun and fair to play before you all try to add more features into it. Please optimize Planetary Conquest, Please figure out how to significantly reduce lag in Planetary Conquest The Sinwarden
Flyingconejo KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 337	Posted - 2013.12.10 12:00:00 - [52] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: It may be too much, but we will keep a close eye on it. We are considering removing the warbarge strike in PC as well. The problem is that it then only allows orbitals for people in alliances. We are discussing with the CPM ways in which we could open up orbital support to EVE pilots outside of an alliance which we think would solve this problem, then we can remove the warbarge strikes from PC as well. This would then tie neatly into our plans for planetary conquest becoming more involved with EVE. Warbarge strikes should never have existed in this game. They have always been easily farmed and exploited, and give a great reward for very low effort. For me, they are like a COD killstreak reward, and don't fit at all with the rest of the game design, where everything has a cost. (I got a strike? Nice, free kills just for pressing a button!). But if they have to stay, I can understand them being in pubs as a placeholder for the real orbital strikes, but wargarge strikes certainly have no place in PC. The team using an orbital strike has to make the effort of coordinating with an EVE player, and that same player has to risk his money and his ship, and stay in the same place for 20-40 minutes. What effort does the team using warbarge strikes have to do? No effort at all. I understand you guys wanting to give unaligned corps a chance to compete against corps with EVE support, but allowing both kind of strikes to coexist in this way is just na+»ve. Were you tired of people complaining about FG spam, MD spam and Core Locus spam? That will be nothing compared to the QQ from the Orbital+Warbarge strike spam that is coming. I have no easy answer for your dilemma about corps not in an alliance. But allowing both kind of strikes to the same team in their present form sounds to me like the worst kind of solution, sorry. Eliminating warbarge strikes completely from PC would be a better solution, and short of that, increasing their WP cost, or deactivating them for teams with EVE support, or forcing a team to buy some kind of Warbarge Strike ammo previous to the battle, etc... Any of this would be better than what we have now in 1.7. I really hope you find a better way soon. Good luck.

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 3202	Posted - 2013.12.10 12:04:00 - [53] - Quote Flyingconejo wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: It may be too much, but we will keep a close eye on it. We are considering removing the warbarge strike in PC as well. The problem is that it then only allows orbitals for people in alliances. We are discussing with the CPM ways in which we could open up orbital support to EVE pilots outside of an alliance which we think would solve this problem, then we can remove the warbarge strikes from PC as well. This would then tie neatly into our plans for planetary conquest becoming more involved with EVE. Warbarge strikes should never have existed in this game. They have always been easily farmed and exploited, and give a great reward for very low effort. For me, they are like a COD killstreak reward, and don't fit at all with the rest of the game design, where everything has a cost. (I got a strike? Nice, free kills just for pressing a button!). But if they have to stay, I can understand them being in pubs as a placeholder for the real orbital strikes, but wargarge strikes certainly have no place in PC. The team using an orbital strike has to make the effort of coordinating with an EVE player, and that same player has to risk his money and his ship, and stay in the same place for 20-40 minutes. What effort does the team using warbarge strikes have to do? No effort at all. I understand you guys wanting to give unaligned corps a chance to compete against corps with EVE support, but allowing both kind of strikes to coexist in this way is just na+»ve. Were you tired of people complaining about FG spam, MD spam and Core Locus spam? That will be nothing compared to the QQ from the Orbital+Warbarge strike spam that is coming. I have no easy answer for your dilemma about corps not in an alliance. But allowing both kind of strikes to the same team in their present form sounds to me like the worst kind of solution, sorry. Eliminating warbarge strikes completely from PC would be a better solution, and short of that, increasing their WP cost, or deactivating them for teams with EVE support, or forcing a team to buy some kind of Warbarge Strike ammo previous to the battle, etc... Any of this would be better than what we have now in 1.7. I really hope you find a better way soon. Good luck. Yep, all valid points and well presented. We will see how 1.7 plays out first and keep the discussion going. I expect more changes to orbitals in PC to follow. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Flyingconejo KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 337	Posted - 2013.12.10 12:11:00 - [54] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Yep, all valid points and well presented. We will see how 1.7 plays out first and keep the discussion going. I expect more changes to orbitals in PC to follow. Meanwhile, I will try to have a roof over me at all times. Thank you for answering.


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