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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
135
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Posted - 2013.11.18 07:42:00 -
[1] - Quote
so we are all familiar with the rendering/draw distance problems, its been a big part of the game and its tactics for 6 months now and over that time ive dedicated quite alot to tracking down information about it and petitioning CCP for an answer as to why its in the game, why its not being fixed, and why nobody at CCP can talk about it.
thats right people at CCP cant actually really talk about the problem without some smoke and mirrors protecting from backlask, and theres a reason for this.
The rendering problems arnt so much a problem, but a FEATURE. for the uprising deployment the higher ups in CCP made a DECISION to sacrafice the ability to see reliably for shinyer graphics in an attempt to lession the visual gap in compairison to current/next gen FPS games.
So CCP poured their resources into making the game as pretty as possable at first glance, in part to compair to other games and in part in an attempt at improving new player retention. due to the reviews dust was getting all referancing its somewhat lackluster graphics at the time this makes sence.
around the time of uprising one of the most notable blue posts before the gag order was a post referancing rendering distance being tied to weapons, and how cutting down the player sight was standard practice in FPS games (you can search this just look for posts in the first month of uprising)
now while that is somewhat true dust doesnt actually use the same system as other FPS games, other games use a fog of war type system that reduces teh clarity of everything on a scale moving outwards fromt eh player, but dusts system just removes player objects after a certain unknown and unmeasurable distance.
Now of course no DEV / Blue or the like is alowed to talk about the subject and as a result we havnt heard a word outside a few footnotes in patch notes that try to fix some very specific rendering related issues (like turrets disapearing when you shoot at them and sniper rifles not being able to see anything in their range of operation)
None of those "fixes" from teh patch notes have actually improved anything however because they fail to adress the actual issue.
The actual issue is rendering CANT be fixed, not anymore, you see when they went about improving the graphics for the game they banked EVERYTHING on it, and now all the art resources, graphics, and a whole lot of core systems are dependant on rendering being broken.
Fixing rendering requires a complete rollback to chromosome for the graphics, rendering all their new pretty art assets useless. wich as far as CCP is concerned is not an option.
so the official stance of CCP on the rendering/draw distance problem is "Working as intended" there are no plans to change the rendering effects/ draw distance settings outside of minor tweeks in the most obvious areas and only when it would effect new player retention.
Untill CCP publicly states otherwise, this is what we have to assume. and since theres a gag order in effect, CCP cant actually state otherwise.
THIS is why i doubt CCP, this is why i dont play much anymore, and this is what will ultimatly kill the game, these kinds of choices will inevitably result in a game full of holes that looks deep on the surface, but cant hold players after they start being effected by the bugs.
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Sigberct Amni
Goonfeet
Top Men.
188
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Posted - 2013.11.18 07:46:00 -
[2] - Quote
That's a whole lot of tinfoil and words to say "I think CCP is a liar about this thing I want fixed." I need a whole lot more citations and proof before I jump onto this conspiracy. |
Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
135
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Posted - 2013.11.18 07:50:00 -
[3] - Quote
Sigberct Amni wrote:That's a whole lot of tinfoil and words to say "I think CCP is a liar about this thing I want fixed." I need a whole lot more citations and proof before I jump onto this conspiracy.
i diddnt call CCP a liar, in fact the point is CCP hasnt said ANYTHING and CANT say anything about it.
well since CCP has a gag order no post from CCP has been made on the subject in 5 months.
cant cite nothing now can you. (thats the point)
the points above + the wierdly low reply time means i can be pretty damn (98%) sure you diddnt actually read the post |
Sigberct Amni
Goonfeet
Top Men.
188
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Posted - 2013.11.18 08:05:00 -
[4] - Quote
I cringed through read all of your post until
Ghosts Chance wrote:Now of course no DEV / Blue or the like is alowed to talk about the subject and as a result we havnt heard a word outside a few footnotes in patch notes that try to fix some very specific rendering related issues (like turrets disapearing when you shoot at them and sniper rifles not being able to see anything in their range of operation)
What an armchair programmer thing to say.
As for what you could cite - how about that five month old blue post that you asked the reader to go find? It's your thread, fill it with content instead of inane ramblings about how terrible CCP is. |
Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
135
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Posted - 2013.11.18 08:11:00 -
[5] - Quote
Sigberct Amni wrote:I cringed through read all of your post until Ghosts Chance wrote:Now of course no DEV / Blue or the like is alowed to talk about the subject and as a result we havnt heard a word outside a few footnotes in patch notes that try to fix some very specific rendering related issues (like turrets disapearing when you shoot at them and sniper rifles not being able to see anything in their range of operation) What an armchair programmer thing to say. As for what you could cite - how about that five month old blue post that you asked the reader to go find? It's your thread, fill it with content instead of inane ramblings about how terrible CCP is.
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=779483#post779483
happy now? search rendering + blue tags and theres a whole 2 pages of posts to go through,
also dont misuse the term armchair programmer please. |
SgtDoughnut
Red Star Jr.
EoN.
387
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Posted - 2013.11.18 08:29:00 -
[6] - Quote
Is this what insanity is like, am I looking into the mind of a crazy man ?
"The actual issue is rendering CANT be fixed, not anymore, you see when they went about improving the graphics for the game they banked EVERYTHING on it, and now all the art resources, graphics, and a whole lot of core systems are dependant on rendering being broken."
soon as I hit that line i knew you were bonkers. |
Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
135
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Posted - 2013.11.18 08:32:00 -
[7] - Quote
SgtDoughnut wrote:Is this what insanity is like, am I looking into the mind of a crazy man ?
"The actual issue is rendering CANT be fixed, not anymore, you see when they went about improving the graphics for the game they banked EVERYTHING on it, and now all the art resources, graphics, and a whole lot of core systems are dependant on rendering being broken."
soon as I hit that line i knew you were bonkers.
so your saying they CAN fix it, but refuse to for some unknown reason.
that makes more sence then cant fix it?
can you come up with a more plausable reason as to why something like that would not only be broken for 6 months, but CCP also remaining completly silent on the topic after stating it was done on purpose? |
SgtDoughnut
Red Star Jr.
EoN.
387
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Posted - 2013.11.18 08:36:00 -
[8] - Quote
Every problem associated with programing can be fixed however they are not instant, most of the time you cannot observe code in a live environment at the same time, so narrowing down the problem requires trial and error. This can take a very long time when you cannot reproduce this issue in your test environment. |
Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
135
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Posted - 2013.11.18 08:39:00 -
[9] - Quote
SgtDoughnut wrote:Every problem associated with programing can be fixed however they are not instant, most of the time you cannot observe code in a live environment at the same time, so narrowing down the problem requires trial and error. This can take a very long time when you cannot reproduce this issue in your test environment.
im stating it can be fixed, but not without sacraficing all their new pretty art assets that were developed with the new rendering/art system in mind.
meaning sure it can be fixed, IF they want to throw out/spend a long time retrofitting their assets to fit the old system.
the problem is my theory is that they cant figure out how to get chromo rendering with uprising graphics, and have since decided that keeping the art assets takes priority over gameplay.
wich is a rather simple, practical, and realistic conclusion to come to.
from a buisness standpoint it doesnt make sence to fix it, its simply not worth it, and so they have decided to follow their wallet and leave it as it is, simply tweeking it now and then, when absolutly nessesary. |
Sigberct Amni
Goonfeet
Top Men.
188
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Posted - 2013.11.18 10:45:00 -
[10] - Quote
If you really believe all these things you post, I have a solution for you and it's far better than facerolling across your keyboard to produce all this dribble you call a thread. Ready? Stop spending money on DUST. Stop playing DUST. Or don't. Yeah, just keep on posting about it because now that you've exposed CCP's evil plot, they're sure to drop everything and address this.
Hahahahahahahaahahah *gasp* Hhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhhahaha! |
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Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
137
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Posted - 2013.11.18 13:15:00 -
[11] - Quote
this was half satire half truth, as CCP is so silent they may as well have a gag order becuase it would essentially look the same to observers.
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Shley Ashes
TanksVeryMuch
68
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Posted - 2013.11.18 13:38:00 -
[12] - Quote
Gotta say i'm with you here OP, I have made comments about render issues since 1.4 and nothing, ever, so I'm inclined to agree with you, even made a YouTube video showing it, I'd link it but I'm on my tablet
I used to pilot HAV's then I took a forge gun to the knee
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SteelDark Knight
Ancient Exiles.
Renegade Alliance
151
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Posted - 2013.11.18 14:43:00 -
[13] - Quote
While we may never know if the OP is entirely correct on his theory on the issues what we do know for fact is that any and all inquiries in to this issue over many, many, months have gone unanswered.
The rendering issue is game breaking for certain styles of play and has generated a huge amount of frustration. The OP has gone out of his way over many months to bring this issue to CCP's attention via the proper channels. At this point we can accuse him of putting on the "tinfoil hat" but if so I cannot really blame him.
Ghosts Chance - Have you tried to contact the CPM in regards to this issue? |
KenKaniff69
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
898
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Posted - 2013.11.18 14:52:00 -
[14] - Quote
SteelDark Knight wrote:
Ghosts Chance - Have you tried to contact the CPM in regards to this issue?
Cheerleaders will get you no where. OP is right on. Ranged combat is just stupid now. I literally had people not rendering 50m away from me on the pipes of Ashand the other day.
So about those vehicle locks...
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
10379
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Posted - 2013.11.18 18:25:00 -
[15] - Quote
I would complain to the developers but the only posts to support cause I can find for possible responses are invitation to toxin spewing fest. So no, I am not going to fight for something stabbing me in the back at the same time. I got bigger game breaking bugs to fry anyways such as PC lag, black screens, bad matchmaking drops/idle/fails and PS3 hard/soft freezes.
CPM 0 Secretary
Omni-Soldier Specialist
Current Theme \\= Advanced Scrambler Rifle =// Unlocked
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KenKaniff69
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
900
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Posted - 2013.11.18 18:31:00 -
[16] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I would complain to the developers but the only posts to support cause I can find for possible responses are invitation to toxin spewing fest. So no, I am not going to fight for something stabbing me in the back at the same time. I got bigger game breaking bugs to fry anyways such as PC lag, black screens, bad matchmaking drops/idle/fails and PS3 hard/soft freezes.
But you are not a dev. Dev's correct those things. As a CPM it is your job to reflect the voice and concerns of the community. Ignoring such a giant problem not be doing your job as CPM.
So about those vehicle locks...
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon 514
Turalyon Alliance
5219
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Posted - 2013.11.18 18:34:00 -
[17] - Quote
KenKaniff69 wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I would complain to the developers but the only posts to support cause I can find for possible responses are invitation to toxin spewing fest. So no, I am not going to fight for something stabbing me in the back at the same time. I got bigger game breaking bugs to fry anyways such as PC lag, black screens, bad matchmaking drops/idle/fails and PS3 hard/soft freezes. But you are not a dev. Dev's correct those things. As a CPM it is your job to reflect the voice and concerns of the community. Ignoring such a giant problem not be doing your job as CPM.
I'm sure he'd quite happily pass these threads along if they weren't so mindlessly ragey.
Level 5 Forum Warrior
Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution
Supporter of CCP raRaRa.
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KenKaniff69
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
900
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Posted - 2013.11.18 18:53:00 -
[18] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:KenKaniff69 wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I would complain to the developers but the only posts to support cause I can find for possible responses are invitation to toxin spewing fest. So no, I am not going to fight for something stabbing me in the back at the same time. I got bigger game breaking bugs to fry anyways such as PC lag, black screens, bad matchmaking drops/idle/fails and PS3 hard/soft freezes. But you are not a dev. Dev's correct those things. As a CPM it is your job to reflect the voice and concerns of the community. Ignoring such a giant problem not be doing your job as CPM. I'm sure he'd quite happily pass these threads along if they weren't so mindlessly ragey.
It's a game breaking issue for all ranged weapons that cannot be ignored any longer/end thread.
So about those vehicle locks...
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Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star.
EoN.
1697
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Posted - 2013.11.18 18:56:00 -
[19] - Quote
KenKaniff69 wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I would complain to the developers but the only posts to support cause I can find for possible responses are invitation to toxin spewing fest. So no, I am not going to fight for something stabbing me in the back at the same time. I got bigger game breaking bugs to fry anyways such as PC lag, black screens, bad matchmaking drops/idle/fails and PS3 hard/soft freezes. But you are not a dev. Dev's correct those things. As a CPM it is your job to reflect the voice and concerns of the community. Ignoring such a giant problem not be doing your job as CPM.
CPM do nothing anyways
Also IWS hates vehicles and wants them out of DUST which is well known
Dont ask for help from the CPM you wont get any and they wont do anything |
Scheherazade VII
136
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Posted - 2013.11.18 18:58:00 -
[20] - Quote
I'm sorry but as far as looks go the game looks very washed-out and blurry.
And yes the field of view, draw distance, render distance what have you, is very bad.
Needs some major work in the technical-graphical department, if such a thing exists 
GêÜGëêDUST VIDEOSGëêGêÜ
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Saxbrin Shain
Ivory Vanguard
88
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Posted - 2013.11.18 19:04:00 -
[21] - Quote
Not sure if troll or actually slow. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
10381
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Posted - 2013.11.18 19:08:00 -
[22] - Quote
KenKaniff69 wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I would complain to the developers but the only posts to support cause I can find for possible responses are invitation to toxin spewing fest. So no, I am not going to fight for something stabbing me in the back at the same time. I got bigger game breaking bugs to fry anyways such as PC lag, black screens, bad matchmaking drops/idle/fails and PS3 hard/soft freezes. But you are not a dev. Dev's correct those things. As a CPM it is your job to reflect the voice and concerns of the community. Ignoring such a giant problem not be doing your job as CPM.
My job is to relay concerns, not voices. There is a lot of voice here and not so much concern, if the OP is truly passionate about the subject he would have gathered a stronger case and let the evidence speak for itself.
If I were to say show this post to the developer responsible he'd think I'd be wearing a bit too much tin foil. Then expects me to snap off his hand at any response.
CPM 0 Secretary
Omni-Soldier Specialist
Current Theme \\= Advanced Scrambler Rifle =// Unlocked
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
10381
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Posted - 2013.11.18 19:10:00 -
[23] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:
CPM do nothing anyways
Also IWS hates vehicles and wants them out of DUST which is well known
Dont ask for help from the CPM you wont get any and they wont do anything
Didn't you get called a total idiot of a pilot by the real pilots in this game?
CPM 0 Secretary
Omni-Soldier Specialist
Current Theme \\= Advanced Scrambler Rifle =// Unlocked
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CommanderBolt
A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S.
Renegade Alliance
415
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Posted - 2013.11.18 19:12:00 -
[24] - Quote
Still the same old dust hey? Does not surprise me. |
CharCharOdell
1558
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Posted - 2013.11.18 19:13:00 -
[25] - Quote
I'd rather have draw distance past 200m than shiny shadows
Gùñ-é-º+¼+ò+¦GÖÑ+ú+ú+¡ GÖÑ'Ðe+ü+üGùÑ
Gùú -ä>-üð+++Ç++§<-¡<-¡ Gùó
Speaker of the Mangrove / King of QQ / Co-Founder of the Learning Coalition
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CharCharOdell
1558
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Posted - 2013.11.18 19:15:00 -
[26] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:KenKaniff69 wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I would complain to the developers but the only posts to support cause I can find for possible responses are invitation to toxin spewing fest. So no, I am not going to fight for something stabbing me in the back at the same time. I got bigger game breaking bugs to fry anyways such as PC lag, black screens, bad matchmaking drops/idle/fails and PS3 hard/soft freezes. But you are not a dev. Dev's correct those things. As a CPM it is your job to reflect the voice and concerns of the community. Ignoring such a giant problem not be doing your job as CPM. My job is to relay concerns, not voices. There is a lot of voice here and not so much concern, if the OP is truly passionate about the subject he would have gathered a stronger case and let the evidence speak for itself. If I were to say show this post to the developer responsible he'd think I'd be wearing a bit too much tin foil. Then expects me to snap off his hand at any response.
It is a legitimate complaints t, though. CCP sacrifices being able to see past 200m for shiny graphics. More than anything, it gimps tanks which is not something that should be gimped more than it already was by the PG nerf.
Gùñ-é-º+¼+ò+¦GÖÑ+ú+ú+¡ GÖÑ'Ðe+ü+üGùÑ
Gùú -ä>-üð+++Ç++§<-¡<-¡ Gùó
Speaker of the Mangrove / King of QQ / Co-Founder of the Learning Coalition
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CLONE117
planetary retaliation organisation
478
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Posted - 2013.11.18 19:20:00 -
[27] - Quote
and if ppl render for miles across entire maps for snipers?.
well thats something bad for all the players who need to get their ground roles done. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
10381
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Posted - 2013.11.18 19:20:00 -
[28] - Quote
CharCharOdell wrote:I'd rather have draw distance past 200m than shiny shadows
? you sure about that ?
scuse me while I go find a game that you can turn its shadows off.
Most of tech going into shadows though are not shinier in anyway btw.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Screen_space_ambient_occlusion
for its disadvantages it actually makes shadows worse.
here we go, mid way down you can go between the different settings there is one with shadows entirely off (despite this the trees still have localized model shadows possibly a texture thing instead)
http://www.dayzpvp.com/why-you-should-turn-shadows-off-when-playing-dayz/
CPM 0 Secretary
Omni-Soldier Specialist
Current Theme \\= Advanced Scrambler Rifle =// Unlocked
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KenKaniff69
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
901
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Posted - 2013.11.18 19:41:00 -
[29] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:KenKaniff69 wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I would complain to the developers but the only posts to support cause I can find for possible responses are invitation to toxin spewing fest. So no, I am not going to fight for something stabbing me in the back at the same time. I got bigger game breaking bugs to fry anyways such as PC lag, black screens, bad matchmaking drops/idle/fails and PS3 hard/soft freezes. But you are not a dev. Dev's correct those things. As a CPM it is your job to reflect the voice and concerns of the community. Ignoring such a giant problem not be doing your job as CPM. My job is to relay concerns, not voices. There is a lot of voice here and not so much concern, if the OP is truly passionate about the subject he would have gathered a stronger case and let the evidence speak for itself. If I were to say show this post to the developer responsible he'd think I'd be wearing a bit too much tin foil. Then expects me to snap off his hand at any response.
Well how about I take some pictures then? Pics or it didn't happen then, right? How about I show them indisputable factual evidence that rendering is completely broken yielding rails useless at 100m plus? Would that be enough for you?
So about those vehicle locks...
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
10384
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Posted - 2013.11.18 20:06:00 -
[30] - Quote
KenKaniff69 wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:KenKaniff69 wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I would complain to the developers but the only posts to support cause I can find for possible responses are invitation to toxin spewing fest. So no, I am not going to fight for something stabbing me in the back at the same time. I got bigger game breaking bugs to fry anyways such as PC lag, black screens, bad matchmaking drops/idle/fails and PS3 hard/soft freezes. But you are not a dev. Dev's correct those things. As a CPM it is your job to reflect the voice and concerns of the community. Ignoring such a giant problem not be doing your job as CPM. My job is to relay concerns, not voices. There is a lot of voice here and not so much concern, if the OP is truly passionate about the subject he would have gathered a stronger case and let the evidence speak for itself. If I were to say show this post to the developer responsible he'd think I'd be wearing a bit too much tin foil. Then expects me to snap off his hand at any response. Well how about I take some pictures then? Pics or it didn't happen then, right? How about I show them indisputable factual evidence that rendering is completely broken yielding rails useless at 100m plus? Would that be enough for you?
For this case, scenarios specific that other people could reproduce reliably would work as well. (IE charts)
Videos are nice but of the legitimate complaints I am getting so far there seems to be inconsistencies between clients as well but these are just hearsay tales. There also seems to be other factors such as sockets causing rendering (or the lack of) issues.
Also the tron bug has them currently distracted. :(
CPM 0 Secretary
Omni-Soldier Specialist
Current Theme \\= Advanced Scrambler Rifle =// Unlocked
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