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Tallen Ellecon KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 805	Posted - 2013.11.02 17:15:00 - [1] - Quote Let's have a reasonable discussion on the future of BPOs in a player driven Economy. So here are some of the problems with BPOs. They stop demand. How easy will it be to "manufacture" and sell standard assault rifles or assault suits when half of the current player base will never need them? They are items that excluding the MAG tribute suits require no SP investment so despite despite only being standard they can save players a lot of SP by not having to grind all the basic suits to level 3. Now these are things that made them such a great deal. I personally have almost all the BPOs and at least have one of each type (no skinweaves or MAG tributes). BPOs were a large driving force in actually throwing money into this game and I used the Aurum to buy most of the militia BPOs (post super discount). The Templar gear was also a large driving factor in getting the second decade collectors box, along all the other EVE shwagg. I love running in completely 0 ISK suits because I can keep the matches a challenge, relatively fair for noobs, and if I get stomped I lose nothing but some stats. So them leaving the game would hurt not just my confidence in real life purchases but also my playstyle and a large source of my income. All that said we need to find a balance where we can get an unlimited item out of the marketplace and people's inventory without destroying the uniqueness or worth of BPOs. The key is that all BPO gear except militia has a unique paint scheme, so as items they still have the potential to exist. Myself personally I would think that making the BPO gear we have now remain and used in manufacturing similar to EVE would be a good compromise. The BPO itself would be unusable but through some manufacturing costs it could be used to make more gear. Those with BPOs gain nothing more than the potential to sell rarer items with different skins. As for those who stocked up on BPOs to prepare for the coming player market, this is something I have no real opinion on because I was neither here when they had cheap militia BPOs or have I bought multiples of any packs. We can't have a player driven market and economy with BPOs having their current mechanic, but we can't make them lose their worth as they will drive down confidence in CCP. TL;DR I'm all for a player driven market CPP, but if you make me regret getting BPOs it will effect my willingness to spend more money on this game. Let's discuss. The Ellecon's come from a long line of Gallente. Tarn chose Peace. Tallen chose war.
Ulysses Knapse duna corp 554	Posted - 2013.11.02 17:24:00 - [2] - Quote BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. Humanity is the personification of change.
Tallen Ellecon KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 805	Posted - 2013.11.02 17:28:00 - [3] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. If they completely remove them there will be a shitstorm unlike anything they've ever seen. The Ellecon's come from a long line of Gallente. Tarn chose Peace. Tallen chose war.
Ulysses Knapse duna corp 554	Posted - 2013.11.02 17:37:00 - [4] - Quote Tallen Ellecon wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. If they completely remove them there will be a shitstorm unlike anything they've ever seen. It's their own fault for releasing them without considering the economy. Humanity is the personification of change.
Ulysses Knapse duna corp 554	Posted - 2013.11.02 17:50:00 - [5] - Quote Regardless, I did have an idea to replace BPOs. I call them "Supply Contracts". These basically act like BPOs do now, but aren't called BPOs. Additionally, they can come with some restrictions (to make it more desirable to buy player-produced items). 1. They aren't as customizable. Weapons won't be able to be customized (when that feature comes, hopefully soon), and dropsuits will lose module slots and resources in favor of built-in bonuses. 2. They aren't unlimited. If you consume too many uses of that item in a short amount of time, you won't be able to use any until the contractor replenishes their stock for you. 3. They might be statistically inferior. I think this speaks for itself. Humanity is the personification of change.
KaTaLy5t-87 Shadow Company HQ 116	Posted - 2013.11.02 18:02:00 - [6] - Quote Since people paid real money for BPOs in the merc, veteran and elite packs I don't think CCP can remove the BPOs completely without some kind of major legal issues. Maybe if they refunded the real money value of the items they removed they could do it but I can't see CCP doing that.
Yelhsa Jin-Mao Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 64	Posted - 2013.11.02 20:40:00 - [7] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. Lol have fun playing DUSTon your own then. I've bought all the packs and spent all my aurumn on the militia BPOs and boosters. Now if CCP want to refund me the real world money I've spent on the packs, over $200 to be precise, then they can happily take away my BPOs and I along with a large proportions of the community will leave this game forever. So have fun playing DUST when its left as empty as CCPs bank account. I can has ISK
Ulysses Knapse duna corp 554	Posted - 2013.11.02 21:33:00 - [8] - Quote Yelhsa Jin-Mao wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. Lol have fun playing DUSTon your own then. I've bought all the packs and spent all my aurumn on the militia BPOs and boosters. Now if CCP want to refund me the real world money I've spent on the packs, over $200 to be precise, then they can happily take away my BPOs and I along with a large proportions of the community will leave this game forever. So have fun playing DUST when its left as empty as CCPs bank account. Goodbye, then! Also, you're mistaken if you think that Dust 514 failing will cause CCP to go bankrupt. Humanity is the personification of change.
Yelhsa Jin-Mao Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 65	Posted - 2013.11.02 22:01:00 - [9] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: Yelhsa Jin-Mao wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. Lol have fun playing DUSTon your own then. I've bought all the packs and spent all my aurumn on the militia BPOs and boosters. Now if CCP want to refund me the real world money I've spent on the packs, over $200 to be precise, then they can happily take away my BPOs and I along with a large proportions of the community will leave this game forever. So have fun playing DUST when its left as empty as CCPs bank account. Goodbye, then! Also, you're mistaken if you think that Dust 514 failing will cause CCP to go bankrupt. Do you think CCP will float DUST off the back of EVE If it keeps losing them money, I think not. This game will get pulled faster than your daddies **** from between your butt cheeks when your mom arrives home. I can has ISK
Ulysses Knapse duna corp 555	Posted - 2013.11.02 22:14:00 - [10] - Quote Yelhsa Jin-Mao wrote: Do you think CCP will float DUST off the back of EVE If it keeps losing them money, I think not. Wow. You are really, really bad at reading, because what I said was nothing like that... Yelhsa Jin-Mao wrote: This game will get pulled faster than your daddies **** from between your butt cheeks when your mom arrives home. ...And that's just uncalled for. Humanity is the personification of change.

KA24DERT Pure Innocence. EoN. 228	Posted - 2013.11.02 22:19:00 - [11] - Quote I don't think there's any way to get around the fact that BPOs as they currently are need to go away. However there was a great proposal in these forums a couple of days ago where BPOs could generate X amount of equipment every downtime. I think that would be a good transitional behaviour between the current Dust-style BPOs and the eventual Eve-style BPOs. It'll soften the blow a little, but there will still be a blow.
Talos Alomar Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 1702	Posted - 2013.11.02 22:50:00 - [12] - Quote All CCP needs to do is to stop selling them. I don't think they have to take any further steps. As more people start playing, or people run more expensive gear that there isn't a BPO of, people will be consuming goods that need the market. I doubt the market is going to be that seriously impacted by a few people who were there when the game launched (and paid money for an incomplete game) not buying militia or a very limited selection of standard level gear off the market. Completely removing BPOs would just fix a problem that time itself would have healed while pissing everyone off.
Yelhsa Jin-Mao Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 65	Posted - 2013.11.02 22:57:00 - [13] - Quote CCP won't dare pull BPOs because of the backlash, flaming and lawsuits they would face for breaching the purchase agreements between consumers and Sony, of which CCP was not a part of and cannot interfere with, such as removing assets which consumers paid another party for. When a person buys a Mercenary, Veteran or Elite Pack, the purchase agreement was made between the consumer and Sony, not the consumer and CCP. I can has ISK
Jrakraa5 ZilchmobZ Industries 18	Posted - 2013.11.02 23:00:00 - [14] - Quote since people are all worrying about losing the bpo's cause of the paint scheme, why not make it so you can fit suits with different paint schemes. you still have to buy the suit every time, but you keep the scheme forever. that would help the market with more isk flowing into it because your now buying two things instead of none. visit my site here! ZilchMobZ or at Facebook JOIN NOW!
Ulysses Knapse duna corp 555	Posted - 2013.11.03 02:30:00 - [15] - Quote Yelhsa Jin-Mao wrote: CCP won't dare pull BPOs because of the backlash, flaming and lawsuits they would face for breaching the purchase agreements between consumers and Sony, of which CCP was not a part of and cannot interfere with, such as removing assets which consumers paid another party for. When a person buys a Mercenary, Veteran or Elite Pack, the purchase agreement was made between the consumer and Sony, not the consumer and CCP. You're mistaken if you think that the only way to remove BPOs as they are is to delete them. Humanity is the personification of change.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 4894	Posted - 2013.11.03 03:00:00 - [16] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: Tallen Ellecon wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. If they completely remove them there will be a shitstorm unlike anything they've ever seen. It's their own fault for releasing them without considering the economy. It doesn't matter. They already confirmed that they are no longer going to be selling the BPOs after November 5th this month. They also confirmed that they will NOT, I repeat, NOT going to remove them from our personal hangars. We paid a lot of money for them after all. Not only that, refunding them with AUR will cause the #1 issue that CCP has been trying to avoid when CCP found out about players who bought crate-loads of BPOs back in closed beta for as cheap as 100 AUR a piece. So no matter what you think, although I do respect your opinion on the matter, CCP is not going to remove them from our personal hangars. Once the secondary market hits, there will just be a FIXED amount of BPOs in circulation no matter how many hands a BPO changes in its lifetime. And as the population of the game increases over the years, so will the value of the BPOs. CCP, please fix the Nova Knives. Thank you.
Awry Barux Shining Flame Amarr Empire 210	Posted - 2013.11.03 05:28:00 - [17] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. Let me guess: you don't have any BPOs.
Draco Cerberus Hell's Gate Inc 456	Posted - 2013.11.03 06:41:00 - [18] - Quote I have plans to sell my BPOs to an Eve Indy corp upon the implementation of a market system so they can provide my proto suits to me at cost. There is no broken game if the BPOs stop functioning as they do atm in favor of being marketable items. If we can sell them to Capsuleers to make stuff from then they will have transitioned into something that fits the Eve Universe, and I for one could use the cheap source of equipment that would come from this. There is no reason to remove them from the game but rather turn them into an asset only usable in the way the Eve BPOs are usable. *-=OneUniverse=-=OneEverything=-*
Belendur Balfour Silver Gryphons Inc DARKSTAR ARMY 16	Posted - 2013.11.03 06:58:00 - [19] - Quote Okay, well I have several BPO's and I do not want to lose them, they are unique in color and name, and getting a kill with a 'Templar Scrambler Rifle' is cooler than with just a scrambler rifle. That said, I am not opposed to changing the way they work. I am an Eve player as well as a Dust player. In Eve a BPO lets you produce the item on the blueprint for less than you have to pay for it if you have good skills and management of resources. So lets do this if we have to change them, since we have no resources at the moment in Dust. A BPO lets you produce the item for say 66% or 75% the cost of the standard/militia item that is on the BPO. This gives the players that have it something for what they paid, since they can now use the rare suit on the BPO or even sell copies they produce of the suit to toher players. Seems to me that this would solve the problem.
Heimdallr69 Imperfect Bastards 1144	Posted - 2013.11.03 07:26:00 - [20] - Quote I'd only buy bpo's if they were adv or proto...

Godin Thekiller Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 1387	Posted - 2013.11.03 07:51:00 - [21] - Quote Well, if it works anything like EVE's BPO's, I would be fine with it. Would have to make a manufacturing alt, but I'd be cool with that. 'lights cigar' fuck with me, and I'll melt your face off. Gallente forever!
Evicer THE HECATONCHIRES 40	Posted - 2013.11.03 08:15:00 - [22] - Quote Why start another thread? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=116404&find=unread Closed Beta Tester: Survivor of Infantry lock on swarms,map glitches,Large missile SIgarus spawn camps,and PS3 crashes.
Tallen Ellecon KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 808	Posted - 2013.11.03 08:16:00 - [23] - Quote Evicer wrote: Why start another thread? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=116404&find=unread That's a dev response to a misquote. I want everyone including BPO owners to discuss what would be reasonable for the future of BPOs. The Ellecon's come from a long line of Gallente. Tarn chose Peace. Tallen chose war.
SponkSponkSponk The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 461	Posted - 2013.11.03 08:18:00 - [24] - Quote I have a suggestion to solve this already. "Pulvis et umbra sumus. (We are but dust and shadow.)" GÇò Horace, The Odes of Horace
Tallen Ellecon KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 808	Posted - 2013.11.03 08:32:00 - [25] - Quote SponkSponkSponk wrote: I have a suggestion to solve this already. I love this idea, CCP can tweak the amount given per day in order to keep it from breaking the market. As long as they go no lower than 5 per day I could get onboard with that idea. The Ellecon's come from a long line of Gallente. Tarn chose Peace. Tallen chose war.
Ulysses Knapse duna corp 557	Posted - 2013.11.03 08:37:00 - [26] - Quote Awry Barux wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. Let me guess: you don't have any BPOs. Stalwart conclusion, but it's incorrect. I do, in fact, have two BPOs. Humanity is the personification of change.
Baltazar Pontain Phantom Universe Task Force Orion Empire 22	Posted - 2013.11.03 10:18:00 - [27] - Quote To much emotions in this thread, but anyway. For me solution looks simple. 1.) Add production to DUST. 2.) Add Refinering of stuff to DUST 2.) Let us PRODUCE weapons based on BPOs So... ppl can produce weapons based on BPOs. Pro: * Cheaper than simple buying them on the market. * BPOs are not useless * We would finally have some business aspects for players that want something beside killing.
Haerr Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 78	Posted - 2013.11.03 10:44:00 - [28] - Quote Are you suggeting that my permanent gear, requiring no restocking or replacement which I paid money for will no longer be permanent gear, requiring no restocking or replacement? I don't like that idea at all.
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Kinsho Swords Caldari State 50	Posted - 2013.11.03 12:19:00 - [29] - Quote Yelhsa Jin-Mao wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. Lol have fun playing DUSTon your own then. I've bought all the packs and spent all my aurumn on the militia BPOs and boosters. Now if CCP want to refund me the real world money I've spent on the packs, over $200 to be precise, then they can happily take away my BPOs and I along with a large proportions of the community will leave this game forever. So have fun playing DUST when its left as empty as CCPs bank account. Sad to say but you WILL just be replaced . YOU and WHOEVER goes with you . I can't see them going bankrupt any time soon . CCP is building and attempting to become as big or bigger than Electronic Arts , and you know that's BIG . " Doubts are like flies and should be crushed !!!!!! " I hope that I am THE FLY SWATTER of those in my presence .
Yelhsa Jin-Mao Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 65	Posted - 2013.11.03 16:34:00 - [30] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: Awry Barux wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. Let me guess: you don't have any BPOs. Stalwart conclusion, but it's incorrect. I do, in fact, have two BPOs. Well I have over 30, so STFU! I can has ISK

Yelhsa Jin-Mao Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 65	Posted - 2013.11.03 16:36:00 - [31] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: Awry Barux wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. Let me guess: you don't have any BPOs. Stalwart conclusion, but it's incorrect. I do, in fact, have two BPOs. Well I have over 30, so STFU! I can has ISK
Yelhsa Jin-Mao Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 65	Posted - 2013.11.03 16:39:00 - [32] - Quote Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: Yelhsa Jin-Mao wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. Lol have fun playing DUSTon your own then. I've bought all the packs and spent all my aurumn on the militia BPOs and boosters. Now if CCP want to refund me the real world money I've spent on the packs, over $200 to be precise, then they can happily take away my BPOs and I along with a large proportions of the community will leave this game forever. So have fun playing DUST when its left as empty as CCPs bank account. Sad to say but you WILL just be replaced . YOU and WHOEVER goes with you . I can't see them going bankrupt any time soon . CCP is building and attempting to become as big or bigger than Electronic Arts , and you know that's BIG . Replaced, what you mean by New players, what sort of **** have you been smoking. You'd have more luck convincing someone with a fear of needles to give blood than have them start playing DUST. I can has ISK
Yelhsa Jin-Mao Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 65	Posted - 2013.11.03 16:43:00 - [33] - Quote Baltazar Pontain wrote: To much emotions in this thread, but anyway. For me solution looks simple. 1.) Add production to DUST. 2.) Add Refinering of stuff to DUST 2.) Let us PRODUCE weapons based on BPOs So... ppl can produce weapons based on BPOs. Pro: * Cheaper than simple buying them on the market. * BPOs are not useless * We would finally have some business aspects for players that want something beside killing. If I can make ISK and still play with free kit, I'm all for this suggestion. Call me the Eourland Gray-Mane of DUST 514, the finest BPCs in all of New Eden. I can has ISK
Ulysses Knapse duna corp 561	Posted - 2013.11.03 16:49:00 - [34] - Quote Yelhsa Jin-Mao wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: Awry Barux wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. Let me guess: you don't have any BPOs. Stalwart conclusion, but it's incorrect. I do, in fact, have two BPOs. Well I have over 30, so STFU! Good for you. No one cares. Except for the industrialists. They hate you for it. Humanity is the personification of change.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1080	Posted - 2013.11.03 16:49:00 - [35] - Quote I think removing BPOs made sense for the direction ccp wants to take the economy. that said, I BOUGHT THESE WITH MY MONEY! so I am against ANY change to the ones I own. I bought them because of what they are and with no expectation they would change. if CCP changes the way the stuff I already bought works without a full cash refund, I will cancel my eve account, stop playing dust and boycott any future endeavor CCP is a part off. plus I will do my best to sue them for ripping me off. you make no sense man, why would you support ccp changing things you already bought....??? insert witty or profound statement here _______.
Ulysses Knapse duna corp 561	Posted - 2013.11.03 16:53:00 - [36] - Quote Seymor Krelborn wrote: I think removing BPOs made sense for the direction ccp wants to take the economy. that said, I BOUGHT THESE WITH MY MONEY! so I am against ANY change to the ones I own. I bought them because of what they are and with no expectation they would change. if CCP changes the way the stuff I already bought works without a full cash refund, I will cancel my eve account, stop playing dust and boycott any future endeavor CCP is a part off. plus I will do my best to sue them for ripping me off. you make no sense man, why would you support ccp changing things you already bought....??? Because it's for the greater good of New Eden, of course. Of course I don't want to lose my investment, but if that's what is necessary, then so be it. Humanity is the personification of change.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1080	Posted - 2013.11.03 17:02:00 - [37] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: I think removing BPOs made sense for the direction ccp wants to take the economy. that said, I BOUGHT THESE WITH MY MONEY! so I am against ANY change to the ones I own. I bought them because of what they are and with no expectation they would change. if CCP changes the way the stuff I already bought works without a full cash refund, I will cancel my eve account, stop playing dust and boycott any future endeavor CCP is a part off. plus I will do my best to sue them for ripping me off. you make no sense man, why would you support ccp changing things you already bought....??? Because it's for the greater good of New Eden, of course. Of course I don't want to lose my investment, but if that's what is necessary, then so be it. lol what rubbish... do me a favor, look up T2 BPOs in eve.... BPOs of dust will go a similar way, minus the manufacturing aspect if you just leave them alone.... you are trying to be noble under a false pretense and leave yourself looking foolish... once you look up those T2 BPs come reply to this post with why you think BPOs need to be removed... insert witty or profound statement here _______.
plaplapla Dogs of War Gaming DARKSTAR ARMY 10	Posted - 2013.11.03 18:13:00 - [38] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. if they remove the BPO then the starter fits need to go to sins people wil just start to use them
Ulysses Knapse duna corp 561	Posted - 2013.11.03 18:30:00 - [39] - Quote Seymor Krelborn wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: I think removing BPOs made sense for the direction ccp wants to take the economy. that said, I BOUGHT THESE WITH MY MONEY! so I am against ANY change to the ones I own. I bought them because of what they are and with no expectation they would change. if CCP changes the way the stuff I already bought works without a full cash refund, I will cancel my eve account, stop playing dust and boycott any future endeavor CCP is a part off. plus I will do my best to sue them for ripping me off. you make no sense man, why would you support ccp changing things you already bought....??? Because it's for the greater good of New Eden, of course. Of course I don't want to lose my investment, but if that's what is necessary, then so be it. lol what rubbish... do me a favor, look up T2 BPOs in eve.... BPOs of dust will go a similar way, minus the manufacturing aspect if you just leave them alone.... you are trying to be noble under a false pretense and leave yourself looking foolish... once you look up those T2 BPs come reply to this post with why you think BPOs need to be removed... I've never liked the existence of T2 BPOs, so if you thought this would change my mind, you're dead wrong. Humanity is the personification of change.
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1091	Posted - 2013.11.03 18:49:00 - [40] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: I think removing BPOs made sense for the direction ccp wants to take the economy. that said, I BOUGHT THESE WITH MY MONEY! so I am against ANY change to the ones I own. I bought them because of what they are and with no expectation they would change. if CCP changes the way the stuff I already bought works without a full cash refund, I will cancel my eve account, stop playing dust and boycott any future endeavor CCP is a part off. plus I will do my best to sue them for ripping me off. you make no sense man, why would you support ccp changing things you already bought....??? Because it's for the greater good of New Eden, of course. Of course I don't want to lose my investment, but if that's what is necessary, then so be it. lol what rubbish... do me a favor, look up T2 BPOs in eve.... BPOs of dust will go a similar way, minus the manufacturing aspect if you just leave them alone.... you are trying to be noble under a false pretense and leave yourself looking foolish... once you look up those T2 BPs come reply to this post with why you think BPOs need to be removed... I've never liked the existence of T2 BPOs, so if you thought this would change my mind, you're dead wrong. lol, you cant change the minds of the brainless...the point is it doesn't effect the eve economy, or the enjoyment of the hundreds of thousands of eve pilots....dust bpos are no where near worth as much or as effective so the argument that they need to be removed to preserve dust economy is already proven wrong.... unless you can give an argument other than you don't like them as to why they should be removed, you should just be bitter in silence. insert witty or profound statement here _______.

Evicer THE HECATONCHIRES 40	Posted - 2013.11.04 23:03:00 - [41] - Quote Tallen Ellecon wrote: Evicer wrote: Why start another thread? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=116404&find=unread That's a dev response to a misquote. I want everyone including BPO owners to discuss what would be reasonable for the future of BPOs. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=116404&p=3 CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance Likes received: 3,236 #58 Posted: 2013.10.21 16:28 \| Report \| Edited by: CCP Logibro Like 4 The reason why BPOs aren't working as intended is they are having a large negative impact on the ingame economy. For the economy to function properly, items need to be consumed in battle. With BPOs, no items are consumed, which breaks this fundamental requirement. As far as trading of BPOs, that's not decided yet. I will be taking your feedback though. We'll let you know when we come to a decision. CCP Logibro // EVE Universe Community Team // Distributor of Nanites // Patron Saint of Logistics again read the thread Closed Beta Tester: Survivor of Infantry lock on swarms,map glitches,Large missile SIgarus spawn camps,and PS3 crashes.
Tallen Ellecon KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 954	Posted - 2013.11.26 13:20:00 - [42] - Quote I have read it. The Ellecon's come from a long line of Gallente. Tarn chose Peace. Tallen chose war. SoonGäó514 CPM1 Candidate
Ulysses Knapse duna corp 642	Posted - 2013.11.26 13:36:00 - [43] - Quote Seymor Krelborn wrote: lol, you cant change the minds of the brainless... I presume you are calling me brainless? How wonderfully ad hominem. Seymor Krelborn wrote: the point is it doesn't effect the eve economy, or the enjoyment of the hundreds of thousands of eve pilots.... Are you talking about T2 BPOs or Dust BPOs now? If you're talking about T2 BPOs, of course they affect the economy, even if slightly. If you're talking about Dust BPOs, they will affect the economy in the future. And "hundreds of thousands of EVE players" is quite a large number. It takes a helluva lot to affect that many people. So, you're right, Dust BPOs wouldn't. Seymor Krelborn wrote: dust bpos are no where near worth as much or as effective There are far more BPOs in Dust, and far fewer players in Dust, not to mention that BPOs in Dust reward you just for having them, whereas you still need the materials required to use T2 BPOs in EVE. Seymor Krelborn wrote: unless you can give an argument other than you don't like them as to why they should be removed, you should just be bitter in silence. The items come from nowhere. They aren't manufactured, found, harvested, awarded, or bought. They just pop out of nowhere because you own a "BPO". It violates one of the most fundamental rules of New Eden. The only exceptions to that rule should be things like rookie ships and starter fits, since it would suck if you couldn't do anything. I don't like T2 BPOs because they are artifacts. I dislike Dust 514 BPOs for a completely different reason: they aren't consistent with the rest of the game! Humanity is the personification of change.
Yelhsa Jin-Mao GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention 166	Posted - 2013.11.26 22:22:00 - [44] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: Seymor Krelborn wrote: lol, you cant change the minds of the brainless... I presume you are calling me brainless? How wonderfully ad hominem. Seymor Krelborn wrote: the point is it doesn't effect the eve economy, or the enjoyment of the hundreds of thousands of eve pilots.... Are you talking about T2 BPOs or Dust BPOs now? If you're talking about T2 BPOs, of course they affect the economy, even if slightly. If you're talking about Dust BPOs, they will affect the economy in the future. And "hundreds of thousands of EVE players" is quite a large number. It takes a helluva lot to affect that many people. So, you're right, Dust BPOs wouldn't. Seymor Krelborn wrote: dust bpos are no where near worth as much or as effective There are far more BPOs in Dust, and far fewer players in Dust, not to mention that BPOs in Dust reward you just for having them, whereas you still need the materials required to use T2 BPOs in EVE. Seymor Krelborn wrote: unless you can give an argument other than you don't like them as to why they should be removed, you should just be bitter in silence. The items come from nowhere. They aren't manufactured, found, harvested, awarded, or bought. They just pop out of nowhere because you own a "BPO". It violates one of the most fundamental rules of New Eden. The only exceptions to that rule should be things like rookie ships and starter fits, since it would suck if you couldn't do anything. I don't like T2 BPOs because they are artifacts. I dislike Dust 514 BPOs for a completely different reason: they aren't consistent with the rest of the game! I have 62 BPOs, so let me rest my nuts on your forehead and let that 'gamebreaking' fact sink in. I can has ISK
Ulysses Knapse duna corp 647	Posted - 2013.11.27 05:03:00 - [45] - Quote Yelhsa Jin-Mao wrote: I have 62 BPOs, so let me rest my nuts on your forehead and let that 'gamebreaking' fact sink in. To be honest, I feel far more pity towards you than anger, but thanks anyway. Humanity is the personification of change.
KA24DERT Pure Innocence. EoN. 262	Posted - 2013.11.27 05:05:00 - [46] - Quote Lots of whining in this thread. Here's the reality: When CCP converts Dust BPOs into EVE BPOs, they'll probably give you the option to get a refund in the form of AUR/USD/ISK. And if you don't like it, then go find the softest blanket and the biggest pacifier you can, and go sob quietly in a corner about how life's not fair.
Talos Vagheitan Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 240	Posted - 2013.11.27 06:59:00 - [47] - Quote Tallen Ellecon wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. If they completely remove them there will be a shitstorm unlike anything they've ever seen. People will cry, moan, ****, whine, petition, rage, threaten to quit, calm down, forget BPO's ever existed, and happily move on as we've seen many many times. Who cares what some sniper has to say
Yelhsa Jin-Mao GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention 168	Posted - 2013.11.27 21:36:00 - [48] - Quote Talos Vagheitan wrote: Tallen Ellecon wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. If they completely remove them there will be a shitstorm unlike anything they've ever seen. People will cry, moan, ****, whine, petition, rage, threaten to quit, calm down, forget BPO's ever existed, and happily move on as we've seen many many times. No, they won't. They just won't. I can has ISK
Tallen Ellecon KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 965	Posted - 2013.11.27 22:43:00 - [49] - Quote I can deal with them taking and refunding anything I bought on the market, but if they take my Templar gear I will go batshit. The Ellecon's come from a long line of Gallente. Tarn chose Peace. Tallen chose war. SoonGäó514 CPM1 Candidate
SponkSponkSponk The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 539	Posted - 2013.11.27 22:58:00 - [50] - Quote Tallen Ellecon wrote: I can deal with them taking and refunding anything I bought on the market, but if they take my Templar gear I will go batshit. That's because there's really two types of blueprints; market blueprints, and limited-edition blueprints. They have to be treated differently. "Pulvis et umbra sumus. (We are but dust and shadow.)" GÇò Horace, The Odes of Horace

Jakobi Wan Legions of Infinite Dominion 47	Posted - 2013.12.02 11:48:00 - [51] - Quote EVE MARKET = FIX am i sadly mistaken? i know it will take time but cant the "brokeness" be overlooked and the game just be played people??? i hate to see such a baby of a game butchered in every which way before it can even clearly speak "dada?" so i ask you.. if this game isnt worth investing time in.. everything is OP at one point sooner or later and it just seems like CCP is playing ping pong with the weapon stats as a reaction to the various "broken mechanics" of this process so in the fashion of DUST514's budding childhood might have mistakes been made with BPO mechanics and their possible impact on the effective utility of a player market being released? maybe.. perhaps at the same time those of us who have support DUST514 long time have undoubtedly bought aurum packs.. more than likely suit bundles and or miltia bpos.. i support the thread originators evaluation as i think it's important to modify functionality for the player market to work properly and in all ignorance (seriously though, really dont care how it works but it apparently works ***** fine) i believe the EVE market is a perfect model. so please with that assumption please can we demonstrate a little patients and continuing support? regardless of opinion (although i myself only bought PSN bundles and miltia BPOs) i think honestly believe its a huge step in my level of commitment, having customizable BPOs at my disposal and i started playing this game way more often.. and having more (at least) militia BPO for sake makes this game way more attractive for people like us. the only thing i'd like to add that this is a free game and an MMO so releasing time-frame exclusive gear and sales and ** is what they want to do it's not that outlandlish.. really.. maybe i'm alone on that but every other MMO i've played has done that..
Jooki Chewaka Stalking Wolfpack 18	Posted - 2013.12.02 13:38:00 - [52] - Quote They should be exactly the same thing as eve's bpos, what would mean that ccp should add mining into game, industrial skilltree, the hability to build player owned stations, research mechanics such as material efficiency, research time efficiency, invention, inverse research, and tied to the mining, all the refining skills and perks, but previous from that they should fix all the broken content, protostomping, bugs and glitches that are still here from early closed beta, matchmaking being ridiculously stupid, lag, low framerate, etc. So, good luck with that for a game that hass less than 4000 players XD http://eve-offline.net/?server=dust My EVE toon
Jvnx Nightchill Tripoint Mercetile Rimrunners Universal Rockstars 2	Posted - 2013.12.02 13:45:00 - [53] - Quote I find it rather amusing that some players are so vehemently against the BPOs and are in such a tirade over how they break the market that as yet does not exist. We can't even transfer items we loot off the field (or buy) amongst corp-mates let alone buy or sell them on the 'market'. There seems to be many more pressing issues that need tending than the underlying complaint "it's not fair" Personally, yes, I have several *different* packs I have bought with BPOs and I 'purchased' some with Aurom. Only duplicates I have where due to purchasing items by mistake. The BPO's bought really should be bound to the account that purchased them. If a person bought multiple packs offer them the option to convert the multiples into boosters or aurom, simple solution. Last time I checked the best of any BPO have the same stats and requirements as basic gear. In fact I have a 'Sever' Logistics BPO I can't use because I haven't invested the SP since they where changed. Advanced and Prototype gear is still going to be bought and consumed for the simple reason when you have the skills to run them you will for precisely the reason that you had to spend the SP to unlock them in the first place; CPU/PG slots and bonuses. Someone could run BPO only fits exclusively same as they could run the starter default fits (which are unlimited and will always be for same reason an Eve capsuleer gets a free rookie ship whenever they need one). The BPO's included in the package deals for $$$ can be reasonably expected to not to deviate from the initial purchased content functionality nor considered transferable due to their non-consumable nature. As for the concerns of manufacture of suits and equipment the existing BPO's should not be a part of it. However I am looking forward to the possibility for corporations without the ability to possess a district to support their Dust 514 members.
KA24DERT Pure Innocence. EoN. 267	Posted - 2013.12.02 18:05:00 - [54] - Quote Jvnx Nightchill wrote: I find it rather amusing that some players are so vehemently against the BPOs and are in such a tirade over how they break the market that as yet does not exist. We can't even transfer items we loot off the field (or buy) amongst corp-mates let alone buy or sell them on the 'market'. There seems to be many more pressing issues that need tending than the underlying complaint "it's not fair" Personally, yes, I have several *different* packs I have bought with BPOs and I 'purchased' some with Aurom. Only duplicates I have where due to purchasing items by mistake. The BPO's bought really should be bound to the account that purchased them. If a person bought multiple packs offer them the option to convert the multiples into boosters or aurom, simple solution. Last time I checked the best of any BPO have the same stats and requirements as basic gear. In fact I have a 'Sever' Logistics BPO I can't use because I haven't invested the SP since they where changed. Advanced and Prototype gear is still going to be bought and consumed for the simple reason when you have the skills to run them you will for precisely the reason that you had to spend the SP to unlock them in the first place; CPU/PG slots and bonuses. Someone could run BPO only fits exclusively same as they could run the starter default fits (which are unlimited and will always be for same reason an Eve capsuleer gets a free rookie ship whenever they need one). The BPO's included in the package deals for $$$ can be reasonably expected to not to deviate from the initial purchased content functionality nor considered transferable due to their non-consumable nature. As for the concerns of manufacture of suits and equipment the existing BPO's should not be a part of it. However I am looking forward to the possibility for corporations without the ability to possess a district to support their Dust 514 members. And we find it amusing that most BPO defenders are so short sighted that they can't look past their own interests to see how Dust-style BPOs will impede the integration of Dust into Eve. We know people are upset, but if you step outside your shoes and look at the situation from a game design perspective, Dust BPOs gotta go. They should have never existed, and are no doubt a prominent item on a bulleted list circulating around CCP's office titled: "Things that are blocking the integration of Eve and Dust economies." CCP will make you a decent offer if you don't want Eve BPOs, and the devoted crybabies can call their credit card companies or file a petition.
M1GHTY M0NKEY Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic 0	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:07:00 - [55] - Quote Honestly, the only time I use my BPOs is when I run out of advanced or prototype suits. yes, the BPOs are "unlimited" but if a limit is put in place on the amount of times you can spawn in the suit it takes away from the point people bought them in the first place. It would be nice if they put a system for gathering mats from the planets but if I have to grind to use BPOs that are NEXT TO ROOKIE that defeats the point of me using them.
Ivy Zalinto Bobbit's Hangmen 63	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:18:00 - [56] - Quote Talos Alomar wrote: All CCP needs to do is to stop selling them. I don't think they have to take any further steps. As more people start playing, or people run more expensive gear that there isn't a BPO of, people will be consuming goods that need the market. I doubt the market is going to be that seriously impacted by a few people who were there when the game launched (and paid money for an incomplete game) not buying militia or a very limited selection of standard level gear off the market. Completely removing BPOs would just fix a problem that time itself would have healed while pissing everyone off. +1 to this. The market will likely come out far in the future. I already see very few people running drens at this point and I run a valor. Its basically like a limited edition mount in other games. Eventually that's a piece of eyecandy from before launch Dedicated scout. Caldari loyalist. Pistol supremacy.
Jvnx Nightchill Tripoint Mercetile Rimrunners Universal Rockstars 2	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:58:00 - [57] - Quote KA24DERT wrote: And we find it amusing that most BPO defenders are so short sighted that they can't look past their own interests to see how Dust-style BPOs will impede the integration of Dust into Eve. We know people are upset, but if you step outside your shoes and look at the situation from a game design perspective, Dust BPOs gotta go. They should have never existed, and are no doubt a prominent item on a bulleted list circulating around CCP's office titled: "Things that are blocking the integration of Eve and Dust economies." CCP will make you a decent offer if you don't want Eve BPOs, and the devoted crybabies can call their credit card companies or file a petition. I'm happy to assure you and everybody else, I'm far from short sighted on this issue. Pragmatically the first thing that would be offered via player interaction would be vehicles, why you may ask. Simple, considering the tooling mockup of the Eve Universe's Industrial model the smallest item made is ship ammunition which the smallest units/run is 1 and significant in size, 1m3 for a small standard frequency crystal. One cubic meter if translated into small arms would be dozens or more hand held weapons. Larger items such a vehicles would be a drop-in fit. Drop-suits, modules, and munitions would have to be built in lots, large lots. I am also aware that Eve side Planetary Interaction is going to play a large role in infantry item production. EVE produced items are going to have a different manner of origin compared to what we consider BPC & BPO currently in Dust It is also probably a safe bet that there will be no industry on the Dust side of things until CCP is comfortable enough to expand it onto different platforms the PC would probably be the threshold. Mixing the game mechanics of a FPS and the menu driven operations of manufacture would be a headache to say the least on a console. Ultimately as the player base suffers attrition of early adopters and new players come into the dynamic the few that have the packs purchased for real world money will become a minority resolving the issue itself. As long as they are not transferable and *extremely* limited in the future Also the fact that BPOs where part of the deal in packages purchased through the Playstation Store modification of purchased media will draw Sony into the mix and they have already experienced issues with reducing functionality namely in the PS3 system itself that lead to lawsuits with some favoring the plantiffs depending on where they where filed. So it isn't a simple matter of whiners whining it is a matter of a major PR nightmare and quite likely a degradation of the very unique arrangement CCP has with Sony. Patches, DLCs and other add-ons do not in any way shape or form happen as quickly as the Dust updates have been coming by any other distributor other than CCP
ZEN 33 Carbon 7 CRONOS. 6	Posted - 2014.01.02 05:50:00 - [58] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. you make absolutely nosense with that statement. BPOS have no negative effect on the economy of DUST and need to stay. say something useful next time. Minmater Loyalist Freedom Fighter
Munin-Frey Fish Spotters Inc. 70	Posted - 2014.01.02 06:07:00 - [59] - Quote Talos Alomar wrote: All CCP needs to do is to stop selling them. I don't think they have to take any further steps. As more people start playing, or people run more expensive gear that there isn't a BPO of, people will be consuming goods that need the market. I doubt the market is going to be that seriously impacted by a few people who were there when the game launched (and paid money for an incomplete game) not buying militia or a very limited selection of standard level gear off the market. Completely removing BPOs would just fix a problem that time itself would have healed while pissing everyone off. Perfect answer. I own most of them but I almost never use them. They have mediocre to poor stats and just arn't competative....although I do really enjoy being able to jump into a game as a sniper or a heavy whenever I want. I don't really understand the logic behind them ruining the economy....in EVE you have an unlimited numer of rookie ships and the economy is fine because the whole point is to use something better.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 6212	Posted - 2014.01.02 06:47:00 - [60] - Quote Munin-Frey wrote: Talos Alomar wrote: All CCP needs to do is to stop selling them. I don't think they have to take any further steps. As more people start playing, or people run more expensive gear that there isn't a BPO of, people will be consuming goods that need the market. I doubt the market is going to be that seriously impacted by a few people who were there when the game launched (and paid money for an incomplete game) not buying militia or a very limited selection of standard level gear off the market. Completely removing BPOs would just fix a problem that time itself would have healed while pissing everyone off. Perfect answer. I own most of them but I almost never use them. They have mediocre to poor stats and just arn't competative....although I do really enjoy being able to jump into a game as a sniper or a heavy whenever I want. I don't really understand the logic behind them ruining the economy....in EVE you have an unlimited numer of rookie ships and the economy is fine because the whole point is to use something better. So far only four particular BPOs (all vehicle-only modules) have been completely removed by CCP. The rest are staying in our inventory according to them. Anyways, I don't see a problem with the BPOs that are currently in circulation since there are no more coming and as the player base grows the impact of the BPOs will diminish over time. Case in point: Tech 2 BPOs in Eve Online. OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*

DeathwindRising ROGUE SPADES 170	Posted - 2014.01.02 10:44:00 - [61] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: BPOs as they currently are need to be completely removed from Dust 514. I don't care about the rage it will cause, they need to go in order to have a functional economy. CCP can refund them, or they can replace them, but they need to go. we have BPO's in Eve. We will have BPO's in Dust. the only thing that should/will change is that the BPO suits would have to be manufactured first before they can be used, in which case i hope the stats are changed slightly to make them better (increased fittings) or cheaper manufacturing costs. the real question is will dust be dependent on Eve players to manufacture all their items or will Dust players be given some control/ability to manufacture as well. What would happen if all the Eve players stopped making Dust items? or created a shortage in supply in order to force insane inflation? Dust player dont have the isk flow that Eve players enjoy


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