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What good is 16m in PC?

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Knight Soiaire Mercenaries of Sunlight 2896	Posted - 2013.10.31 12:57:00 - [1] - Quote In a mode where someone in your squad is sure to run a 100m or more Active Scanner, what good is 16m? I'm glad you buffed us but I was expecting something more, seriously, the Heavies got a load of HP, and we get +6m. Raffle signup closed - Draw will be SoonTM, 2 prizes of 5mil being rewarded for delay. *Mercenaries of Sunlight!
Bendtner92 Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1187	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:00:00 - [2] - Quote Don't forget that passive scanning isn't shared either, while active scanners share with squad.
Monkey MAC killer taxi company General Tso's Alliance 881	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:01:00 - [3] - Quote Knight Soiaire wrote: In a mode where someone in your squad is sure to run a 100m or more Active Scanner, what good is 16m? I'm glad you buffed us but I was expecting something more, seriously, the Heavies got a load of HP, and we get +6m. In PC? Right now? ** All! But on the newly designed maps, with max electronics skills in core upgrades, everything, *ING EVERYTHING!! The pen is mightier than the sword* The gun is mightier than both
Funkmaster Whale Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 1037	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:04:00 - [4] - Quote Nothing. Abso-*******-lutely nothing. And I'm not even a scout. Just a way of CCP saying "See? We have scouts a buff! Now shhhhhh..." Let me play you the song of my people!
Himiko Kuronaga MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 2078	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:07:00 - [5] - Quote 10 + 50% (range amplification skill) = 15 15 + 50% (gallente scout skill) = 22.5 After buff 16 + 50% (range amplification skill) = 24 24 + 50% (gallente scout skill) = 36 Now play with a single amplification modules. 22.5 + 45% = 32. or.... 36 + 45% = 52. Behold, the power of multiplication.
Knight Soiaire Mercenaries of Sunlight 2896	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:09:00 - [6] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: 10 + 50% (range amplification skill) = 15 15 + 50% (gallente scout skill) = 22.5 After buff 16 + 50% (range amplification skill) = 24 24 + 50% (gallente scout skill) = 36 Now play with a single amplification modules. 22.5 + 45% = 32. or.... 36 + 45% = 52. Behold, the power of multiplication. Quote: Don't forget that passive scanning isn't shared either, while active scanners share with squad. Quote: 100m or more Active Scanner Raffle signup closed - Draw will be SoonTM, 2 prizes of 5mil being rewarded for delay. *Mercenaries of Sunlight!
Himiko Kuronaga MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 2078	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:12:00 - [7] - Quote When a target scans me, you know what I start thinking? "Oh great, there's somebody nearby. Time to start watching my back." Yea, it's good for your squad but it's terrible for solo work.
Absoliav Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 84	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:14:00 - [8] - Quote Quote: Don't forget that passive scanning isn't shared either, while active scanners share with squad. Passive scans are shared with your squad, and they don't broadcast you're scanning your enemies, every time my squad gets scanned we become more cautious and stay alert for a minute after the scan notification goes away.
Knight Soiaire Mercenaries of Sunlight 2896	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:17:00 - [9] - Quote Absoliav wrote: Quote: Don't forget that passive scanning isn't shared either, while active scanners share with squad. Passive scans are shared with your squad, and they don't broadcast you're scanning your enemies, every time my squad gets scanned we become more cautious and stay alert for a minute after the scan notification goes away. Since when were passive scans shared with your squad? I thought that got removed? Raffle signup closed - Draw will be SoonTM, 2 prizes of 5mil being rewarded for delay. *Mercenaries of Sunlight!
Bendtner92 Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1189	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:17:00 - [10] - Quote Absoliav wrote: Passive scans are shared with your squad, and they don't broadcast you're scanning your enemies, every time my squad gets scanned we become more cautious and stay alert for a minute after the scan notification goes away. 1.4 patch notes says otherwise. CCP Logibro wrote: Shared passive scanner vision for squads disabled (results of active scanners are still shared with squads)

Absoliav Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 84	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:20:00 - [11] - Quote Knight Soiaire wrote: Absoliav wrote: Quote: Don't forget that passive scanning isn't shared either, while active scanners share with squad. Passive scans are shared with your squad, and they don't broadcast you're scanning your enemies, every time my squad gets scanned we become more cautious and stay alert for a minute after the scan notification goes away. Since when were passive scans shared with your squad? I thought that got removed? They never took it out, only team share was removed, no one really noticed squad share is in cause everyone only has a 10m scan radius.
Absoliav Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 84	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:25:00 - [12] - Quote Bendtner92 wrote: Absoliav wrote: Passive scans are shared with your squad, and they don't broadcast you're scanning your enemies, every time my squad gets scanned we become more cautious and stay alert for a minute after the scan notification goes away. 1.4 patch notes says otherwise. CCP Logibro wrote: Shared passive scanner vision for squads disabled (results of active scanners are still shared with squads) That's from target marking, before the patch looking at an enemy marked him for teammates on you mini-map and screen.
Protected Void Endless Hatred 169	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:30:00 - [13] - Quote Absoliav wrote: Knight Soiaire wrote: Absoliav wrote: Quote: Don't forget that passive scanning isn't shared either, while active scanners share with squad. Passive scans are shared with your squad, and they don't broadcast you're scanning your enemies, every time my squad gets scanned we become more cautious and stay alert for a minute after the scan notification goes away. Since when were passive scans shared with your squad? I thought that got removed? They never took it out, only team share was removed, no one really noticed squad share is in cause everyone only has a 10m scan radius. Hmmm...source? Have you or anyone tested this methodically?
DeadlyAztec11 Gallente Federation 2339	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:31:00 - [14] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: 10 + 50% (range amplification skill) = 15 15 + 50% (gallente scout skill) = 22.5 After buff 16 + 50% (range amplification skill) = 24 24 + 50% (gallente scout skill) = 36 Now play with a single amplification module. 22.5 + 45% = 32. or.... 36 + 45% = 52. Behold, the power of multiplication. Yes! Someone willing to do math. I was just about to make a post about this. Now go play with more amplification modules and see what happens. Also, you are not limited to a single angle of scan, unlike the active scanner. Also, with a single dampener, no active scanner will ever be able to find you. "It's because of people like you that I became this. And you'll never give me a reason to become someone else."
Protected Void Endless Hatred 169	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:38:00 - [15] - Quote I already have my range skill and gallente scout suit maxed out, and have high hopes for the range buff. I use my minimap extensively to sneak up on and flank around people, especially at CQC. I'm currently relying a lot on my active scanner to populate the minimap, but with one range extender I probably won't need one to use most of my regular movement strategies. I might still run one to help my squad out, but it'll be great to be able to swap in remotes or an uplink without feeling blind. I've already been making myself somewhat useful compared to my team mates in the PC matches I've fought, and I see the added scan range as a nice upgrade. Also, I believe very firmly that more scout hugs are coming further down the line. The added scan range was an easy fix that CCP could implement with minimal work done, and quite frankly a no-brainer that is in no danger of upsetting game balance. So, we've basically been given a quite nice and juicy bone - the proper bowl of food is in our future.
Knight Soiaire Mercenaries of Sunlight 2896	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:49:00 - [16] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Himiko Kuronaga wrote: 10 + 50% (range amplification skill) = 15 15 + 50% (gallente scout skill) = 22.5 After buff 16 + 50% (range amplification skill) = 24 24 + 50% (gallente scout skill) = 36 Now play with a single amplification module. 22.5 + 45% = 32. or.... 36 + 45% = 52. Behold, the power of multiplication. Yes! Someone willing to do math. I was just about to make a post about this. Now go play with more amplification modules and see what happens. Also, you are not limited to a single angle of scan, unlike the active scanner. Also, with a single dampener, no active scanner will ever be able to find you. Single angle of scan? You know you can just spin around when scanning, right? Raffle signup closed - Draw will be SoonTM, 2 prizes of 5mil being rewarded for delay. *Mercenaries of Sunlight!
Himiko Kuronaga MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 2083	Posted - 2013.10.31 14:00:00 - [17] - Quote Knight Soiaire wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Himiko Kuronaga wrote: 10 + 50% (range amplification skill) = 15 15 + 50% (gallente scout skill) = 22.5 After buff 16 + 50% (range amplification skill) = 24 24 + 50% (gallente scout skill) = 36 Now play with a single amplification module. 22.5 + 45% = 32. or.... 36 + 45% = 52. Behold, the power of multiplication. Yes! Someone willing to do math. I was just about to make a post about this. Now go play with more amplification modules and see what happens. Also, you are not limited to a single angle of scan, unlike the active scanner. Also, with a single dampener, no active scanner will ever be able to find you. Single angle of scan? You know you can just spin around when scanning, right? You have to hold the scanner over a target for an allotment of time before they will "flash" and stay active. How long you have to hold it over them depends on their profile and your precision. If all you do is spin the scanner, you will not catch everything.
Absoliav Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 85	Posted - 2013.10.31 20:10:00 - [18] - Quote Protected Void wrote: Absoliav wrote: Knight Soiaire wrote: Absoliav wrote: Quote: Don't forget that passive scanning isn't shared either, while active scanners share with squad. Passive scans are shared with your squad, and they don't broadcast you're scanning your enemies, every time my squad gets scanned we become more cautious and stay alert for a minute after the scan notification goes away. Since when were passive scans shared with your squad? I thought that got removed? They never took it out, only team share was removed, no one really noticed squad share is in cause everyone only has a 10m scan radius. Hmmm...source? Have you or anyone tested this methodically? I've tested this on my Gal-scout, I try to find a position close to the enemy without being detected, it's hard to pull-off, but my teammates appreciate me not telling the enemy we know were they are. To be clear, I've never been on the receiving end of this, I've always been the scout, me and my squad use our mics to confirm each others targets and I'm always the one doing all the scouting, fair warning, doing will cost you some ISK .
Knight Soiaire Mercenaries of Sunlight 2903	Posted - 2013.10.31 20:13:00 - [19] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: When a target scans me, you know what I start thinking? "Oh great, there's somebody nearby. Time to start watching my back." Yea, it's good for your squad but it's terrible for solo work. Who runs solo in PC anyway? Pretty sure everyone would be in a squad. We need at least 20m, maybe even to go back to Chromosone's 25m. Raffle signup closed - Draw will be SoonTM, 2 prizes of 5mil being rewarded for delay. *Mercenaries of Sunlight!
DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2383	Posted - 2013.10.31 20:14:00 - [20] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Knight Soiaire wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Himiko Kuronaga wrote: 10 + 50% (range amplification skill) = 15 15 + 50% (gallente scout skill) = 22.5 After buff 16 + 50% (range amplification skill) = 24 24 + 50% (gallente scout skill) = 36 Now play with a single amplification module. 22.5 + 45% = 32. or.... 36 + 45% = 52. Behold, the power of multiplication. Yes! Someone willing to do math. I was just about to make a post about this. Now go play with more amplification modules and see what happens. Also, you are not limited to a single angle of scan, unlike the active scanner. Also, with a single dampener, no active scanner will ever be able to find you. Single angle of scan? You know you can just spin around when scanning, right? You have to hold the scanner over a target for an allotment of time before they will "flash" and stay active. How long you have to hold it over them depends on their profile and your precision. If all you do is spin the scanner, you will not catch everything. I just spin like crazy and light everthing up. Angle really doesn't matter because the spin is so effective GôÉGô¥GôÿGô£Gôö > GôÉGô¢Gô¢ Gÿà¿When will dust get better?Gÿà Forum Warrior LV. 2

THUNDERGROOVE ZionTCD Public Disorder. 1206	Posted - 2013.10.31 20:24:00 - [21] - Quote In reality 16 meters small with the size of the maps. I wouldn't be opposed to 30+ base on scouts. They should be able to not run a scanner to see people near by. What is a signature?
Daxxis KANNAH Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 441	Posted - 2013.10.31 20:27:00 - [22] - Quote The buff is fine for Gallente but for other scouts - read two or less low slots with no built in range bonus - it is trivial. If I were to do as Himiko Kuronaga says and put those in my low slots then I could forget about trying to get away when spotted by anyone with any rifle. If LoS is easily going to trump this then why bother. Just use reds and greens and sneak. The buff isnt enough to help scouts properly avoid hot spots. CCP fixing the sound so it doesnt drop out etc and allowing us to see vehicles easier on passive scans will be a better move. I am all for the buff but lets not make it sound like cake and ice cream when known Scouts say otherwise.
General John Ripper MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 11548	Posted - 2013.10.31 20:28:00 - [23] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Also, with a single dampener, no active scanner will ever be able to find you. You can spin to scan more Dust 514's #17 Forum Warrior Founder of the Forum Warrior Club King of Tacos
Goric Rumis Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn 244	Posted - 2013.10.31 20:47:00 - [24] - Quote General John Ripper wrote: You can spin to scan more The spin trick seems like it's not intended, I wouldn't be surprised if we get an updated mechanism in the future that either prevents you from turning while scanning or degrades the quality of information you're getting if you move. Probably something like the breach forge, where you have to hold down the trigger and are unable to move while scanning, but you can always let up the trigger before completion if you need to move. Point being, it's a pretty safe bet that passive scanning is working as intended, while I wouldn't count on the active scanners staying that way.
Grimmiers 0uter.Heaven Proficiency V. 298	Posted - 2013.10.31 20:50:00 - [25] - Quote I think scanners should lower accuracy based on range. It should only scan at full accuracy at about 20m and then drop off from there so scouts have a better chance at sneaking around. Grimm Grimm! \ Youtube Channel Recruiter Link
Stefan Stahl Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 328	Posted - 2013.10.31 21:00:00 - [26] - Quote Remember that this is a 60% buff to scanning range. Even when only skilled mildly into scanning this gives some adequate scanning ranges: 1.) Let's assume a minimal-effort fit: Basic light frame + enhanced range amplification mod: 16 meter base * 1.35 from the mod * 1.3 from the range amplification skill = 28 meters 2.) Some higher investment, let's also skill into Gallente Scout III: 28 meter from above * 1.3 = 36 meters That's almost an AR's effective range worth of omni-vision here. 3.) If we'd go all-in on scanning with Range amplification V and Gallente Scout V and equip a complex range amplification module we'd arrive at 52 meters (like Himiko Kuronaga already said). Personally, I think this is extremely powerful and absolutely worth skilling into. Generally, the passive scanning system is really awesome. This change finally makes it useful again.
Vyzion Eyri The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 1654	Posted - 2013.10.31 21:02:00 - [27] - Quote Grimmiers wrote: I think scanners should lower accuracy based on range. It should only scan at full accuracy at about 20m and then drop off from there so scouts have a better chance at sneaking around. Best not to tinker with the active scanner mechanics until we get all the equipment that will counter it. I'm guessing there will be electronic 'cloaks', active counter-scanners, etc. And who knows, maybe CCP will introduce a module or equipment that re-enables squad/team vision through passive scanning, and it earns you Intel kill assists. Then scouts could recon all day. > "I will show you fear in a handful of dust." T.S. Eliot, The Wasteland
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1686	Posted - 2013.10.31 21:12:00 - [28] - Quote In PC? It's okay but hardly a winning change. I'll personally be adding a range amp to my fits to get that 52m scan when I run in for a cheeky hack or run rampant around the more built up areas and be able to avoid being seen by anyone because I'll be unscannable and I'll know where everyone else is. In totally unrealistic terms, you could now reach a passive scan range of ~100m, even with stacking penalties, so that's pretty cool but leaves you entirely unprotected from attack if you actually want to try to do anything more useful than hide. Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1686	Posted - 2013.10.31 21:15:00 - [29] - Quote Grimmiers wrote: I think scanners should lower accuracy based on range. It should only scan at full accuracy at about 20m and then drop off from there so scouts have a better chance at sneaking around. Nah, I don't have a problem with active scanners and their precision at range; the only real problems with active scanners is the ability to spin-scan and the shortness of the cooldown allowing almost constant scanning. Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
Cass Caul Namtar Elite Gallente Federation 211	Posted - 2013.10.31 21:21:00 - [30] - Quote I'm sorry everyone, I appologize for Himiko Kuronaga. He has what we in the Biz like to call, "Forum tourettes." Even though he is speaking out about something he has never played with he thinks he's an authority on the subject. He's even voiced his utterly, incomprehensibly wrong opinions f the Gallente Scout in corp chat. . . If anything, he could have looked to his corp-mate, Appia Vibbia, and see how she does as far as KDR goes in PC to see that a Scout without any Kinetic Catalyzers AND armor plates is incapable of being in a combat role, and you better put an armor repairer too. 1 slot left... it is going to be more armor, not a range amplifier. Playing with a passive scan based suit can be fun in public matches, but is worthless in PC. and it is nearly useless on any map outside a city. Himiko seriously needs to shut the **** up and stay out of topics about Scouts. ~Appia Vibbia, MHPD Ninja Hacker Extraordinaire



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