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Judge Rhadamanthus
Seraphim Auxiliaries
425
|
Posted - 2013.09.24 19:09:00 -
[1] - Quote
I thought rather than just pointing out issues, I would try to offer a solution. So from a dropship POV, although would be great for tanks too; here is a video where i added graphics to a real fight with a swarmer to show my suggestions to fix the radar and HUD to make it fairer. Not the total solution but part of it.
What do you think community and what you you think DEVs?
Remember to set it to 720p
The Video |
Synbot
Expert Intervention Caldari State
156
|
Posted - 2013.09.24 19:22:00 -
[2] - Quote
I like your idea. But I also believe that adding an indicator, much like the hit indicator (that red thing that pops up when you're hit), that increases in size depending on how close the swarms are to you. Also having these swarms tracked on your radar would be nice. Also adding an active module that would allow swarms to shoot out flares that would attract these swarms to the flare instead would be cool. If these swarm missiles track vehicles by radar signature instead of heat signature, rather letting dropships shoot out radio frequencies that could throw the swarm missiles off, maybe forcing them to explode in mid-air or crash into the ground or a building.
Also being able to destroy these missiles would be a good defense for tanks and LAVs.
And I'd like to thank you for teaching me how to drive a dropship effectively ;) I watched your video awhile back and it really help. Thanks! |
Pvt Numnutz
Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State
236
|
Posted - 2013.09.24 19:51:00 -
[3] - Quote
Brilliant early warning system. Its not unbalanced, and provides enough information so the pilot isn't always guessing, but can make educated guesses. This system would go quite a long way in keeping pilots in the sky and isk in their pockets. Good video judge I fully support this +1. We have needed this for a long time.... |
Cosgar
ParagonX
5423
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Posted - 2013.09.24 19:58:00 -
[4] - Quote
Remember when all you needed was an afterburner to evade swarms? |
Judge Rhadamanthus
Seraphim Auxiliaries
431
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Posted - 2013.09.24 20:23:00 -
[5] - Quote
Pvt Numnutz wrote:Brilliant early warning system. Its not unbalanced, and provides enough information so the pilot isn't always guessing, but can make educated guesses. This system would go quite a long way in keeping pilots in the sky and isk in their pockets. Good video judge I fully support this +1. We have needed this for a long time....
Thanks. I think it would be balanced. I could see i was being locked from behind without having to turn round and get a shot in the face before realising. Then I can decide to turn and fight or module and evade. |
Blaze Ashra
Bragian Order Amarr Empire
8
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Posted - 2013.09.24 20:28:00 -
[6] - Quote
This would be very nice and could be a band aid fix to hold us over until they get rendering fixed. |
richiesutie 2
The Rainbow Effect
309
|
Posted - 2013.09.24 20:31:00 -
[7] - Quote
I'd think i prefer it if it stuck to the corner if the screen like squad chevrons, other than that wonderful idea! |
Bright Cloud
Namtar Elite Gallente Federation
210
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Posted - 2013.09.24 21:23:00 -
[8] - Quote
Well your dropship still turns to dust when a forgegunner appears. 2 hits and you hit the ground and your armor HP are nowhere near to survive a direct hit after your shields dropped. Even with both armor reps going. Cause my assault forgegun does a whopping 1900HP damage. Seriously ditch your shield tank on that thing. Get rid off the shield extenders, replace 1 off the power diagnostic systems with a 15% PG upgrade and get a plate on. You have amazing armor repair capability but you put a penalty on yourself with the shield extenders. And another fact has beeing proven in that vid that dropships take only 55% damage from swarms regardless if its shield or armor. Why? Well the guy in the vid had a advanced swarm launcher (5 missiles) so he would do 2145HP damage against armor (basically killing you with alpha damage). However when you where into armor you had around 200 shields and 1700 armor. All 5 missiles did hit and you dropped down to 1072HP armor. So the swarm did effectively "only" a whopping 900HP damage against you. The main thing that kills dropships are forgeguns which deal exactly 100% damage. Which makes it the only true choice to take dropships down. That beeing sayd your dropship pilots had still the easy mode on versus swarm launchers. Oh and for the people who didnt noticed. He was fighting 2 swarm launchers not just 1 and he still survived. |
Bright Cloud
Namtar Elite Gallente Federation
210
|
Posted - 2013.09.24 21:30:00 -
[9] - Quote
Counted the amount of volleys he took without exploding. A whopping 5 volleys from swarms and the 6th he sponged with the speed of the dropships. Tell me how many swarms would a tank take before blowing up these days? Probably around 5~6 and thats the max. |
richiesutie 2
The Rainbow Effect
310
|
Posted - 2013.09.24 21:37:00 -
[10] - Quote
Bright Cloud wrote:Well your dropship still turns to dust when a forgegunner appears. 2 hits and you hit the ground and your armor HP are nowhere near to survive a direct hit after your shields dropped. Even with both armor reps going. Cause my assault forgegun does a whopping 1900HP damage. Seriously ditch your shield tank on that thing. Get rid off the shield extenders, replace 1 off the power diagnostic systems with a 15% PG upgrade and get a plate on. You have amazing armor repair capability but you put a penalty on yourself with the shield extenders. And another fact has beeing proven in that vid that dropships take only 55% damage from swarms regardless if its shield or armor. Why? Well the guy in the vid had a advanced swarm launcher (5 missiles) so he would do 2145HP damage against armor (basically killing you with alpha damage). However when you where into armor you had around 200 shields and 1700 armor. All 5 missiles did hit and you dropped down to 1072HP armor. So the swarm did effectively "only" a whopping 900HP damage against you. The main thing that kills dropships are forgeguns which deal exactly 100% damage. Which makes it the only true choice to take dropships down. That beeing sayd your dropship pilots had still the easy mode on versus swarm launchers. Oh and for the people who didnt noticed. He was fighting 2 swarm launchers not just 1 and he still survived. That was just a theory crafting fit. The point of this is to allow pilots to prepare for that first forge-gun hit and evade the consecutive and not fly directly toward the forgegunner. |
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Blaze Ashra
Bragian Order Amarr Empire
8
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Posted - 2013.09.24 23:21:00 -
[11] - Quote
Bright Cloud wrote:Counted the amount of volleys he took without exploding. A whopping 5 volleys from swarms and the 6th he sponged with the speed of the dropships. Tell me how many swarms would a tank take before blowing up these days? Probably around 5~6 and thats the max.
Can you not realize that this would help you out as well? Oh hey, theres a swarm launcher guy there let me point my turret at him and blow him to pieces. One of tankers biggest complaints is that infantry doesn't help them out, well here you'd know the culprit and can deal with it yourself.
This is a proposed idea. Do you support it or not? |
Spkr4theDead
International-Fleet
891
|
Posted - 2013.09.24 23:40:00 -
[12] - Quote
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:I thought rather than just pointing out issues, I would try to offer a solution. So from a dropship POV, although would be great for tanks too; here is a video where i added graphics to a real fight with a swarmer to show my suggestions to fix the radar and HUD to make it fairer. Not the total solution but part of it. What do you think community and what you you think DEVs? Remember to set it to 720p The Video But that's not fair! You can't expect infantry to actually live with being seen on the map because they're locking on to you, could you? How could you suggest actually giving pilots a buff!?
In all seriousness, this is a wonderful idea. I support it fully. Would help too when I don't have a scanner and someone is behind me. |
Judge Rhadamanthus
Seraphim Auxiliaries
437
|
Posted - 2013.09.24 23:43:00 -
[13] - Quote
Bright Cloud wrote:Well your dropship still turns to dust when a forgegunner appears. 2 hits and you hit the ground and your armor HP are nowhere near to survive a direct hit after your shields dropped. Even with both armor reps going. Cause my assault forgegun does a whopping 1900HP damage. Seriously ditch your shield tank on that thing. Get rid off the shield extenders, replace 1 off the power diagnostic systems with a 15% PG upgrade and get a plate on. You have amazing armor repair capability but you put a penalty on yourself with the shield extenders. And another fact has beeing proven in that vid that dropships take only 55% damage from swarms regardless if its shield or armor. Why? Well the guy in the vid had a advanced swarm launcher (5 missiles) so he would do 2145HP damage against armor (basically killing you with alpha damage). However when you where into armor you had around 200 shields and 1700 armor. All 5 missiles did hit and you dropped down to 1072HP armor. So the swarm did effectively "only" a whopping 900HP damage against you. The main thing that kills dropships are forgeguns which deal exactly 100% damage. Which makes it the only true choice to take dropships down. That beeing sayd your dropship pilots had still the easy mode on versus swarm launchers. Oh and for the people who didnt noticed. He was fighting 2 swarm launchers not just 1 and he still survived.
this is pretty much all wrong. I really do not have the time to dissect it. So I'll leave it at all wrong. Are you even talking about DUST? |
Blaze Ashra
Bragian Order Amarr Empire
10
|
Posted - 2013.09.24 23:52:00 -
[14] - Quote
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: this...
Undo Judge Undo. Don't get this thread locked up or derailed. Please, I'm begging you undo. |
Spycrab Potato
Hold-Your-Fire
489
|
Posted - 2013.09.24 23:53:00 -
[15] - Quote
I LOVE it. I thought you would just be another QQuer, but low and behold you are a level headed individual! |
Judge Rhadamanthus
Seraphim Auxiliaries
440
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 00:01:00 -
[16] - Quote
Blaze Ashra wrote:Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: this...
Undo Judge Undo. Don't get this thread locked up or derailed. Please, I'm begging you undo.
You are right. it's 1 in the morning. fixed.
|
Blaze Ashra
Bragian Order Amarr Empire
13
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 00:07:00 -
[17] - Quote
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:Blaze Ashra wrote:Judge Rhadamanthus wrote: this...
Undo Judge Undo. Don't get this thread locked up or derailed. Please, I'm begging you undo. You are right. it's 1 in the morning. fixed.
It's still up. Just edit it and type nvm.
Also it's a great idea. added a link to this thread from here. |
Django Quik
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
1515
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 00:13:00 -
[18] - Quote
Great idea - though I'd go for another colour other than green because that's pretty close to squad colour. Maybe have him flash bright red. Vehicles could also have a similar thing that tells them whenever a forge gunner is charging too (but only vehicles).
Bright Cloud wrote:Counted the amount of volleys he took without exploding. A whopping 5 volleys from swarms and the 6th he sponged with the speed of the dropships. Tell me how many swarms would a tank take before blowing up these days? Probably around 5~6 and thats the max. I've unloaded full ammo on dropships before that have managed to survive due to skillful maneuvering and really good fittings. I also earlier had a madrugar take 8 adv swarms with 2 cmp dmg mods in quick succession before dieing. It's not impossible to make sturdy vehicles in Uprising but you need to be a damn good pilot too. |
Judge Rhadamanthus
Seraphim Auxiliaries
440
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 00:20:00 -
[19] - Quote
Spkr4theDead wrote:Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:I thought rather than just pointing out issues, I would try to offer a solution. So from a dropship POV, although would be great for tanks too; here is a video where i added graphics to a real fight with a swarmer to show my suggestions to fix the radar and HUD to make it fairer. Not the total solution but part of it. What do you think community and what you you think DEVs? Remember to set it to 720p The Video But that's not fair! You can't expect infantry to actually live with being seen on the map because they're locking on to you, could you? How could you suggest actually giving pilots a buff!? In all seriousness, this is a wonderful idea. I support it fully. Would help too when I don't have a scanner and someone is behind me.
Thank you. I think it would also add a dimension of thought to swarming a vehicle. Sure you can lock on at 300m but you give your position away and allow the pilot to share your location with the squad. Plus it allows the tank/dropship more time to act/evade if you lock on too far away. Adds an element of risk and reward. |
ratamaq doc
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
82
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 00:42:00 -
[20] - Quote
Synbot wrote:If these swarm missiles track vehicles by radar signature instead of heat signature, rather letting dropships shoot out radio frequencies
The words you are looking for are Chaff and Jammers. Along with Flares for heat seekers, chaff and Jammers are part of a typical aircraft counter measure system. Chaff is pretty much shredded tin foil that will return a massive signature, Jammers are little balls that actually emit radio waves to confuse active radar guided warheads. |
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Fire of Prometheus
DUST University Ivy League
440
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 00:43:00 -
[21] - Quote
I like this idea but how would it work if you aren't facing the swarmer? Would there be a warning lock sound? Or would an icon pop up on the side of the screen? |
GREEN DEATH21
Subsonic Synthesis Alpha Wolf Pack
10
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 00:45:00 -
[22] - Quote
Yeah, this is a great idea, but I also think with your idea they should maybe add a swarms symbol on your radar, you you know where the hell they are at, I mean our jets today have warning alarms and radars that see missiles, so why dont they have it in the future with blasters and lazers and **** lol! |
Princeps Marcellus
Expert Intervention Caldari State
241
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 00:46:00 -
[23] - Quote
I might add a suggestion -- make the swarm missile icon on the mini radarmap thing blink. Flash green as in "******* HELL MAN WATCH OUT" |
ladwar
Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn
1693
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 00:47:00 -
[24] - Quote
adding a lock on sound as well would just make sense. |
Spkr4theDead
International-Fleet
895
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 01:23:00 -
[25] - Quote
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:Spkr4theDead wrote:Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:I thought rather than just pointing out issues, I would try to offer a solution. So from a dropship POV, although would be great for tanks too; here is a video where i added graphics to a real fight with a swarmer to show my suggestions to fix the radar and HUD to make it fairer. Not the total solution but part of it. What do you think community and what you you think DEVs? Remember to set it to 720p The Video But that's not fair! You can't expect infantry to actually live with being seen on the map because they're locking on to you, could you? How could you suggest actually giving pilots a buff!? In all seriousness, this is a wonderful idea. I support it fully. Would help too when I don't have a scanner and someone is behind me. Thank you. I think it would also add a dimension of thought to swarming a vehicle. Sure you can lock on at 300m but you give your position away and allow the pilot to share your location with the squad. Plus it allows the tank/dropship more time to act/evade if you lock on too far away. Adds an element of risk and reward. But risk while swarming vehicles is unbalanced! Why should pilots have a chance to react?! That's not fair!
If CCP puts that in, I'll be a happy little bunny nestled in my tanks. |
echo47
Sebiestor Field Sappers Minmatar Republic
79
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 01:34:00 -
[26] - Quote
+1
I think this is a great idea. Devs definitely need to take a look. |
Judge Rhadamanthus
Seraphim Auxiliaries
450
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 08:50:00 -
[27] - Quote
Fire of Prometheus wrote:I like this idea but how would it work if you aren't facing the swarmer? Would there be a warning lock sound? Or would an icon pop up on the side of the screen?
I show you my idea on that in the video at 2:17 (link to that time code) Since i am not facing him and he is launching rockets he is marked in green on the radar.
But I think anyone shooting rockets should be marked like that even if they are not shooting at me. My ship would be designed to detect missiles but could not tell if they were aimed at me. That way it helps swarmers asif there are two fireing but only one is shooting me i don't know which one it is. This adds teamwork and some defence against being painted by my ship. |
pegasis prime
BIG BAD W0LVES
1034
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 09:01:00 -
[28] - Quote
I like this idea but think it should be a passive skill attached to the vehicle skill tree. Possibky increasing the range and time on radar per levle. |
Judge Rhadamanthus
Seraphim Auxiliaries
451
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 09:09:00 -
[29] - Quote
pegasis prime wrote:I like this idea but think it should be a passive skill attached to the vehicle skill tree. Possibly increasing the range and time on radar per level.
And perhaps a similar skill for swarmers, or a module that reduces a vehicle's ability to detect them. |
pegasis prime
BIG BAD W0LVES
1034
|
Posted - 2013.09.25 09:17:00 -
[30] - Quote
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:pegasis prime wrote:I like this idea but think it should be a passive skill attached to the vehicle skill tree. Possibly increasing the range and time on radar per level. And perhaps a similar skill for swarmers, or a module that reduces a vehicle's ability to detect them.
Well if you read the description on the swarm launcher it dose state that the missiles are designed to combat basic counter mesures vehicles at the moment have no counter mesures. This woukd be the first . So it would already be balanced should it be implemented.
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