DUST Search - Keyboard and Mouse vs. Dual Shock 3

xxwhitedevilxx M wrote:

Himiko Kuronaga wrote:

xxwhitedevilxx M wrote:

Quote:

- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZi22yS92rA
- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5EtYn0jILM
- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLMKNpHbopw
- http://www.rahulsood.com/2010/07/console-gamers-get-killed-against-pc.html

I can still continue. If you don't believe me, maybe you'll trust them.
Dust is a ps3 f2p exclusive. Giving ds3 such a disadvantage (among with the fact that sensitivity on ds3 is so damn low) will only make ps3 players leave.

My opinion is that Keyboard and Mouse should not be allowed on a ps3 game, or at least, should be balanced (at the moment it's not).

What's your opinion?
*no rage, "git gud scrub" etc please*

Every other gaming community and genre in existence allows third party control types in competition and casual play alike. It does not matter if they are superior or inferior. The only strictly banned devices are ones that literally play the game for you with pre-programmed inputs.

Console FPS community needs to get with the times about this issue. You guys are not moving the industry forward with this draconic attitude.

You're absolutely right, but why penalizing ds3 with such a low sensitivity too? and why such a slow rotation speed? a 100/100 here is like 50/50 on MAG and 10/10 on BF3...

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Jaysyn Larrisen OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 65	Posted - 2013.09.13 03:57:00 - [31] - Quote Saxbrin Shain wrote: I was a hardcore KB+M gamer when I was younger, and this all but destroyed my mousing wrist. I've since switched to trackballs and digitizer tablets just to be able to work through the week. I can only game with controllers now. As long as it doesn't give them too great of an advantage, I don't care if people use KB+M to play a console game GÇö I simply can't. Ok...did you just site a video game "sports injury"? We're gonna have to start putting Dust on ESPN Ocho for the next tournament.
Ayures II Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 282	Posted - 2013.09.13 04:00:00 - [32] - Quote We're not the ones with aimbots...
DootDoot Forty-Nine Fedayeen Minmatar Republic 36	Posted - 2013.09.13 04:00:00 - [33] - Quote xxwhitedevilxx M wrote: hackerzilla wrote: Right now DS3 is king because of aim assist and auto aim They tuned it down hard, now it just worsen your aim. Pretty much called yourself out there... Its instant noticeable to anyone who does a majority of their own aiming... its literally like a toggled hack i just have to give basic input's to get result's from... "I can barely notice AA you guys are just QQ" "Aim assist doesn't move your aim what are you talking about?!?!" can go on forever about the oblivious people talking about training wheel's being needed to compete in a multiplayer game where loss's have real impact on personal wealth. Go back to your bubblegum shooter where you think that 50 bux bought into a title should give you a reason to kill someone that is just better then you, not your own ability and your fine with that. Me personally? I want to get to the point where my personal skill can kill people in a gunfight Vs Chicagocubsforever and Regnyum and all those bastardly Djinn's.... I Don't need their skill dulled by some aim assist when i get there... i want it me vs them.... Not Me = aim assist + them + aim assist... its the stupidest concept defended by people who can't aim....
xxwhitedevilxx M Maphia Clan Corporation CRONOS. 613	Posted - 2013.09.13 04:04:00 - [34] - Quote hackerzilla wrote: xxwhitedevilxx M wrote: hackerzilla wrote: Right now DS3 is king because of aim assist and auto aim They tuned it down hard, now it just worsen your aim. Really? I just switched over to controller an hour ago and the AI and AA are extremely noticeable... Only noticeable with laser for me. AA keep "track" (not magnetism) for much less time (let's say a second or two), while it's tracking you adjust your aim with much lower sensitivity, but suddenly it goes off and you're aiming elsewhere.
McFurious TeamPlayers EoN. 361	Posted - 2013.09.13 04:20:00 - [35] - Quote I'm fine with DS3 having aim assist. Just give me back Chromosome mouse aiming. Mouse aiming has been wonky ever since Uprising. You got it right once before already CCP, so just go back to that.
Beld Errmon Evocatius 858	Posted - 2013.09.13 04:27:00 - [36] - Quote McFurious wrote: I'm fine with DS3 having aim assist. Just give me back Chromosome mouse aiming. This a thousand times this, I could kick arse on foot back then, kicking arse now on foot is rare.
xxwhitedevilxx M Maphia Clan Corporation CRONOS. 613	Posted - 2013.09.13 04:27:00 - [37] - Quote DootDoot wrote: xxwhitedevilxx M wrote: hackerzilla wrote: Right now DS3 is king because of aim assist and auto aim They tuned it down hard, now it just worsen your aim. Pretty much called yourself out there... Its instant noticeable to anyone who does a majority of their own aiming... its literally like a toggled hack i just have to give basic input's to get result's from... "I can barely notice AA you guys are just QQ" "Aim assist doesn't move your aim what are you talking about?!?!" can go on forever about the oblivious people talking about training wheel's being needed to compete in a multiplayer game where loss's have real impact on personal wealth. Go back to your bubblegum shooter where you think that 50 bux bought into a title should give you a reason to kill someone that is just better then you, not your own ability and your fine with that. Me personally? I want to get to the point where my personal skill can kill people in a gunfight Vs Chicagocubsforever and Regnyum and all those bastardly Djinn's.... I Don't need their skill dulled by some aim assist when i get there... i want it me vs them.... Not Me = aim assist + them + aim assist... its the stupidest concept defended by people who can't aim.... I was giving you a great reasoning, but then...why should i do that? it's like talking to a wall. You want a fair fight? ok then, no aa and no other support except ds3, shall we?
xxwhitedevilxx M Maphia Clan Corporation CRONOS. 613	Posted - 2013.09.13 04:29:00 - [38] - Quote McFurious wrote: I'm fine with DS3 having aim assist. Just give me back Chromosome mouse aiming. Mouse aiming has been wonky ever since Uprising. You got it right once before already CCP, so just go back to that. I'm actually not fine with AA. What I think is that it's needed because tracking with a ds3 is sht.
Doc Noah Algintal Core Gallente Federation 554	Posted - 2013.09.13 04:46:00 - [39] - Quote Assuming CCP plans to give full proper functionality to kb/m, analog controllers wont even be in the same league. Proper kb/m would mean: -More diverse sensitivity options -Customizable keybinds -Removal of the gamepad emulator and allowing raw mouse input -Better compatability with PS3 -Removal of max suit turn speed (not sure if this still exists but I imagine a kb/m user can still turn pretty fast or even spin 360 in a fraction of a second) Game developers themselves admit that, even if they could, they would never put console users against PC users (something CCP cant figure out why yet) because it wouldnt be fair. The fact that every console shooter has an aim assist speaks volumes in itself. This thread doesnt even ask a proper question as the answer is already clear.
McFurious TeamPlayers EoN. 363	Posted - 2013.09.13 04:53:00 - [40] - Quote Bethhy wrote: PS4 is fully KB/M supported.... People already use http://www.penguinunitedstore.com/products/Eagle-Eye-Converter-for-Playstation-3.html so its not like it really changes much having the kb/m supported. Its nice of CCP to allow someone to use their preferred peripheral on a game without having to go out and spend 60 bux though. Has anyone tried the Eagle Eye with Dust? I'm wondering how it performs compared to Dust's current KBM controls.

xxwhitedevilxx M Maphia Clan Corporation CRONOS. 613	Posted - 2013.09.13 04:56:00 - [41] - Quote Doc Noah wrote: Assuming CCP plans to give full proper functionality to kb/m, analog controllers wont even be in the same league. Proper kb/m would mean: -More diverse sensitivity options -Customizable keybinds -Removal of the gamepad emulator and allowing raw mouse input -Better compatability with PS3 -Removal of max suit turn speed (not sure if this still exists but I imagine a kb/m user can still turn pretty fast or even spin 360 in a fraction of a second) Game developers themselves admit that, even if they could, they would never put console users against PC users (something CCP cant figure out why yet) because it wouldnt be fair. The fact that every console shooter has an aim assist speaks volumes in itself. This thread doesnt even ask a proper question as the answer is already clear. It's a game design fault, up to now, they can't change their tack, because any decision they make will make a certain group of people unhappy.
KA24DERT Pure Innocence. EoN. 96	Posted - 2013.09.13 05:10:00 - [42] - Quote xxwhitedevilxx M wrote: Quote: - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZi22yS92rA - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5EtYn0jILM - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLMKNpHbopw - http://www.rahulsood.com/2010/07/console-gamers-get-killed-against-pc.html I can still continue. If you don't believe me, maybe you'll trust them. Dust is a ps3 f2p exclusive. Giving ds3 such a disadvantage (among with the fact that sensitivity on ds3 is so damn low) will only make ps3 players leave. My opinion is that Keyboard and Mouse should not be allowed on a ps3 game, or at least, should be balanced (at the moment it's not). What's your opinion? no rage, "git gud scrub" etc please You should send your opinion to Sony, and have them remove the mouse drivers from the PS3. Let me know how that goes. CCP should expose all the DS3 and KB/M settings via an in-game control panel and let players customize settings for their preferred input device. They should NOT however let the game assist the aim for anybody.
Rei Shepard Spectre II 561	Posted - 2013.09.13 06:17:00 - [43] - Quote xxwhitedevilxx M wrote: Quote: - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZi22yS92rA - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5EtYn0jILM - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLMKNpHbopw - http://www.rahulsood.com/2010/07/console-gamers-get-killed-against-pc.html I can still continue. If you don't believe me, maybe you'll trust them. Dust is a ps3 f2p exclusive. Giving ds3 such a disadvantage (among with the fact that sensitivity on ds3 is so damn low) will only make ps3 players leave. My opinion is that Keyboard and Mouse should not be allowed on a ps3 game, or at least, should be balanced (at the moment it's not). What's your opinion? no rage, "git gud scrub" etc please KBM controls on Dust are a shadow of what they are on a PC shooter, the PS3 suffers from low FPS, stuttering, skipping then Dust adds Hit Box issues, sluggish Virtual controls overlayed on the KBM (yes your DS3 is virtually being layed over our KBM input) so in essence we are using a KBM to control a DS3 that then controls our characters movement and actions causing input delays. If i wanted to get any type of feel to this game ihad to play in 576p for all of Chromosone up to 1.4. On a PC shooter, i almost never miss a single shot, with the delays going on here i can't keep my crosshairs over a target and normally i can follow and track a moving target even if is behind a wall and keeps its current heading and speed. All of this is impossible here, now you guys get Aim Assist witch allows me who never played with a DS3 to go 43/3 mind you, ive swapped back to KBM and i am going 30+/5 consistently, but i do better with a control i cant play with. Thats 20 years of KBM speaking, beaten by 1 day of DS3, there is something still very wrong about KBM here... But hey whatever makes you feel better at night, right ?
hgghyujh Expert Intervention Caldari State 117	Posted - 2013.09.14 07:55:00 - [44] - Quote so you used the point of view of pc gamers that they hate controllers for your argument that kbm is op??? hell even level cap wasn't saying that. all he said was kbm have a lower barrier of entry. in the end i'll agree that ccp needs to speed cap kb/m but they need to fix the way they do it, throwing away mouse input earlier then two turns in is stupid. any half way decent mouse knows how far he turned and will attempt to compensate for it with or with out visual cues but they can only do that if the mouse input is consistent.
xxwhitedevilxx M Maphia Clan Corporation CRONOS. 639	Posted - 2013.09.14 08:04:00 - [45] - Quote hgghyujh wrote: so you used the point of view of pc gamers that they hate controllers for your argument that kbm is op??? Not really, i just used reviews made by others (maybe more "prepared" than me) to validate my point. It's the same "beef" happening on FFXIV ARR forums; people are not accepting ds3 healers because it's a "disadvantage". But that's not really a problem because FFIV is a computer game ported to ps3, and anyway you can still play well with any other class except healer. Now, on Dust514, it's an fps and a ps3 exclusive, why the sudden need of a kb/m support? Didn't you guys recognize that this is repelling, among with really bad DS3 feeling PS3 players from this game?
Vin Vicious Capital Acquisitions LLC Public Disorder. 447	Posted - 2013.09.14 08:33:00 - [46] - Quote If kb/m is so much better than DS3 then use a kb/m Incoming "but but this is on a console, so only DS3 should be used" Whiny comment That's cool, you can also use a controller on a computer too. It's your fault your using the less "superior" input device Don't bring a knife to a gun fight The day kb/m support is gone is the day this game dies FYI Ill bet Vin Vicious on it
xxwhitedevilxx M Maphia Clan Corporation CRONOS. 644	Posted - 2013.09.14 08:36:00 - [47] - Quote Vin Vicious wrote: If kb/m is so much better than DS3 then use a kb/m Incoming "but but this is on a console, so only DS3 should be used" Whiny comment That's cool, you can also use a controller on a computer too. It's your fault your using the less "superior" input device Don't bring a knife to a gun fight The day kb/m support is gone is the day this game dies FYI Ill bet Vin Vicious on it Simply? Never used Kb/m to play any game. As many other PS3 gamers. It would take ages before PS3 players get used to it, and istead of "adapting or die" people just left. That's why.
CommanderBolt A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S. 283	Posted - 2013.09.14 09:02:00 - [48] - Quote xxwhitedevilxx M wrote: Himiko Kuronaga wrote: xxwhitedevilxx M wrote: Quote: - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZi22yS92rA - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5EtYn0jILM - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLMKNpHbopw - http://www.rahulsood.com/2010/07/console-gamers-get-killed-against-pc.html I can still continue. If you don't believe me, maybe you'll trust them. Dust is a ps3 f2p exclusive. Giving ds3 such a disadvantage (among with the fact that sensitivity on ds3 is so damn low) will only make ps3 players leave. My opinion is that Keyboard and Mouse should not be allowed on a ps3 game, or at least, should be balanced (at the moment it's not). What's your opinion? no rage, "git gud scrub" etc please Every other gaming community and genre in existence allows third party control types in competition and casual play alike. It does not matter if they are superior or inferior. The only strictly banned devices are ones that literally play the game for you with pre-programmed inputs. Console FPS community needs to get with the times about this issue. You guys are not moving the industry forward with this draconic attitude. You're absolutely right, but why penalizing ds3 with such a low sensitivity too? and why such a slow rotation speed? a 100/100 here is like 50/50 on MAG and 10/10 on BF3... I play with a KB/M, however I was playind DUST with my little brother yesterday and he said, first thing, why is the sensitvity so low? So I checked the options for the controller and found to my surprise that us was at full sensitivity! It seems full sensitivity on the controller needs to be higher.
straya fox CybinSect 8	Posted - 2013.09.14 09:11:00 - [49] - Quote bolsh lee wrote: Wait so how is kb/m superior ever since Uprising the KB/M has blown in the sensitivity and responsiveness category ? DS3 has aim assist still, whats all this about aim assist being gone ? I played today and AA was still sucking my cross hairs towards my targets like whoa..! you lie bro.
Banning Hammer Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 1402	Posted - 2013.09.14 09:18:00 - [50] - Quote I been using the mouse for YEARS, asking me to use the DS3 is like asking me to learn how to walk again. You can't teach an old dog new tricks.

Spectral Clone The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 227	Posted - 2013.09.14 09:19:00 - [51] - Quote Are you still whining about this? I dont think CCP will remove support for mouse and keyboard. They have added it to have an unique game on the PS3.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 4000	Posted - 2013.09.14 10:05:00 - [52] - Quote Doc Noah wrote: Assuming CCP plans to give full proper functionality to kb/m, analog controllers wont even be in the same league. Proper kb/m would mean: -More diverse sensitivity options -Customizable keybinds -Removal of the gamepad emulator and allowing raw mouse input -Better compatability with PS3 -Removal of max suit turn speed (not sure if this still exists but I imagine a kb/m user can still turn pretty fast or even spin 360 in a fraction of a second) Game developers themselves admit that, even if they could, they would never put console users against PC users (something CCP cant figure out why yet) because it wouldnt be fair. The fact that every console shooter has an aim assist speaks volumes in itself. This thread doesnt even ask a proper question as the answer is already clear. Cut the "removal of max turn speed" point, and this is EXACTLY what I want to see on KB/M controls. For Sixaxis, we need a lot of tuning up of controls as well, including controller remapping (it's just as important for many of us as it is for KB/M players). And NOT just presets, ACTUAL custom remapping. If you need an example, Armored Core V has probably the best controller remapping options around. Do what From Software did. And the same request I keep making - OPTIONAL disabling of turn acceleration. If I don't want it, I shouldn't have it forced on me.
Knight Soiaire Better Hide R Die 2419	Posted - 2013.09.14 11:27:00 - [53] - Quote Lol. The classic "He was using a KB/M!" excuse for sucking. Git gud! Some of the best players are DS3 users.
Rogue Saint Science For Death The Shadow Eclipse 163	Posted - 2013.09.14 11:28:00 - [54] - Quote Patrick57 wrote: the grenade button on the kb/m is an awkward place You can use X or G.
Rastael Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy 2	Posted - 2013.09.14 11:41:00 - [55] - Quote I have bought a ps3 only for dust 514. I play dust 514 only because kb+m is supported. wanna petition to remove kbm support? Then have to refund . From 1.4 kbm is harder to play with (if not impossible, e.g. drop ship) and with ds3 aim assist the balance is even worste. Cant even sniper properly anymore with kbm now and so ive got over 1m of completely useless skill. Parcondicio: remove ds3 and kbm support.. how does that ps move works?
BARDAS DUST University Ivy League 470	Posted - 2013.09.14 12:30:00 - [56] - Quote On a PS3? The controller obviously. Keyboard and Mouse have no place in a console game unless it plans on forever being a casual shooter. Hardcore tourneys will never happen when there is no level playing field. If this was a PC game I would feel differently but its not so I don't.
Csikszent Mihalyi DUST University Ivy League 181	Posted - 2013.09.14 12:50:00 - [57] - Quote Well first of all, DUST has mouse support and whatever you think about that decision, removing it now would probably do more harm than good. As somebody who grew up with KB/M on PC games, when we used to laugh about anybody attempting to play with a joystick, I find it very hard to believe that sticks can be competitive. However, I have seen some impressive COD gameplay with sticks, so perhaps the gap isn't necessarily as huge as it used to be. That said, while I'm not an expert on stick controls, they do seem pretty bad to me in DUST. Part of the issue might just be the large deadzone of the DS3, which isn't known to be the greatest controller for FPS. The DS4 should improve the situation quite a bit. But also, max sensitivity is really low, and there is very little acceleration. I see people turn a LOT faster in COD, without losing a lot of accuracy. I also tried BF3 (since it came free with PS+), and noticed that I could turn a lot faster even at medium sensitivity settings, while still having some control for fine aiming by making only minor stick adjustments. Yes, the exponential acceleration is hard to get used to, but I don't understand why CCP isn't going down that route if it clearly works for other popular console FPS. Then again, like I said, I don't know much about gamepad controls... As for the mouse controls, it's no secret that I believe they are perfectly fine (whenever the game runs smoothly). I think one reason so many people think they suck is that they are only used to using the mouse on PC games, without realising how crappy 30 FPS really are (with vsync...). Yes I am sensitive to it too, and it's annoying, but saying that mouse controls are gimped is such hyperbole. While we can't do super fast instant twitching, neither can the DS3, and a good mouse player is still going to have better accuracy. Also the insinuation that ADS sensitivity is now higher than hip fire is pretty stupid, since it can be easily refuted by doing a full turn with and without ADS and comparing how fast your mouse moved (if it didn't move far enough to be measured, your sensitivity is too high to play properly anyway...). ADS was super slow in 1.3 to the point of being unusable, so now that it's fixed, it's understandably a huge shock for those who got used to it. It probably would have been smarter for CCP to make this change at the same time as introducing separate sensitivity settings to ease the transition, but anyway... The new settings are definitely the better default. I don't deny that I have an advantage thanks to KB/M, but I also think that the mouse is pretty much at the limit of what's possible now (without increasing FPS), while the DS3 still has a lot of room for improvements. Ultimately I think it's cool that we can choose our favourite input device. There is no such thing as a fair fight in DUST anyway, so as long as mouse users aren't completely walking all over everybody else (which I don't think will happen), I think the best thing to do is to relax, enjoy the game, and do the best with what we got. And just like I respect somebody more for being good with militia gear, I also respect somebody more for being good with a gamepad. Aim assist hasn't changed anything about that for me. I wish we could all coexist in peace. :)
M McManus Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 51	Posted - 2013.09.14 13:49:00 - [58] - Quote Now that DS3 has an op aim assist kb/m needs rawinput especially compared to what the mouse is now this horrible inaccurate DS3 movement Remove aim assist or give kb/m raw input because the fact is DS3 is able to make super fine movements with aim assist and the kb/m is all over the place.. Which it wouldn't be all over the place with raw input.. For the people that say that would make the mouse OP (you must be new here) it used to be this way in chromosome when aim assist was random and you still had DS3 users out performing kb/m...
Banning Hammer Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 1414	Posted - 2013.09.14 13:55:00 - [59] - Quote M McManus wrote: Now that DS3 has an op aim assist kb/m needs rawinput especially compared to what the mouse is now this horrible inaccurate DS3 movement Remove aim assist or give kb/m raw input because the fact is DS3 is able to make super fine movements with aim assist and the kb/m is all over the place.. Which it wouldn't be all over the place with raw input.. For the people that say that would make the mouse OP (you must be new here) it used to be this way in chromosome when aim assist was random and you still had DS3 users out performing kb/m... People have forgotten how well balance aiming was in Chromosome But it just toke few Scrubs complaining about the mouse, and CCP decided to **** everything in Uprising. Funny thing is.. that we slowly returning to the same aiming balance we had in Chromosome, and the Scrubs are not even realizing what is happening.
bolsh lee Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 538	Posted - 2013.09.14 14:11:00 - [60] - Quote M McManus wrote: Now that DS3 has an op aim assist kb/m needs rawinput especially compared to what the mouse is now this horrible inaccurate DS3 movement Remove aim assist or give kb/m raw input because the fact is DS3 is able to make super fine movements with aim assist and the kb/m is all over the place.. Which it wouldn't be all over the place with raw input.. For the people that say that would make the mouse OP (you must be new here) it used to be this way in chromosome when aim assist was random and you still had DS3 users out performing kb/m... +1 the only way to balance the inputs now is give m/kb raw input, it doesn't look like aim assist is going anywhere so why continue to handicap the mouse CCP ?



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