IRL, weapon fire from militia weapons hurt like hell still.

Probably someone with a lot of SP in proficency and the aim assist on, plus the improved hit detection

So i was on my make shift scout with 153 over all health and of course it dies alot.... BUT i get on my heavy with 1047 over all health. My hmg needs to be reloaded so i start on the endless process of reloading it, when a redberry pops up. i switch to my advanced submachine gun. Mind you all that no other redberrys were presently around. The redberry starts to shoot before i started... and it killed my 1047 health heavy in 2 SECONDS. And what mysterious weapon of mass destruction killed me that quick? A D@MN MILITIA ASSAULT RIFLE. IT WAS A COMPLETE STARTER FIT SUIT. I would love to have someone try to explain how it is ive dumped so much d@mn SP into my character but no matter what i do the militia is still better then me? whats the point then to strive for proto gear if that much shield and armor is takin away by a starter rifle

So all this taught me is the game is worse off then i thought. CCP listened to the wrong f*cking people on these boards... they HAD a good game, and now are they are working together to dig the biggest hole they can to bury themselves.... it honestly is to bad.

IRL, weapon fire from militia weapons hurt like hell still.

So i was on my make shift scout with 153 over all health and of course it dies alot.... BUT i get on my heavy with 1047 over all health. My hmg needs to be reloaded so i start on the endless process of reloading it, when a redberry pops up. i switch to my advanced submachine gun. Mind you all that no other redberrys were presently around. The redberry starts to shoot before i started... and it killed my 1047 health heavy in 2 SECONDS. And what mysterious weapon of mass destruction killed me that quick? A D@MN MILITIA ASSAULT RIFLE. IT WAS A COMPLETE STARTER FIT SUIT. I would love to have someone try to explain how it is ive dumped so much d@mn SP into my character but no matter what i do the militia is still better then me? whats the point then to strive for proto gear if that much shield and armor is takin away by a starter rifle

You see that guy that killed you in the report. You don't see the guys that hurt you too. Several times this week I've been in what I thought was 1 v 1 and end up being killed by someone I didn't see.

IRL, weapon fire from militia weapons hurt like hell still.

IRL, weapon fire from militia weapons hurt like hell still.

I love when CPMs come on here and always talk about real life... ok lets talk about real life...

1) holy sh!t nades kill people easily in RL
2) get a friend, on gets AR one gets MD fire at eachother and see which wins in RL
3) Whens the last time you used a Spawn Link in RL?
4) Please relate to me what a true RL forge gun is
5) Where is the closet CRU to your home?

i did that for 2 reasons.

1) A VIDEO GAME ISNT REAL LIFE
2) that had nothing to do with my post, i was wondering how its possible for a starter fit to take out a heavy in any aspect much less a tanked heavy...

So i was on my make shift scout with 153 over all health and of course it dies alot.... BUT i get on my heavy with 1047 over all health. My hmg needs to be reloaded so i start on the endless process of reloading it, when a redberry pops up. i switch to my advanced submachine gun. Mind you all that no other redberrys were presently around. The redberry starts to shoot before i started... and it killed my 1047 health heavy in 2 SECONDS. And what mysterious weapon of mass destruction killed me that quick? A D@MN MILITIA ASSAULT RIFLE. IT WAS A COMPLETE STARTER FIT SUIT. I would love to have someone try to explain how it is ive dumped so much d@mn SP into my character but no matter what i do the militia is still better then me? whats the point then to strive for proto gear if that much shield and armor is takin away by a starter rifle

While this is the case a lot of the time, we've been seeing it in places and engagements where it clearly 1v1 - enclosed spaces etc. enough for me to think its not the third party doing the damage and the starter suit getting the kill.

Base/militia AR (before bonus damage) does 425 DPS. It can pump out over 1500 damage before you have to reload it. If you have a damage mod, any points in the AR spec skill or get any head shots you just increase the damage it can do.
And with hit detection actually detecting the shots this is very much possible.

Edit: Because of clip size difference, the militia does 1564 damage per clip and the basic AR does 2040.

Sure. Let's say you fight a merc that has spent 1 million SP into AR. If they have AR Proficiency 3 (not counting resistances) rounding for simplicity:

Militia Assault Rifle: 34 x 1.09 = 37 damage per round x 48 rounds = 1776 damage per clip. 12.5 rounds per second = 462 HP/s. Just over two seconds to take down a Heavy. Maybe three with resistances. Not even a full clip.

GEK-38: 35.7 x 1.09 = 39 x 60 = 2340 per clip. 12.5 x 39 = 487 HP/s. Not a huge difference but could mean the difference between winning and losing.

Duvolle: 37.4 x 1.09 = 41 x 60 = 2460 per clip. 12.5 x 41 = 512 HP/s. About a bullet and half better per second than militia for a whole lot more money and fitting.

Some combination of hit detection and aim assistance means that more of those rounds are landing on target. A Heavy has a nice fat hit box which makes them easy targets too. I've had plenty of fights in 1.4 where both of us are actively trying to avoid being hit and with quite a bit of success so I disagee with the aimbot claims. If either party ends up reloading then not all shots landed considering the potential damage per clip.

Still, Time-To-Kill is much shorter if you are face to face with your opponent. I think the game is finally working as CCP intended.

Mate, I'm fully skilled in armour and shield, maxed out AR and 5 other weapons and and have been playing since CB. When 26 million sp says something is different and bad, maybe you should put your math away and listen.

Here it is: theoretical dps is always better than actual dps. While your numbers are pretty, they do not describe the mechanics of the issue at hand.

TTK has been taken out back and put down. A scout is made of tisue paper, and heavys are just slightly beafyer than a logi.

Whoever starts shooting first wins, and no, all you "get in cover" idiots are just ignorant, because if you can shoot them you can be shot back, the Aim assist sticky will lock onto just your head or arm just as well as your entire body.

I'm a closed beta vet with only 21 million SP. Probably due to work getting in the way. I guess my opinion isn't worth as much. Can we finish the epeen waving and move on with more analysis?

We have to start with numbers before we can judge what is wrong otherwise we're just talking about squishy feelings. Wolfman kept saying we should wait until 1.4 before suggesting rebalance on anything. He knew changes to hit detection and aim assist would change the game. If a player can apply the majority of the maximum damage of a weapon then TTK is going to be below three seconds for any engagement. I agree that seems short but maybe CCP wanted it to be faster and more brutal than it had been.

So, how do you suggest that we fix it?

Does it need to be fixed?

Should CCP scale back aim assist? Should players miss more than they currently are?

Should AR damage output be reduced? How much? What about other weapons?

How short should TTK be in theory, in an optimal situation? I think this may be the key question. How long should a 1 versus 1 engagement last if the players have no cover? 3 seconds? 5? 10?

I'm sure there are more questions we can ask about the current situation and I encourage it. I've considered doing charts comparing maximum weapon damage at a variety of ranges but CCP still hasn't delivered range data which makes it difficult. I'd like to see if the AR should be the king of all engagements or if we are just meeting in its optimal all the time. I have prototype in SMG and it shreds people in close range too.

Fair enough, stowing epeen. The point I was attempting to make is that the available numbers on the weapons and AA are not the full picture. Lacking the full model, all we can do is speculate and rely on anecdotal evidence.

If a starter fit gets the drop on me I die before I can react. If I get the drop on a starter fit I figure my odds are about 50-50. I'm not the greatest player, but I'm better than that....or was.

So i was on my make shift scout with 153 over all health and of course it dies alot.... BUT i get on my heavy with 1047 over all health. My hmg needs to be reloaded so i start on the endless process of reloading it, when a redberry pops up. i switch to my advanced submachine gun. Mind you all that no other redberrys were presently around. The redberry starts to shoot before i started... and it killed my 1047 health heavy in 2 SECONDS. And what mysterious weapon of mass destruction killed me that quick? A D@MN MILITIA ASSAULT RIFLE. IT WAS A COMPLETE STARTER FIT SUIT. I would love to have someone try to explain how it is ive dumped so much d@mn SP into my character but no matter what i do the militia is still better then me? whats the point then to strive for proto gear if that much shield and armor is takin away by a starter rifle

Thanks.

OK, I think you've hit the true OP/FOTM item in Uprising 1.4: the Active Scanner. If you know where the enemy is then you can setup the encounter to your best advantage. It doesn't matter if they are running full proto or militia. I run lone wolf and use the scanner. I know when to run from blobs and where individuals are so that I'm ready to shoot when they appear. If I'm jumped because it took me took long to kill someone then I'm dead.

Combat awareness now trumps gear in almost every case.

I guess the next question is should a person consider themselves dead if surprised? Shouldn't shields and armor give them at least a little reaction time?

Range amp is at V, precision enhancement is at IV, and dampening is at V. Should I be getting surprised? I wouldn't have thought so.

Range amp is at V, precision enhancement is at IV, and dampening is at V. Should I be getting surprised? I wouldn't have thought so.

Not true. The game was actually bad in 1.3.

Poor hit detection
Too many AFKers (compared to now)
Not that many faction contracts
No functional aim-assist
Graphics were needing improvement
Maps were unbalanced

1.4 fixed most of that.
Way better hit detection
Not that many AFKers
More faction contracts
A functioning aim assist (still needs tuning)
Graphics are much more crisp, clear, and load faster
The new maps are well balanced to prevent snipers from dominating every match

The only way to take down that much HP in 2 seconds is with continuous headshots. Without headshots it would only do 850 damage in those 2 seconds.

dont forget they militia damage mod on that starter fit

The only way to take down that much HP in 2 seconds is with continuous headshots. Without headshots it would only do 850 damage in those 2 seconds.
2 seconds is about 12 shots (all having to hit). 12 shots is a lot of bullets.

Hit detection is still crap for everything but the full auto weapons
AFKers - fair point
faction contracts are the same, they go by EVE, not dust
aim assist should never be in an FPS game, it makes it ****
graphics are a moot point, they need to fix core mechanics and **** off with the graphics
new maps are nice, should of been working on play testing bugs though.

Not to mention the old chromo hardcrash bug is back.

How the hell did you get elected? Jesus christ.

He was not elected.

Well, I mean, are you gonna argue with the son of god? I wouldn't... Might turn me into a fish sandwich.

Elected, selected... the point is, it was a colossal mistake.

This has been happening a lot we've noticed. Starter suits worn by players you've never heard of in NPC corps ripping up advanced and proto suits in no time whatsoever. 2-3 seconds and its over.

Starter fits taking out proto fits routinely, and all of a sudden after 1.4, tells me something is badly wrong here.

So i was on my make shift scout with 153 over all health and of course it dies alot.... BUT i get on my heavy with 1047 over all health. My hmg needs to be reloaded so i start on the endless process of reloading it, when a redberry pops up. i switch to my advanced submachine gun. Mind you all that no other redberrys were presently around. The redberry starts to shoot before i started... and it killed my 1047 health heavy in 2 SECONDS. And what mysterious weapon of mass destruction killed me that quick? A D@MN MILITIA ASSAULT RIFLE. IT WAS A COMPLETE STARTER FIT SUIT. I would love to have someone try to explain how it is ive dumped so much d@mn SP into my character but no matter what i do the militia is still better then me? whats the point then to strive for proto gear if that much shield and armor is takin away by a starter rifle

Broke game still broke.

It's ok GTA out in a week, then broke game be dead.

It makes me sad but thems the breaks.

Hit detection is still crap for everything but the full auto weapons

Nope. Shotgun hit detection is vastly improved. Also, my scrambler rifle (not the assault one) seems to hit just fine.

How the hell did you get elected? Jesus christ.

IRL, weapon fire from militia weapons hurt like hell still.

So i was on my make shift scout with 153 over all health and of course it dies alot.... BUT i get on my heavy with 1047 over all health. My hmg needs to be reloaded so i start on the endless process of reloading it, when a redberry pops up. i switch to my advanced submachine gun. Mind you all that no other redberrys were presently around. The redberry starts to shoot before i started... and it killed my 1047 health heavy in 2 SECONDS. And what mysterious weapon of mass destruction killed me that quick? A D@MN MILITIA ASSAULT RIFLE. IT WAS A COMPLETE STARTER FIT SUIT. I would love to have someone try to explain how it is ive dumped so much d@mn SP into my character but no matter what i do the militia is still better then me? whats the point then to strive for proto gear if that much shield and armor is takin away by a starter rifle

Headshots drop a heavy so fast he comes on the forums to post about it :), but seriously anyone considered he could have taken a couple to the face ?

Not real life, man if were gonna start all that my mass driver should mirror the hammer grenade launcher hmm?
Besides its not nessecarily the miltia part thats the problem, proto gives you an edge, a handicap,, not a guaranteed kill, the problem a heavy who is supoosed to be resistant to small arms fire, can be dropped in to seconds by an ar, there sure as hell is something wrong there!!

You see that guy that killed you in the report. You don't see the guys that hurt you too. Several times this week I've been in what I thought was 1 v 1 and end up being killed by someone I didn't see.

Bomb suits are not bomb proof. They're just there to make sure they have something to go bury.

Resists =/= Immune.

Small Arms are what regular non clone infantry use.

We're clone soldiers our weaponry is a league above that crap.

The standard issue Gauss Rifles given to most Caldari Army infantrymen, for example; are not powerful enough to penetrate our shields or armor and lacks smart targeting. Which is why they had to upgraded the technology to a small railgun.

Most of our guns have the safeties turned off, calibur upsized to the point they almost require vehicle mounting, radiation hazards, and deadly amounts of backscatter and pressure waves to kill most regular operators.

The HMG weighs a good 300 lbs loaded and is typically something you would have found on aircraft and more designed to shoot other aircraft down.

If by some measure you think that being in full prototype gear grants you immunity from militia weapons... I'm sorry.

Im not worried about the "immunity" im worried how a starter rifle killed a 1000+ hp heavy. whats the point of specing into the things ccp has created and givin to us, when if we do spec into them to crate a better character we get sliced through with no problem by a starter fit that we so called "upgraded" from.

and side note to you mr. cpm stay on subject with the post or dont bother typing here. i asked how it was possible, and said nothing about how i wanted immunity to militia weapons. So way to go there killer u failed twice in 1 run...

So i was on my make shift scout with 153 over all health and of course it dies alot.... BUT i get on my heavy with 1047 over all health. My hmg needs to be reloaded so i start on the endless process of reloading it, when a redberry pops up. i switch to my advanced submachine gun. Mind you all that no other redberrys were presently around. The redberry starts to shoot before i started... and it killed my 1047 health heavy in 2 SECONDS. And what mysterious weapon of mass destruction killed me that quick? A D@MN MILITIA ASSAULT RIFLE. IT WAS A COMPLETE STARTER FIT SUIT. I would love to have someone try to explain how it is ive dumped so much d@mn SP into my character but no matter what i do the militia is still better then me? whats the point then to strive for proto gear if that much shield and armor is takin away by a starter rifle

So i was on my make shift scout with 153 over all health and of course it dies alot.... BUT i get on my heavy with 1047 over all health. My hmg needs to be reloaded so i start on the endless process of reloading it, when a redberry pops up. i switch to my advanced submachine gun. Mind you all that no other redberrys were presently around. The redberry starts to shoot before i started... and it killed my 1047 health heavy in 2 SECONDS. And what mysterious weapon of mass destruction killed me that quick? A D@MN MILITIA ASSAULT RIFLE. IT WAS A COMPLETE STARTER FIT SUIT. I would love to have someone try to explain how it is ive dumped so much d@mn SP into my character but no matter what i do the militia is still better then me? whats the point then to strive for proto gear if that much shield and armor is takin away by a starter rifle

You stop spraying your big gun and out from cover pops a vet with a cooked grenade.
1 Militia locus grenade at your feet = you're almost dead before you know what's happening.

Bomb suits are not bomb proof. They're just there to make sure they have something to go bury.

Resists =/= Immune.

Small Arms are what regular non clone infantry use.

We're clone soldiers our weaponry is a league above that crap.

The standard issue Gauss Rifles given to most Caldari Army infantrymen, for example; are not powerful enough to penetrate our shields or armor and lacks smart targeting. Which is why they had to upgraded the technology to a small railgun.

Most of our guns have the safeties turned off, calibur upsized to the point they almost require vehicle mounting, radiation hazards, and deadly amounts of backscatter and pressure waves to kill most regular operators.

The HMG weighs a good 300 lbs loaded and is typically something you would have found on aircraft and more designed to shoot other aircraft down.

Well if we say 90% accuracy, 35 dmg a shot, full auto for 2 secs.

24 +ù 35 = 840 +ù 0.9 = 756

so it is safe to assume he got headshotted yes. However do the same math for 3 secs

37 +ù 35 = 1295 +ù 0.9 = 1165

he still would have fallen less than a second later, therefore I believe when he says 2secs he means 2.8secs, which still too bloody fast!!

Thats right people I just pulled maths on all you a!se's!!

Break it down barny style here.
-1047 total health
-militia assault rifle
-2 seconds to die from it

so what is the point of ever specing into a single thing if all the stuff i do spec into gets tossed aside by a starter fit?

So i was on my make shift scout with 153 over all health and of course it dies alot.... BUT i get on my heavy with 1047 over all health. My hmg needs to be reloaded so i start on the endless process of reloading it, when a redberry pops up. i switch to my advanced submachine gun. Mind you all that no other redberrys were presently around. The redberry starts to shoot before i started... and it killed my 1047 health heavy in 2 SECONDS. And what mysterious weapon of mass destruction killed me that quick? A D@MN MILITIA ASSAULT RIFLE. IT WAS A COMPLETE STARTER FIT SUIT. I would love to have someone try to explain how it is ive dumped so much d@mn SP into my character but no matter what i do the militia is still better then me? whats the point then to strive for proto gear if that much shield and armor is takin away by a starter rifle

Here is my question, were you in fact in a proto suit?

If so, why do you only have 1047 HP total?

I have 1012 with no modules.

3 Complex armor plates gives me more than 900 armor, putting my over all HP at 1400+.

I laugh at solo MLT AR scrubs the whole time I'm reloading, then proceed to shove my HMG so far up their wazoo, the bullets fly out of their mouth when I pull the trigger.

Oh dear... getting called out.

The HMG weighs a good 300 lbs loaded and is typically something you would have found on aircraft and more designed to shoot other aircraft down.

To reply to your earlier statement about real life weapons: the Dillon minigun fires the same ammo as the m16/m4 family of weapons. The dillon and m16 by virtue of having longer barrels (allowing powder to burn longer) are much better at longer ranges than the m4. Now the same could be said for a longer barreled rail gun. They operate differently but a longer barrel will add more velocity to a projectile.

Ok... Now with out being stupid and thinking your funny comment fits... Everyone go back to page one and look at what i put... does it say anywhere that i am in a proto suit? NO. so STFU and contribute to the post without having a witty retort. Watching the progression of this post, and knowing DEVS listen to you all... No wonder this game is dying out... and that goes for the "funny guy" CPM as well

so why does an AR typically beat it in battle? as an anti aircraft weapon, its range should be very long, instead of expecting a pilot to fly 20 meters from an opposing craft before firing it lol.


the M4/M16 family of rifles fires the 5.56x45 cartridge. the GE/dillon m134 fires the 7.62x51 NATO cartridge, or .308 if you prefer american designations. big difference.

-- snip explanation of Heavy insta death --