DUST Search - Nerf damage mods (read why before you flame).

Cross Atu wrote:

Nerf damage mods (read why before you flame).

When discussing infantry tank (not HAV) balance the subject of damage mods comes up a lot.
When talking about role balance and definition between Medium Frames the subject of damage mods comes up a lot.
When discussing comparative weapon balance the subject of damage mods comes up a lot.

Damage mods are widely viewed as one of the most, perhaps the most, useful/valuable module type in the game. So lets nerf them, wait, wait, donGÇÖt flame me just yet.

HereGÇÖs why:
Armor is weaker than shields right now, but it is frequently pointed out that if they were equal Armor would become superior due to the free high slots for damage mods.
Logi need high eHP to do real support work but it has been vigorously pointed out that Logi with high eHP + stacked damage mods can be GÇÿbetter slayersGÇÖ than the Assault suits, thus diminishing the role of that frame.

There are other aspects but rather than elaborating further let me address the obvious question
GÇ£How does nerfing a mod for everyone improve balance for anyone, that just keeps things the same doesnGÇÖt it?GÇ¥
Well, not quite, hereGÇÖs what I propose.

Nerf damage mods, and give Assault suits some role buff to enhance the effectiveness of damage mods fit to their suit (so they still have the same ballpark of performance from them as now), give armor much better eHP mostly via buffer (but also the other things discussed here) and let things develop.

Net effect on roles
QCQ Scouts generally do not need damage mods to get 1-2 hit kills.

Snipers would have a choice

Scouts for stealth and speed
Heavies for HP
Assaults for high Alpha damage
Logi for supplies

So snipers will be fine.

AV would have also have a choice

Scouts for stealth and speed
Heavies for HP and use of the Forge Gun
Assaults for high Alpha damage with Swarms/Plasma
Logi for supplies

Net AV balance remains approximately the same, now with greater role specialization/reason to use different frames based on play style.

Assaults get a buff to their role as skirmishers/hit and run gankers. They'll be great slayers but won't be able to "stand in the fight" much. (This will also give Assaults some reason to seriously consider armor tanking despite the possible speed implications)

Logi are able to build up meaningful eHP totals but even with stacked damage mods won't reach the dps output of a similarly built Assault suit.

Heavy will lose a little bit of dps (but Heavies can't stack damage mods the way Med Frames can anyway so this will impact them less) and will get a meaningful boost to their overall eHP. They'll still be deadly in their optimal ranges and won't be as vulnerable to sudden death via one nade toss or a 'falank-n'gank' (unless it's an assault flanker).

0.02 ISK
Cross


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Mobius Wyvern Guardian Solutions 2880	Posted - 2013.08.05 19:50:00 - [1] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Nerf damage mods (read why before you flame). When discussing infantry tank (not HAV) balance the subject of damage mods comes up a lot. When talking about role balance and definition between Medium Frames the subject of damage mods comes up a lot. When discussing comparative weapon balance the subject of damage mods comes up a lot. Damage mods are widely viewed as one of the most, perhaps the most, useful/valuable module type in the game. So lets nerf them, wait, wait, donGÇÖt flame me just yet. HereGÇÖs why: Armor is weaker than shields right now, but it is frequently pointed out that if they were equal Armor would become superior due to the free high slots for damage mods. Logi need high eHP to do real support work but it has been vigorously pointed out that Logi with high eHP + stacked damage mods can be GÇÿbetter slayersGÇÖ than the Assault suits, thus diminishing the role of that frame. There are other aspects but rather than elaborating further let me address the obvious question GÇ£How does nerfing a mod for everyone improve balance for anyone, that just keeps things the same doesnGÇÖt it?GÇ¥ Well, not quite, hereGÇÖs what I propose. Nerf damage mods, and give Assault suits some role buff to enhance the effectiveness of damage mods fit to their suit (so they still have the same ballpark of performance from them as now), give armor much better eHP mostly via buffer (but also the other things discussed here) and let things develop. Net effect on roles QCQ Scouts generally do not need damage mods to get 1-2 hit kills. Snipers would have a choice Scouts for stealth and speed Heavies for HP Assaults for high Alpha damage Logi for supplies So snipers will be fine. AV would have also have a choice Scouts for stealth and speed Heavies for HP and use of the Forge Gun Assaults for high Alpha damage with Swarms/Plasma Logi for supplies Net AV balance remains approximately the same, now with greater role specialization/reason to use different frames based on play style. Assaults get a buff to their role as skirmishers/hit and run gankers. They'll be great slayers but won't be able to "stand in the fight" much. (This will also give Assaults some reason to seriously consider armor tanking despite the possible speed implications) Logi are able to build up meaningful eHP totals but even with stacked damage mods won't reach the dps output of a similarly built Assault suit. Heavy will lose a little bit of dps (but Heavies can't stack damage mods the way Med Frames can anyway so this will impact them less) and will get a meaningful boost to their overall eHP. They'll still be deadly in their optimal ranges and won't be as vulnerable to sudden death via one nade toss or a 'falank-n'gank' (unless it's an assault flanker). 0.02 ISK Cross I'm actually still holding out hope that they might remove them completely in favor of "mods" that you equip to the weapon itself, which would eliminate the whole problem.
Mobius Wyvern Guardian Solutions 2885	Posted - 2013.08.06 07:06:00 - [2] - Quote Beren Hurin wrote: I don't get your two 'snipers have a choice sections' Also, I think my suggestion is elegant and appropriate: What you want is something viable for logibros to favor their armor resiliance, but doesn't make them better slayers necessarily. Therefore: Ancillary Armor Booster - - highslot module (has to sacrifice slots for damage mods) - Multiplies the effect of armor repair rate by 25% to 45% per module (basically like a regulator) So trading 2 highslots could effectively free up a lowslot for either a utility module or more eHP. The trade-off for resiliance would make the most sense for logibros who need it as they are scrambling around the front lines and who are already getting a good starting base armor repair rate. Armor slayers who would want to be doing high alpha damage (amarr scrambler/laser users) wouldn't want to sacrifice the damage mods for regen. Their damage is based on alpha strikes anyway, so they need to get in and out. This means HP resiliance isn't as important as buffer. My fundamental disagreement with you Cross is it seems like you want both armor and shield to be equal at close range. I think this would throw off balance on a number of levels. See my new Wu Xing post. Armor suits (high armor slot layout) should have the option of using their lowslots of eHP or speed/stealth and highslots for damage. So they get to pick 2 of those options. Armor slot logi's get a third option to use their slots for added fitting ability. Shield suits have the option of turning their abundant high slots into a either regen, buffer, or damage fit and basically can pick 2 of those. They also have the option of choosing a glass cannon fit using the limited lows for fitting. That sounds like an excellent idea. Would that work for Reactive Plating as well?