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Derp 514
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.08.05 01:54:00 -
[1] - Quote
I just started Dust 514. I have a lot of skill points saved up from when I started my account. What skills should I get and how far should I take them for a scout SMG build?
I've seen a ton of threads and youtube videos on fittings and such, but I'm still unsure about the SP allocation, so thanks in advance for any advice. Fitting recommendations are more than welcome too, to ensure I'm on the right path. |
calvin b
Molon Labe. League of Infamy
203
|
Posted - 2013.08.05 03:04:00 -
[2] - Quote
Base skills first. Armor and shields to at least three, max if you have the SP. Next CPU and PG to three. Then I would work on suit to lvl 3 at least and max the weapon to at least proficiency 3. Also work on your speed mods and hack skills or you can work on remote explosives as well. What type of build are you after? Stealth, Hacker, or infiltration. |
FATPrincess - XOXO
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
373
|
Posted - 2013.08.05 04:02:00 -
[3] - Quote
I wouldn't use a SMG as a main weapon, it blows vs shields. The scout can use a light weapon so why limit yourself? Which scout are you thinking about using? Minmatar is good because it can shield tank. Should get around 300 shield HP at proto level.
Since your main idea is to use the SMG you should get a light weapon that can complement with it. SMG has longer range than the shotgun so it's very good when you encounter enemies that out range you. Scrambler Rifles are excellent when combined with SMG to drop shields fast. Plasma cannon is another one where you'll be using your SMG a lot. It's CPU/PG heavy so it'll be difficult to fit on a scout.
I think your best bet is using the assault Scrambler Rifle because if you choose the shotgun you won't be using the SMG as much as you would like in close quarters combat. So the strategy is to drop shields first and finish off with the SMG. Get your assault SMG ASAP btw, and the ADV Scrambler Rifle should be enough. In this case scenario your rifle is your sidearm and the SMG your main, used for getting the kill.
For modules just stack shield extenders on the highs and catalyzers/shield regulators/whichever you like and most likely a CPU upgrade if you're going to use Minmatar. For Gallente it should armor tank with ferroscale plates and a armor repairer, shield energizers for the highs (it should help you recover your armor). No need for profile dampeners/enhancers because you already have them low enough. For equipment I would try the scanner to get a better view of your surroundings.
-XOXO |
Rogatien Merc
Red Star. EoN.
606
|
Posted - 2013.08.05 06:24:00 -
[4] - Quote
If you only have a few mil SP... start by getting SMG Op to IV for an assault version. You want grenadier to II for flux grenades. You want shields/armor to II (III-IV later on, shields first). You want biotics to V asap so you can get kinetic catelization and cardiac reg to III. need electronics I - III for whatever level of CPU upgrade you might need to fit your guns and engineering in case you're short PG.
get armor repair I for a basic rep. don't **** with plates early on as a scout.
now get shield extension to V for a complex extender. it's a huge % increase to EHP on low level scout suits, but may be hard to fit with advanced SMG(s). might have to just dual wield toxins or something.
decide what equipment you want to carry and get the basic version. if dual wielding advanced SMGs, might just skip this. try to get at least nanocircuitry II so you can carry a compact nanohive for grenades IMO.
NOW get light gallente suit to III so u can use the advanced light.
From there, you're on your own and everything beyond that is pretty SP intensive. I'd stick to the advanced suit for a while at this point and focus on getting SMG Op to V and proficiency III or IV if you can stand it to make those advanced assault SMGs hit like a truck. Then get grenadier III for advanced flux grenades. |
Rogatien Merc
Red Star. EoN.
606
|
Posted - 2013.08.05 06:32:00 -
[5] - Quote
FATPrincess - XOXO wrote:I wouldn't use a SMG as a main weapon, it blows vs shields. The scout can use a light weapon so why limit yourself? Which scout are you thinking about using? Minmatar is good because it can shield tank. Should get around 300 shield HP at proto level.
Since your main idea is to use the SMG you should get a light weapon that can complement with it. SMG has longer range than the shotgun so it's very good when you encounter enemies that out range you. Scrambler Rifles are excellent when combined with SMG to drop shields fast. Plasma cannon is another one where you'll be using your SMG a lot. It's CPU/PG heavy so it'll be difficult to fit on a scout.
I think your best bet is using the assault Scrambler Rifle because if you choose the shotgun you won't be using the SMG as much as you would like in close quarters combat. So the strategy is to drop shields first and finish off with the SMG. Get your assault SMG ASAP btw, and the ADV Scrambler Rifle should be enough. In this case scenario your rifle is your sidearm and the SMG your main, used for getting the kill.
For modules just stack shield extenders on the highs and catalyzers/shield regulators/whichever you like and most likely a CPU upgrade if you're going to use Minmatar. For Gallente it should armor tank with ferroscale plates and a armor repairer, shield energizers for the highs (it should help you recover your armor). No need for profile dampeners/enhancers because you already have them low enough. For equipment I would try the scanner to get a better view of your surroundings.
-XOXO I think SMG scout is viable, just very dependent on flux grenades. flux+smg leads to very fast TTK when done properly as opposed to combo with scram rifle or something (talking fractions of seconds here that matter because you can't afford to stand in front of anyone or hang out in a group of red dots too long). i prefer to dual wield SMGs on a min assault - my personal new toy - but scout works too... more speed, faster shield recharge but smaller clip and less tank. |
FATPrincess - XOXO
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
374
|
Posted - 2013.08.05 13:42:00 -
[6] - Quote
Rogatien Merc wrote:FATPrincess - XOXO wrote:I wouldn't use a SMG as a main weapon, it blows vs shields. The scout can use a light weapon so why limit yourself? Which scout are you thinking about using? Minmatar is good because it can shield tank. Should get around 300 shield HP at proto level.
Since your main idea is to use the SMG you should get a light weapon that can complement with it. SMG has longer range than the shotgun so it's very good when you encounter enemies that out range you. Scrambler Rifles are excellent when combined with SMG to drop shields fast. Plasma cannon is another one where you'll be using your SMG a lot. It's CPU/PG heavy so it'll be difficult to fit on a scout.
I think your best bet is using the assault Scrambler Rifle because if you choose the shotgun you won't be using the SMG as much as you would like in close quarters combat. So the strategy is to drop shields first and finish off with the SMG. Get your assault SMG ASAP btw, and the ADV Scrambler Rifle should be enough. In this case scenario your rifle is your sidearm and the SMG your main, used for getting the kill.
For modules just stack shield extenders on the highs and catalyzers/shield regulators/whichever you like and most likely a CPU upgrade if you're going to use Minmatar. For Gallente it should armor tank with ferroscale plates and a armor repairer, shield energizers for the highs (it should help you recover your armor). No need for profile dampeners/enhancers because you already have them low enough. For equipment I would try the scanner to get a better view of your surroundings.
-XOXO I think SMG scout is viable, just very dependent on flux grenades. flux+smg leads to very fast TTK when done properly as opposed to combo with scram rifle or something (talking fractions of seconds here that matter because you can't afford to stand in front of anyone or hang out in a group of red dots too long). i prefer to dual wield SMGs on a min assault - my personal new toy - but scout works too... more speed, faster shield recharge but smaller clip and less tank.
Flux + SMG is a deadly combo as well. Forgot to said that to the OP. OP, get flux grenades!
-XOXO
|
Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis League of Infamy
508
|
Posted - 2013.08.05 14:01:00 -
[7] - Quote
Rogatien Merc wrote: SMGs + Flux Nades = Good Idea
FATPrincess - XOXO wrote: For equipment I would try the scanner to get a better view of your surroundings.
You've chosen a challenging course, Brother. Be warned that Hard Mode is a long, frustrating path. Scouts are more SP intensive than any other infantry class, and we perform substantially worse than other infantry classes even at high SP levels. If you're keen on maintaining good stats and hope to eventually serve a combat role in Planetary Conquest, I recommend that you continue playing the role of Scout but use a medium frame (i.e. Min Assault). Here are a few statistics to consider:
- Scouts account for 2% to 5% of Dust's player base.
- Over 50% of Scouts have a lifetime KDR under 2.0.
- Over 80% of Scouts have a lifetime KDR under 3.0.
- The majority of old-school Scouts switched to medium frames after Chromosome.
- The Scout's combat handicap has progressively worsened with each release of Uprising.
- There exists no combat role wherein a Scout can outperform an appropriately equipped medium frame.
Not trying to discourage you here; only to offer fair warning. If you're up to the challenge, Scout loadouts can be a lot of fun. Should you opt to embrace Hard Mode, join the in-game channel "Scouts United" once you complete your Academy training. We'll bring you up to speed and pair you with a tutor. In the mean time, don't hesitate to invest your SP gains in SMGs; this sidearm will come in handy regardless of which path you take (Scout or otherwise).
Happy Hunting,
Shotty GoBang Gallente Scout (~14.5M SP)
PS: +1 to the advice of Princess and Rogatien (above) |
Oso Peresoso
RisingSuns
530
|
Posted - 2013.08.05 14:02:00 -
[8] - Quote
Spend some time getting used to your base suit while you work on weapon and support skills before you fool around sinking a bunch of SP to unlock the adv scout. Keep in mind most of the SP you put into SMGs will be useful no matter what smg you use (dat proficiency bonus gives teeth to cheap fits). SMG skills will also be handy for assault and sentinel suits. I run a logi as my primary so I only have SMG operation 2, but I still manage to get a ton of kills with it when I'm running my shotty scout or any of my assault classes. Scouts also have fast shield recharge time, so although the gallente scout is armor focused, a shield extender will almost always be the best high slot option. That said skilling up for the complex extender will be wasted SP until you're running an adv scout or better the majority of the time (I haven't checked, but I expect it gimps your fit hard if you use complex extender on a basic scout). Armor skills also good. My scout is a shotgun/smg build designed to kill more expensive stuff, so I use armor plate + rep. Has saved me a LOT. Definitely use a drop uplink (lvl 2 to save a bit of CPU with the stable version) or remote explosives. Once your other skills are in good shape, definitely do biotics and get it up to level 3. Hacking is also good, but its a high multiplier skill, and may not be worth skilling up core upgrades to 4 sooner than you need (better to spend SP on other fitting skills early). Also don't forget the electronics skills, get a point in each of them, with maybe 2 in range amplification. |
Derp 514
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.05 14:35:00 -
[9] - Quote
calvin b wrote:Base skills first. Armor and shields to at least three, max if you have the SP. Next CPU and PG to three. Then I would work on suit to lvl 3 at least and max the weapon to at least proficiency 3. Also work on your speed mods and hack skills or you can work on remote explosives as well. What type of build are you after? Stealth, Hacker, or infiltration.
Thank you! I'm going to go for stealth I think.
FATPrincess - XOXO wrote:I wouldn't use a SMG as a main weapon, it blows vs shields. The scout can use a light weapon so why limit yourself? Which scout are you thinking about using? Minmatar is good because it can shield tank. Should get around 300 shield HP at proto level.
Since your main idea is to use the SMG you should get a light weapon that can complement with it. SMG has longer range than the shotgun so it's very good when you encounter enemies that out range you. Scrambler Rifles are excellent when combined with SMG to drop shields fast. Plasma cannon is another one where you'll be using your SMG a lot. It's CPU/PG heavy so it'll be difficult to fit on a scout.
I think your best bet is using the assault Scrambler Rifle because if you choose the shotgun you won't be using the SMG as much as you would like in close quarters combat. So the strategy is to drop shields first and finish off with the SMG. Get your assault SMG ASAP btw, and the ADV Scrambler Rifle should be enough. In this case scenario your rifle is your sidearm and the SMG your main, used for getting the kill.
For modules just stack shield extenders on the highs and catalyzers/shield regulators/whichever you like and most likely a CPU upgrade if you're going to use Minmatar. For Gallente it should armor tank with ferroscale plates and a armor repairer, shield energizers for the highs (it should help you recover your armor). No need for profile dampeners/enhancers because you already have them low enough. For equipment I would try the scanner to get a better view of your surroundings.
-XOXO
Thanks for all the advice. I had already mad a character months ago and have been getting passive SP on it, which is Gallente. I have been thinking that I do want to have a shotgun as my other weapon, but I will consider your suggestion.
Rogatien Merc wrote:If you only have a few mil SP... start by getting SMG Op to IV for an assault version. You want grenadier to II for flux grenades. You want shields/armor to II (III-IV later on, shields first). You want biotics to V asap so you can get kinetic catelization and cardiac reg to III. need electronics I - III for whatever level of CPU upgrade you might need to fit your guns and engineering in case you're short PG.
get armor repair I for a basic rep. don't **** with plates early on as a scout.
now get shield extension to V for a complex extender. it's a huge % increase to EHP on low level scout suits, but may be hard to fit with advanced SMG(s). might have to just dual wield toxins or something.
decide what equipment you want to carry and get the basic version. if dual wielding advanced SMGs, might just skip this. try to get at least nanocircuitry II so you can carry a compact nanohive for grenades IMO.
NOW get light gallente suit to III so u can use the advanced light.
From there, you're on your own and everything beyond that is pretty SP intensive. I'd stick to the advanced suit for a while at this point and focus on getting SMG Op to V and proficiency III or IV if you can stand it to make those advanced assault SMGs hit like a truck. Then get grenadier III for advanced flux grenades.
Thank you for the specifics. This is great. I will definitely go with the flux granades. |
Derp 514
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.05 14:45:00 -
[10] - Quote
Shotty GoBang wrote:Rogatien Merc wrote: SMGs + Flux Nades = Good Idea
FATPrincess - XOXO wrote: For equipment I would try the scanner to get a better view of your surroundings.
You've chosen a challenging course, Brother. Be warned that Hard Mode is a long, frustrating path. Scouts are more SP intensive than any other infantry class, and we perform substantially worse than other infantry classes even at high SP levels. If you're keen on maintaining good stats and hope to eventually serve a combat role in Planetary Conquest, I recommend that you continue playing the role of Scout but use a medium frame (i.e. Min Assault). Here are a few statistics to consider: - Scouts account for 2% to 5% of Dust's player base.
- Over 50% of Scouts have a lifetime KDR under 2.0.
- Over 80% of Scouts have a lifetime KDR under 3.0.
- The majority of old-school Scouts switched to medium frames after Chromosome.
- The Scout's combat handicap has progressively worsened with each release of Uprising.
- There exists no combat role wherein a Scout can outperform an appropriately equipped medium frame.
Not trying to discourage you here; only to offer fair warning. If you're up to the challenge, Scout loadouts can be a lot of fun. Should you opt to embrace Hard Mode, join the in-game channel "Scouts United" once you complete your Academy training. We'll bring you up to speed and pair you with a tutor. In the mean time, don't hesitate to invest your SP gains in SMGs; this sidearm will come in handy regardless of which path you take (Scout or otherwise). Happy Hunting, Shotty GoBang Gallente Scout (~14.5M SP) PS: +1 to the advice of Princess and Rogatien (above)
Errr.. thanks. I am a bit nervous now. I'll look you guys up. |
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Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis League of Infamy
511
|
Posted - 2013.08.05 18:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
Derp 514 wrote:Errr.. thanks. I am a bit nervous now. I'll look you guys up. Knowledge is power, Brother. Our newest arrivals are critical to the success of Dust, and we don't want you running off to another game following your first post-Academy pubstomping. With that said, I think it's important for a newcomer to manage his expectations.
The beauty of Dust is that it is constantly changing. CCP does a great job at recognizing and eventually correcting imbalance. While the past couple of months have been especially hard on Scouts, there's a good chance that we may see a course correction in the not-too-distant future.
The Scout Registry is another resource I'd encourage you to check out: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=90055
I started the Registry a month or so into Uprising to chronicle the mass exodus to medium-frame. It has since become a barometer of sorts for measuring how a given build impacts the Scout Community. I keep tabs on 150-160 Scouts, tracking their individual kill progression and KDR changes for each build. In Uprising 1.2, we observed a pattern of declining KDRs for Scouts at every experience level. KDRs tend to improve as mercs gain experience, so this was a good indicator that 1.2 had a negative net effect on Scout viability. That pattern has held constant for the current build, which was expected given 1.3's limited scope. We're hearing that 1.4 may include an infantry rebalance pass and mechanical changes which could help out the Scout. Fingers crossed!
Many Scouts use the Registry to ask for input and share tips/tricks. It serves as a repository for links to other resources, requests, and experiments related to our cause. I think you'll find this resource especially helpful as a newcomer.
Cheers,
Shotty GoBang |
Fox Gaden
DUST University Ivy League
786
|
Posted - 2013.08.06 17:43:00 -
[12] - Quote
The worse the Scout suits get, the greater the chance that they will get buffed. Also, patch 1.4 will have infantry changes, so hopefully something for Scouts. Nothing announced yet though.
Also if you like the SMG, check out my guide: SMG, Unlocking Versatility |
mollerz
Minja Scouts
825
|
Posted - 2013.08.07 22:19:00 -
[13] - Quote
Flux nades, IMO, are classified as an accept no substitute tool for a scout. If it's not just taking down the shields of stronger opponents, it also clears REs from capture points. As well as makes vehicles run away.
One other tip I would offer is to pack compact nanohives in your equipment slot to repair armor (moreimportant for a ganja than a minja) as well as topping off your ammo chewing SMGs.
Plural you say? Yup. If you go SMG- dual up. Instead of reloading, you switch to your second SMG. You can be one deadly mofo that way. You are looking at 160 rnds of fury.. You just want to stay at close range. If you get up close and personal the first SMG will wipe even the hardest shield, and then you switch to the second SMG to mop up their armor.
And yes- the scout registry is a wealth of scout info at this point! read it!
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Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis League of Infamy
525
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 15:29:00 -
[14] - Quote
Here's a build I've found to be fun and effective:
Adv Light or Scout (Gallente)
PW: SMG (Toxin) SW: SMG (Toxin) GR: Flux Nade EQ: Compact Nanohive HS: Shield Extender HS: Shield Extender LS: KinCat (Red Pill) LS: CardReg (Green Pill)
Consistently going positive, despite having virtually zero points invested in SMGs. Two complex shield extenders really come in handy here. I recommend investing early on in shield extension if you haven't already. The advanced suit is another must, given its two high slots. This ~20k smg loadout is just as deadly as my ~120k proto shotgun loadout, not to mention more durable. There's alot of potential here. Good luck. o7 |
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