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Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2013.11.14 02:04:00 -
[61] - Quote
Incidentally, is the Assault HMG worth it for more open maps? |
Megaman Trigger
Knights of Eternal Darkness
48
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Posted - 2013.11.14 02:20:00 -
[62] - Quote
I have yet to try the HMG variants, I've stuck to just the base model.
The Assault, I assume, would be better for Ambush/ranged encounters since it has better range/less bullet spread at the price of less damage per round.
The Burst one....let's just say seeing the heat build up on on the specs put me off. I've seen people run it well, it just doesn't look right for me.
Look out! Here comes the Megaman!
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Megaman Trigger
Knights of Eternal Darkness
48
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Posted - 2013.11.14 02:23:00 -
[63] - Quote
Audacious Mandate wrote:Megaman Trigger wrote:Audacious Mandate wrote:On another note, had an awesome hour of play last night with 3 other heavies and 2 Logis. Skirm, Dom, Ambush...we mauled everybody. I did notice that my kill to assist ratio was highly skewed toward assist, is that typical? That depends entirely on the map, mode and who you're with\up against. Typically my kills are at least double my assists with a HMG, but I'm running mostly advanced gear and am more point-defence/living turret in my style. That may just be it, other than holding a doorway in Ambush, I think I mostly did roving fire support. I was pleasantly surprised with my K/D, though I don't tend to worry about that usually. I think I only went negative one match, it was 3K/12A/5D if I recall correctly.
I personally avoid Ambush matches and stick to Skirmish and Domination. I perform better there.
Look out! Here comes the Megaman!
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Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2013.11.14 02:28:00 -
[64] - Quote
Megaman Trigger wrote:Audacious Mandate wrote:Megaman Trigger wrote:Audacious Mandate wrote:On another note, had an awesome hour of play last night with 3 other heavies and 2 Logis. Skirm, Dom, Ambush...we mauled everybody. I did notice that my kill to assist ratio was highly skewed toward assist, is that typical? That depends entirely on the map, mode and who you're with\up against. Typically my kills are at least double my assists with a HMG, but I'm running mostly advanced gear and am more point-defence/living turret in my style. That may just be it, other than holding a doorway in Ambush, I think I mostly did roving fire support. I was pleasantly surprised with my K/D, though I don't tend to worry about that usually. I think I only went negative one match, it was 3K/12A/5D if I recall correctly. I personally avoid Ambush matches and stick to Skirmish and Domination. I perform better there. Yeah, on all my alts I only do ambush if grinding ISK and SP doesn't matter. I can really see just how important it is for a Heavy to have a specific objective to attack or defend, even in the Ambush if it weren't for that building we would have been hosed. |
Megaman Trigger
Knights of Eternal Darkness
48
|
Posted - 2013.11.14 02:48:00 -
[65] - Quote
Audacious Mandate wrote:Megaman Trigger wrote:Audacious Mandate wrote:Megaman Trigger wrote:Audacious Mandate wrote:On another note, had an awesome hour of play last night with 3 other heavies and 2 Logis. Skirm, Dom, Ambush...we mauled everybody. I did notice that my kill to assist ratio was highly skewed toward assist, is that typical? That depends entirely on the map, mode and who you're with\up against. Typically my kills are at least double my assists with a HMG, but I'm running mostly advanced gear and am more point-defence/living turret in my style. That may just be it, other than holding a doorway in Ambush, I think I mostly did roving fire support. I was pleasantly surprised with my K/D, though I don't tend to worry about that usually. I think I only went negative one match, it was 3K/12A/5D if I recall correctly. I personally avoid Ambush matches and stick to Skirmish and Domination. I perform better there. Yeah, on all my alts I only do ambush if grinding ISK and SP doesn't matter. I can really see just how important it is for a Heavy to have a specific objective to attack or defend, even in the Ambush if it weren't for that building we would have been hosed.
If I get dragged into an Ambush by my squad lead I only run one of my BPO starter suits, typically the Medic or Frontline (which has an added Militia Nanohive) and just work on ISK while trying not to get killed.
Look out! Here comes the Megaman!
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Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2013.11.14 02:52:00 -
[66] - Quote
I just put a militia repper on my Frontline, ironically, I then chase Heavies around. :) |
Megaman Trigger
Knights of Eternal Darkness
48
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Posted - 2013.11.14 03:01:00 -
[67] - Quote
Audacious Mandate wrote:I just put a militia repper on my Frontline, ironically, I then chase Heavies around. :)
Being a Gallente means my BPO suits come with two reps and a plate, but have no Damage Mods, so I need to get the drop on targets.
Look out! Here comes the Megaman!
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Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2013.11.18 04:55:00 -
[68] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:Audacious Mandate, once you have basic plate/repair I would definitely recommend maxing out your Armour and Shield skills to increase your base Armour and Shield stats. That will probably benefit you more than upgrading your weapon at this stage. Besides, you can save up some ISK while you are running cheap gear.
So I finally got around to crunching numbers on the armor skills. I wish I still had them handy, but... The Armor core skill gives you 120 additional armor at level 5 for 5K and change SP per point of armor. The Armor Plates, if you go conservative and only do 2 Complex, gives you 270 additional armor for 3K and change SP per point. Bottom line, I'll definitely level the core Shield and Armor skills up, but I'll get to enhanced plates and reps before putting a couple levels in each. The last 2 levels of everything are where it gets really expensive anyway. Thanks for the advice, I might not have looked that closely at it otherwise. |
Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
1570
|
Posted - 2013.11.18 16:59:00 -
[69] - Quote
Anyone who has not already done so should watch this video, from this thread. It went completely against what I thought was happening, but once I saw the truth, and used that knowledge in battle, I became a lot more effective with the HMG. No longer can an Assault with an Assault Rifle expect to beat me in a 1 vs 1 unless they are strafing like crazy.
____________________________________________________________________________ Immortal Guides, supporting knowledge dissemination in New Eden since August 31, 2013. |
Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2013.11.18 17:57:00 -
[70] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:Anyone who has not already done so should watch this video, from this thread. It went completely against what I thought was happening, but once I saw the truth, and used that knowledge in battle, I became a lot more effective with the HMG. No longer can an Assault with an Assault Rifle expect to beat me in a 1 vs 1 unless they are strafing like crazy. ____________________________________________________________________________ Immortal Guides, supporting knowledge dissemination in New Eden since August 31, 2013. I had slowly been coming to this realization myself after running across enough stationary enemies that I could take my time aiming; it was good to see someone test it more rigorously than I had and prove it. I actually don't mind the ultra precise stream of fire, though it is a ***** at close range. |
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Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2013.11.19 00:20:00 -
[71] - Quote
So, I now have Plates, Reppers and Damage Mods at level 3, I had to put 1 level into Electronics to get a couple fittings to work though. That being the case I'm at a loss as to my next investment, not enough CPU for advanced weapons too. So should I invest in Electronics for more CPU, or will investing a few more levels in Heavy Weapons reduce CPU requirements enough to fit Adv. weapons (as well as allowing me access to FGs, which I want anyway). Or, should I bypass both and go for Adv. Heavy Suits. I'm going to level up Armor and Shield core skills until I figure it out, thoughts or suggestions? |
Megaman Trigger
Knights of Eternal Darkness
48
|
Posted - 2013.11.19 12:52:00 -
[72] - Quote
I'd personally go for the CPU and PG skills over the weapon skill, unless you're set on getting access to the FG.
Look out! Here comes the Megaman!
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Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2013.11.19 13:37:00 -
[73] - Quote
Although I do want to unlock FGs, I think my bread and butter will be the HMG. Oddly PG doesn't seem to be an issue yet, so I guess I'll do Electronics upgrades first, then PG as necessary. Thanks for the advice. |
Megaman Trigger
Knights of Eternal Darkness
48
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Posted - 2013.11.19 14:13:00 -
[74] - Quote
You're welcome. I've found that PG is rarely an issue for any Dropsuit.
Look out! Here comes the Megaman!
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Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
1570
|
Posted - 2013.11.19 15:42:00 -
[75] - Quote
Audacious Mandate wrote:So, I now have Plates, Reppers and Damage Mods at level 3, I had to put 1 level into Electronics to get a couple fittings to work though. That being the case I'm at a loss as to my next investment, not enough CPU for advanced weapons too. So should I invest in Electronics for more CPU, or will investing a few more levels in Heavy Weapons reduce CPU requirements enough to fit Adv. weapons (as well as allowing me access to FGs, which I want anyway). Or, should I bypass both and go for Adv. Heavy Suits. I'm going to level up Armor and Shield core skills until I figure it out, thoughts or suggestions? I would go Damage Mods to 5 rather than upgrading to an Advanced HMG, unless you want the Assault HMG which I think is only available at Advanced. If I remember correctly upgrading from Advanced Damage Mod to Proto Damage Mod is 5% damage, and the fitting cost is much less than upgrading your weapon. Going Proto Damage Mod will cost you less ISK than going Advanced HMG. (Of course I am looking at this more from a fitting standpoint than a skills standpoint, as the HMG skill does reduce kick.)
I was running Proto Damage mod, Proto Kinetic Catalyser, with Basic Armour Repair and Basic HMG on Standard (Dren) suit, with Electronics and Engineering both at zero, for a while. I am upgrading Electronics and Engineering now to fit a Proto Armour Repair, or Proto HMG, but you can get a lot of bang for your buck out of Proto Modules.
That being said, getting your Armour and Shield skills up are also a priority. |
Megaman Trigger
Knights of Eternal Darkness
48
|
Posted - 2013.11.19 17:56:00 -
[76] - Quote
Fox raises a good point.
Fitting just a single Enhanced Heavy Damage Mod will grant you a 5% bonus to your HMG damage, which is (I believe) equal to the damage increase of an Advanced HMG. Fitting a Proto Mod is 10%, meaning a basic HMG with a Proto Mod rivals the base power of the proto-level Boundless HMG. If you can fit two Proto Mods, you're looking at about a 19% increase in damage once you factor in the staking penalty, which out-powers even the Officer/Salvage class weapons.
Damage Mods might be the best way to go in terms of SP, fittings and ISK for starting Heavies looking to pump up their DPS.
If the math is wrong, feel free to point it out.
Look out! Here comes the Megaman!
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Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2013.11.19 22:35:00 -
[77] - Quote
Great tip, I'll have to check out the numbers tonight.
I'm not fat, I'm just big boned!
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Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2013.11.20 00:54:00 -
[78] - Quote
With my usual fit, 1 Enhanced Plate, 1 Enhanced Repper, I still need to put Electronics to Level 2 to fit the Complex Damage mod. Even at that, it fits exactly, couldn't use it with my 2 Repper fit. This is a real toughie. Just to compare: it would take 578,290 SP for the Electronics and Damage mods, with that my standard HMG would do exactly the same DPS as the Proto HMG. It would take 609,400 SP to max my HMG. It would cost about 7,000 ISK for the mod and weapon together vs 47,000 for the Proto HMG. But it would only take 124,360 to get my suit to Adv, where I could fit 2 Enhanced Damage mods which I've already skilled into...I think you see which way I'm leaning here. Thanks for the help though, really, if you guys didn't make these specific suggestions, I wouldn't crunch numbers well enough.
I'm not fat, I'm just big boned!
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Megaman Trigger
Knights of Eternal Darkness
49
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Posted - 2013.11.20 01:00:00 -
[79] - Quote
Be careful fitting multiple damage mods; every mod after the first has a stacking penalty. So two Enhanced is inferior to a single Complex.
Look out! Here comes the Megaman!
|
Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
3
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 02:28:00 -
[80] - Quote
Megaman Trigger wrote:Be careful fitting multiple damage mods; every mod after the first has a stacking penalty. So two Enhanced is inferior to a single Complex. True, but it should come out to around 9%, uses modules I'm currently skilled into and gets me into a suit with more CPU/PG. I do believe in leveling up modules before the suit, so I'll probably stay in Adv suits until I'm proto with everything else (with the possible exception of the HMG). I'll think on it awhile anyway as I only have 60,000 SP right now.
I'm not fat, I'm just big boned!
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Megaman Trigger
Knights of Eternal Darkness
50
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Posted - 2013.11.20 15:00:00 -
[81] - Quote
Audacious Mandate wrote:Megaman Trigger wrote:Be careful fitting multiple damage mods; every mod after the first has a stacking penalty. So two Enhanced is inferior to a single Complex. True, but it should come out to around 9%, uses modules I'm currently skilled into and gets me into a suit with more CPU/PG. I do believe in leveling up modules before the suit, so I'll probably stay in Adv suits until I'm proto with everything else (with the possible exception of the HMG). I'll think on it awhile anyway as I only have 60,000 SP right now.
I believe the number is 8.5%, which is still a nice enough boost, although it will take up an awful lot of CPU.
If you have that much SP, it might be worth just sitting on it for now until you have more. No point spending it on something just because you can, and end up waiting longer for something important. I know I've made that mistake before.
Look out! Here comes the Megaman!
|
Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
3
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 15:59:00 -
[82] - Quote
Megaman Trigger wrote:Audacious Mandate wrote:Megaman Trigger wrote:Be careful fitting multiple damage mods; every mod after the first has a stacking penalty. So two Enhanced is inferior to a single Complex. True, but it should come out to around 9%, uses modules I'm currently skilled into and gets me into a suit with more CPU/PG. I do believe in leveling up modules before the suit, so I'll probably stay in Adv suits until I'm proto with everything else (with the possible exception of the HMG). I'll think on it awhile anyway as I only have 60,000 SP right now. I believe the number is 8.5%, which is still a nice enough boost, although it will take up an awful lot of CPU. If you have that much SP, it might be worth just sitting on it for now until you have more. No point spending it on something just because you can, and end up waiting longer for something important. I know I've made that mistake before. Good point about saving the SP. As for the damage, I'll have to search for the post, but I read that in cases of a remainder, all figures are rounded in favor of the player. I don't know if this applies to the .5, or if that means actual bullet damage would be rounded to the nearest whole number...I'll do some more research and post the results.
I'm not fat, I'm just big boned!
|
Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
1578
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 16:06:00 -
[83] - Quote
Audacious Mandate wrote:With my usual fit, 1 Enhanced Plate, 1 Enhanced Repper, I still need to put Electronics to Level 2 to fit the Complex Damage mod. Even at that, it fits exactly, couldn't use it with my 2 Repper fit. This is a real toughie. Just to compare: it would take 578,290 SP for the Electronics and Damage mods, with that my standard HMG would do exactly the same DPS as the Proto HMG. It would take 609,400 SP to max my HMG. It would cost about 7,000 ISK for the mod and weapon together vs 47,000 for the Proto HMG. But it would only take 124,360 to get my suit to Adv, where I could fit 2 Enhanced Damage mods which I've already skilled into...I think you see which way I'm leaning here. Thanks for the help though, really, if you guys didn't make these specific suggestions, I wouldn't crunch numbers well enough. Crunch the numbers to decide whether going advanced over basic on your plate is better than going with a Proto damage mod. As I understand it the increase from Basic to Advanced on plate is not as dramatic as with some other modules.
I went proto with my Kinetic Catalyser and my Damage mod first, while still using a Basic armour repair, and was able to fit it on the Standard Sentinel without any Engineering or Electronics skills. But that was before the health buff of 1.5, so the repair might be higher priority now. I assume that the Kinetic Catalyser has a different PG and CPU profile than the Plates, so I am not sure if my numbers will work for you. But I would try it with an Enhanced Repair, Basic plate and a Proto Damage mod, and see if it will fit.
Skilling to the Advanced suit is very tempting, and I would do it myself if I was sure I was going to stick with the Amarr Heavy suit, but with it's bonus to feedback damage (Laser) and my love for the HMG, I suspect I will be going with one of the other racial suits when they come out. (1.8?) |
Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
3
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 16:17:00 -
[84] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:Audacious Mandate wrote:With my usual fit, 1 Enhanced Plate, 1 Enhanced Repper, I still need to put Electronics to Level 2 to fit the Complex Damage mod. Even at that, it fits exactly, couldn't use it with my 2 Repper fit. This is a real toughie. Just to compare: it would take 578,290 SP for the Electronics and Damage mods, with that my standard HMG would do exactly the same DPS as the Proto HMG. It would take 609,400 SP to max my HMG. It would cost about 7,000 ISK for the mod and weapon together vs 47,000 for the Proto HMG. But it would only take 124,360 to get my suit to Adv, where I could fit 2 Enhanced Damage mods which I've already skilled into...I think you see which way I'm leaning here. Thanks for the help though, really, if you guys didn't make these specific suggestions, I wouldn't crunch numbers well enough. Crunch the numbers to decide whether going advanced over basic on your plate is better than going with a Proto damage mod. As I understand it the increase from Basic to Advanced on plate is not as dramatic as with some other modules. I went proto with my Kinetic Catalyser and my Damage mod first, while still using a Basic armour repair, and was able to fit it on the Standard Sentinel without any Engineering or Electronics skills. But that was before the health buff of 1.5, so the repair might be higher priority now. I assume that the Kinetic Catalyser has a different PG and CPU profile than the Plates, so I am not sure if my numbers will work for you. But I would try it with an Enhanced Repair, Basic plate and a Proto Damage mod, and see if it will fit. Skilling to the Advanced suit is very tempting, and I would do it myself if I was sure I was going to stick with the Amarr Heavy suit, but with it's bonus to feedback damage (Laser) and my love for the HMG, I suspect I will be going with one of the other racial suits when they come out. (1.8?) I'll check tonight if the Basic Plate frees up enough CPU, the Repper is the real CPU hog though and I definitely want to keep the Enhanced Repper on my fitting. If I could count on having a logi with a proto repair tool on a regular basis I could make the Complex Damage mod work (after grinding 500,000 SP that is). Guess I'll just hoard SP for now while number crunching.
I'm not fat, I'm just big boned!
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Megaman Trigger
Knights of Eternal Darkness
50
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 16:38:00 -
[85] - Quote
I wonder if, once the other racial variants for heavy are available, we get a respec for the Heavy suit's SP (and solely that suit.)
Look out! Here comes the Megaman!
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Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
1578
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 16:38:00 -
[86] - Quote
That makes sense. Most of my fitting problems started when I upgraded to an Advanced Repper, but now I really want to find a way to fit a Propo Repper. It sure gets tiresome cowering in a corner waiting to get some health back. |
Megaman Trigger
Knights of Eternal Darkness
50
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 19:55:00 -
[87] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:That makes sense. Most of my fitting problems started when I upgraded to an Advanced Repper, but now I really want to find a way to fit a Propo Repper. It sure gets tiresome cowering in a corner waiting to get some health back.
That's an understatement.
Look out! Here comes the Megaman!
|
Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
3
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 21:59:00 -
[88] - Quote
Megaman Trigger wrote:Fox Gaden wrote:That makes sense. Most of my fitting problems started when I upgraded to an Advanced Repper, but now I really want to find a way to fit a Propo Repper. It sure gets tiresome cowering in a corner waiting to get some health back. That's an understatement.
Yeah, if no one in squad has even a basic repair tool I run 2 Enhanced reppers, it's still woefully inadequate.
I'm not fat, I'm just big boned!
|
Megaman Trigger
Knights of Eternal Darkness
50
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 22:38:00 -
[89] - Quote
Audacious Mandate wrote:Megaman Trigger wrote:Fox Gaden wrote:That makes sense. Most of my fitting problems started when I upgraded to an Advanced Repper, but now I really want to find a way to fit a Propo Repper. It sure gets tiresome cowering in a corner waiting to get some health back. That's an understatement. Yeah, if no one in squad has even a basic repair tool I run 2 Enhanced reppers, it's still woefully inadequate.
I've had that situation a few times; join a blueberry squad and not one of them has a Rep Tool, or can even figure out how to use an Injector. I tend to run Logi-reliant fittings, so I suffer with no support. Two Complex Plates + a Basic Rep keeps me in the fight for a while, but not forever.
I'm considering running a test fitting of 3 Enhanced Reps and a Shield Recharger, coupled with a HMG and SMG. I ran something like that with an AR to great affect, I think my score was something like 15/12/0, so I wonder how a HMG would do.
Look out! Here comes the Megaman!
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Audacious Mandate
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
3
|
Posted - 2013.11.20 22:49:00 -
[90] - Quote
I'd love to hear how that turns out, with the plates you can probably stay in the fight 1-2 seconds longer, but those Complex reps should get you back in the fight signifigantly quicker.
I'm not fat, I'm just big boned!
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