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Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
413
   |
Posted - 2013.07.26 18:30:00 -
[1] - Quote
An Assassin's blade to be carried by every Scout.
- A defining characteristic specific to the Scout suit
- Occupies no weapon slot
- Depletes a target's shields when struck
- Shatters when used in frontal assault (returned on respawn)
- Persists in inventory after successful "back-stab"
- Emits no sound on use
- Requires no charge time
- Has a cooldown rate comparable to the active scanner
- Does zero damage to Armor, unless used against another Scout
Please and thank you.
- Shotty GoBang |
Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
413
|
Posted - 2013.07.26 18:49:00 -
[2] - Quote
Why, you ask?
- Because being a Scout is currently a bad idea.
- Because Scouts need a role or differentiating quality.
- Because 1.4 is going to wipe out Scouts, short of Dev salvation.
- Because Scouts wish to collect water and tears.
- Because more scouts = more depth = more players.
- Because the scout-on-scout violence would be spectacular.
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Oso Peresoso
RisingSuns
367
|
Posted - 2013.07.26 18:57:00 -
[3] - Quote
seems kind of pointless unless you have a raging hardon for frank Herbert. |
Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
414
|
Posted - 2013.07.26 19:01:00 -
[4] - Quote
Oso Peresoso wrote:seems kind of pointless.
Pointless perhaps to a sniper, but an upper hand returned in smart CQC. Just a suggestion though; tweak as you see fit. |
Oso Peresoso
RisingSuns
367
|
Posted - 2013.07.26 19:06:00 -
[5] - Quote
Shotty GoBang wrote:Oso Peresoso wrote:seems kind of pointless. Pointless perhaps to a sniper, but an upper hand returned in smart CQC. Just a suggestion though; tweak as you see fit.
I guess I don't see anything about this idea that is inherently scouty. Scouts have sidearms, there are knife options for sidearms. Just make this into another variety of sidearm.
Or perhaps change the scout melee animation to involve a knife? Or make the melee damage mods change your animation to a knife? Probably technical limitations there. |
ALPHA DECRIPTER
M.E.R.C. Conventional Forces
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
162
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Posted - 2013.07.26 19:06:00 -
[6] - Quote
Shotty GoBang wrote:Why, you ask?
- Because being a Scout is currently a bad idea.
- Because Scouts need a role or differentiating quality.
- Because 1.4 is going to wipe out Scouts, short of Dev salvation.
- Because Scouts wish to collect water and tears.
- Because more scouts = more depth = more players.
- Because the scout-on-scout violence would be spectacular.
What they doing to my scouts? 
`sigh. Another good game of DUST  |
Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
416
|
Posted - 2013.07.26 19:38:00 -
[7] - Quote
Oso Peresoso wrote:
I guess I don't see anything about this idea that is inherently scouty.
Assassination from behind is certainly Scoutly. This tactic will potentially be made obsolete in 1.4. The Crysknife concept or something like it could keep us in combat.
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Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
416
|
Posted - 2013.07.26 19:39:00 -
[8] - Quote
ALPHA DECRIPTER wrote:What they doing to my scouts?
Nullifying the scout's only combat advantage.
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1104484#post1104484 |
Oso Peresoso
RisingSuns
370
|
Posted - 2013.07.26 19:47:00 -
[9] - Quote
It also means I might actually get to kill 2 people with 2 shotgun blasts because the aiming issues are worse at close range. In which case I won't need to dodge fire because I'll get my kills in while I still am undetected. |
Daxxis KANNAH
Tronhadar Free Guard
Minmatar Republic
263
|
Posted - 2013.07.26 20:09:00 -
[10] - Quote
No - field of vision, collision detection (how come you bump into allies but morph through enemies) and the ability to use nova knives are enough reasons to not go down that path.
Scouts could get built in cloak. Maybe minnie gets a cloak and gallente gets a scanner
Climbing abilities would be nice but mantle of boxes, rails etc and reduced fall damage are a must if they cant sort out stamina.
Scouts should turn and strafe dramatically faster than other classes if the speed stats are going to stay as they are. |
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Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
417
|
Posted - 2013.07.26 22:01:00 -
[11] - Quote
Daxxis KANNAH wrote:Scouts could get built in cloak.
This is a great idea, Daxxis, way better than mine. The bottom line is that Scouts need a new edge, something to make us different and effective again. Something we can work toward mastering.
The promise of "future Dev love" remains unseen and undefined. Tweaking our base statistics may slow the bleed, but it isn't gonna cut it in the long haul. We need a big change, or even the promise of a big change.
People have a tendency to repeat patterns that reward them. Playing Dust as a Scout presently lacks reward. Scouts have been crippled again and again since Uprising. For the sake of an entire class of mercs, I would see this pattern changed rather than reinforced. |
Chilled Pill
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
122
|
Posted - 2013.07.27 14:32:00 -
[12] - Quote
Please please stop thinking that cloaking will fix all that is wrong with the scout. It won't. Especially if it will use up a module slot and CPU/PG of which we have none to spare.
The Scout is in limbo...more of a novelty than anything else at this point -- maybe even a bad joke come 1.4. All changes that have come to pass, and changes in the horizon only serve to make the environment more hostile for us Scouts.
Brace yourselves brothers! If you think it's tough to be a Scout now, I suggest you get your ass ready for the next few patches. |
N1ck Comeau
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
863
|
Posted - 2013.07.27 14:42:00 -
[13] - Quote
It's a shame that increasing game performance makes it easier to hit scouts, they need to have a higher base speed both in movement and sprint to make up for this |
Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
425
|
Posted - 2013.07.27 15:05:00 -
[14] - Quote
N1ck Comeau wrote:It's a shame that increasing game performance makes it easier to hit scouts, they need to have a higher base speed both in movement and sprint to make up for this
Strangely, speed doesn't translate to higher scout survivability anymore. It's helpful on attack but fails to improve the odds of successful evasion or retreat. The guys have proven that our hitbox is displaced with speed, but it apparently isn't expanding with our collision model. So I blame our new, larger hitbox and improved projectile weapon performance.
Perhaps "Dev love" could involve shrinking our hitbox. |
Daxxis KANNAH
Tronhadar Free Guard
Minmatar Republic
267
|
Posted - 2013.07.27 15:18:00 -
[15] - Quote
Of course, thats why I said built in so doesnt impact our slots or cpu.
To balance it you activate and cant run or obviously shoot/stab as that would break cloak. Maybe its timed so you have to strategically use it and then it has a short cooldown.
On the scanner, it doesnt alert the scanned foe(s) but doesnt have the range of the normal scanner. It would have a long cooldown time.
I would also hope that the other things I mentioned would be high on CCP's list as well as balancing out the other classes wisely. An offensive scout should be able to pick off logis in their sleep, kill heavies if they approach them correctly and have trouble with assaults unless they catch them totally unaware.
We should have to rapidly retreat if spotted which it is now and will be worse after the update.
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Maken Tosch
DUST University
Ivy League
3487
|
Posted - 2013.07.27 15:37:00 -
[16] - Quote
No. I want my enemies to hear me stab one of their squad mates so that they know, as I am stabbing their friend to death, they are next. I want fear to grow in the eyes of my victims as the sound of hot burning plasma is eating through the shields and armor of their dropsuits and into their clone flesh.
Can you hear it? That is death knocking on your door.
Can you smell it? That is fear. |
Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
425
|
Posted - 2013.07.27 15:41:00 -
[17] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:No. I want my enemies to hear me stab one of their squad mates so that they know, as I am stabbing their friend to death, they are next.
Lol. Fixed (see above).
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Gorgoth24Reborn
Kang Lo Directorate
Gallente Federation
13
|
Posted - 2013.07.27 16:49:00 -
[18] - Quote
More then a Crysknife I'd love to see a "lunge" mechanic like COD in play with knives (A COD reference, let the hate begin). I've always had more luck with shotguns over Nova Knives b/c I can avoid the enemy spray by remaining just far enough away for me to dodge it. At least with a short "lunge" it was neutralize the backpedaling that makes the learning curve for them so steep |
Chilled Pill
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
124
|
Posted - 2013.07.27 23:06:00 -
[19] - Quote
While knives are fun in Pubs and giving it some buffs for the weapon is nice, these won't help the Scout Knifer to become a viable option for PC -- again a novelty. |
N1ck Comeau
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
864
|
Posted - 2013.07.27 23:07:00 -
[20] - Quote
Chilled Pill wrote:While knives are fun in Pubs and giving it some buffs for the weapon is nice, these won't help the Scout Knifer to become a viable option for PC -- again a novelty.
They could very well be a viable option if balanced correctly. |
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voidfaction
Void of Faction
24
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Posted - 2013.07.28 00:01:00 -
[21] - Quote
Shotty GoBang wrote:Oso Peresoso wrote:seems kind of pointless. Pointless perhaps to a sniper, but an upper hand returned in smart CQC. Just a suggestion though; tweak as you see fit.
If the scout suit is made melee only then sure.
I am a scout and I don't do cQc. I am a sniper that wears the suit for stealth. Its primary purpose is stealth. You want it to take a melee purpose to suit your play style and in return screw over those like me that use it for its intended purpose of stealth. Buff the stealth or speed it helps all that wear the suit not just the cQc players.
Problem 1 is cQc scouts that think the scout suit is only purpose is back stabbing and cQc. |
ALPHA DECRIPTER
M.E.R.C. Conventional Forces
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
169
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 00:11:00 -
[22] - Quote
I too use the scout suit for stealth (hacking and uplinks). As a hacker I tend to find myself in CQC a lot while approaching an objective. My weapons of choice are Breach SMGs, for when I need to defend myself, and Nova Knives, for killing rival hackers and dispatching sniper nests.
When playing Ambush this play style isn't all that useful so I utilize a secondary sniper class. As a sniper that prefers to keep moving I tend to run into other snipers and wouldn't mind being able to assassinate them quietly.
But hey, that's just me.
`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST . |
Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
431
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 00:20:00 -
[23] - Quote
voidfaction wrote:Shotty GoBang wrote:Oso Peresoso wrote:seems kind of pointless. Pointless perhaps to a sniper, but an upper hand returned in smart CQC. Just a suggestion though; tweak as you see fit. If the scout suit is made melee only then sure. I am a scout and I don't do cQc. I am a sniper that wears the suit for stealth. Its primary purpose is stealth. You want it to take a melee purpose to suit your play style and in return screw over those like me that use it for its intended purpose of stealth. Buff the stealth or speed it helps all that wear the suit not just the cQc players. Problem 1 is cQc scouts that think the scout suit is only purpose is back stabbing and cQc.
Hey Void, didn't intend to overlook scout snipers; I figured the suggestion would help you out as well.
I can't tell you how many scout snipers I've lost track of while hunting in the hills. You guys know the terrain better than anyone. You know how to disappear. You're immune to my active scanner.
Imagine hunting a scout sniper in the hills, only for him to disappear, sneak up behind you, poke you with his shield-disabling blade, then take you out via sidearm. If I were a scout sniper, I'd look forward to such an opportunity to hunt the hunter.
- Shotty GoBang |
Vyzion Eyri
The Southern Legion
1080
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 00:21:00 -
[24] - Quote
Could combine this idea with one revolving around recently, of flattening the tier std-adv-pro progression of suits, and change it into variants of variants of variants.
For example, the basic racial light suits exist now. Then there can be scout suits with an inbuilt knife, as suggested here.
Then there are scout suits with an inbuilt cloak.
Then there are scout suits with greatly reduced scan profile.
Then there are scout suits with increased scan radius/precision.
Then there are scout suits with reduced sniper scope sway.
Then multiply these variants by 4, for a slight variation per race.
There are dozens of others I could list, and all could be variants of the basic light suits. None are better than the other, but all have strengths in particular areas of combat.
This could be applied to medium and heavy dropsuits as well. No more huge benefits over the next guy, yet you'd still be able to gain an edge if you play to your specialisation. |
KalOfTheRathi
Talon Strike Force LTD
Covert Intervention
559
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 00:28:00 -
[25] - Quote
Oso Peresoso wrote:Shotty GoBang wrote:Oso Peresoso wrote:seems kind of pointless. Pointless perhaps to a sniper, but an upper hand returned in smart CQC. Just a suggestion though; tweak as you see fit. I guess I don't see anything about this idea that is inherently scouty. Scouts have sidearms, there are knife options for sidearms. Just make this into another variety of sidearm. Aside from the lack of big freaking worms the OP seems pointless to myself as well. I still have squad mates that play scout shotties and my alt heavy has to stay aware of nova knife wielding scouts and shotties.
Get good or get gone. There is no automatic win button in this game. |
ALPHA DECRIPTER
M.E.R.C. Conventional Forces
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
170
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 00:31:00 -
[26] - Quote
Vyzion Eyri wrote:Could combine this idea with one revolving around recently, of flattening the tier std-adv-pro progression of suits, and change it into variants of variants of variants.
For example, the basic racial light suits exist now. Then there can be scout suits with an inbuilt knife, as suggested here.
Then there are scout suits with an inbuilt cloak.
Then there are scout suits with greatly reduced scan profile.
Then there are scout suits with increased scan radius/precision.
Then there are scout suits with reduced sniper scope sway.
Then multiply these variants by 4, for a slight variation per race.
There are dozens of others I could list, and all could be variants of the basic light suits. None are better than the other, but all have strengths in particular areas of combat.
This could be applied to medium and heavy dropsuits as well. No more huge benefits over the next guy, yet you'd still be able to gain an edge if you play to your specialisation.
That's what mods are for I suppose 
Don't get me wrong, if those were put into the game I would make the best of it;
Built in knife - For my more aggressive scout.
Cloak - For my sniper.
Reduced profile - For my hacker.
Reduced sway - For my Alt Sniper.
This idea wouldn't really hurt anything so I'm not gonna knock it.
`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST . |
ALPHA DECRIPTER
M.E.R.C. Conventional Forces
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
170
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 00:34:00 -
[27] - Quote
KalOfTheRathi wrote:Oso Peresoso wrote:Shotty GoBang wrote:Oso Peresoso wrote:seems kind of pointless. Pointless perhaps to a sniper, but an upper hand returned in smart CQC. Just a suggestion though; tweak as you see fit. I guess I don't see anything about this idea that is inherently scouty. Scouts have sidearms, there are knife options for sidearms. Just make this into another variety of sidearm. Aside from the lack of big freaking worms the OP seems pointless to myself as well. I still have squad mates that play scout shotties and my alt heavy has to stay aware of nova knife wielding scouts and shotties. Get good or get gone. There is no automatic win button in this game.
Not true... at least not until the 30th... Contact grenades.
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Shotty GoBang
Pro Hic Immortalis
League of Infamy
431
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 00:37:00 -
[28] - Quote
KalOfTheRathi wrote:Get good or get gone.
I'm glad you play with Scouts, Kal. I'll try to "get good" just for you, buddy. |
Some Alaskan
DUST CORE
DARKSTAR ARMY
7
|
Posted - 2013.07.29 16:55:00 -
[29] - Quote
Oh my god Yes a auto-cloak and a melee bonus would be fantastic. Anything that gives the scout back their edge is welcome. |
ALPHA DECRIPTER
M.E.R.C. Conventional Forces
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
176
|
Posted - 2013.07.29 19:31:00 -
[30] - Quote
Sux that, for scouts, things are going to get worse b4 they get better.
`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST . |
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