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Dexter307
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
83
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Posted - 2013.07.25 19:53:00 -
[31] - Quote
Mobius Wyvern wrote:Dexter307 wrote:Then why as a heavy do i do better with a AR at all ranges? The only thing the hmg is good for is barrel stuffing. If the hmg got its damage buffed up then it would be good I can't count the number of times I've been instantly blapped by an HMG. But see, that's a good thing, because every time that's happened, it's been by an HMG user that used enclosed environments and cover to his advantage, catching me off guard and hosing me down before I could fight back. You don't have to play point-defense with a Heavy suit, but if you don't want to do that, you're going to need to make sure you're the one dictating the terms of the engagement. Also, have you considered the fact that you might be very good with Assault Rifles? Just because you're a Heavy, you shouldn't feel like you have to use an HMG if you're better with a different weapon. That's the beauty of this game, after all. Its not just me, most of the heavies i know are switching to other suits. Also its not because im good with assult rifles, in chromosome i used the hmg and it worked just fine |
Heavy Breaks
Red Star. EoN.
131
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Posted - 2013.07.25 20:20:00 -
[32] - Quote
Kinkku-Ananas Kepappi wrote:The Minmatar heavy suit will probably be more agile and faster than the Amarr one.
And maybe even get a bonus to HMG or something.
This will save dust for many heavies IMHO.
Now how to save it for scouts & tankers & DS pilots &.............. |
Django Quik
R.I.f.t
1065
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Posted - 2013.07.25 20:24:00 -
[33] - Quote
The HMG is the 3rd most killing weapon in this game behind only the AR and Snipers. That's a pretty good indication that it's not in a whole lot of bother and the other racial heavies will likely provide several ways for the HMG to really shine. |
LT SHANKS
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
302
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Posted - 2013.07.25 22:21:00 -
[34] - Quote
Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:The fact that the HMG need 3/4 of its mag to kill 1 caldari shield tanked suit means it's fine?
any half decent caldari + AR player can dmg a heavy enough to almost 1v1 a good heavy. Not hard to do when they can strafe faster than a heavy can track, and they can't miss a heavy cuz of the huge hitbox.
Sorry, but the HMG is a joke compared to the AR. In CQC it's suppose to dominate, instead of just barely killing.
Again, I'm not even talking about pub games. I'm talking about going up against good players. By the time I'm done killing a caldari suit I need to reload. That's fine? lol Hey Lance, is the HMG the problem or is it the fact that the Heavy can't keep up with a back pedaling shield tanked strafer?
With better maneuverability, the Caldari can dance around your spray, strafe off without you being able to keep up, and move back, away from your optimal range. These you acknowledge. Now, where in your post do you give reason for your claim that the HMG is a joke. From what you posted, the problems stem from the suit itself: the one thing I have said that needs to be worked on.
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Lance 2ballzStrong
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
3142
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Posted - 2013.07.25 22:32:00 -
[35] - Quote
LT SHANKS wrote:Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:The fact that the HMG need 3/4 of its mag to kill 1 caldari shield tanked suit means it's fine?
any half decent caldari + AR player can dmg a heavy enough to almost 1v1 a good heavy. Not hard to do when they can strafe faster than a heavy can track, and they can't miss a heavy cuz of the huge hitbox.
Sorry, but the HMG is a joke compared to the AR. In CQC it's suppose to dominate, instead of just barely killing.
Again, I'm not even talking about pub games. I'm talking about going up against good players. By the time I'm done killing a caldari suit I need to reload. That's fine? lol Hey Lance, is the HMG the problem or is it the fact that the Heavy can't keep up with a back pedaling shield tanked strafer? With better maneuverability, the Caldari can dance around your spray, strafe off without you being able to keep up, and move back, away from your optimal range. These you acknowledge. Now, where in your post do you give reason for your claim that the HMG is a joke. From what you posted, the problems stem from the suit itself: the one thing I have said that needs to be worked on.
There's people that say the gun is fine, and other that say it's not. My personal opinion, is that it is not fine. It kills, sure, but my belief is that anything in 5m should be destroyed. CCP designed the gun to be effective in CQC, that's it's "strong point" yet it doesn't feel strong against proto caldari suits. It feels meh.
The other problem which might be compounding the HGM's weakness is the tracking speed. Again some people say it's fine, other say it's not. It's not fine. They gave us a CQC weapon with the inability to track targets in CQC?
The Amarr suit itself is fine. The Sentinel suit itself could use a better bonus though. Reload speed and dmg feedback reduction? |
calvin b
Molon Labe. League of Infamy
121
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Posted - 2013.07.25 23:16:00 -
[36] - Quote
I as a heavy feel the HMG is not what it should be. It needs a buff. All I ask is this proto heavy vs proto assault who do you think will win? If you said heavy your wrong. An assault can out play a heavy 95% or more on a regular basis. Now if the heavy corners the Assault then its a different story. Again the reason no one wants to buff the HMG is because of all the Assault players will QQ and CCP will nerf it. That is why this game has failed in so many ways, CCP has given into one class of players over and over to the point the rest of the weapons get no attention. If this wasn't so, why is the scout and the heavy still have only two suits and heavy has only 2 heavy like weapons. I have buffed my heavy to lvl 5 on almost everything, and it still is out gunned by a militia rifle. I am done arguing and defending this subject because the COD crowd of AR users have the say for they are the majority and no matter what I say it does not matter. If your a heavy and you say the HMG is fine then that is your opinion all you are doing is hurting the chances of this weapon becoming what it is supposed to be. |
Eno Raef
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
53
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Posted - 2013.07.25 23:32:00 -
[37] - Quote
Cosgar wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Chibi Andy wrote:didnt CCP at one stage said that the HMG would also cause some sort of slow effect when the bullets hit someone?? its been a while, so i can't remember it properly It does. That's why I'm scared shitless of them, I have to jump around or else they will catch me in their stream of bullets and then I'm a gonner. If aiming and hit detection weren't so borked, the HMG would probably be fine.
Maybe hit detection is all it is. When I shoot people it always seems as if they hardly take any damage but I notice this with other weapons except the sniper rifle. The HMG along with other weapons seemed to never fail in Chromosome. I just don't understand how other players seem to have much better hit detection. I've wear 2 complex damage mods with lvl 5 HMG proficiency on my HMG load out and 3 on my AR load outs but others always seem to out damage me easily. For the most part have quit engaging anyone since my bullets cause too little damage. I've been forced into boredom by sniping where hit detection doesn't seem to be as bad. |
ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1259
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Posted - 2013.07.26 00:44:00 -
[38] - Quote
I bet if you decoupled the move speed and aiming sensitivity and removed the speed penalty on armor plates, heavies would be OP lol. |
Delilah Judge-Slayer
Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire
7
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Posted - 2013.07.26 00:59:00 -
[39] - Quote
Speaking from RL experience with both AR's and mini-guns. Which is what the HMG is. It's not really a "Heavy" machine gun at all.
If you were to throw any intention of maintaining game balance the HMG mini-gun would absolutely shred everything in it's path. Most fire 7.62 NATO and just one bullet is enough to kill a man. Being shot from a mini-gun you literally have bullets that are mere inches apart from one another. It doesn't need AP ammo because it literally will pound it's way through just about anything through sheer volume of fire.
So imagine AR bullet damage spewing from the HMG. Because that's how it works in reality.
DUST 514 is clearly not reality and CCP obviously didn't spend any time at a firing range to understand how modern, non-futuristic weapons work.
A real heavy machine gun is something more like a .50 cal M2 Browning "Ma Deuce". ROF of around 500 RPM and very very hard hitting. Most M2's are mounted on vehicles and are attached to 500 to 1000 round boxes of belt ammo. Recoil and shot spread is moderate, but range is not a problem.
I know what CCP wanted to do. They wanted to put the "Predator" machine gun in DUST. Because it's "cool". It's statistics are pretty much the same. 2000-6000 RPM, etc. They only difference is that the HMG in DUST 514 is more like a fully automatic .22 rimfire minigun. Yes it will kill you but it's going to tickle you to death and your bullets are actually made of marshmallow lead because after about 100 meters or so they just vanish. |
Rynoceros
Rise Of Old Dudes
368
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Posted - 2013.07.26 01:17:00 -
[40] - Quote
HMG is a capable win machine, now. Could use a damage buff, hit detection fix, or dispersion fix - just one of those would probably sufflice.
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Boomer Dues Mortis
D3ath D3alers
180
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Posted - 2013.07.26 01:29:00 -
[41] - Quote
I would like to see a 5% buff to both range and dispersion, or if they do not want to do that. fix the hit detection. On numerous occasions I have put rounds into people for them to take no damage. |
DJINN leukoplast
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
840
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Posted - 2013.07.26 01:32:00 -
[42] - Quote
Agree, the HMG is indeed fine. Unless I am running my shield tanked calogi suit, if I run across a heavy a lot of the time I can't get away before it takes me down. Even using an advanced minmatar assault with great movement/sprint speed, tanked as much as possible in shields and using a MD, the heavy is almost untouchable and I die in an instant if I come across them.
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NOAMIzzzzz
The Shadow Cavalry Mercenaries DARKSTAR ARMY
5
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Posted - 2013.07.26 01:53:00 -
[43] - Quote
the HMG is OK but...the heavy suit iisen't it needs something like turn speed or just alittle movement or something... |
Delta90212
R.I.f.t
13
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Posted - 2013.07.26 10:48:00 -
[44] - Quote
Delilah Judge-Slayer wrote:Speaking from RL experience with both AR's and mini-guns. Which is what the HMG is. It's not really a "Heavy" machine gun at all. If you were to throw any intention of maintaining game balance the HMG mini-gun would absolutely shred everything in it's path. Most fire 7.62 NATO and just one bullet is enough to kill a man. Being shot from a mini-gun you literally have bullets that are mere inches apart from one another. It doesn't need AP ammo because it literally will pound it's way through just about anything through sheer volume of fire. So imagine AR bullet damage spewing from the HMG. Because that's how it works in reality. DUST 514 is clearly not reality and CCP obviously didn't spend any time at a firing range to understand how modern, non-futuristic weapons work. A real heavy machine gun is something more like a .50 cal M2 Browning "Ma Deuce". ROF of around 500 RPM and very very hard hitting. Most M2's are mounted on vehicles and are attached to 500 to 1000 round boxes of belt ammo. Recoil and shot spread is moderate, but range is not a problem. I know what CCP wanted to do. They wanted to put the "Predator" machine gun in DUST. Because it's "cool". It's statistics are pretty much the same. 2000-6000 RPM, etc. They only difference is that the HMG in DUST 514 is more like a fully automatic .22 rimfire minigun. Yes it will kill you but it's going to tickle you to death and your bullets are actually made of marshmallow lead because after about 100 meters or so they just vanish. At 100 meters you can cut a target in half with a minigun with only 50 rounds. That's one round for every half inch or so. The HMG we have now should be relegated to a "light" weapon. A new weapon put in place of the current HMG that has lower RPM, higher damage, greater range, similar accuracy, and half the magazine size of the current HMG. Something more akin to a M242 Bushmaster chaingun.
I'm not sure if you noticed we are faaaar in the future where armor and shields are designed to withstand almost everything for a short amount of time i am pretty sure that a HMG will take a couple of seconds chewing up a dropsuit
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