As many of you know, EoN is currently being attacked by people... which includes the districts owned by Ahrendee Mercenaries. That's fine... war is fun, and the rewards from PC battles are a nice amount of ISK, and generally a skill level above that of regular pub stomps.

One thing that makes it nice? How about a gentlemen's agreement from both sides involved to NOT use either Flaylocks or explode-on-contact grenades (unless, of course, the other side uses them first)?

CCP.... when your end-game players (and PC is the current end-game of Dust) are making agreements to not use what are arguably effective weapons because they are so over-powered and broken.... you must take this opportunity to review both the existence and the balance of said weapons.

Please CCP - you listening to all the QQ'ing about the TAC AR, you fixed the range issues that arose post-Uprising... please listen to your community, your players, your paying customers, and do something about Flaylocks and Contact Grenades.

Regards,
Nightbird (on behalf of the community at large)

Wait. You're proposing an agreement, and then asserting for the rest of your post that the agreement is already in effect?

Wait. You're proposing an agreement, and then asserting for the rest of your post that the agreement is already in effect?

You must be out of the loop. The agreememt to take the weapons out is NOT because the weapon is OP. It is because they want to prevent people from Q.Qing. Which was already happening, almost all related threads were filling up with flaylock callouts. The leaders know that they don't run corporations, they run daycares full of crybabies that can't follow a simple instruction to "not Q.Q or troll the enemies". So they made an agreement.

Has less to do with the items as you think and more to do with alliance members being a bunch or crybabies, and you leaders being smarter than you.

Think about it. The crossbow is easy to train into, didn't take any skill to aim and use, and provide equal if not greater killing power than that of a traditional bow and arrow.

So, to stop the "You have weapons that can kill us, and make us feel sad" crowd from drowning in their own tears.

There has been a decision to tie one hand behind your back, to give the other team a chance.

This is a very admirable.

I am wondering just how far this will go before all whining stops?

Will we see full Starter Fit PC battles in the future?

Will all PC battles have to be fought by newly created "Academy" Alts?

What happened to the noble tradition of "Tear Collection"?

Can we just all agree to use AR?

No... diversity is the spice of life. I am fine with Scrambler rifles... LRs (though they need a bit of a buff), forge guns (even the roof-top snipers), sniper rifles, shotguns and mass drivers (bit noob-ish, but whatever).

Each weapon has a roll, and all contribute to a diverse game. Flaylock and contact grenades are broken and unbalanced, and their use (and abuse) lower the quality of the game.

I like to think that the people actually involved in PC, who are dedicating their time and resources to it, are genuinely concerned about making sure that they enjoy their experience.

They are doing what CCP *should* have done... removing the Flaylock and Contact Grenades from the equation.

When crossbows were invented during the medieval ages, the Pope at the time felt that the crossbow was OP and decided to ban them from warfare. This was the first recorded nerf of any first person shooter in human history.

When crossbows were invented during the medieval ages, the Pope at the time felt that the crossbow was OP and decided to ban them from warfare. This was the first recorded nerf of any first person shooter in human history.

...effectively killing real people isn't the same as fake killing people for fun.

Under that logic, CCP should just design one weapon who kills everyone on the map with the press of a button. Then the game can just be a race to spawn and button mash. It'll be a ton of fun.

Am I the only one who finds MDs far more problematic than I do flaylocks?

How about a MD player with a Flaylock as a secondary?

Annoyed yet?

Now give that player remote explosives.

Now give that player remote explosives.

You must be out of the loop. The agreememt to take the weapons out is NOT because the weapon is OP. It is because they want to prevent people from Q.Qing. Which was already happening, almost all related threads were filling up with flaylock callouts. The leaders know that they don't run corporations, they run daycares full of crybabies that can't follow a simple instruction to "not Q.Q or troll the enemies". So they made an agreement.

Has less to do with the items as you think and more to do with alliance members being a bunch or crybabies, and you leaders being smarter than you.

ccp listens like korea fires missiles....NOT VERY WELL

Think about it. The crossbow is easy to train into, didn't take any skill to aim and use, and provide equal if not greater killing power than that of a traditional bow and arrow.

Is there an agreement against orbitals and murder taxis and droplink spams and cal logis and spamming nades from multiple nanohives as well?

Am I the only one who finds MDs far more problematic than I do flaylocks?

Do you see the problems yet or should I provide images and calculations for you?

Yet another NPC corp player running his mouth.

Sit quietly little man, your betters are speaking.

So, to stop the "You have weapons that can kill us, and make us feel sad" crowd from drowning in their own tears.

There has been a decision to tie one hand behind your back, to give the other team a chance.

This is a very admirable.

I am wondering just how far this will go before all whining stops?

Will we see full Starter Fit PC battles in the future?

Will all PC battles have to be fought by newly created "Academy" Alts?

What happened to the noble tradition of "Tear Collection"?

I'll address this post on behalf of everyone. Shut up bro. Uplink spams are logis doing their job. If you can't handle it then keep playing call of duty. You have a point on Logistics... running over everyone is lame... If it hurts you so much train up in flux grenades and a mass driver / swarm launchers, or lai dai grenades. Pretty simple fix. Nanohives also run out of ammo much faster when you restock grenades. If three people come to a nanohive and get 9 grenades from it, it dies. If 6 people refill their ammo from a nanohive it dies. (talking proto here). Get over it.

I used to play DUST 514 but then I took a crossbow arrow to the knee.

So, to stop the "You have weapons that can kill us, and make us feel sad" crowd from drowning in their own tears.

There has been a decision to tie one hand behind your back, to give the other team a chance.

This is a very admirable.

I am wondering just how far this will go before all whining stops?

Will we see full Starter Fit PC battles in the future?

Will all PC battles have to be fought by newly created "Academy" Alts?

What happened to the noble tradition of "Tear Collection"?

Am I the only one who finds MDs far more problematic than I do flaylocks?

You must be out of the loop. The agreememt to take the weapons out is NOT because the weapon is OP. It is because they want to prevent people from Q.Qing. Which was already happening, almost all related threads were filling up with flaylock callouts. The leaders know that they don't run corporations, they run daycares full of crybabies that can't follow a simple instruction to "not Q.Q or troll the enemies". So they made an agreement.

Has less to do with the items as you think and more to do with alliance members being a bunch or crybabies, and you leaders being smarter than you.

My Thunker grenades have a blast radius of 2.5m and don't always kill on contact...

...effectively killing real people isn't the same as fake killing people for fun.

Under that logic, CCP should just design one weapon who kills everyone on the map with the press of a button. Then the game can just be a race to spawn and button mash. It'll be a ton of fun.

just 90% of the time? you poor baby you. I have to hit a small, fast moving target, accounting for lag with my pistol. and it still takes 2-3 shots.

Thukker grenades take more skill then a core flaylock does.

did I say flaylock pistol? I said pistol. which means scrambler pistol. you know, the one that works like an actual pistol.
Sorry I thought you were talking about the flaylock

and really? you get more splash damage, and a bigger radius. how exactly is that harder?
Yes but we have 3 while they have more ammo + 3 per clip. Also flaylocks are easier to aim. Also only .5 more splash (I'm only talking about the Core flaylock BTW)

I haven't used flaylocks since they came out(wanted to use the lock on variant that they were ****teasing us with... just like, uh... pretty much everything that was supposed to be in the game at release. That happened 2 months ago, where are the jets, mtacs, racial suits, racial guns? oh right, SOONtm)
The players asked CCP to improve the core gameplay mechanics before releasing more content. So you can blame it on other people.

Yep... and the crossbow was highly effective against mounted knights in armor... and who had more armor and mounted soldiers than the crown and the church.

This wasn't about banning a weapon because it was OP.... it was about banning a weapon that would give the common man the ability to take down the symbol of authority (crown or church).

Is there an agreement against orbitals and murder taxis and droplink spams and cal logis and spamming nades from multiple nanohives as well?

SNIP

and that's why I hate other people. they want the game to be "fixed" before everything is actually in. if we had all the weapons and vehicles, and gameplay we were shown and told would be there, it would be better balanced, since CCP is balancing everything for what it's going to fight in 4 years when they launch it. then it gets horribad broken since it's counter doesn't exist yet. except for the scrambler rifle, since everyone was stacking shields, it works in it's role, and look, no one is complaining about it.

Flaylocks could certainly use a few small nerfs, but banning them from PC? They aren't that "broken"

Me thinks you're not as good as you think you are

So when do ARs get banned, or do they require too much "skill" to be OP?

The problem isn't skill. It's the fact that in skilled hands, the CFLP becomes so powerful it's not even funny. It can outshine any other weapon in CQC, and so whole teams were using them in the compound. It became less of a gun game, and more of a CQC Zerg with explosives everywhere. Both alliances hated how the gameplay had become, so they made a mutual agreement to disuse the weapons in favor of tactical gameplay.

...effectively killing real people isn't the same as fake killing people for fun.

Under that logic, CCP should just design one weapon who kills everyone on the map with the press of a button. Then the game can just be a race to spawn and button mash. It'll be a ton of fun.

Is there an agreement against orbitals and murder taxis and droplink spams and cal logis and spamming nades from multiple nanohives as well?

Seriously, yet another QQ about Cal Logi? Tell me seriously if you have fitted a full Proto Cal Logi yet? If not, then please tell me how we are OP? The Cal Logi is the ONLY suit that actually has a full balance, meaning it's racial and suit bonus make sense and add to the effectiveness of the suit. Instead of QQ'ing for a nerf of the Cal Logi, perhaps ask for a balance of the other suits who need to have better bonuses.

Not to mention, the cost it takes to outfit a Cal Logi Proto. The Cost to run the suit, the bright Yellow making for a more immediate target. While they have toned the suit down, colored suits are typically a priority suit.

Also, if I am standing in the middle of a field, trying to res your dead ass, I better have more HP to do so, otherwise I'm going to walk past your ass and leave you dead so I don't die too.

It's seriously NOT hard to kill a Cal Logi if you know what your doing. We are some of the easiest if you are fitted correctly to kill next to scouts. The only Cal Logi's I have seen that damn near are as bad ass as a heavy are in The Generals Corp. Maxed Shield, Maxed Armor, Proto. However kill one a few times and you hit that pocket book pretty hard.

Last note, with the radius hit to MD, it now takes a bit more skill to use. While yes they are still somewhat a noob weapon, they are effective. Would you prefer a Logi with a pistol watching your heavies back and keeping him rep'd up? Or a Logi with a MD/Tac/Etc, with good shields, good armor, and good rep tool, injector, hives to protect your ass?

I agree the Flaylock needs to be looked at, but I am not going to QQ about them, I just learn to stay away from them and kill them a different way than stand toe to toe with them.

All of these derps trying to save the gayest weapon in the game. Get a gun and aim it....try to use some sort of skill.

When crossbows were invented during the medieval ages, the Pope at the time felt that the crossbow was OP and decided to ban them from warfare. This was the first recorded nerf of any first person shooter in human history.

Think about it. The crossbow is easy to train into, didn't take any skill to aim and use, and provide equal if not greater killing power than that of a traditional bow and arrow.

So master, why didnt you take up a sniper, tac, scr etc and kill all these non skilled opponents.

Yeah - that non FP treaty was the way to go.

Mad Skills