There is so much counterintuitive, strange, and bad design decisions with the laser rifle:

It does low damage up close, but does higher damage the further away you shoot... but it starts doing low damage again once you exceed a certain range. That is just silly, lasers do not work that way at all. It is made even worse by the fact that the game doesn't explain that at all.

Giving a mid-long range laser weapon an ironsight was not a good idea. Even worse, giving it a sight that blocks the user from seeing the beam, no one in CCP testing this weapon before Uprising thought it was a bad idea? A close-range shotgun has a better sight than the laser rifle.

The weapon does damage the longer it fires, that is also silly, but at least the game actually explains it to you when you spawn with the weapon (unlike the range thing). This incentivises players to miss on purpose at first until the laser builds up enough damage, this is because initially hitting your target is only good for scaring them away. This does not reward skill.

How the laser should be:

Damage should not be dependent on range. I propose lowering the base damage to 15, but make it just as good at close range as mid range. Damage should then drop at the 80 meter ranges.

Get rid of the ironsight, give it a sight like the scrambler rifle.

Make damage build on the target, not on the laser. Damage buildup should not be based on how long the laser has fired, but how of it hit the target. The longer you hit the target, the more damage should increase. It will reward precise aiming skill, and also makes sense because the laser should be heating up the enemy's from continuous fire.

pew pew, pew pew, pew

1)nope. Better have it increasing in dmg uptil 95m
2) better zoom optics please
3) nope. It would still be useless, considering that it will damage you initially at 15/-shot. I propose a much-more rapid increase in damage should you go with this suggestion

If damage builds up on target as opposed to on beam, then wouldn't you think it would make it even more useless?

Then your target manages to escape the bean, so now the weapon does the same damage it did before you had it on target.

The range issue is correct, as it does make no sense.

Everybody and their grandma knows about how sucky the LR sights are.

There is so much counterintuitive, strange, and bad design decisions with the laser rifle:

It does low damage up close, but does higher damage the further away you shoot... but it starts doing low damage again once you exceed a certain range. That is just silly, lasers do not work that way at all. It is made even worse by the fact that the game doesn't explain that at all.

Giving a mid-long range laser weapon an ironsight was not a good idea. Even worse, giving it a sight that blocks the user from seeing the beam, no one in CCP testing this weapon before Uprising thought it was a bad idea? A close-range shotgun has a better sight than the laser rifle.

The weapon does damage the longer it fires, that is also silly, but at least the game actually explains it to you when you spawn with the weapon (unlike the range thing). This incentivises players to miss on purpose at first until the laser builds up enough damage, this is because initially hitting your target is only good for scaring them away. This does not reward skill.

How the laser should be:

Damage should not be dependent on range. I propose lowering the base damage to 15, but make it just as good at close range as mid range. Damage should then drop at the 80 meter ranges.

Get rid of the ironsight, give it a sight like the scrambler rifle.

Make damage build on the target, not on the laser. Damage buildup should not be based on how long the laser has fired, but how of it hit the target. The longer you hit the target, the more damage should increase. It will reward precise aiming skill, and also makes sense because the laser should be heating up the enemy's from continuous fire.

EDIT: the damage buildup needs to happen faster also.

pew pew, pew pew, pew

Im fairly certain I read somewhere that the explained reason for the range is that the beam doesn't completely focus till a certain distance, hence the low damage up close. If you know some basic optics from physics this actually makes a good bit of sense.

That might work as an explanation if the beam started out wide, narrowed to a point, then diverged again, but it's a constant narrow beam.

Instead I would go with "frequency matching" bs where the three seprate beams composing the main beam have differing wavelengths and they have to all align for maximum power transfer through material. Of course with the short wavelength of light that:

A) would happen at far shorter distances
And
B) repeat over and over down the length of the beam

So forget it. There is no believable explanation for the screwy damage profile.
It's just there because it balances the weapon.

There is so much counterintuitive, strange, and bad design decisions with the laser rifle:

It does low damage up close, but does higher damage the further away you shoot... but it starts doing low damage again once you exceed a certain range. That is just silly, lasers do not work that way at all. It is made even worse by the fact that the game doesn't explain that at all.

Giving a mid-long range laser weapon an ironsight was not a good idea. Even worse, giving it a sight that blocks the user from seeing the beam, no one in CCP testing this weapon before Uprising thought it was a bad idea? A close-range shotgun has a better sight than the laser rifle.

The weapon does damage the longer it fires, that is also silly, but at least the game actually explains it to you when you spawn with the weapon (unlike the range thing). This incentivises players to miss on purpose at first until the laser builds up enough damage, this is because initially hitting your target is only good for scaring them away. This does not reward skill.

How the laser should be:

Damage should not be dependent on range. I propose lowering the base damage to 15, but make it just as good at close range as mid range. Damage should then drop at the 80 meter ranges.

Get rid of the ironsight, give it a sight like the scrambler rifle.

Make damage build on the target, not on the laser. Damage buildup should not be based on how long the laser has fired, but how of it hit the target. The longer you hit the target, the more damage should increase. It will reward precise aiming skill, and also makes sense because the laser should be heating up the enemy's from continuous fire.

EDIT: the damage buildup needs to happen faster also.

pew pew, pew pew, pew

so im the only one left using them? nice.. burn burn burn!!!!

Laser needs A better scope , better iron sight sensetivity. Those are the two things ccp must do to make the laser decent again. What I would also like to see is a 5% heat reduction skill because I think it's unfair that only the amarr assault gets it because I use to long range tank with. Lastly the age old question of DMG output I think it's fine the way it is because it takes 1.2 secounds for a scout, 3.5 secounds for medium and 6.5 to 7.5 secounds for a heavy like it should if ccp changed the DMG output lower it would be completely useless if it where higher it would be to fast. the lr just needs better aiming and tracking.

so im the only one left using them? nice.. burn burn burn!!!!

I don't think its unfair at all. Its a weapon designed to be used by Amarrians....not by mercenaries, traitors, and heretics.

I don't think that's a good point since I'm sure no race would want their weapons being used by everyone either.

But what I am saying is that a dropsuit designed by that race would take into account its own style of warfare.

I don't think its unfair the gallente get a CPU reduction of hybrid weapons, or the caldari get a reload boost, nor do I think the Minnies have a bad bonus in having extra side arm rounds.

The Amarr bonus is perfectly sound, while I do agree a skill would be nice it would just make the amarr suit better which Im not going to complain about.....even so its hardly unfair the amarr get a bonus to the weapon type the dropsuit was intended to be used with.

I agree there should be a heat buildup reduction skill, because the laser is not worth using at all without the Amarr assault. No other race has their weapon's performance so dependent on their specific suit. A CPU reduction, and an almost worthless reload bonus doesn't really compare IMO.

Good thing I'm specced into Amarr mediums on my main, so I can get an Amarr assault later on for laser rifle (only tested it on an alt).

Lol you're not the only one I use them exclusively with my smg. And on the note of laser rifles you people do realize why the optimal range is the way it is, because it's supposed to be a DEFENSIVE weapon. When using this gun you're basically a sentry gun defending an area which is why this gun truely shines in skirmish and domination. Also to those saying this gun is horrible and useless you might be using it wrong cause I've gone 15/3 all the way up to 27/0 with this gun and with less than 10 assists. Of course i would LOVE a new sight for the gun and a short range variant of the gun.

I don't think its unfair at all. Its a weapon designed to be used by Amarrians....not by mercenaries, traitors, and heretics.

I use amarr heavy..... FYI I should have the reduction I'm amarrian .....

There is so much counterintuitive, strange, and bad design decisions with the laser rifle:

It does low damage up close, but does higher damage the further away you shoot... but it starts doing low damage again once you exceed a certain range. That is just silly, lasers do not work that way at all. It is made even worse by the fact that the game doesn't explain that at all.

Giving a mid-long range laser weapon an ironsight was not a good idea. Even worse, giving it a sight that blocks the user from seeing the beam, no one in CCP testing this weapon before Uprising thought it was a bad idea? A close-range shotgun has a better sight than the laser rifle.

The weapon does damage the longer it fires, that is also silly, but at least the game actually explains it to you when you spawn with the weapon (unlike the range thing). This incentivises players to miss on purpose at first until the laser builds up enough damage, this is because initially hitting your target is only good for scaring them away. This does not reward skill.

How the laser should be:

Damage should not be dependent on range. I propose lowering the base damage to 15, but make it just as good at close range as mid range. Damage should then drop at the 80 meter ranges.

Get rid of the ironsight, give it a sight like the scrambler rifle.

EDIT: A scope would be even better.

Make damage build on the target, not on the laser. Damage buildup should not be based on how long the laser has fired, but how long it hit the target. The longer you hit the target, the more damage should increase. The heat buildup on the target should decrease slowly when the laser stops hitting it, but should not automatically reset. It will reward precise aiming skill, and also makes sense because the laser should be heating up the enemy's from continuous fire.

EDIT: the damage buildup needs to happen faster also.

pew pew, pew pew, pew

You know... for some reason, this thread made me consider the viability of having lasers be able to totally ignore shields, and directly impact armour.

Lets say we weakened damage even further, but implemented the damage scaling based on how long you had a laser on a target. Would that merit being able to ignore shields?

That sounds pretty freakin cool, though I would make it a variant, or an entirely different weapon type.

You know... for some reason, this thread made me consider the viability of having lasers be able to totally ignore shields, and directly impact armour.

Lets say we weakened damage even further, but implemented the damage scaling based on how long you had a laser on a target. Would that merit being able to ignore shields?

I think adding a dropsuit heat build up would be a terriable idea also I think ignoring shields would make no sense we want the weapon fixed not overpowerd and nerfed again or have it be more garbage, a couple things would balance it again
1.a REAL scope or have it back where it just zoomed In(anything is better than it is now)
2. Iron sight sensitivity changes with the sensitivity you set
3.Heat build up reduction skill or to make some people happy.... Only have the skill on amarr suits including assualt amarr sentinel and cammandos

I agree with 1, 2, and the first part of 3 but I think it would be unfair to give the amarr dropsuit even more of an advantage when using this gun you don't see this in any other suit. For example the minmatar assault suit gives a bonus to sidearm clip size but that affects ALL sidearms including the amarr scrambler pistol and the others. Maybe we should make it an individual skill so that everyone can get that skill and switch out the suit bonus for the amarr to something more suitable like less recoil for all light weapons since i know the scrambler rifle has a bunch when under continuos fire. What do you guys think? Or what suit bonus would be more suitable for the amarr?

That's a very good point I really don't have a problem with heat build up though I can go through about 70-75 rounds on my proto laser it's just a question of aiming the thing.

"You make it sound so awful that they need to bend physics a bit"

Let me tell you about how outer space in eve is more fluid than void. It's a common joke that we're actually playing internet space submarines.

I like the fact that the laser rifle works in a way that isn't intuitive. It's one of the few truly original weapons that makes me feel like I'm playing in a sci-fi universe rather than a modern military shooter with costumes.

I equate sci-fi with the existence of things that don't work exactly like things I can experience in real life, today. There is also very little hardness to the New Eden sci-fi. Physics least of all. Gameplay trumps science in this universe, which is why we have fluid mechanics for space and the concept of "up". When I play a game I look for things that add fun to the experience. Encountering a gun on the battlefield that makes me need to close the distance quickly if I want to live, or stick in cover and find a different approach, is fun. The more damage at range mechanic dramatically alters the strategy of the game. If we took your approach and made the laser have a damage profile that is identical to an assault rifle, then we might as well just reskin it as an assault rifle. The important thing isn't whether the gun displays bullets or light when it fires, but how the gun behaves and shapes your choices in a fight. Different is better than more of the same.

Kage - I'm with ya for 1 point, against ya for another, and completely undecided on the third.

Scope - yes.

Range / Damage Mechanic change I disagree with partly. I like the inverted range - keeps it better at Long range operation without being too powerful. But I agree that the drop off in damage at range is wierd. Shouldn't it just have a maximum range? The end of that max range is the end of the optimum as well? Make the range fully inverted.

Heat buildup? Meh. I don't know. As it stands its better for catching groups of guys in the open.

I would actually be fine with inverted range if it actually was what that is, but it isn't. It gets better at long range, but it starts to suck again, there's only like a 20 meter optimal. I would actually like it if the damage kept increasing with range, and at a certain point did not increase or decrease instead of sucking again.