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Kharga Lum
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
86
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Posted - 2013.07.10 21:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
I know they've stated that there will be no changes but this is some serious BS regarding tanks. A single heavy armor rep will outpace the damage from any proto large missile turret on a Falchion with Enforcer 3....and every other shield related vehicle skill at 5. ( Yes...I know...what a mistake thinking they'd have looked into balance by the time I capped out all my skills.)
So, instead of "balance" why not just make them totally equal and the differences purely cosmetic so that they are at least playable until a balance change can be made. I shouldn't have to spec into a different race to play as a tanker. Two options, one is pure comedy. Might as well be bright colors and shoot balloons.
I've posted numerous times about vehicle imbalances, as have others. I've yet to see a CCP response. I feel very much that I'm being told "Fuc|< off ". I didn't spec into the OP suit/vehicle-of-the-week and have paid the price.
I know their moto is "HTFU" but after trying and hoping this will be looked into...I shouldn't be so continuously disappointed by this game.
...patience running low.
This email was inspired by ambushing a Madrugar with a Falchion, watching the Madrugar slowly turn around and rip me apart. If there's a damage bonus for missiles vs armor it's laughable. When the damage you do gets repaired immediately it's frustrating. The shield equivalent struggles to keep up with basic or mid level AV.
I could write a book about the issues with vehicles, I might have to in order to get their attention. Most obvious of all is the x3 and x5 training discrepancy between Armor and Shield hardeners. At least could be fixed without new content/build.
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Void Echo
Internal Error.
League of Infamy
468
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Posted - 2013.07.10 21:41:00 -
[2] - Quote
no, just no, then you would make all tanks useless if there the same as the enforcers, you skilled into the enforcers, deal with the consequences |
Cy Clone1
Kinsho Swords
Caldari State
97
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Posted - 2013.07.10 21:46:00 -
[3] - Quote
enjoy waiting 15 sec to get less hp than an armor tank? If so pick a caldari tank! Don't worry you get 24 shields back passively every second. who needs speed when you are self sufficient killing machine.
Is the sales pitch used. |
Kharga Lum
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
86
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 21:48:00 -
[4] - Quote
Void Echo wrote:no, just no, then you would make all tanks useless if there the same as the enforcers
Not the same as the enforces. Just the same as each other. Right now ALL shield tanks are useless and their modules are so horribly outclassed by their armor counter parts.
As it stands right now only shield tanks are useless...if they're all useless then at least they'd be balanced but that was not my intent with that post.
Making tanks totally equal, as a temporary fix, would at least make them all playable. |
Kharga Lum
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
87
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 21:50:00 -
[5] - Quote
Cy Clone1 wrote:enjoy waiting 15 sec to get less hp than an armor tank? If so pick a caldari tank! Don't worry you get 24 shields back passively every second. who needs speed when you are self sufficient killing machine.
Is the sales pitch used.
With the shield regen skill at 5 it caps out at 26hp a sec! 4 extra hp/sec and it'll only cost you 621,840 sp. What a deal. |
Void Echo
Internal Error.
League of Infamy
469
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Posted - 2013.07.10 21:54:00 -
[6] - Quote
Kharga Lum wrote:Void Echo wrote:no, just no, then you would make all tanks useless if there the same as the enforcers Not the same as the enforces. Just the same as each other. Right now ALL shield tanks are useless and their modules are so horribly outclassed by their armor counter parts. As it stands right now only shield tanks are useless...if they're all useless then at least they'd be balanced but that was not my intent with that post. Making tanks totally equal, as a temporary fix, would at least make them all playable.
since the enforcers are meant to be better than standard, how about actually make them better? |
Cy Clone1
Kinsho Swords
Caldari State
99
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 21:55:00 -
[7] - Quote
Kharga Lum wrote:Cy Clone1 wrote:enjoy waiting 15 sec to get less hp than an armor tank? If so pick a caldari tank! Don't worry you get 24 shields back passively every second. who needs speed when you are self sufficient killing machine.
Is the sales pitch used. With the shield regen skill at 5 it caps out at 26hp a sec! 4 extra hp/sec and it'll only cost you 621,840 sp. What a deal.
 I know its a great skill. I mean armor tanks only get 15% better armor reps, which is aweful of coarse. Go shield tanks you cannot lose.
Disclaimer: shield tanks will not preform as described, I am not liable for any large amount of isk or sp wasted. |
Exmaple Core
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
506
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 21:56:00 -
[8] - Quote
Although its a good idea we dont want CCP to balance things by nerfing stuff. There is nothing wrong with armor tanks, their great and fair tanks its the shield tanks that are the promblem, their trash and those are the tanks that should be buffed |
Knight SoIaire
Rent-A-Murder Taxi
1147
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 21:57:00 -
[9] - Quote
Only if Shield tanks are buffed, and Armour tanks are left as is.
But knowing CCP, they'll probably nerf Armour tanks..... |
Kharga Lum
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
87
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 21:57:00 -
[10] - Quote
Void Echo wrote:Kharga Lum wrote:Void Echo wrote:no, just no, then you would make all tanks useless if there the same as the enforcers Not the same as the enforces. Just the same as each other. Right now ALL shield tanks are useless and their modules are so horribly outclassed by their armor counter parts. As it stands right now only shield tanks are useless...if they're all useless then at least they'd be balanced but that was not my intent with that post. Making tanks totally equal, as a temporary fix, would at least make them all playable. since the enforcers are meant to be better than standard, how about actually make them better?
This would be ideal. However CCP has stated that they will not make any changes to vehicles until more content has been introduced..."SOONtm" ( I f'ckin hate that "soon" crap, it's a complete disgrace ).
Which is a polite way of telling anyone who skilled into shield tanks to **** off. |
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Aizen Intiki
Ghost Wolf Industries
Alpha Wolf Pack
136
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Posted - 2013.07.10 21:58:00 -
[11] - Quote
HAHA no.Have you forgot that most used AV is better against armor? Plus Caldari HAV's are more manuverable than Gallente HAV's? The list goes on and on. The fix that Caldari HAV's need is for passive Shield regen to be viable, and then a slight boost to the out put of shield boosters for the Winmatar HAV's. Then, if I ever see a QQ thread about Caldari HAV's sucking I'll just laugh at it.
(note: increase the timer of the hardners to 15 seconds too.)
Peace, AIzen  |
Knight SoIaire
Rent-A-Murder Taxi
1149
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:00:00 -
[12] - Quote
Aizen Intiki wrote:HAHA no.Have you forgot that most used AV is better against armor? Plus Caldari HAV's are more manuverable than Gallente HAV's? The list goes on and on. The fix that Caldari HAV's need is for passive Shield regen to be viable, and then a slight boost to the out put of shield boosters for the Winmatar HAV's. Then, if I ever see a QQ thread about Caldari HAV's sucking I'll just laugh at it. (note: increase the timer of the hardners to 15 seconds too.) Peace, AIzen
15 Seconds?
Lol, 30 Seconds more like, Armour can have them active for 60 seconds. |
Kharga Lum
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
88
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:01:00 -
[13] - Quote
Aizen Intiki wrote:HAHA no.Have you forgot that most used AV is better against armor? Plus Caldari HAV's are more manuverable than Gallente HAV's? The list goes on and on. The fix that Caldari HAV's need is for passive Shield regen to be viable, and then a slight boost to the out put of shield boosters for the Winmatar HAV's. Then, if I ever see a QQ thread about Caldari HAV's sucking I'll just laugh at it. (note: increase the timer of the hardners to 15 seconds too.) Peace, AIzen
AV vs Armor is the theory but in practice they are still more devestating vs shield. Caldari HAV's are NOT more menuverable at all. Their base speed, acceleration and turn rate are lower. You're list needs more research. |
Aizen Intiki
Ghost Wolf Industries
Alpha Wolf Pack
136
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:05:00 -
[14] - Quote
Kharga Lum wrote:Aizen Intiki wrote:HAHA no.Have you forgot that most used AV is better against armor? Plus Caldari HAV's are more manuverable than Gallente HAV's? The list goes on and on. The fix that Caldari HAV's need is for passive Shield regen to be viable, and then a slight boost to the out put of shield boosters for the Winmatar HAV's. Then, if I ever see a QQ thread about Caldari HAV's sucking I'll just laugh at it. (note: increase the timer of the hardners to 15 seconds too.) Peace, AIzen AV vs Armor is the theory but in practice they are still more devestating vs shield. Caldari HAV's are NOT more menuverable at all. Their base speed, acceleration and are lower. You're list needs more research.
easier to turn, and if you put plates on vehicles, your turn rate, top speed and acceleration goes into the toilet. Base doesn't mean ****. Also, the Caldari vehicles all have a better turn rate, so you're wrong on that front. |
Exmaple Core
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
507
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:05:00 -
[15] - Quote
theres a post that does what this post is meant for but better. here ya goo
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=93323&find=unread |
Patoman Radiant
ZionTCD
151
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Posted - 2013.07.10 22:06:00 -
[16] - Quote
Knight SoIaire wrote:Only if Shield tanks are buffed, and Armour tanks are left as is.
But knowing CCP, they'll probably nerf Armour tanks.....
hopefully not, but then again this is coming from the people who thought buging the PG upgrade skill was a good idea, when literaly every other thing in the univese gets one including dropsuits, and spaceships.
I can read a cyber book that gets implanted in my brain all about how to fit suits and ships better, but never a tank, or other vehicle.
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Aizen Intiki
Ghost Wolf Industries
Alpha Wolf Pack
136
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:08:00 -
[17] - Quote
Knight SoIaire wrote:Aizen Intiki wrote:HAHA no.Have you forgot that most used AV is better against armor? Plus Caldari HAV's are more manuverable than Gallente HAV's? The list goes on and on. The fix that Caldari HAV's need is for passive Shield regen to be viable, and then a slight boost to the out put of shield boosters for the Winmatar HAV's. Then, if I ever see a QQ thread about Caldari HAV's sucking I'll just laugh at it. (note: increase the timer of the hardners to 15 seconds too.) Peace, AIzen 15 Seconds? Lol, 30 Seconds more like, Armour can have them active for 60 seconds.
It's a burst tank. It's not supposed to last that long. On equal terms, my repps would have turned off on the same time, so both our major tanks are gone. I don't see the problem. |
Exmaple Core
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
511
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:12:00 -
[18] - Quote
nerfing armor tanks is not the answer and CCP should know that. give CCP some credit |
Kharga Lum
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
89
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:12:00 -
[19] - Quote
Thanks for the link. This one is way more articulate. |
Exmaple Core
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
511
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:14:00 -
[20] - Quote
Kharga Lum wrote:Thanks for the link. This one is way more articulate.
lol. tell that to your corpmate, Jason  |
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Takahiro Kashuken
Red STar.
EoN.
644
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Posted - 2013.07.10 22:15:00 -
[21] - Quote
lol he thinks enforcers are good |
Patoman Radiant
ZionTCD
151
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:16:00 -
[22] - Quote
Aizen Intiki wrote:Kharga Lum wrote:Aizen Intiki wrote:HAHA no.Have you forgot that most used AV is better against armor? Plus Caldari HAV's are more manuverable than Gallente HAV's? The list goes on and on. The fix that Caldari HAV's need is for passive Shield regen to be viable, and then a slight boost to the out put of shield boosters for the Winmatar HAV's. Then, if I ever see a QQ thread about Caldari HAV's sucking I'll just laugh at it. (note: increase the timer of the hardners to 15 seconds too.) Peace, AIzen AV vs Armor is the theory but in practice they are still more devestating vs shield. Caldari HAV's are NOT more menuverable at all. Their base speed, acceleration and are lower. You're list needs more research. easier to turn, and if you put plates on vehicles, your turn rate, top speed and acceleration goes into the toilet. Base doesn't mean ****. Also, the Caldari vehicles all have a better turn rate, so you're wrong on that front.
Still find it easy enough to be quite manuverable in a armor tank.
Checking the stats, the maduger has a higher base HP, and higher top speed. So.... yes it literaly has more of everything.
Before the offical release diffference actualy existed but the manuverability of both tanks has been brought in line, so caldari have both subpar tanking (total HP, and reping) and subpar speed.
No sheild tank has ever outrun me, and nearly all I slaughter, including the proto tank.
it works in your theory word, on the field you are playing a gimped tank, and will lose in 9/10 tank duels with a maduger. I am not even sure why I should be saying its unbalanced, anyone who is smart will just pick the I win tank, and the rest can deal wiz it, and pad my KDR when it comes to tanks. |
Kharga Lum
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
89
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:16:00 -
[23] - Quote
Exmaple Core wrote:Kharga Lum wrote:Thanks for the link. This one is way more articulate. lol. tell that to your corpmate, Jason
"Articulate" may have been a bit of an exaggeration... ;) |
Kharga Lum
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
89
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:18:00 -
[24] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:lol he thinks enforcers are good
Well this is exactly my point. No I don't think they're good but I couldn't have described the state of any shield tank more succinctly. |
Patoman Radiant
ZionTCD
151
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:21:00 -
[25] - Quote
Kharga Lum wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:lol he thinks enforcers are good Well this is exactly my point. No I don't think they're good but I couldn't have described the state of any shield tank more succinctly.
I have seen people put rails on enforcers even though neither one has a bonus to them.
I really wish tank losses and kills could be a stat, mine would be very positive compared with many of the dumber tankers.
Also it would really prove who has merit in talking about how to use tanks, see how a higher turn rate works vs a maduger.
And a very spesific manuver I use vs tanks that have missiles and rails, is to get right next to them and charge back and forth, reduces damage by a good half or more. So yes, madugers have plenty of manuverability, and that mabey faster turn rate, seems not to be saving many sheild tanks. |
Kharga Lum
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
90
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:23:00 -
[26] - Quote
Patoman Radiant wrote:Kharga Lum wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:lol he thinks enforcers are good Well this is exactly my point. No I don't think they're good but I couldn't have described the state of any shield tank more succinctly. I have seen people put rails on enforcers even though neither one has a bonus to them. I really wish tank losses and kills could be a stat, mine would be very positive compared with many of the dumber tankers.
"Dumb tanker", in this build, means anyone using shield tanks. |
Exmaple Core
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
512
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:24:00 -
[27] - Quote
Aizen Intiki wrote:HAHA no.Have you forgot that most used AV is better against armor? Plus Caldari HAV's are more manuverable than Gallente HAV's? The list goes on and on. The fix that Caldari HAV's need is for passive Shield regen to be viable, and then a slight boost to the out put of shield boosters for the Winmatar HAV's. Then, if I ever see a QQ thread about Caldari HAV's sucking I'll just laugh at it. (note: increase the timer of the hardners to 15 seconds too.) Peace, AIzen
LMAO you have to be a radiant, cuz protoman isent a dumbass like you. get your facts straight, better natural regen is only a small part in fixing the toy caldari tanks and caldari are rediculasly slower than armor tanks |
Exmaple Core
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
512
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:25:00 -
[28] - Quote
Kharga Lum wrote:Patoman Radiant wrote:Kharga Lum wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:lol he thinks enforcers are good Well this is exactly my point. No I don't think they're good but I couldn't have described the state of any shield tank more succinctly. I have seen people put rails on enforcers even though neither one has a bonus to them. I really wish tank losses and kills could be a stat, mine would be very positive compared with many of the dumber tankers. "Dumb tanker", in this build, means anyone using shield tanks.
yepp. i wish i was good, but im just a shield tank |
Aizen Intiki
Ghost Wolf Industries
Alpha Wolf Pack
136
|
Posted - 2013.07.10 22:26:00 -
[29] - Quote
Exmaple Core wrote:Aizen Intiki wrote:HAHA no.Have you forgot that most used AV is better against armor? Plus Caldari HAV's are more manuverable than Gallente HAV's? The list goes on and on. The fix that Caldari HAV's need is for passive Shield regen to be viable, and then a slight boost to the out put of shield boosters for the Winmatar HAV's. Then, if I ever see a QQ thread about Caldari HAV's sucking I'll just laugh at it. (note: increase the timer of the hardners to 15 seconds too.) Peace, AIzen LMAO you have to be a radiant, cuz protoman isent a dumbass like you. get your facts straight, better natural regen is only a small part in fixing the toy caldari tanks and caldari are rediculasly slower than armor tanks
without plates, that is true. a 120mm or 180mm plates and it's the exact opposite. And actually, doing so will make them better. It's not like you're supposed to be on the front lines with a blaster  |
Patoman Radiant
ZionTCD
151
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Posted - 2013.07.10 22:29:00 -
[30] - Quote
Exmaple Core wrote:Kharga Lum wrote:Patoman Radiant wrote:Kharga Lum wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:lol he thinks enforcers are good Well this is exactly my point. No I don't think they're good but I couldn't have described the state of any shield tank more succinctly. I have seen people put rails on enforcers even though neither one has a bonus to them. I really wish tank losses and kills could be a stat, mine would be very positive compared with many of the dumber tankers. "Dumb tanker", in this build, means anyone using shield tanks. yepp. i wish i was good, but im just a shield tank
If you manage to be good with a sheild tank, it means you are realy good at it because you are using a gimped tank, you have to use tatics I did when using millita tanks vs standard or maraduers like
1. not engaging a tank unless heavly wounded, and or doing a suprise attack from the back
2. sniping (and doing it from hull down, not geting hit)
3. waiting for them to exaust repers, and hardeners
4. never geting hit in general, and allways ready to run if you don't have a heavy advantage |
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