This fix is supposed to make shields and armor have unique roles.


Please read GÇ£[P2] Roles of shield and armourGÇ¥, where the roles of shield and armor are covered.


Here are the list of things done, I will then expand on each:
-All plates HP increased by 2x
-Plates movement penalties changed to 5/7.5/10
-Armor reps changed to 5/7.5/10
-Armor reps now have a unique mechanic
-Gallente suits are given an inherent 5hp/s regeneration, helping lower level armor tanking


You might see the 2x HP increase and think GÇ£WTFGÇ¥, and I expected that.
But see, armor is supposed to have much higher HP than shields do, but because we need to use half our slots for reps, the HP gained is lost, while still having less reps.


But then you think GÇ£But didnGÇÖt you just increase reps amount?GÇ¥, and thatGÇÖs true, but hear me out on this.
This is the main part of the idea:
If you read the Roles of shield and armor part, then you would know that shields are skirmishers, they dictate their range, get out of battle, regenerate quickly and come back.
Armor is a brawler, taking a good punch while dealing lots of damage and regenerating under fire, but need repair tools to repair properly outside of battle.
Armor is also slow, which means it canGÇÖt dictate range, and canGÇÖt run out of battle as quickly, and its a very easy target.
Also has problems with power projection, taking time to respond to enemies taking your objectives, or teammates need help.
So taking this into consideration, I have got an idea to solidify the armor tanking role.
When you take damage from an enemy (not just any damage, like fall damage), your reps work at 100%.
The longer time has passed from the last time you took damage, the slower your reps work, down to 25% at the lowest level.
It goes like this:
0-5 seconds = 100%
5-10 seconds = 75%
10-15 seconds = 50%
15 seconds and beyond = 25%


The basic and enhanced plates penalty has been increased, because in its current form, the penalty rises very disproportionately to the HP gained.
This fixes the problem, making complex plates worthwhile.


New plates numbers:
Basic plate = 130HP, -5% speed
Enhanced plate = 174HP - 7.5% speed
Complex plate = 230HP - 10% speed


Some numbers.
Gallente Assault:
210 Armor HP + 230HP + 230HP (2x Complex plates) = 670 HP
The other two slots are used for armor repairers, and in addition to the inherent rep speed this turns into 25hp/s of regeneration at the first 5 seconds you take damage.
After 15 seconds this rep drops to 25%, putting it at 6.25, which is painfully slow.

Now that's just insanity tbh.

Forgot about that, carry-on, this seems to be a good fix. Although I still think damage should be increased :)

With this in place I would actually use Damage modifiers :)

Were is this list sir.

let them suffer as we did

Just give it up people. CCP will never give us Gallente's what we want. They love their precious shields and Caldari's far too much.

Agreeing with a Mobius thread......world is gonna end....gg lol
+1

Not really, you guys are extremely fast so you can dodge bullets, also hit box goes back to normal when your shields are down so you should invest in armor. Regardless scouts are UP now, so once they are buffed then this would be a fair implementation.

of course, i use a gallente scout, but minma scout-shotgun all use complex shield extenders

Man this takes armor tanking from slightly weaker to FAR stronger than shields. I mean, wow, this is too major of a buff.

Have you guys considered that armor is the only one capable of active regen? One nanohive, repair tool, and these reppers and good lord 200hp per/sec is achievable, screw speed when you are invincible. Shields ONLY have passive regen and you want reppers to equal that, why? Plus shields have a delay, none of the ACTIVE repair methods do, this delay is not something easily shrugged off.

Let's look at the disparities between shields vs armor:
1. Shields have no penalty: This needs fixed, hitbox increase is one route I'm fine with that. I prefer shield tanks lasting longer on minimap once spotted as it follows Eve Lore, ala BF3, but I digress.
2. Skills allow mods to be both in highs and lows for shields: I understand this, despite shields requiring 3 skill vs armor's 2 but are less vital, so I think regulators should go into high slots.
3. Hp values are too similar: I think giving shields an actual penalty solves this. Cal Logi upsets the whole balance here. Complex plates is 174% higher hp vs Extenders, I think armor may deserve a SLIGHT buff to maybe 130 hp... all other levels are pretty good.
4. Shields have higher passive regen: I think this is solved by the fact that armor has active regen why shields do not. More people need to run hives or repair tools. Reppers may need a slight buff but nothing major maybe 2/4/8. Could make reactive plates better as well like 1/2/4... maybe.

We should strive for balance and I think we are closer than we sometimes think. Let's not flop making armor the only viable route.

Where is the other grenade coming from if a flux was thrown? If thats the case even a flux grenade + grenade combo will two shot any suit but thats not the point, the point was shield suits can survive almost twice the amount of explosives, while there is no weapon out there that can kill them that fast, granted the flux argument but they are non lethal. Shield tanks stack armor for a small amount of extra HP but they have the choice of completely ignoring it, armor tanks stack shields because it is extremely essential to our survival.

Shields having no active regen is barely a negative. It is a hinderance but not enough to be comparable to armor penalties. Also the regen can be dropped by half with regulators, with 1 complex energizer is enough to blow armor repair, active or not, out of the water.

Caldari assault is 5 seconds...

Flux grenade on a shield tanker wipes the HP but after 20 seconds they are back at full health, flux grenade on an armor tankers triage wipes their shields, it takes them 30% longer to replenish their shields, and now their armor repair is gone.

If both are under fire then both armor and shield repair can be ignored because weapons do so much DPS that the armor repair is negligible, so out of fire shields has the advantage but under fire none have an advantage.

Wasn't an idea, what I said is what happens when a Armor suit is standing on a triage nanohive and it gets fluxxed, because the triage nanohive is supplying the bulk of armor repair he essentially loses his repair.

Everything I have written was a reply to this

% bonuses to armor and shields is the same as higher base armor, except the better modules you put the more HP you get. Damage resistances do make sense but this is a long way from now to be implemented.

u cant hardly put any modules on mlt suits..

and a player shouldnt need all of those modules just to survive any ways...

plus even with all those modules its not gonna matter if ur enemy has stacked damage mods on..


thats y the heavy needs an increase in base hp.

it needs to tank those shots.

modules only make the suit cost more money.

not going to help much anyways as an armor repair module might be the only thing worth getting.

plus there rnt hardly any module slots on a mlt heavy suit.

i may get high kdr with free mlt gear in most of my battles. but from what ive seen the heavy is always out gunned and surrounded..

i see most of em hide around corners trying to set of there own kill zones since they cant really go any where and the only place they could defend effectively would be the supply depot....

Wrong wrong aaaaaaaaaaaaaaand wrong.
First of all, Locus grenades outright kill any armor tanker, shield tankers get hit by a flux they have a chance to recharge.
You know how much damage a core locus grenade does to armor?
920+.

If your shields are down, it's not like you're dead.
Plus the damage from the locus grenade is more permenant, as it takes way longer to regain that HP.

Now, about your silly little rep tool and nanohive, rep tools require you to take a gun off the field, a gun does much more than a rep tool, even the prototype rep tool can't match the damage from a standard AR with no skills or damage mods.
And what happens when that logi dies?
You're ******.

Your 70hp/s nanohive doesn't restore ammo, at all.
For an assault this is extremely bad as this game barely gives us enough ammo to last 5 minutes.
In addition to that, they can be destroyed, specifically by grenades which WILL happen thanks to nade spam.
The Cal Logi 90hp/s stays that way, you can't destroy it.
Also, in the future there will be shield transfer modules, which act the same as rep tools.
The reason there aren't any yet is because it would be kind of a slap in the face to add them when armor is this weak.

The loss in shields should INCREASE in addition to applying to all of the shields.
These are extremely powerful, rechargers are pointless as long as the penalty is so small and only applies to base shields.

And yes there are explosive weapons that wipes the entire armor in one blast, or two if we're talking about the fast firing flaylock.

You are using edge cases for the reason why armor has a use.
It doesn't, these cases are few and far in between when they make themselves useful, 99% of the time shield tankers are better.

P.S
Shield recharge doesn't reset every bullet, the timer starts from your first bullet not your last.
So you can take fire all you want as long as you find cover in the last second of the timer.
And if you do take fire?
You get that 90hp and then the timer resets >_>

It's even crazier when you add shield regulators, which should be in high slots tbh.