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Good Basic Medium Frame AR build and fitting for the new guys (565950 SP)

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Spectral Clone The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 30	Posted - 2013.06.22 22:46:00 - [1] - Quote Created a build and fitting for guys starting out with the game. It is a shield tanking assault rifle assault which costs 565950 SP: Fitting 1x Militia Minmatar Medium Suit OR 1x Militia Caldari Medium Suit 2x Enhanced Shield Extenders 1x Basic Armor Plate 1x GEK Assault rifle 1x Militia Grenade 1x Militia Nanohive Skills Dropsuit Upgrades 2 Dropsuit Armor Upgrades 1 Armor Plating 1 Dropsuit Core Upgrades 1 Dropsuit Electronics 1 Dropsuit Engineering 1 Dropsuit Shield Upgrades 1 Shield Extension 3 Weaponry 3 Light Weapon Operation 1 Assault Rifle Operation 3 This should give you: - Good speed (even though you have an armor plate). - Good tank (461 EHP for militia caldari medium, 416 with militia minmatar medium). - Good gank with level 3 in AR. - Some basic resupply with nanohive. - Grenades to start practicing cooking. You can then continue to build on this toward caldari/minmatar assault or logistics suit if you so prefer.
Rogatien Merc Ill Omens EoN. 95	Posted - 2013.06.23 01:06:00 - [2] - Quote Cool, and this is the kind of thing new players need. For longevity, I would really rather see a basic armor rep on there if it will fit rather than a plate though.
Spectral Clone The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 38	Posted - 2013.06.25 14:49:00 - [3] - Quote Well, I dont know why you would want to repair armor on a shield suit. But sure, that could work. Probably better to just replace the armor plate(s) with a shield regulator in that case. But for new players increasing the survivability is prime, regen is only a luxury IMO. I wanted to add, if you-¦re new to the game and read this thread. Feel free to contact me ingame and I will try to help create a good fitting with the corresponding skills going for any basic class you desire, using militia/standard gear.
Terra Thesis HDYLTA Defiant Legacy 247	Posted - 2013.06.25 23:48:00 - [4] - Quote i like the concept but i disagree with almost everything in the implementation. we made a similar guide for my corp. you're pouring a ton of SP (and on death, isk) into the ADV level GEK when it doesn't really help you enough to justify it to a fresh newbie. the STD level Assault Rifle is decent and much easier to acquire. also, i wouldn't ever recommend using the enhanced shield extenders. i'd say stick to basic until you can skill up to complex. i don't know why you wouldn't skill into at least the STD medium dropsuit. it's a tiny amount of SP and you get an extra slot or two. i agree with the other guy, you don't want to put on a plate. as a newbro you can't afford to stand still and play EHP chicken with anyone. i highly recommend all newbies learn to duck and cover and regen. imho regen is the only way a newbie can compete. cooking Locus grenades is fun, but at this point i recommend everyone use AV grenades 99% of time. if there's one thing i'd recommend skilling up to ADV level, it would be droplinks. you can put down 2 simultaneously and watch those WPs roll in. if the newb is good enough to survive long enough to need a nanohive, i'd still recommend getting the STD hives, because the MIL one is just so incredibly weak.
Sylen Soon Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 0	Posted - 2013.06.26 00:04:00 - [5] - Quote Nice critique Terra, those seem like good points. I have been looking for a basic SP build to try and follow, and this topic was the closest I have found. As someone recently out of Academy, what are my first goals SP wise to be as effective as possible against people who dramatically out gear me? I have heard shotguns are a good route, but I don't enjoy the knife fight style bunny hopping CQ combat you get with shotguns. Sniper rifle is the opposite extreme for me, I am an average gamer with some FPS experience with Halo and CoD etc. And I am most comfortable with an assault rifle type class. You mention going for the STD medium dropsuit first, and focusing on regen, I have heard that logi suits are semi OP atm. Should I work on one of those? I have heard that AV nades are a requirement in other topics, and I already skilled into those. I have also heard that mods scale really well, should I work on those ASAP or are they a lower priority? I went ahead and dumped points into getting the basic Scrambler Rifle. I am absolutely terrible at it, but I feel like mastering it will make me a better FPS player. I have to try and get the jump on people in order to line up a headshot, I can't spray and pray effectively, and it's range is decent. I am torn between sticking with the SR and maybe going for a Amarr medium assault suit, or going with a standard AR build. Though I am not sure if I would go with a logi suit or an assault suit if I did go assault rifle instead of scrambler. I do decent in matches, but that's mainly because I am playing in a squad, and my teammates tear people up. How can I be as effective as possible with my first SP points? What are my goals and priorities from the start?
Spectral Clone The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 43	Posted - 2013.06.26 10:23:00 - [6] - Quote Thing is, caldari/minmatar dropsuits get only extra low slots going from MLT to STD. This does not help a shield tanker with low skill points a lot. The MLT class of dropsuits are also EXTREMELY cheap, which is why I did not recommend going into anything more than MLT. Shield extenders are more worth putting the money on. Also, for new guys, specing into a specific dropsuit should maybe be done at a later stage, when you exactly know what to play. About the assault rifle, sure, going STD level is good enough (im using the toxin AR and it is fking awesome, since I did not spec into AR at all). Could recommend going for the SMG instead of the AR. This weapon is however crippled by range, and requires more tactical coordination and retreat than a AR. Would not recommend the scrambler rifle to start with. It is however quite good at the standard level if you can use the charge shot and one hit kill people. dropsuit modules (extenders, plates) and core skills are IMO a higher priority than anything else when you are new, I cannot stress this more! Also, do not spec into the weapon dmg mods until you have a good tank. You will not gain much from these unless you have over 5 million SP.
Spectral Clone The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 43	Posted - 2013.06.26 10:27:00 - [7] - Quote Terra Thesis wrote: i highly recommend all newbies learn to duck and cover and regen. imho regen is the only way a newbie can compete. You remember that caldari suits have a quite good shield regen, right? :) You do not need regen mods on that one. A armor plates gives the new players a buffer to regen the shield, and practice what you mentioned above, and is thereby the better option.
bobtbob Bojo's School of the Trades 7	Posted - 2013.06.26 12:50:00 - [8] - Quote Another person, another opinion. Personally, I agree that the Enhanced Shield Extender is kind of meh when compared to basic/militia until you can get to Complex. Therefore, I would take points out of Shield Extension and put them in Shield Upgrade. By doing this, you can get Lvl 3 with a large chunk of SP change (136,800Upgrade vs 205,200Ext), or by dropping the GEK38 down to STD AR you can get to Lvl 4 in Shield Upgrades and Lvl1 Shield Extension. Crunching the numbers for a MLT Caldari Assault starting with 210HP shields (I'm not sure if Shield Upgrades apply to total shields including modules or just base suit, I've assumed the latter as it's worst case) gives: First post setup 2 Enhanced Shield Extenders (33HP each) stack to give 61.7HP Shield Upgrade 1 = 10.5HP Total 72.2HP Alternative shield skill setup 2 MLT/Basic Shield Extenders (22HP each) stack to give 41.1HP Shield Upgrade 3 = 31.5HP Total 72.6HP (plus reduced cost and easier fitting) Drop GEK38 to STD AR 2 MLT/Basic Shield Extenders (22HP each) stack to give 41.1HP Shield Upgrade 4 = 42HP Total 83.1HP (plus reduced cost and easier fitting) Taking into account Costs & Fitting OPs (Enhanced Extenders) setup = 5220 ISK, 72CPU, 12PG Basic Extenders setup = 1950 ISK, 36CPU, 6PG MLT Extenders setup = 800 ISK, 46CPU, 8PG Hopefully I haven't made any ridiculous errors, and please note that these are my opinions. Also, it is likely that you'll want to maximise both skills eventually.
Spectral Clone The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 43	Posted - 2013.06.26 13:01:00 - [9] - Quote Shield upgrades only apply to suit. Edit: People seem to forget that you get 5% shield module efficiency when specing into shield modules. the scaling of shield modules are (without mods): 1x 1.5x 3x of the basic shield module if you have LVL 3 in shield extension this scaling becomes: 1.15x 1.725x with lvl 5 in shield extension: 1.25x 1.875x 3.75x
bobtbob Bojo's School of the Trades 7	Posted - 2013.06.26 13:24:00 - [10] - Quote Spectral Clone wrote: Shield upgrades only apply to suit. Edit: People seem to forget that you get 5% shield module efficiency when specing into shield modules. the scaling of shield modules are (without mods): 1x 1.5x 3x of the basic shield module if you have LVL 3 in shield extension this scaling becomes: 1.15x 1.725x with lvl 5 in shield extension: 1.25x 1.875x 3.75x A good compromise is to spec into shield lvl 3 and using STD modules if you want to save cash. Yup, people do, my bad That bumps your fit up to about level with my 3rd fit. My setup is more about cheapness and ease of fitting for the same SP, which says more about me than the fit...

Spectral Clone The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 43	Posted - 2013.06.26 13:28:00 - [11] - Quote Of course, there are millions of ways of doing this. I tried applying the OP build on my brother, when he tried the game out, and it is working out all right. He is now soon in ADV suit with 3 ADV shield extenders. He can take out most protos with his GEK, since hes a skilled player.
Fox Gaden DUST University Ivy League 552	Posted - 2013.06.26 15:42:00 - [12] - Quote Spectral Clone wrote: Terra Thesis wrote: i highly recommend all newbies learn to duck and cover and regen. imho regen is the only way a newbie can compete. You remember that caldari suits have a quite good shield regen, right? :) You do not need regen mods on that one. A armor plates gives the new players a buffer to regen the shield, and practice what you mentioned above, and is thereby the better option. When the shields go down the armour provides a buffer to give you time to get to cover. Or at least it does the first time. With your setup, the second time you are out of luck because your armour was chewed up the first time and you donGÇÖt have that buffer any more. Unless I have a good reason not to, I always equip an Armour Repair, even on a shield suit. It is not for keeping you alive during the fight. It is for getting that armour buffer back between fights. Now, if you always run with a Logi friend, then sure, go with the plate.
Spectral Clone The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 60	Posted - 2013.07.08 12:10:00 - [13] - Quote Show some luuuv to the new players! Bump.
Oso Peresoso RisingSuns 154	Posted - 2013.07.08 15:34:00 - [14] - Quote Spectral Clone wrote: Created a build and fitting for guys starting out with the game. It is a shield tanking assault rifle assault which costs 565950 SP: Fitting 1x Militia Minmatar Medium Suit OR 1x Militia Caldari Medium Suit 2x Enhanced Shield Extenders 1x Basic Armor Plate 1x GEK Assault rifle 1x Militia Grenade 1x Militia Nanohive Skills Dropsuit Upgrades 2 Dropsuit Armor Upgrades 1 Armor Plating 1 Dropsuit Core Upgrades 1 Dropsuit Electronics 1 Dropsuit Engineering 1 Dropsuit Shield Upgrades 1 Shield Extension 3 Weaponry 3 Light Weapon Operation 1 Assault Rifle Operation 3 This should give you: - Good speed (even though you have an armor plate). - Good tank (461 EHP for militia caldari medium, 416 with militia minmatar medium). - Good gank with level 3 in AR. - Some basic resupply with nanohive. - Grenades to start practicing cooking. You can then continue to build on this toward caldari/minmatar assault or logistics suit if you so prefer. You must be an Eve player. I can tell because you've made mostly non-rtarded skill choices (and you referred to your GEK as 'gank'). Congratulations on that. You look like you're already in a good place to get some kills and make some isk. I also agree with most of Terra's critiques minus the one about the STD med suit (they're expensive garbage, use militia medium or a basic assault). This may be a bit controversial, but if you like the game, I would encourage buying one of the mercenary, veteran, or elite packs (particularly if you're an Eve player and used to giving money to CCP). http://dust514.com/news/2013/05/merc-vet-elite-packs/ Firstly, skill boosters are key and you'll want both of them. The rate of progression is a tad slow without. Secondly the bonus items like BPOs and such, as well as Aurum BPOs, are quite useful, but their usefulness is heavily skewed towards newer players (old players can still use them to farm isk if they want). Performance-wise, the caldari assault BPOs are identical to the standard caldari assault suit, they don't require any SP investment to use, and they're free/infinite/whatever. The Dren and Toxin AR's in the Merc and Elite packs are also the only way to get BPO ARs that are equal to the standard AR. The covenant sniper rifle is slightly less useful. The other Dren suit BPOs are kinda nice, and the other 3 dren weapons are no-skill versions that perform on par with their basic counterparts but with the fittings cost of the militia weapons (shotgun and swarm are useful BPOs as they have high SP requirements and bigger clips, the scrambler pistol not so much). Regarding the GEK, it strains your wallet and your fittings, so there are two approaches. One is to put it on your militia suit, which has the same CPU as the basic caldari med frame or assault C-1, but one less lowslot. Being a slot down makes up for the fittings of the GEK, and you can use basic/militia gear to minimize cost. The other option is to save the GEK for a few tryhard setups that are more expensive and more survivable (ie basic assault suit + enhanced shield extenders + basic stuff). Then just be sure to switch out of your tryhard suit when you're getting proto-pub-stomped. However, I would not use the GEK all the time. The basic version is quite good (and free with a BPO version!), and is improved by the lvl 3 AR operation for less kick. Also the basic version leaves more fitting for other stuff. This is important because more fitting means you can fit better equipment, sidearms, and enhanced modules for more survivability. You can also use more fittings to change basic stuff to militia versions to save on money when it won't impact the module performance. I would also check out the GLU tactical assault rifle. Paired with a good sidearm, its a very versatile and powerful weapon. It costs an extra 7k but uses the same fittings as the gek, so play around with it a few times. Skillpoint wise, I would unlock the basic equipment (nanocircuitry 1, drop uplinks 1, maybe repair tool 1), I would unlock grenadier to get AV grenades (easy to use, reliable source of warpoints), and I would definitely unlock sidearms and the SMG (smg BPO is one of the better things to spend aurum on) and scrambler pistol. I would also unlock shield regulators as they are a core part of many shield builds. Finally, if you plan to do any AV or Sniping, I would think about handheld weapon upgrades (for other situations you'll be relying on shield extenders instead). When you need to sink some points into advanced levels, shield upgrades for more HP, electronics for more CPU, and caldari/minmatar medium for access to assault/logi suits should all be your first choices. Lastly, I love drop uplinks. They get you a ton of points and are critical to winning any game mode (not having uplinks in ambush is bad). However, they are a complete btch to fit on a basic assault suit, particularly if you're sporting enhanced modules or advanced weapons. For that reason its nice to get them at lvl 2 for the "stable" version of them, but I would not advise getting them to level 3 unless you're running any kind of logi suit or running some advanced suit. * modules where the militia version performs similarly to basic version = damage enhancers, armor repairers, shield regulators, shield extenders, sensor stuff, nanite injector, repair tool, scrambler pistol
Spectral Clone The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 66	Posted - 2013.07.08 15:49:00 - [15] - Quote Im not an EVE player :-) But I used to craft templates in Dark Age of Camelot which are similar in some sense to dropsuits. I am also an engineer, which kind of explains why I find these things fun to do. Couldn-¦t agree more about the merc pack. They can potentially lay out a very good base for you to grow on. EDIT: Also, im not a newberry. Started playing in open beta. Made this thread for guys just starting out.
Terra Thesis HDYLTA Defiant Legacy 299	Posted - 2013.07.08 15:51:00 - [16] - Quote Sylen Soon wrote: Nice critique Terra, those seem like good points. I have been looking for a basic SP build to try and follow, and this topic was the closest I have found. As someone recently out of Academy, what are my first goals SP wise to be as effective as possible against people who dramatically out gear me? hmm. i would say stick to one general purpose suit template and prioritize upgrading everything from MIL to STD first. usually STD stuff is a significant upgrade, even if it's just reducing the fitting requirements so you can fit more stuff. Sylen Soon wrote: I have heard shotguns are a good route, but I don't enjoy the knife fight style bunny hopping CQ combat you get with shotguns. Sniper rifle is the opposite extreme for me, I am an average gamer with some FPS experience with Halo and CoD etc. And I am most comfortable with an assault rifle type class. any high alpha weapon will allow you to somewhat ignore the opponent's sp. REs, forge guns, locus grenades, LAVs also fit the bill. if you want to stick killing with ARs, i recommend avoiding any frontal combat. flank, ambush, cover, run. do whatever you can to avoid a fair fight where your SP is measured directly against your opponent's. Sylen Soon wrote: You mention going for the STD medium dropsuit first, and focusing on regen, I have heard that logi suits are semi OP atm. Should I work on one of those? I have heard that AV nades are a requirement in other topics, and I already skilled into those. I have also heard that mods scale really well, should I work on those ASAP or are they a lower priority? yes. specialized suits are even cheaper than the medium frames for some reason. logi is a little more useful than assault. the only problem is that you have to decide on a race before committing your SP. different modules scale differently. but yes, complex modules are generally cheaper to skill and lose than PRO weapons or dropsuits.
Sneaky Fletcher DUST University Ivy League 3	Posted - 2013.07.08 20:10:00 - [17] - Quote Pfff... Use starter fits and bring your Armor n Shild uprades to lvl 5 15% or so more HP makes ALL teh diffrence Favor survivability and cost effectiveness and forget about K/Dr when your rich with ISKIES who cares?? e.g. went 17/9 the other day with Militia Medic Fit(no murder cab tho that's SO MUCH FUN!!!!)


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