DUST Search - I wonder how matchmaking will work. (speculation/input)

Master Jaraiya wrote:

Abron Garr wrote:

Anita Hardone wrote:

Abron Garr wrote:

Anita Hardone wrote:

This gear balancing wont solve anything. The battles will play out the same, in favor of those with more SP and skills, and someone with more SP is usually the better player because they have spent more time playing....

This is why we need what ive stated. Instead of matching people based on gear, how about trying to show a players skill level is, based on what they get done in a match. Id someone proto stomps all day and has high stats, then they should be more likely to be put with other proto stompers.

Because matches literally full of snipers, full of logis or full of heavies doesn't interest me.

Dude, this already happens right now, its pretty random, but it happens. But if that happens with a legitament match maker, then obviously something is broke balancing wise.

HMG heavies generally have low accuracy. Snipers generally have high accuracy. So tell me how a matchmaking system with accuracy as a variable is going to make sure that matches don't end up having 32 snipers or 32 heavies? I'm not saying your idea is a bad one, I'm just saying lets start off with gear and and variables as we go along.

Only variables you need for successful matchmaking in non FW Pubs!


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Anita Hardone Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 105	Posted - 2013.06.12 23:08:00 - [1] - Quote I wonder how the match making will work. I know it says it takes gear into the equation, but im sure there is a way to circumvent this lol. Was meant for another thread, but then it got really long so i decided to make it its own. Delete all proto fits. Join game. Make a proto fit in 20 seconds while in game and get hate mail. There needs to be like, a made up skill rating. It takes everything into consideration. Kills per minute, KD ratio, how many vehicles destroyed, accuracy, squad actions, objective actions, average kill streak, total playing time, and total SP and then spits out a number like 750, or 1118 which is used for Matchmaking. If people are in a squad, it could either average everyones rating and do it like that, or just go off of one player with the highest rating. Total SP would be more for a status, like in normal war games you go off of military positions. But in DUST they can make up some random two part alias that basically describes how long they have played, and what they do the most if they have a stat thats above the norm. Like in Tokyo Xtreme Racer, if you never hit a wall and drive super clean an usually win all your races, you will gain a "handle/alia's" like, "Threaded Veteran, or Hyperspeed Vigilante". But if you suck, you could end up with, "Clumsy Psycho, or Typical Woman". These names can also change through sheer playing time too. And it takes everything into account, collisions, how aggressive you drive, average top speed, how often you adjust car settings like gear ratios, how much money you have, play time, number of cars you own, if you leave the body of the cars stock or equip body kits and other ricey add ons etc. This would help to distinguish Vets from noobs at a glance. The names dont have to be derogatory. But they should convey some form of superiority/inferiority to others. If you want a better name, play better, or figure out some other type of playstyle. Have a good name, dont start sucking. One part could be determined by total SP and Playtime and the first part could be the averaged stat name. Which lets say there is a new player and vet which play exactly the same way, the Vet would have a name like "Dead Eye Veteran" and the new player would be "Dead Eye Commando"
Anita Hardone Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 106	Posted - 2013.06.12 23:47:00 - [2] - Quote I dont know how anyone could intelligently argue against a matchmaking system that's fare, and un-exploitable. ie, you stat pad, then get stuck in game wayyy above your skill level... get stomped and then your score falls within 1-3 games until you are somewhere you belong.
Anita Hardone Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 106	Posted - 2013.06.13 00:40:00 - [3] - Quote Problem will still persist lol. Core skills.... Abron Garr wrote: I believe Gear-only matchmaking would be sufficient. These latest iterations of Dust are heavily skewed in favor of gear making the difference over RL and IG skills. The skill bonuses we get from spending SP are simply not enough of an advantage to warrant matchmaking based solely off SP or WP. Here are my thoughts: If we do manage to actually get a working economy in Dust, I would like to see a market for mid tier equipment. Right now they're simply stepping stones to protogear. If there was a matchmaking system based off gear, veteran players could still participate in matches, provided they "downgrade" their gear to an appropriate level. This solves the problem of having too low of a high-sp population as well as encouraging players to "max out" fitting and support skills instead of rushing straight into prototype gear. As an added benefit, testing and balancing will actually be possible because there will be, hopefully, fewer variables that complicate the discussion. Needless to say -- Corp, PC and FW matches should remain "anything goes" with zero matchmaking IMO. this system doesnt just go off of WP and SP though. Accuracy K/D average Kill Streak Time played Score Per minute everything...
Anita Hardone Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 107	Posted - 2013.06.13 02:38:00 - [4] - Quote The only time when there are empty matches because of matchmaking is because of a barrier. Just dont have any barriers. If you are the highest skilled player in the world, well you will just be placed in the best match available. This xould idk be done by increasing the load time by like 15-20 seconds to give the Que time to fill up and place everyone in the best match. I mean hell, why cant people/full squads be migrated to a harder matches if one becomes available while in the crew deck? Which isnt a big deal, just making room for noobs to play noobs. But, there shouldnt be a barrier. the game should try to match the best people against the best people at that moment. Which is how a matchmaker should work. Matchmakers shouldnt categorize people to cut them off from everyone below them, but try to keep them separated as much as possible. In every MMO there is that one time you got pwned by an Uber L77T no lifer, but it shouldnt be an everyday occurrence.
Anita Hardone Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 107	Posted - 2013.06.13 02:42:00 - [5] - Quote This gear balancing wont solve anything. The battles will play out the same, in favor of those with more SP and skills, and someone with more SP is usually the better player because they have spent more time playing.... This is why we need what ive stated. Instead of matching people based on gear, how about trying to show a players skill level is, based on what they get done in a match. Id someone proto stomps all day and has high stats, then they should be more likely to be put with other proto stompers.
Anita Hardone Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 107	Posted - 2013.06.13 02:59:00 - [6] - Quote Abron Garr wrote: Anita Hardone wrote: This gear balancing wont solve anything. The battles will play out the same, in favor of those with more SP and skills, and someone with more SP is usually the better player because they have spent more time playing.... This is why we need what ive stated. Instead of matching people based on gear, how about trying to show a players skill level is, based on what they get done in a match. Id someone proto stomps all day and has high stats, then they should be more likely to be put with other proto stompers. Because matches literally full of snipers, full of logis or full of heavies doesn't interest me. Dude, this already happens right now, its pretty random, but it happens. But if that happens with a legitament match maker, then obviously something is broke balancing wise.
Anita Hardone Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 107	Posted - 2013.06.13 03:21:00 - [7] - Quote Master Jaraiya wrote: Abron Garr wrote: Anita Hardone wrote: Abron Garr wrote: Anita Hardone wrote: This gear balancing wont solve anything. The battles will play out the same, in favor of those with more SP and skills, and someone with more SP is usually the better player because they have spent more time playing.... This is why we need what ive stated. Instead of matching people based on gear, how about trying to show a players skill level is, based on what they get done in a match. Id someone proto stomps all day and has high stats, then they should be more likely to be put with other proto stompers. Because matches literally full of snipers, full of logis or full of heavies doesn't interest me. Dude, this already happens right now, its pretty random, but it happens. But if that happens with a legitament match maker, then obviously something is broke balancing wise. HMG heavies generally have low accuracy. Snipers generally have high accuracy. So tell me how a matchmaking system with accuracy as a variable is going to make sure that matches don't end up having 32 snipers or 32 heavies? I'm not saying your idea is a bad one, I'm just saying lets start off with gear and and variables as we go along. Only variables you need for successful matchmaking in non FW Pubs! And the Heavy user can make up for it by destroying vehicles, racking kills defending a point etc. This type of matchmaking is dynamic and is always changing. SP tiers is a barrier and high end players would eventually outgrow everyone below them to the point that they consider others at the same tier a personal friend and not even bother fighting.
Anita Hardone Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 107	Posted - 2013.06.13 03:26:00 - [8] - Quote You guys are kinda getting off topic.
Anita Hardone Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 108	Posted - 2013.06.13 04:04:00 - [9] - Quote Shion Typhon wrote: Abron Garr wrote: Acezero 44 wrote: Abron Garr wrote: You just described 99% of the player base. the problem,.? Like I said, the best players dont need to crutch there rank, the ones that do, well,.. to bad for them,. Let the ELO sort us out. The problems is that Dust is not (well ,not supposed to be) a run of the mill shooter. Different gear, tactics, roles means that it's not as simple as run & shoot. It doesn't matter, he's right, all you need is an ELO system. If someone is wearing proto and 10m SP but is a total garbage player then he will sit in amongst the lower end crowd because he's not a threat to anyone, even the militia geared players. If someone is wearing militia and has 1m SP but is some sort of FPS Superman then he'll climb the ladder until he meets people who can give him a good match (either through skill or gear, it doesn't matter). The proto equipped FPS master will sit at the top of the tree. So Tl:dr you don't need to differentiate WHY a player is kicking ass or not, an ELO system will agnostically account for it. ELO pretty much works the same as what im describing. But what im describing takes everything into account for a composite score that constantly change. It can change rapidly or very slowly.
Anita Hardone Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 109	Posted - 2013.06.14 00:01:00 - [10] - Quote @General Technique lolwut? Just using gear alone wont work. Why? Because you gain SP over time... So eventually even a horrible player will get some proto gear, but even then he will still be a bad player. You seem like you hate the thought of a challenge, and havent learned how to take a loss. How is matchmaking based on skill a scam? You sound borderline fanatic.

Anita Hardone Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 109	Posted - 2013.06.14 00:23:00 - [11] - Quote ZDub 303 wrote: I can't see any way that matchmaking will work in this game. If i am stuck (with my 12 million SP) playing the same 16v16 lobby in IB, cause we're literally the only 32 people on in the 'high bracket', then there is really going to be no point in playing. They needed to make a system that incentivizes through rewards, not just excluding high SP players altogether. They should have put their efforts towards making FW worthwhile instead of implementing a matchmaking system for IB that probably will do very little. As it is... there is not that many people online at any one time, and I usually end up playing IB against the same people over and over anyways. Thats if they have a bracketed/gated/barrier for each skill level which isnt going to work. Ive said this several times already in the thread while proposing a way to help alleviate noobstomping to a minimum. It will still happen but not as frequently in Quickmatches.
Anita Hardone Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 109	Posted - 2013.06.14 00:48:00 - [12] - Quote Because of your frequent use of the phrase "carebear". Im going to ask you to go back to EvE and never come back.