DUST Search - Request] Remove free LAV's and AV grenades

Encharrion wrote:

The problem with AV grenades is the lack of sacrifice to fit them. This means that mostly everyone has them. They have limited range, so clearly you can't let them get close. They can use cover to approach you without you seeing them until they are pitching grenades at you, so you need an open area so that you can see and shoot them before they get too close. Now you get torn apart by forge guns. You go in close using cover and use a support squad to deal with enemies. They didn't sacrifice anything for their AV capabilities so they can deal with your support squad. You take cover somewhat distant from the enemy, but now you have to use railguns because you're too far away. Want to use blasters? Too bad.

Sure, you need quite a few AV grenades to kill a well fit tank. Let's say you need 8 grenades to take one out. One guy throwing three grenades just took away nearly half the tanks health. That one guy just forced the tank to retreat (because who knows if he has a nanohive or a buddy with him to throw more grenades) and take time to recover it's health, not to mention make it easy prey to forge guns and swarms while it breaks cover and retreats at half health. He did all this, without sacrificing his ability to fight other infantry in the slightest. Even if he dies, he loses almost nothing by trying.

No wonder everyone rail snipes from the hills with their tanks.


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CAELAN Andoril Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 20	Posted - 2013.05.23 16:48:00 - [1] - Quote I'd prefer AV grenades requiring higher skills than it does now. Not a separate skill or anything, but for instance make STD AV grenades require LVL 3 Grenadier rather than LVL 1. That way they kind of have to specialise in order to get them. They'll be easier to get than other AV options, but not too easily available. Also, the Hacked variant or whichever one that doesn't require skills: get rid of it. That one's a load of crap and I refuse to use it on principle.
CAELAN Andoril Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 22	Posted - 2013.05.24 15:52:00 - [2] - Quote Encharrion wrote: The problem with AV grenades is the lack of sacrifice to fit them. This means that mostly everyone has them. They have limited range, so clearly you can't let them get close. They can use cover to approach you without you seeing them until they are pitching grenades at you, so you need an open area so that you can see and shoot them before they get too close. Now you get torn apart by forge guns. You go in close using cover and use a support squad to deal with enemies. They didn't sacrifice anything for their AV capabilities so they can deal with your support squad. You take cover somewhat distant from the enemy, but now you have to use railguns because you're too far away. Want to use blasters? Too bad. Sure, you need quite a few AV grenades to kill a well fit tank. Let's say you need 8 grenades to take one out. One guy throwing three grenades just took away nearly half the tanks health. That one guy just forced the tank to retreat (because who knows if he has a nanohive or a buddy with him to throw more grenades) and take time to recover it's health, not to mention make it easy prey to forge guns and swarms while it breaks cover and retreats at half health. He did all this, without sacrificing his ability to fight other infantry in the slightest. Even if he dies, he loses almost nothing by trying. No wonder everyone rail snipes from the hills with their tanks. I somewhat disagree with your premise. There is a combat sacrifice in order to fit AV grenades: you can't use grenades on anything but vehicles. Now, before you go angrily disagreeing with me, hear me out. I have AV grenades, and I actually had them on my Assault suit for a while. But in the end I swapped them out for real grenades. Why? Because there far more times as an Assault suit where Locus grenades could have saved me, but instead I had AV grenades. That one, small, insignificant difference can kill you. Each grenade has it's own pro and con, and for each one you equip, you are sacrificing something in return. Want to be able to take out large groups of shield-tanked enemies? Flux nade and a shotty. Want a versatile, lethal grenade? Stick with Locus. Tired of getting hit by LAV's? Equip AV nades, but be careful, because that choice can get you killed.