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Aisha Ctarl
The Unholy Legion of Darkstar DARKSTAR ARMY
98
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Posted - 2013.05.22 18:18:00 -
[1] - Quote
I remember back in the Chromosome days where if you looked across the battlefield you could see bullets whizzing through the air, rockets exploding, the occasional scrambler pistol bolt, and death beams of laser rifles. Nowadays in Uprising all I see are bullets and Scrambler Rifle bolts - the laser rifle has pretty much been wiped out.
Looking at the LRs in closer detail I've noticed that they all, from the starter LR to the Viziam have the same base damage. Well if they all have the same base damage, then does that make a starter LR and the Viziam equals? Does the Viziam ramp up its damage output faster or is it just a recolored "proto" starter LR?
I don't truly know what has been fully done to the LRs, but when you literally see none being used period, that should be an indicator that something is up especially when newberries flock to anything with the word "rifle" included (plus it's a freaking laser!)
I'm not calling for a buff, but I am thinking that perhaps CCP should give LRs the once over to see why the playerbase has abandoned them. |
R'adeh Hunt
The Unholy Legion of Darkstar DARKSTAR ARMY
36
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Posted - 2013.05.22 18:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
The reason you see so many TAR is because it's the current king of the hill...and the majority of people either don't know CCP well or ignore their past history ;)
To give you an example: When they launched EVE, you could fly around in a medium sized ship (Thorax) with 8 heavy drones and obliterate much larger battleships easily. That went on for a good while until they hit it with the nerf hammer and suddenly a completely other race ships (Minmatar) started to excel in comparison with that drone ship (Gallente). In short, going with the FOTM and putting all your eggs in one basket is never a clever idea when it comes to CCP...they will smash your basket to pieces sooner or later. Always better to go with what's most fun for you.
As for the laser rifle, aside from all the other stuff, the thing that makes it unusable for me is the crosshair...too clunky and tough to aim correctly. That alone makes me not wanna use it no matter its damage. The only reason people are using the scrambler rifle over the TAR is because of a better crosshair. It's worse in every other respect. |
Aisha Ctarl
The Unholy Legion of Darkstar DARKSTAR ARMY
98
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Posted - 2013.05.22 18:32:00 -
[3] - Quote
R'adeh Hunt wrote:The reason you see so many TAR is because it's the current king of the hill...and the majority of people either don't know CCP well or ignore their past history ;)
To give you an example: When they launched EVE, you could fly around in a medium sized ship (Thorax) with 8 heavy drones and obliterate much larger battleships easily. That went on for a good while until they hit it with the nerf hammer and suddenly a completely other race ships (Minmatar) started to excel in comparison with that drone ship (Gallente). In short, going with the FOTM and putting all your eggs in one basket is never a clever idea when it comes to CCP...they will smash your basket to pieces sooner or later. Always better to go with what's most fun for you.
As for the laser rifle, aside from all the other stuff, the thing that makes it unusable for me is the crosshair...too clunky and tough to aim correctly. That alone makes me not wanna use it no matter its damage. The only reason people are using the scrambler rifle over the TAR is because of a better crosshair. It's worse in every other respect.
I've come to love the SCR. The Imperial SCR with damage mods and points in proficiency can evaporate an enemy's shields in two to three hits max. The SCR imo is perfect because in DUST it seems that 90% of players shield tank - if you come across an armor tanker with the SCR you're gonna have a bad time.
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Lance 2ballzStrong
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1834
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Posted - 2013.05.22 18:34:00 -
[4] - Quote
Aisha Ctarl wrote:Laser Rifle - Nerfed into Oblivion?
I played Oblivion recently...didn't see a single Laser Rifle... |
WyrmHero1945
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
305
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Posted - 2013.05.22 18:48:00 -
[5] - Quote
The difference is heat build up. Viziam has lower heat build up than the STD laser, so it will do more damage than the STD because you can keep firing for more time till overheat. Continuous fire = damage increase. The 3 lasers where supposed to be like this, same damage. Now they have 17 damage instead of 15, but twice the heat build up (now the STD overheats at 40 ammo instead of 20). IDK at which # of ammo the Viziam overheats with an Amarr assault suit. If it's overheating at 12-20 ammo then it's good, weaker than in Chromosome though. The thing here is the range, they're useless at anything below 100m (rooftops were our friends). |
Full Metal Kitten
Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation
467
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Posted - 2013.05.22 18:50:00 -
[6] - Quote
I'm rolling with laser rifle again, but only the standard. ELM and Viziam do more overheat (feedback) damage but have a reduction to heat build-up. For the massive increase in fitting cost you'd think base damage would be improved.
The old crosshairs were much better, QFT. In order to get a similar effect you have to lol hipfire. ADS cannot track a red dot who is sprinting even at medium range so you are severely limited in continuous damage application. If you are taking laser damage, just sprint to the left or right of your aggressor.
The LR in Uprising feels more like a medium range sniper because you are quite immobile when applying decent damage. This wasnt a problem in Chromosome because you had range superiority. Not anymore. Tactical AR is the new range king, and even a GEK will get you if not very careful. Regardless, it feels good to have a good run with it, but for obvious reasons. You gotta have skillz with a "z". |
Lance 2ballzStrong
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1838
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Posted - 2013.05.22 18:51:00 -
[7] - Quote
WyrmHero1945 wrote:The difference is heat build up. Viziam has lower heat build up than the STD laser, so it will do more damage than the STD because you can keep firing for more time till overheat. Continuous fire = damage increase. The 3 lasers where supposed to be like this, same damage. Now they have 17 damage instead of 15, but twice the heat build up (now the STD overheats at 40 ammo instead of 20). IDK at which # of ammo the Viziam overheats with an Amarr assault suit. If it's overheating at 12-20 ammo then it's good, weaker than in Chromosome though. The thing here is the range, they're useless at anything below 100m (rooftops were our friends).
Yea the range is crap for lasers. Tact. AR's still have more range than a weapon specifically designed to be effective ONLY at range.
Balance in this game is lulz to say the least. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
4551
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Posted - 2013.05.22 18:51:00 -
[8] - Quote
I got used to the aiming on the laser rifle but the heat build up makes it hard to get to peak damage quickly to down players. |
Knarf Black
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
811
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Posted - 2013.05.22 18:55:00 -
[9] - Quote
Laser rifles were way overused in Chromosome because of the borked skills. You could primary a sidearm and then strap a STD laser onto your fits and melt people from the rooftops for only 12,000 SP. (Maybe a couple of points into LW Sharpshooter, too.)
Now they actually require some investment to be effective, in addition to being rendered completely obsolete by Tac ARs. |
dent 308
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
1405
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Posted - 2013.05.22 19:00:00 -
[10] - Quote
Knarf Black wrote:Laser rifles were way overused in Chromosome because of the borked skills. You could primary a sidearm and then strap a STD laser onto your fits and melt people from the rooftops for only 12,000 SP. (Maybe a couple of points into LW Sharpshooter, too.)
Now they actually require some investment to be effective, in addition to being rendered completely obsolete by Tac ARs.
Even with the SP investment lasers are severely underwhelming this build. I have Amarr Assault 5, and should hit laser proficiency 5 tonight. This is basically maximum SP investment in laser performance.
It will be interesting to see how my laser gank fits perform with this final 3% damage bonus. The real bugger of it is my respec fallback plan is logibro, another role without a job in PC.
edit : more data.
The iron sights I can adapt to, the bright blur obscuring my sight picture during firing is more a problem than the sights. Makes it very hard to discern if the target has made it behind cover or not while firing.
The heat management skill and bonus from the suit works fairly well and I can keep a beam burning longer than when I use an unbonused suit, but the narrow optimal and low damage really limit the effectiveness. |
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Knight SoIaire
Better Hide R Die D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
537
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Posted - 2013.05.22 19:04:00 -
[11] - Quote
Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:Aisha Ctarl wrote:Laser Rifle - Nerfed into Oblivion? I played Oblivion recently...didn't see a single Laser Rifle...
God dangit.
This one was easy, and you stole it! |
BMSTUBBYxx
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
19
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Posted - 2013.05.22 19:13:00 -
[12] - Quote
You don't have laser light shows anymore because easy mode LOL no skillz merc's have gone TAC AR. Such cute little Kitten Bears all running in packs with their TAC AR's.
I love when they are in groups makes easy targets for my Death Taxi. |
Lance 2ballzStrong
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1845
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Posted - 2013.05.22 19:20:00 -
[13] - Quote
BMSTUBBYxx wrote:You don't have laser light shows anymore because easy mode LOL no skillz merc's have gone TAC AR. Such cute little Kitten Bears all running in packs with their TAC AR's.
I love when they are in groups makes easy targets for my Death Taxi.
calling out players for not have skill... then proceeds to run them over with an LAV, which I'm guessing requires "skill"? |
Knight SoIaire
Better Hide R Die D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
537
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Posted - 2013.05.22 19:22:00 -
[14] - Quote
Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:BMSTUBBYxx wrote:You don't have laser light shows anymore because easy mode LOL no skillz merc's have gone TAC AR. Such cute little Kitten Bears all running in packs with their TAC AR's.
I love when they are in groups makes easy targets for my Death Taxi. calling out players for not have skill... then proceeds to run them over with an LAV, which I'm guessing requires "skill"?
Yea.
You got to go really fast and make sure not to roll over.
That alone, makes LAVs require more skill than TAC ARs and pre-nerf Viziams. |
Vin Mora
Sand Mercenary Corps Inc. Intersellar Conquest Enterprises
9
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Posted - 2013.05.22 19:28:00 -
[15] - Quote
dent 308 wrote:It will be interesting to see how my laser gank fits perform with this final 3% damage bonus. The real bugger of it is my respec fallback plan is logibro, another role without a job in PC.. Please tell me you have lost all of your districts.
You can't possibly believe that Logis don't have a place in PC, between Repair Tools, Injectors, and Drop Uplinks, I personally saved my corp 10+ clones in our last PC battle, which we won. Throwing yourself into the grinder is not the way that you win PC battles.
The least useful (generally) class is Scout, IMO, as there are more Assault and Heavy in PC matchs. They are useful for back hacking though.
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DeadlyAztec11
One-Armed Bandits Unclaimed.
318
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Posted - 2013.05.22 19:33:00 -
[16] - Quote
Knight SoIaire wrote:Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:BMSTUBBYxx wrote:You don't have laser light shows anymore because easy mode LOL no skillz merc's have gone TAC AR. Such cute little Kitten Bears all running in packs with their TAC AR's.
I love when they are in groups makes easy targets for my Death Taxi. calling out players for not have skill... then proceeds to run them over with an LAV, which I'm guessing requires "skill"? Yea. You got to go really fast and make sure not to roll over. That alone, makes LAVs require more skill than TAC ARs and pre-nerf Viziams. That is why there is a minimum of two LAV driver's running over people in each match right? Because it takes too much skill? |
Jake Bloodworth
DUST University Ivy League
29
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Posted - 2013.05.22 19:34:00 -
[17] - Quote
Knight SoIaire wrote:Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:BMSTUBBYxx wrote:You don't have laser light shows anymore because easy mode LOL no skillz merc's have gone TAC AR. Such cute little Kitten Bears all running in packs with their TAC AR's.
I love when they are in groups makes easy targets for my Death Taxi. calling out players for not have skill... then proceeds to run them over with an LAV, which I'm guessing requires "skill"? Yea. You got to go really fast and make sure not to roll over. That alone, makes LAVs require more skill than TAC ARs and pre-nerf Viziams.
QFT |
Lance 2ballzStrong
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1847
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Posted - 2013.05.22 19:36:00 -
[18] - Quote
Jake Bloodworth wrote:Knight SoIaire wrote:Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:BMSTUBBYxx wrote:You don't have laser light shows anymore because easy mode LOL no skillz merc's have gone TAC AR. Such cute little Kitten Bears all running in packs with their TAC AR's.
I love when they are in groups makes easy targets for my Death Taxi. calling out players for not have skill... then proceeds to run them over with an LAV, which I'm guessing requires "skill"? Yea. You got to go really fast and make sure not to roll over. That alone, makes LAVs require more skill than TAC ARs and pre-nerf Viziams. QFT
nothing mentioned above requires any substantial amount of skill. My point was people calling others out for not being skilled, but then using something, even cheaper, to kill said skill less players.
At least these guys spent money on their weapons... BPO LAV's? |
Hey Fatty
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
14
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Posted - 2013.05.22 19:44:00 -
[19] - Quote
But it sounds like bacon sizzling...how is that NOT OP? :)
The only gun in the game that makes me hungry enough to log out and leave my squad to flounder while I whip out my skillet! Truely devistating! |
R'adeh Hunt
The Unholy Legion of Darkstar DARKSTAR ARMY
37
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Posted - 2013.05.22 19:57:00 -
[20] - Quote
Hey Fatty wrote:But it sounds like bacon sizzling...how is that NOT OP? :)
The only gun in the game that makes me hungry enough to log out and leave my squad to flounder while I whip out my skillet! Truely devistating!
TARs make you wanna log out without you getting hungry ;) |
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Altina McAlterson
Not Guilty EoN.
528
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Posted - 2013.05.22 21:52:00 -
[21] - Quote
BMSTUBBYxx wrote: blah blah blah blah lolz no skillz scrubs blah blah blah protobear blah blah blah i haz truck!!!!
My forge gun and I really enjoy all the scrubs spamming trucks every match. Keep up the good work guys, you're doing great. |
Full Metal Kitten
Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation
471
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Posted - 2013.05.22 22:22:00 -
[22] - Quote
This thread was constructive for a few posts then got nerfed as much as the LR itself. GG. |
Makyre Vahliha
The White Hawk Knights
92
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Posted - 2013.05.22 22:44:00 -
[23] - Quote
Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:Aisha Ctarl wrote:Laser Rifle - Nerfed into Oblivion? I played Oblivion recently...didn't see a single Laser Rifle...
There's one! It's called mods you can download and install onto Oblivion! ;) |
KrazyEyeKilla
Greek Death Squad
4
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Posted - 2013.05.23 16:44:00 -
[24] - Quote
Whether you want to kill with LAVs, camp on top of a rooftop with a Forge while a logibro throes nanos down is up to you. The fact that absolutely no one uses the LR should be sign for CCP. The ridiculous range is what made them OP more than anything else. |
Ignoble Son
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
253
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Posted - 2013.05.23 17:21:00 -
[25] - Quote
The ADS turn speed on LR is ridiculous now; that is what killed it for me. Yah, it's pretty much worthless now. However I am glad to see my baby (the TAR) back in action (oh how I mised you my pressious) but the nerf hammer will eventually fall, and turn my dreams into a nightmare. All that needs to be done to the Tac is to very slightly reduce the damage, reduce the ROF to about 470 or so, and perhaps add a piece of code that disrupts mod controllers. But when the nerf hammer finally drops it will end up doing like twenty damage and will have the shortest range of any rifle in the game. I wish they would actually consult with some of the people who play the **** out of their game, and could give honest/unbiased solutions to fix the abundance of simple functionality flaws that this gamers riddled with. *shakes his head* I don't understand why they are having such a problem themselves. |
RedBleach LeSanglant
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group
253
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Posted - 2013.05.23 21:20:00 -
[26] - Quote
sights on the laser and the range killed it. I would still use it if it could be effectively used, but alas... it has gone the way of the what is extinct in New Eden? Jovians?
Perhaps the TAR nerf and being able to customize your weapon sights will bring it back... so an estimate of 1-2 years. |
2-Ton Twenty-One
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
567
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Posted - 2013.05.23 21:26:00 -
[27] - Quote
As a heavy I laugh at LR's now. That should not be, I should be laughing at AR and TAR not LR's. Just shows how bad CCP is at FPS development |
Crash Monster
Snipers Anonymous
366
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Posted - 2013.05.23 21:31:00 -
[28] - Quote
Maybe the laser rifle was nerfed so nerfed scouts could have a weapon crappy enough to complement their suits? |
XxWarlordxX97
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
1772
|
Posted - 2013.05.23 21:33:00 -
[29] - Quote
Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:WyrmHero1945 wrote:The difference is heat build up. Viziam has lower heat build up than the STD laser, so it will do more damage than the STD because you can keep firing for more time till overheat. Continuous fire = damage increase. The 3 lasers where supposed to be like this, same damage. Now they have 17 damage instead of 15, but twice the heat build up (now the STD overheats at 40 ammo instead of 20). IDK at which # of ammo the Viziam overheats with an Amarr assault suit. If it's overheating at 12-20 ammo then it's good, weaker than in Chromosome though. The thing here is the range, they're useless at anything below 100m (rooftops were our friends). Yea the range is crap for lasers. Tact. AR's still have more range than a weapon specifically designed to be effective ONLY at range. Balance in this game is lulz to say the least.
Tact AR does more damage |
Bones McGavins
TacoCat Industries
250
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Posted - 2013.05.23 21:40:00 -
[30] - Quote
Guys, can we make a thread without going off on TAR tangents? What can be done to the lazer to make it more effective? I believe it could use a range increase to put it ahead of every gun aside from the snipers. Would that be enough to fix it? |
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