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Promethius Franklin
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
3
   |
Posted - 2013.05.23 23:07:00 -
[1] - Quote
Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:Laheon wrote:Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:
Since Open Beta? No.
Pretty sure they were better in Chromosome than in Uprising. Even then they were lulz in Corp Matches, and they had range then. So they took out range and made heavies slower in Uprising.
Actually, they nerfed the HMG dmg by 20%, AND took out sharpshooter. Thanks to allot of heavies speaking up the dev realized he made a mistake with numbers and corrected the dmg nerf.
I went off on a tangent there, but just pointing out that heavies weren't confined to this "defensive" role since open beta, you're wrong. This new role has been forced on us in Uprising due to the fact we ONLY have Amarr suit and ONLY have the HMG (FG is AV)
You misread. I put the "intended" in there intentionally. They were always meant for a defensive role. You're trying to force a class into a specific role...that's not what this game is meant for. Like saying the scout suit is only for sniping in mountains, the assault suit is only for assaulting with AR's, the logi suit is only for healing people. You can't shove a specific role on a class, regardless what CCP says about it. I had a corpmate that made his tank as fast as LAV's just cuz HE COULD. If you think heavies are ONLY for defense then that's a real ignorant outlook to classes.
Yes, you can attempt to use it any way you please. Though it will have a place in which it shines. For the heavy that is a defensive position where the advantages of the weapon can be brought to bear. |
Promethius Franklin
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
3
|
Posted - 2013.05.23 23:26:00 -
[2] - Quote
Ignatius Crumwald wrote:Promethius Franklin wrote:
Yes, you can attempt to use it any way you please. Though it will have a place in which it shines. For the heavy that is a defensive position where the advantages of the weapon can be brought to bear.
You have quite the imagination. Where are these magical places where only the heavy can shine? This can be done in exactly 4 places of importance in the entire game - places where it can be done better with an assault.
I've seen heavies hold their own quite well in a defensive role or spearheading close quartered charges. Just about any skirmish map has a number of points for a heavy to take advantage of with greater force of deterrence than an assault.
Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:
And you're wrong again. The removal of sharpshooter forced the HMG into a defensive role. Before it was a versatile suit / class. Able to attack and defend, which EVERY class should be able to do, as that is a very basic aspect of a FPS.
But people with your mentality are happy to force a class into 1 role and call that a day. The range nerf to all weapons hurt the HMG the most cuz without it, heavies are stuck camping. That's fun for people? Camping a room?
Plus this defensive role you speak of, it's also followed by another one I laugh at... the "support role". Support and defend what exactly? A 10-15m radius? lol
Forcing roles into a class is a sure way to see people move away from it... like many have done already.
The removal of sharpshooter was a proportional nerf to all weapon ranges. What I don't quite understand there is how removing that, which effectively decreases the window in which AR's are effective but HMG's are not hurts HMG's. That said what you should be mad at was the additional range nerf of HMG's which further limited the weapon.
Oddly though neither one of these terribly limits the CQC capabilities of the weapon in my experience.
I suppose I'm not understanding what the point is of different weapons if they all perform in the same roles with the same efficiency. |
Promethius Franklin
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
4
|
Posted - 2013.05.23 23:31:00 -
[3] - Quote
Ignatius Crumwald wrote:You can defend any position better in proto assault than you can in proto heavy for many reasons, but one reason in particular stands out- Two equipment slots.
You can carry repair hives AND REs. You can single handedly hold a position way longer with that than you can with a skittle hose and some armor that eats 4 extra TAC rifle shots.
Those are issues at best with the proto heavy, not the HMG. |
Promethius Franklin
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
4
|
Posted - 2013.05.23 23:35:00 -
[4] - Quote
Ignatius Crumwald wrote:Nonsense. Complete nonsense. Like, do you even play this game? A heavy is basically a stationary turret with the health of a dropsuit and a half.
There is nowhere that a heavy is the best option. No. Where. It doesn't exist.
Yet people are doing what you claim is impossible and using them successfully. How do you account for that? A random collection of accidents? |
Promethius Franklin
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
5
|
Posted - 2013.05.24 00:12:00 -
[5] - Quote
bill the noon wrote:still waiting for a link to where a dev says the hmg ( not the sentinel suit) is a defensive weapon.
Considering it's one of 2 weapons that are exclusive to that suit and the fact that the role was brought up by CCP while discussing HMG balance I'd say demanding a direct statement is at this point being a bit purposefully obtuse. |
Promethius Franklin
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
5
|
Posted - 2013.05.24 02:08:00 -
[6] - Quote
bill the noon wrote:Promethius Franklin wrote:bill the noon wrote:still waiting for a link to where a dev says the hmg ( not the sentinel suit) is a defensive weapon. Considering it's one of 2 weapons that are exclusive to that suit and the fact that the role was brought up by CCP while discussing HMG balance I'd say demanding a direct statement is at this point being a bit purposefully obtuse. 163 kills 0.65 kd . who's alt are you prome. or are you just a noob. still waiting on that link
I'm no ones alt. You yourself can see I play the game on this character if you are looking at my stats. I'm not a noob, I'm just terrible at shooters, run militia level gear and I'm not afraid to run through a hell of bullets to try to take an objective. My KD will always be poor.
Edit: After some searching here is a post from CCP on the subject addressing people's complaints about the HMG while referencing the heavy AND point defense. |
Promethius Franklin
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
5
|
Posted - 2013.05.24 02:29:00 -
[7] - Quote
bill the noon wrote:Promethius Franklin wrote:bill the noon wrote:still waiting for a link to where a dev says the hmg ( not the sentinel suit) is a defensive weapon. Considering it's one of 2 weapons that are exclusive to that suit and the fact that the role was brought up by CCP while discussing HMG balance I'd say demanding a direct statement is at this point being a bit purposefully obtuse. well he didn't say heavies were designed , he said sentinels . while the thread he mentioned it in was an hmg thread people were also complaining about lack of high slots, massdrivers and other things. he also in that thread talked of increased falloff damage as being a solution to the heavies weakness before they increased the damage by aprx. 6 points. so yes i would like them to specifically state that the hmg is defensive. if only so i can then get them to explain the difference between an offensive and defensive weapon. for if im defending objective X, and it has a hallway or door that makes the hmg especially useful. then when im attacking objective X it has a hallway or door (or whatever layout) that is that useful. the terrain is the same the only difference is what color the objective is. at least now with the new patch i just downloaded the hit detection got sooooo much better.
Didn't see this post at first, but I find it interesting.
Mainly the attempt to separate the heavy from the sentinel. As I understood a heavy was a sentinel lacking in the role specific bonuses granted by the skill. Are those bonuses to you so intrinsic to a defensive role that you believe the 2 can really be divorced?
Yes, there are a number of complaints, but as linked the comments immediately following what the sentinel, yet by some mental exercise you have undergone not the heavy, stated the way the HMG specifically was supposed to fill it's part in that role while not encroaching on others.
Which leads to the other point of some confusion for me regarding your position. The post identified the HMG as a tool for the heavy to do the job envisioned by CCP, yet you divorce it from that role by referencing the shortcomings of the heavy/sentinel. This doesn't make sense to me to say anything other than how underpowered the class may be for it's role rather than how the HMG should have a pass from that same role. |
Promethius Franklin
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
5
|
Posted - 2013.05.24 02:33:00 -
[8] - Quote
bill the noon wrote:Promethius Franklin wrote:bill the noon wrote:Promethius Franklin wrote:bill the noon wrote:still waiting for a link to where a dev says the hmg ( not the sentinel suit) is a defensive weapon. Considering it's one of 2 weapons that are exclusive to that suit and the fact that the role was brought up by CCP while discussing HMG balance I'd say demanding a direct statement is at this point being a bit purposefully obtuse. 163 kills 0.65 kd . who's alt are you prome. or are you just a noob. still waiting on that link I'm no ones alt. You yourself can see I play the game on this character if you are looking at my stats. I'm not a noob, I'm just terrible at shooters, run militia level gear and I'm not afraid to run through a hell of bullets to try to take an objective. My KD will always be poor. 19309 wp . if your not an alt and youve only earned 20k in wp, thats pretty nob . still waiting for link
You have the link a few posts ago. That aside is your defense at this point really going to just be stat elitism? |
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