DUST Search - Adding FF Penalties First, to balance FF

Nova Knife wrote:

Food for thought : Do we really need penalties?

Griefer alts are an obvious concern, and should be against the rules.

Other than that though... Outside of the 'noob academy matches' Do we really need mechanics within the game acting as penalties? Sure, it sucks to lose fancy stuff to teammates... but that street flows both ways. I very much like the idea of having a 'rival' I've met in the past, being put on my own team and still being able to carry out sweet vengeance. Or to see my wallet flash in the war barge along with getting a mail saying "This is a down payment. Kill your buddies and help us win... and we'll pay you even more"

There's always going to be a few bad apples whenever FF is enabled. But I am more optimistic. I think the more freedom players have with something like this... the more exciting it can get. Let players create and impose the penalties within the social dynamic of the game itself. Deal with people who do nothing be grief accordingly.

I do not want to see things like vote to kick implemented (Because VTK can be used for more annoying griefing than teamkilling)

Stuff like ISK penalties are possible options... but I'd prefer to see other players dishing out the justice, than some NPC system.

I'm curious what you folks think.

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Dusters Blog Galactic News Network 338	Posted - 2013.05.16 18:09:00 - [1] - Quote In another thread CCP Nullabor mentioned FF couldnt be added before there were deterrents. We;ve always believed New Eden already has mechanics like this in place. We have always supported using CONCORD and other mechanics to provide deterrents for griefing while keeping FF on. EVE is deep. Use the lore whenever possible. It helps with immersion. Penalties: -100 WP for killing a friendly. This is pretty basic. basic deterrent. Fines: Kill friendlies in a hi or lo sec match and and see a 10-50M CONCORD fine in your end game screen. still want to team kill? no money? say hello to negative ISK. better deterrent. CONCORD Bounties: in null sec, [or when TKing is excessive in low & hi sec] have CONCORD take out bounties on griefers in the realm of 10-50M ISK, allow mercs [bounty hunters] to accept these contracts and hire locator agents to follow their bounties into one game. there the targets name will appear in yellow when seen and a portion of the bounty is earned for each time the player is slain, with the full bounty paid out at 5 kills or more. If a TKers bounty is collected he then is subject to a fine by CONCORD. this allows a deterrent but also incentivizes players and allows the playerbase to police TKing to an extent. At the very least it creates a BH profession and allows varies the experience for solo players and slayer types. Clone Deactivation: the lore supports this. in Templar One T3 malfunctioned and had his clone deactivated. three friendly kills and your clone is automatically deactivated. Kick or Forgive: kill a player once and get a mulligan. Kill him again in the same game and he gets the option to deactivate your clone. TKs are another instance where no mcc cmdr and ground platoon leader hurts the game. the officers overseeing the battle would be the ones dealing with treachery or malfunctioning clones.
Davy Headhunter ZionTCD Unclaimed. 11	Posted - 2013.05.16 18:25:00 - [2] - Quote This should not be applied to corp matches at all, sometimes it is worthy do some TK to destroy a tactical location with OB, or mass drive.. or granades... etc
The Robot Devil BetaMax. CRONOS. 312	Posted - 2013.05.16 23:21:00 - [3] - Quote Davy Headhunter wrote: This should not be applied to corp matches at all, sometimes it is worthy do some TK to destroy a tactical location with OB, or mass drive.. or granades... etc Public battles and FW team killers could have a skull put into their chevron and made red to everyone for one battle for every 5 clones killed per 2 battles. More than 5 means you really suck or are trying to tk, either way you get blasted. Every skull collected pays 75k ISK bounty and 75 WP. We could leave the public battles out and only put this in FW to add more risk and reward and a different feel.
Wolfica Planetary Response Organization 19	Posted - 2013.05.17 02:59:00 - [4] - Quote FF happens and is often on accident. but what happens for people who find ways to profit from it. (idea formed but wont share on public forum) I like the idea of the bounty and all but think I think the amount that is placed on them should be the cost for the dropsuit of the player that they killed, say some one is running a proto that cost 120k and they get team killed, that player is given the option to charge that player for that suit and a 0-30%(up to player) interest for emotional damage or forgive. if they forgive then they go on playing, if they wish to charge them then the player that did the team killing is given the option to pay or not. if they pay it all is well if they don't, then a bounty is placed on them for that amount (120k+15% in this case) for any person that can kill them 5 times in a match. if some one does then they get the reward and the person who did the team killing is automaticly forced to pay off both the suit and the bounty. I think this should be enforced heavily in all game modes.
Reiki Jubo Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 139	Posted - 2013.05.17 05:21:00 - [5] - Quote deterrents are good . the bounty idea is gold.
Nova Knife Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 1026	Posted - 2013.05.17 07:44:00 - [6] - Quote Food for thought : Do we really need penalties? Griefer alts are an obvious concern, and should be against the rules. Other than that though... Outside of the 'noob academy matches' Do we really need mechanics within the game acting as penalties? Sure, it sucks to lose fancy stuff to teammates... but that street flows both ways. I very much like the idea of having a 'rival' I've met in the past, being put on my own team and still being able to carry out sweet vengeance. Or to see my wallet flash in the war barge along with getting a mail saying "This is a down payment. Kill your buddies and help us win... and we'll pay you even more" There's always going to be a few bad apples whenever FF is enabled. But I am more optimistic. I think the more freedom players have with something like this... the more exciting it can get. Let players create and impose the penalties within the social dynamic of the game itself. Deal with people who do nothing be grief accordingly. I do not want to see things like vote to kick implemented (Because VTK can be used for more annoying griefing than teamkilling) Stuff like ISK penalties are possible options... but I'd prefer to see other players dishing out the justice, than some NPC system. I'm curious what you folks think.
Breakin Stuff GoonFeet 921	Posted - 2013.05.17 08:24:00 - [7] - Quote Nova Knife wrote: but I'd prefer to see other players dishing out the justice, than some NPC system. This was all I needed to see to be in complete agreement with you.
sammus420 GoonFeet 80	Posted - 2013.05.17 08:39:00 - [8] - Quote One option I've discussed with Kane is a system which I call the Temporary Team Standing. The way this works is everyone on the team starts off at +10. Every time you kill someone on your team it drops by 1. As it drops closer and closer to zero, the arrow over your head shifts from blue to yellow to orange then red, alerting everyone on your team that you're a TKer. If your standing is 4 points below someone and they TK you, their standing doesn't drop, or only drops a fractional amount. This way people being TKed can take out the TKer without worrying about their own standing. At the end of the round, you lose 10% of the isk you would gain per standing point below 10 that you are. At a standing of 0, you gain 0 isk. At a standing of 5, you gain 50%. To prevent people from griefing by jumping in front of your gun, 3 kills of the enemy would raise your standing by 1 point. This makes it easy for dedicated team players to avoid the penalty caused by stupidity, and makes it hard for TKers to avoid losing isk.
Cynabi D3ath D3alers RISE of LEGION 2	Posted - 2013.05.18 01:10:00 - [9] - Quote I think you need to be exceedingly cautious with bounties in Dust. I can certainly see people abusing this to see how much of a price they can get on their heads, or using this as a system to lone-wolf it against both teams in the game. Secondly, why does the other team need a bounty to kill you? If I see that red chevron in the game, I'm gonna shoot whether or not there's a skull in the center. This means the point of bounties is to encourage fighting within your own team.. which also seems to be the reason why the bounty was placed in the first place. Nova Knife wrote: Food for thought : Do we really need penalties? Griefer alts are an obvious concern, and should be against the rules. Other than that though... Outside of the 'noob academy matches' Do we really need mechanics within the game acting as penalties? Sure, it sucks to lose fancy stuff to teammates... but that street flows both ways. I very much like the idea of having a 'rival' I've met in the past, being put on my own team and still being able to carry out sweet vengeance. Or to see my wallet flash in the war barge along with getting a mail saying "This is a down payment. Kill your buddies and help us win... and we'll pay you even more" There's always going to be a few bad apples whenever FF is enabled. But I am more optimistic. I think the more freedom players have with something like this... the more exciting it can get. Let players create and impose the penalties within the social dynamic of the game itself. Deal with people who do nothing be grief accordingly. I do not want to see things like vote to kick implemented (Because VTK can be used for more annoying griefing than teamkilling) Stuff like ISK penalties are possible options... but I'd prefer to see other players dishing out the justice, than some NPC system. I'm curious what you folks think. When you put it this way... I'm actualy really liking the idea of bounties able to be placed BY OTHER PLAYERS. Difficult PC match? Drop a bounty on the other teams top player and watch them all squirm over whether or not to slay him for the bonus, or keep him around to win the match.


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