DUST Search - why bother calling them race specific dropsuits if they arnt going to fallow the...

Natu Nobilis wrote:

In EVE, each faction is known for certain proficiencies and preferences in their weapons.

Amarr
Laser
Missiles
Armor
Slow

They-¦re the slowboats that endure punishment and strike hard with EM and Thermal. Armor tanking with huge HP and resists.

Minmatar
Projectiles / Missiles
Armor / Shield
Super Fast

Strike fast from afar, do a huge alpha, run away reload, repeat. They-¦re the most versatile ones, and their ships do what they must, no matter what you fit. Explosive damage to counter the Armor from the Amarr.

Gallente
Hybrid (Blaster)
Drones
Armor
Fast

Get intimate, get close, get a huge dps on your face. Blasters strike hard with Thermal and Kinetic from close range, they armor tank and use drones as an effective support, or even main weapon. Armor tanking all the way, with bonus for repair cycle.

Caldari
Missiles
Hybrid (Railgun)
Shield
Normal speed

YOU CAN-¦T HIT ME FROM OVER THEEEEEERE. Missiles let them choose what damage type they-¦ll use (EM / Thermal / Kin / Explosive) and it-¦s an all around weapon ready for whoever they face. Shield users with bonus to resist.

***

That applies to ships and the focus on their technology, so i understand OP when he asks for more fidedignity on the atributes of the suits, that could reflect each faction focus on development.

Seein an Amarr with shield bonus is like watching a neo-con trying to give peace a chance.

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mongahu Bragian Order Amarr Empire 0	Posted - 2013.05.04 07:52:00 - [1] - Quote I'm confused. Why bother making different drop suits racial distinctive if they are going to have the same bonus that is not racial specific. Like amarr and lonti suits with shield bonuses? Why not make the bonuses match the race or atleast pretend u people have ever been in new Eden before. Race ship bonuses mostly match why can't the drop suits. And also on the same ranting note why no armor love. Armor is the bees knees but yet even when u use a racially armor modified suit u still only getshield bonus? Wtf mates?
NeoWraith Acedia Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 79	Posted - 2013.05.04 07:55:00 - [2] - Quote Because.
Vyzion Eyri The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION 582	Posted - 2013.05.04 08:01:00 - [3] - Quote Because there is only so much variation in combat operations before something becomes impractical. All guns fire projectiles of some sort because after billions of years of war, men have figured out that is the best way to kill someone else. Kevlar is used for bulletproof vests because after dozens of years of experimentation, that material is the most efficient and effective. Here, it's armour and shields. When we're immortal, the only goal is to have your mercenaries last the longest and withstand the most punishment as possible. ALL factions should recognise this. Amarr isn't going to design their suits to be weighed down by regalia and gold inscriptions because it's impractical. Likewise, the Caldari aren't going to stick advertisements on the latest assault rifle in neon scrolling mini-billboards on their dropsuits. In an arms race, competing factions will aim to match each other in sheer firepower. It's too risky to be innovative and hop out on a limb, hoping the abstract path you've taken will eventually lead to an advantage over your stockpiling opposition. In this sense, having the same bonuses for different factions does make sense.
Sete Clifton PSU GHOST SYNDICATE 101	Posted - 2013.05.04 08:06:00 - [4] - Quote I'm not sure I get what's being asked here. Each dropsuit has a "frame" bonus and a "racial bonus". The frame bonus is the same for each suit within a frame (light, medium, heavy). The racial suits are unique to each individual suit and based on the race it belongs to.
Harkon Vysarii Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn 189	Posted - 2013.05.04 08:17:00 - [5] - Quote Vyzion Eyri wrote: Because there is only so much variation in combat operations before something becomes impractical. All guns fire projectiles of some sort because after billions of years of war, men have figured out that is the best way to kill someone else. Kevlar is used for bulletproof vests because after dozens of years of experimentation, that material is the most efficient and effective. Here, it's armour and shields. When we're immortal, the only goal is to have your mercenaries last the longest and withstand the most punishment as possible. ALL factions should recognise this. Amarr isn't going to design their suits to be weighed down by regalia and gold inscriptions because it's impractical. Likewise, the Caldari aren't going to stick advertisements on the latest assault rifle in neon scrolling mini-billboards on their dropsuits. In an arms race, competing factions will aim to match each other in sheer firepower. It's too risky to be innovative and hop out on a limb, hoping the abstract path you've taken will eventually lead to an advantage over your stockpiling opposition. In this sense, having the same bonuses for different factions does make sense. This makes sense to me because if one empire began using a certain operating system on their drop suits then think about how the other empires would react. They would use the same system because it is on par with their competition, and the original empire would be trying to sell that system so that the competition gains no advantage over its own soldiers. Also as Vyzion said why stick you neck out on the chance that a system designed for with armour in mind over the more competitive shields would be folly. Not only should you have invested a sizable fortune in developing a prototype systems yourself but should it not work or become extremely easily exploited then your soldiers are likely to become much less effective. Also since these are mercs the empires are supplying their equipment to there is no reason for them to give out their own military designs when they can simply adopt what is most likely a cheaper and more standardised option.
Arkena Wyrnspire Turalyon Plus 137	Posted - 2013.05.04 08:19:00 - [6] - Quote Why can't armour dropsuits have armour bonuses? Is that too hard?
Django Quik R.I.f.t Orion Empire 399	Posted - 2013.05.04 08:20:00 - [7] - Quote Sete Clifton wrote: I'm not sure I get what's being asked here. Each dropsuit has a "frame" bonus and a "racial bonus". The frame bonus is the same for each suit within a frame (light, medium, heavy). The racial suits are unique to each individual suit and based on the race it belongs to. ^ What he said. What are you talking about OP?
Cosgar The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 423	Posted - 2013.05.04 08:21:00 - [8] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Why can't armour dropsuits have armour bonuses? Is that too hard? Because out of 10 years CCP still can't get armor tanking right on EVE Online. Why would you expect it to be done right on here?
trollsroyce Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 333	Posted - 2013.05.04 08:35:00 - [9] - Quote Why should ground troops follow spaceships in terms of armament? As far as variety goes, I'm certain the future further specialized suits will go deeper in racial doctrines. Making them different now would be a balancing nightmare. Better be generic but functional on launch, than fully different but completely out of balance.
Syther Shadows The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 71	Posted - 2013.05.04 09:05:00 - [10] - Quote Sete Clifton wrote: I'm not sure I get what's being asked here. Each dropsuit has a "frame" bonus and a "racial bonus". The frame bonus is the same for each suit within a frame (light, medium, heavy). The racial suits are unique to each individual suit and based on the race it belongs to. GG op does not know what he is talking about

mongahu Bragian Order Amarr Empire 0	Posted - 2013.05.04 09:09:00 - [11] - Quote Vyzion Eyri wrote: Because there is only so much variation in combat operations before something becomes impractical. All guns fire projectiles of some sort because after billions of years of war, men have figured out that is the best way to kill someone else. Kevlar is used for bulletproof vests because after dozens of years of experimentation, that material is the most efficient and effective. Here, it's armour and shields. When we're immortal, the only goal is to have your mercenaries last the longest and withstand the most punishment as possible. ALL factions should recognise this. Amarr isn't going to design their suits to be weighed down by regalia and gold inscriptions because it's impractical. Likewise, the Caldari aren't going to stick advertisements on the latest assault rifle in neon scrolling mini-billboards on their dropsuits. In an arms race, competing factions will aim to match each other in sheer firepower. It's too risky to be innovative and hop out on a limb, hoping the abstract path you've taken will eventually lead to an advantage over your stockpiling opposition. In this sense, having the same bonuses for different factions does make sense. This is wrong for a few reasons. First this is a game. And in this game universe not all guns shoot projectiles. It is lore consistent and to have an amarr suit have armor bonuses because amarr as a people think armor is better than shields. So it doesn't make since to have a frame bonus that doesn't support this. Its like saying that potatoes are better than rice but because potatoes are better no one should ever eat rice and people should like them more than rice. Armor like rice is a cultural preference. And in new Eden is a race preference all I'm saying is the suits should reflect this giving all races a shield bonus is just lazy.
Martin0 Brancaleone Maphia Clan Corporation CRONOS. 251	Posted - 2013.05.04 09:18:00 - [12] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Why can't armour dropsuits have armour bonuses? Is that too hard? Because out of 10 years CCP still can't get armor tanking right on EVE Online. Why would you expect it to be done right on here? Sadly this. I would have given to the amarr ang gallente assault a 5% reduction to armor plate speed penality per level.
mongahu Bragian Order Amarr Empire 0	Posted - 2013.05.04 09:27:00 - [13] - Quote Martin0 Brancaleone wrote: Cosgar wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Why can't armour dropsuits have armour bonuses? Is that too hard? Because out of 10 years CCP still can't get armor tanking right on EVE Online. Why would you expect it to be done right on here? Sadly this. I would have given to the amarr ang gallente assault a 5% reduction to armor plate speed penality per level. This. Or give the amarr suit a %amount with slow speed and the gallente a armor rep % they should brave made the frame bonus not something that is race sensitive
Natu Nobilis Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 172	Posted - 2013.05.04 09:34:00 - [14] - Quote In EVE, each faction is known for certain proficiencies and preferences in their weapons. Amarr Laser Missiles Armor Slow They-¦re the slowboats that endure punishment and strike hard with EM and Thermal. Armor tanking with huge HP and resists. Minmatar Projectiles / Missiles Armor / Shield Super Fast Strike fast from afar, do a huge alpha, run away reload, repeat. They-¦re the most versatile ones, and their ships do what they must, no matter what you fit. Explosive damage to counter the Armor from the Amarr. Gallente Hybrid (Blaster) Drones Armor Fast Get intimate, get close, get a huge dps on your face. Blasters strike hard with Thermal and Kinetic from close range, they armor tank and use drones as an effective support, or even main weapon. Armor tanking all the way, with bonus for repair cycle. Caldari Missiles Hybrid (Railgun) Shield Normal speed YOU CAN-¦T HIT ME FROM OVER THEEEEEERE. Missiles let them choose what damage type they-¦ll use (EM / Thermal / Kin / Explosive) and it-¦s an all around weapon ready for whoever they face. Shield users with bonus to resist. *** That applies to ships and the focus on their technology, so i understand OP when he asks for more fidedignity on the atributes of the suits, that could reflect each faction focus on development. Seein an Amarr with shield bonus is like watching a neo-con trying to give peace a chance.
Nirwanda Vaughns Planetary Response Organisation 43	Posted - 2013.05.04 09:50:00 - [15] - Quote Natu Nobilis wrote: In EVE, each faction is known for certain proficiencies and preferences in their weapons. Amarr Laser Missiles Armor Slow They-¦re the slowboats that endure punishment and strike hard with EM and Thermal. Armor tanking with huge HP and resists. Minmatar Projectiles / Missiles Armor / Shield Super Fast Strike fast from afar, do a huge alpha, run away reload, repeat. They-¦re the most versatile ones, and their ships do what they must, no matter what you fit. Explosive damage to counter the Armor from the Amarr. Gallente Hybrid (Blaster) Drones Armor Fast Get intimate, get close, get a huge dps on your face. Blasters strike hard with Thermal and Kinetic from close range, they armor tank and use drones as an effective support, or even main weapon. Armor tanking all the way, with bonus for repair cycle. Caldari Missiles Hybrid (Railgun) Shield Normal speed YOU CAN-¦T HIT ME FROM OVER THEEEEEERE. Missiles let them choose what damage type they-¦ll use (EM / Thermal / Kin / Explosive) and it-¦s an all around weapon ready for whoever they face. Shield users with bonus to resist. *** That applies to ships and the focus on their technology, so i understand OP when he asks for more fidedignity on the atributes of the suits, that could reflect each faction focus on development. Seein an Amarr with shield bonus is like watching a neo-con trying to give peace a chance. exactly each race has evolved a certain rock/paper/scissors/lizzard/spock where damage and defense type comes in. amarr use armor tanking but use weapons that do heavy shield damage because their primary enemy the minmatar use shields, as such minmatar adapted to use shield and armor tanks and explosive damage weapons to be effective against thier oppressors defenses. Caldari and gallentes primary weapon systems do damage which is equal to each others defenses and so adjust their tactics to combat their fighting style. gallente like upclose and personal so caldari went long range and missiles to combat drones. the suits should refect the races choices for defense and offense, give caldari a bonus to shields, snipers and plasma cannon. gallente bonus to armor, AR's and guided explosives (swarms) amarr bonus to armor and lasers and minmatar just hand them a roll of duct tape and some sharp sticks and pebbles. as for the arguement that teh frame bonus is across board is pretty moot, in eve the 'role' ships get the bonus from thier former hull so the wolf gets the same bonus from the rifter to its favored tanking and weapon system. giving gallente and amarr shield tank bonus is like giving the wolf a laser cap use bonus for minmatar frigate and projectile range bonus for assault ships skill
IceStormers Forsaken Immortals 6	Posted - 2013.05.04 10:08:00 - [16] - Quote Natu Nobilis wrote: In EVE, each faction is known for certain proficiencies and preferences in their weapons. Amarr Laser Missiles Armor Slow They-¦re the slowboats that endure punishment and strike hard with EM and Thermal. Armor tanking with huge HP and resists. Minmatar Projectiles / Missiles Armor / Shield Super Fast Strike fast from afar, do a huge alpha, run away reload, repeat. They-¦re the most versatile ones, and their ships do what they must, no matter what you fit. Explosive damage to counter the Armor from the Amarr. Gallente Hybrid (Blaster) Drones Armor Fast Get intimate, get close, get a huge dps on your face. Blasters strike hard with Thermal and Kinetic from close range, they armor tank and use drones as an effective support, or even main weapon. Armor tanking all the way, with bonus for repair cycle. Caldari Missiles Hybrid (Railgun) Shield Normal speed YOU CAN-¦T HIT ME FROM OVER THEEEEEERE. Missiles let them choose what damage type they-¦ll use (EM / Thermal / Kin / Explosive) and it-¦s an all around weapon ready for whoever they face. Shield users with bonus to resist. *** That applies to ships and the focus on their technology, so i understand OP when he asks for more fidedignity on the atributes of the suits, that could reflect each faction focus on development. Seein an Amarr with shield bonus is like watching a neo-con trying to give peace a chance. This is what i was hoping they would follow, its really not to hard for them to do so, however with the weps the way they are now its too hard However i am so much happier with this new build, it atleast makes more sense than what we have now, they just need to sort the weapons out and refine a few bonuses they need to do something about equipment still, should not be able to fit all equipment onto any suit, would rather see it like in EvE with bonuses to certain kit like the cov ops ships
Natu Nobilis Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 173	Posted - 2013.05.04 10:43:00 - [17] - Quote Since i-¦m used to the game CHANGING within time, i think the future holds interesting thing, so i-¦m in no rush. I want the PC to kick in and see the big boys in action, and let the one man army people go their merry way to the pub matches.
Kirah Sommersord Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 0	Posted - 2013.05.04 11:30:00 - [18] - Quote The current Amarr assault suit seems already very inferior to the Gallente one. As a bonus the Gallente get a bonus to damage of 25% at proto level and an extra low slot with more armor than the Amarr version. With 3 hi slots on the Amarr version even if you have 3 complex damage mods you will never have a better damage ratio than the Gallente suit and you'll have a worse armor tank since they get more base armor and an extra low. There is almost no reason to ever go Amarr at the moment. Why the Amarr assault suit has such poor armor is beyond me. Amarr. Are known generally for completely forgoing shielding in favor of the strongest armor and resistances out of the four races. Gallente are known not for armor resistances but armor repairing. So why has this been changed around? It seems like Amarr suits especially the assault variants are getting the short end of the stick when they should have the worst shielding and best armor.


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