DUST Search - CCP, CPM, AFK - the worms falling out of the can must be purged

Parson Atreides wrote:

Maken Tosch wrote:

Parson Atreides wrote:

Maken Tosch wrote:

Overall, what I'm trying to say here is that it's one thing to remove the AFK SP farming but it's another to try to retroactively remove the SP earned when none of the players who were farming were breaking any rules. Yes, I defend their actions by virtue of the fact that they can do whatever they want with the tools given to them. Yes, their actions cheapen our efforts for those of us who actually put forth effort and therefore this mechanic in which SP is earned for time played must be removed. But I will not stand silent to the fact that some people here want to remove the SP earned this way.

Since no rules were broken, there should be no punishment (in this case removing SP earned). Just simply take away the AFK-promoting mechanic and be done with it.

I'm almost positive there was something we agreed to at some point (EULA maybe) that states we will not knowingly and willingly use exploits in the game. So rules were broken. Tears were shed. Now SP should be lost (and hopefully more tears will be shed).

Fully endorse removing SP from AFK farmers.

We'll just end this debate here right now and wait for CCP to make an official announcement on the matter.

Just as a matter of curiosity, I looked up the EULA for EVE, which cites the adherence to the Rules of Conduct. Number 23 is of particular interest, since, if Dust EULA is anything like EVE's, it means they are justifiably punishable.

23. You may not exploit any bug in EVE Online to gain an unfair advantage over other players. You may not communicate the existence of any exploitable bug to others directly or through a public forum. Bugs should be reported through the bug reporting tool on our website.


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Veiny Throbbing Joystick Intara Direct Action Caldari State 3	Posted - 2013.05.02 22:55:00 - [1] - Quote Glossary of terms. CCP is a game company who wants to launch this "triple-A game" and become some sort of shining star in the ocean of video games out there with their one-shard sandboxy ideals. CPM is a group of players who have the trust of the community and acts as the mediator between CCP and players. AFK is the exploit that allows risk-free farming of reward that is normally gained by active gameplay, by taking advantage of the real playing people. --- In the ideal situation. CCP, with their ideals and goals in mind, what they do should have the wider gaming community in mind, because people are always watching. Maybe not now, but in the future, whatever you do is your history, and your history tells people what kind of games you make, and how you run it. To CCP, AFK should be regarded as an exploit and those who make use of it should be punished, or at least set a target of getting the problem fixed. CPM, with player's interest in mind, should discourage this AFK exploit because it is not doing the game any good. It is a stupid bug, a stupid exploit that ruins the game for those who want to actually play. CPM, normally, should discourage AFK farming, and should be communicating to CCP about how unhealthy this is. AFK, being an exploit that ruins, nullify, invalidate, even discourage active gameplay (why fight a fight without your teammates when you can just AFK with them?), should be made illegal, discouraged, and eliminated with the fury of a thousand suns. --- In reality. CCP is quiet about the whole thing, and does not seem to care about the cancer that is killing the game. CPM is actively AFKing, and openly talks about it in the forum, and takes no action to discourage this exploit. AFK is not regarded as an exploit, and is the most rewarding way, the perfect way to "play" the game. --- In my heart, crying out loud. What the flying kittens.
Veiny Throbbing Joystick Intara Direct Action Caldari State 7	Posted - 2013.05.02 23:15:00 - [2] - Quote jenza aranda wrote: CCP knows about the issue and are working to fix it allong with advisement of the CPM in the new build. CCP has not, however, deemed it to be a exploit and so far have no plans to punish those doing it. We are in a sandbox with lots of tools to do what we want. its our choice to do what we want and build what we want with those tools so long as they exist. Regardless of if i like them or not, its not my place to tell people how to play with those tools, its CCPs. Your failure to recognize this AFK mechanism to be a cancerous and is killing the game worries me. Your "sandbox" argument does not even make sense. Sandbox refers to the endless possibilities players can create with their tools. AFK makes it meaningless to play with the sandbox. How can you not see this?
Veiny Throbbing Joystick Intara Direct Action Caldari State 10	Posted - 2013.05.02 23:21:00 - [3] - Quote jenza aranda wrote: Veiny Throbbing Joystick wrote: jenza aranda wrote: CCP knows about the issue and are working to fix it allong with advisement of the CPM in the new build. CCP has not, however, deemed it to be a exploit and so far have no plans to punish those doing it. We are in a sandbox with lots of tools to do what we want. its our choice to do what we want and build what we want with those tools so long as they exist. Regardless of if i like them or not, its not my place to tell people how to play with those tools, its CCPs. Your failure to recognize this AFK mechanism to be a cancerous and is killing the game worries me. Your "sandbox" argument does not even make sense. Sandbox refers to the endless possibilities players can create with their tools. AFK makes it meaningless to play with the sandbox. How can you not see this? i never said that it was a good thing, i totally agree that it needs to go and we are working out a new system. you will never see me saying that AFKing is a good thing, but you will never see me saying that people shoulnt use it while its here. Maybe you should, because, you know, you are supposed to be acting in the interest of players. And you don't want people to play the game by not playing the game.
Veiny Throbbing Joystick Intara Direct Action Caldari State 18	Posted - 2013.05.02 23:52:00 - [4] - Quote CCP's silence on this issue is really disappointing. CPM's inaction is also really disappointing.
Veiny Throbbing Joystick Intara Direct Action Caldari State 18	Posted - 2013.05.02 23:57:00 - [5] - Quote It is not about New Eden. This is about a real life game that is called Dust 514 and there is a bug in the game that lets you sit out the game and do nothing and still gain SP from it although you are ruining other people's gameplay.
Veiny Throbbing Joystick Intara Direct Action Caldari State 27	Posted - 2013.05.03 00:26:00 - [6] - Quote Medic 1879 wrote: Since skirmish stats arent tracking how do you prove you weren't AFK in those games it could look like it if you have low lifetime WP but high SP how do you know they are AFK and not just suffering from this glitch? Maybe there is currently no way to tell who is who. But CCP needs to at leaststart addressing this issue. Because if this afk business is allowed to go on, the game will be nicknamed AFK514 very soon.
Veiny Throbbing Joystick Intara Direct Action Caldari State 30	Posted - 2013.05.03 01:00:00 - [7] - Quote Iron Wolf, Can you please make CCP address this issue publicly? Their silence is very uninspiring. Yours, Joystick
Veiny Throbbing Joystick Intara Direct Action Caldari State 30	Posted - 2013.05.03 01:14:00 - [8] - Quote Deadeye Dic wrote: Man how many of these threads are there today? First the Anti-Kain thread, which was really about AFKing and now this one. All in all though, a good read, bad trolling, not informative at all, lacks substance....I give this thread a 4, but only because there was community involvement. You clearly put effort into it, 1/10
Veiny Throbbing Joystick Intara Direct Action Caldari State 33	Posted - 2013.05.03 02:07:00 - [9] - Quote Parson Atreides wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Parson Atreides wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Overall, what I'm trying to say here is that it's one thing to remove the AFK SP farming but it's another to try to retroactively remove the SP earned when none of the players who were farming were breaking any rules. Yes, I defend their actions by virtue of the fact that they can do whatever they want with the tools given to them. Yes, their actions cheapen our efforts for those of us who actually put forth effort and therefore this mechanic in which SP is earned for time played must be removed. But I will not stand silent to the fact that some people here want to remove the SP earned this way. Since no rules were broken, there should be no punishment (in this case removing SP earned). Just simply take away the AFK-promoting mechanic and be done with it. I'm almost positive there was something we agreed to at some point (EULA maybe) that states we will not knowingly and willingly use exploits in the game. So rules were broken. Tears were shed. Now SP should be lost (and hopefully more tears will be shed). Fully endorse removing SP from AFK farmers. We'll just end this debate here right now and wait for CCP to make an official announcement on the matter. Just as a matter of curiosity, I looked up the EULA for EVE, which cites the adherence to the Rules of Conduct. Number 23 is of particular interest, since, if Dust EULA is anything like EVE's, it means they are justifiably punishable. 23. You may not exploit any bug in EVE Online to gain an unfair advantage over other players. You may not communicate the existence of any exploitable bug to others directly or through a public forum. Bugs should be reported through the bug reporting tool on our website. Was gonna post the same thing. Unfortunately in Dust's EULA there is no written rule specific to exploits. It looks like they are actually still writing it and it has very little things on the list. But if the EVE code applies, afk farming should be an offence.
Veiny Throbbing Joystick Intara Direct Action Caldari State 33	Posted - 2013.05.03 02:12:00 - [10] - Quote Actually, EVE codes DO NOT apply because this is a different game/product. So it is really up to CCP to decide what to do. I don't think the currently AFKing people are gonna be punished.