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Bones McGavins
TacoCat Industries
68
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Posted - 2013.04.16 15:57:00 -
[1] - Quote
I love tank drivers complaining about AV. You are just bad at the game if you lose 1on1 to AV. All these complaints about packed AV.
WHY ARE YOU LETTING ME GET NEXT TO YOU WITH PACKED AV!?
Have some situational awareness. Use the tools given to you. You have scanners. Maybe you need to sacrifice some DPS or armor to equip one, but it will let you know when pesky AV is getting near you.
Tank drivers just want to be able to park and be invincible.
A tank that is bad, and just sits in one spot can be snuck up on and killed by 1 talented AV player.
A tank that is decent, but still just sits in one spot will kill 1 talented AV player, but will lose to a coordinated attack.
A tank that is good and actually moves is very difficult to kill even with a coordinated effort. Ranged AV dont do enough DPS to take them out before they get behind cover, and closer AV is hard to get in range for since they move a lot.
A tank that is good and has squad support is REALLY REALLY hard to kill even with a dedicated squad. AV weapons leave you exposed to sniper fire and AR/Lazer file. A shotgun scout near the tank will destroy any packed AV users who try to get close to throw it.
The problem with tank balance is that tankers lone wolf it and then complain AV is too strong. But then with even minimal squad support, AV is too weak. Being able to disable the tank from retreating would help a long way to balance this. AV doesnt need a buff. Hell, you can nerf close range AV but give ability to stop tanks from retreating and wed be fine.
TLDR: Long range AV is **** right now, close AV is OP, but with a good squad supporting a tank close AV has a hard time getting anything done. Thus, lone wolf tanks get destroyed by close AV, but squad supported tanks feel OP. |
Bones McGavins
TacoCat Industries
78
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Posted - 2013.04.16 19:36:00 -
[2] - Quote
Even right now, I cant imagine how deadly tanks would be if they had crew manning the smaller turrets. Imagine me with my AV nades running at a tank that actually had folks on the smaller turret, theyd be chomping at the bits for a chance to shoot something and I'd be a perfect target. Small turrets arent great, but theyd make mince meat of of a scout sprinting at you...
Honestly the balance for AV nades is already there, and it involves having the other seats filled. (Ill mentioned active scanners again too...but maybe those are bugged since nobody uses them?).
I worry for the day tanks actually have gunners. Or hell, even just a fatsuit sitting there waiting to pop out and HMG any AV unit who gets too close. Would destroy a lot of my current AV plans... |
Bones McGavins
TacoCat Industries
78
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Posted - 2013.04.16 22:04:00 -
[3] - Quote
It does. If any tank ever gets solo'd versus AV they are an idiot and should quit the game.
You have a speed advantage, a range advantage, a damage advantage, a health advantage. Not to mention the fact the AV is vulnerable to all sorts of other enemies while you are only vulnerable to AV.
Honestly, how are you dying to one AV unit?
I sometimes wonder if tankers dont realize the amount of AV units that take them on, and the amount of times those units died by other random guys in the process. Whenever I kill a tank its usually because 2 or 3 other guys were hitting it and I managed to get the last shot.
Usually if I do get a tank kill, its because i sprinted half way across the map to cut off the tanks retreat as soon as swarm or forgers start pelting it. Then i catch it as it comes around a corner, thinking its escaped the long range AV. But that requires the other couple AV units hitting it a bunch first, and then the tanker needs lack of squad support to allow me to get in the position (and be predictable in its escape, but most are). |
Bones McGavins
TacoCat Industries
82
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 14:23:00 -
[4] - Quote
Fun fact, it takes more SP to get to logistics LAV than it does to the current highest tier tanks.
Its funny that you never see LAV or dropship users complaining. Why is that? They take just as much SP and ISK to use as tanks, and are pretty much just support units. They can die super easy (neither have the PGU to use heavy shield or armor and dropships are much easier to get LOS on).
Why do tanks complain that their killing machines are quite as effecient bang for buck as it could be, but LAV and Dropship users dont mind spending just as much SP and ISK to simply be a support role and have fun?
What tankers need to realize is you arent going to get a 1:1 ratio in SP/ISK investment to game impact. The reason being, that system would make it impossible for new players to compete.
A proto suit worth 10X as much as my starter gear is still easy for me to kill if I get the drop. So despite the fact that a smart tanker who is constantly mobile is pretty much immortal in the current game, tankers still complain that a 70K unit can kill their 500k? Well duh. Someones 200K proto suit easily dies by my free starter gear if I play right. Plus, the tank usually at least has enough time to react, headshots from my scrambler pistol will kill most proto suits before they can even do ANYTHING AT ALL.
This game is not meant for you to be able to BUY your way to victory. You buy an advantage, which tanks OBVIOUSLY have. |
Bones McGavins
TacoCat Industries
82
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 14:44:00 -
[5] - Quote
A 70K unit cant touch a 1.7M tank by itself. How can it? If a ranged AV unit has LOS on you, you have LOS on it, if its using AV nades, MOVE. One unit will only own your tank if you suck horribly.
Meanwhile a free sniper can safely, without danger, kill a proto suit before it knows what hit it, regardless of how skilled that proto user is.
Which is more "unfair?" |
Bones McGavins
TacoCat Industries
83
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 19:11:00 -
[6] - Quote
Mathmatically, I dont remotely understand how the jump from standard to advanced forge could be that different. Its like a few 100 HP. Against a unit that has what, 8K? EDIT: I mean, i get the difference between standard versus assault, assault clealry does a signifigant amount of DPS more than standard. But how much more per shot does a higher teir assault do? |
Bones McGavins
TacoCat Industries
83
|
Posted - 2013.04.17 21:44:00 -
[7] - Quote
In the 2.5 seconds it takes to fire a round of the forge gun (and get a 126 damage bonus from the upgrade to a tank which is like 1% of the health of the tank you are fighting) you get 46.875 extra damage from the upgrade from AR to gek. That is like 20% the health of some scouts, like 10% the health of most units, and 5% the health of unit with a lot of health.
So you can see how that jump would be more impactful... |
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