DUST Search - Alliance name underneath your corp name

Leither Yiltron wrote:

CCP FoxFour wrote:

Lord-of-the-Dreadfort wrote:

wouldn't that be more along the lines of what us mercs are responsible for?

read a lot of articles about how you (CCP) provide the mechanics and the players run wold with them.

would suggest releasing it like it is in eve and then tweaking it based on player feedback Big smile

That is exactly my point though, what we release is a set of tools. The tools though should be based on what you guys need and want. We could just straight up implement it as it is in EVE, but we may be spending development time on things you guys don't actually use. Equally important though is that maybe there are some things we can do to make alliances work better for you guys in DUST.

As it stands alliances do work, so long as you have an EVE player in your corporation to join. With Uprising we are adding alliance chat, alliance mail, and bonuses for owning districts that apply to your entire alliance. So we are working on it and as I said we are monitoring how you guys use alliances to see what tools you need most.

The current Dust alliances have been requesting features for a long time, and they've been very consistent feature sets. There are also dead-bang OBVIOUS features with the upcoming PC rollout that you're not providing to alliances. If I can use a CCP member's name, your reasoning in a logic loop:

(1) CCP: Let's wait and see what features they need for alliances.

(2) Alliances: Well it looks like CCP isn't giving us very many features. We'll just have to do our best without them.

(3) CCP: Alliances don't seem to need additional mechanics. They're doing just fine managing with the current set.

(4) -> Nothing happens

These are the things that don't need looking over, don't need to be questioned, and do need to be implemented. There is no waiting for these, because alliances will eventually compensate at the cost of burning out the leaders and managers who drive the human drama you're hoping to emulate from Eve Online:

Core alliance management:

Unless you plan to change the entirety of the alliance experience in New Eden, the Dust client needs to be able to do the following, provided the correct permissions:

Create alliances

Apply to alliances

Vote for executor

Leave alliances

Send alliance mail (from Dust client)

etc

So basically all the management tools that are independent of physical items in space or on the ground. If I could do the action in a station and no in-game items change their current locations for doing it, it's something that needs to be around in Dust's client. If there are pieces and parts that aren't used, I'll guarantee you that they're not used on the Eve side of things either.

Planetary Conquest Interaction:

If you do not provide the proper tools for alliances to cooperate with each other in PC, they will simply find workarounds. Not providing cooperation mechanics in PC for alliances only serves to punish smaller entities. Big alliances with tons of resources will be able to justify and effect workarounds at the cost of large down payments of resources in terms of both manpower and ISK. Smaller groups don't have that luxury.

These are obvious features that will just be worked around in their absence:

Add clones to other corps' districts if they are in your alliance

Open contracts, attacking and defending, for other alliance corporations to fill

Item trading should increase interactivity between Dust corporations within an alliance, and it would be great to see the alliance hangar concept implemented on the Dust side.

Needless to say that there needs to be more interaction between Dust and Eve added on all levels of gameplay. Even with the changes reported in the PC dev blog and on the PC Wiki page, interaction is slim to none. At best War Barge strikes should be removed while in PC, but something smacks me that this won't happen. Unless the PI bonuses are much better than anyone expects, you're not going to see many entities with the desire to hold both ground and space targets to the point of justifying having a stationary object in a hot zone on the Eve side.

Interaction between Dust and Eve has to be a crucial component of the next updates to both games. Yeah, everybody knows you've been going slow, but "So slow that nobody cares enough to notice when it's enough" is too slow.

I want everyone working on Dust 514 at CCP to take your thoughts that FPS gamers are somehow more disorganized than Eve players and don't need the same management tools, ball those thoughts up, and throw them so hard that they make it nearly to California before they drown in the ocean. As I've said before, the little suggestions constantly dropped by CCP on that front are condescending and downright wrong. If the fact that 2 of the 20 biggest alliances in New Eden are Dust-centric only 4 months after you put us on Tranquility isn't enough to convince you otherwise, I'm not really sure what will.

ONE UNIVERSE, ONE WAR

Your words, not mine.

TL;DR: With alliances and interaction, it's about time to get on the ball. "Wait and see" sounds a lot like "deal with how bad it is while we procrastinate".


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 4 post(s)
low genius The Sound Of Freedom Renegade Alliance 21	Posted - 2013.05.02 16:29:00 - [1] - Quote Leither Yiltron wrote: CCP FoxFour wrote: Lord-of-the-Dreadfort wrote: wouldn't that be more along the lines of what us mercs are responsible for? read a lot of articles about how you (CCP) provide the mechanics and the players run wold with them. would suggest releasing it like it is in eve and then tweaking it based on player feedback That is exactly my point though, what we release is a set of tools. The tools though should be based on what you guys need and want. We could just straight up implement it as it is in EVE, but we may be spending development time on things you guys don't actually use. Equally important though is that maybe there are some things we can do to make alliances work better for you guys in DUST. As it stands alliances do work, so long as you have an EVE player in your corporation to join. With Uprising we are adding alliance chat, alliance mail, and bonuses for owning districts that apply to your entire alliance. So we are working on it and as I said we are monitoring how you guys use alliances to see what tools you need most. The current Dust alliances have been requesting features for a long time, and they've been very consistent feature sets. There are also dead-bang OBVIOUS features with the upcoming PC rollout that you're not providing to alliances. If I can use a CCP member's name, your reasoning in a logic loop: (1) CCP: Let's wait and see what features they need for alliances. (2) Alliances: Well it looks like CCP isn't giving us very many features. We'll just have to do our best without them. (3) CCP: Alliances don't seem to need additional mechanics. They're doing just fine managing with the current set. (4) -> Nothing happens These are the things that don't need looking over, don't need to be questioned, and do need to be implemented. There is no waiting for these, because alliances will eventually compensate at the cost of burning out the leaders and managers who drive the human drama you're hoping to emulate from Eve Online: Core alliance management: Unless you plan to change the entirety of the alliance experience in New Eden, the Dust client needs to be able to do the following, provided the correct permissions: Create alliances Apply to alliances Vote for executor Leave alliances Send alliance mail (from Dust client) etc So basically all the management tools that are independent of physical items in space or on the ground. If I could do the action in a station and no in-game items change their current locations for doing it, it's something that needs to be around in Dust's client. If there are pieces and parts that aren't used, I'll guarantee you that they're not used on the Eve side of things either. Planetary Conquest Interaction: If you do not provide the proper tools for alliances to cooperate with each other in PC, they will simply find workarounds. Not providing cooperation mechanics in PC for alliances only serves to punish smaller entities. Big alliances with tons of resources will be able to justify and effect workarounds at the cost of large down payments of resources in terms of both manpower and ISK. Smaller groups don't have that luxury. These are obvious features that will just be worked around in their absence: Add clones to other corps' districts if they are in your alliance Open contracts, attacking and defending, for other alliance corporations to fill Item trading should increase interactivity between Dust corporations within an alliance, and it would be great to see the alliance hangar concept implemented on the Dust side. Needless to say that there needs to be more interaction between Dust and Eve added on all levels of gameplay. Even with the changes reported in the PC dev blog and on the PC Wiki page, interaction is slim to none. At best War Barge strikes should be removed while in PC, but something smacks me that this won't happen. Unless the PI bonuses are much better than anyone expects, you're not going to see many entities with the desire to hold both ground and space targets to the point of justifying having a stationary object in a hot zone on the Eve side. Interaction between Dust and Eve has to be a crucial component of the next updates to both games. Yeah, everybody knows you've been going slow, but "So slow that nobody cares enough to notice when it's enough" is too slow. I want everyone working on Dust 514 at CCP to take your thoughts that FPS gamers are somehow more disorganized than Eve players and don't need the same management tools, ball those thoughts up, and throw them so hard that they make it nearly to California before they drown in the ocean. As I've said before, the little suggestions constantly dropped by CCP on that front are condescending and downright wrong. If the fact that 2 of the 20 biggest alliances in New Eden are Dust-centric only 4 months after you put us on Tranquility isn't enough to convince you otherwise, I'm not really sure what will. ONE UNIVERSE, ONE WAR Your words, not mine. TL;DR: With alliances and interaction, it's about time to get on the ball. "Wait and see" sounds a lot like "deal with how bad it is while we procrastinate". how about you start an eve character and look at the way corporation titles and roles look, and see if you can realize why you're acting like a kid with a skinned knee right now?