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My offer to the people who want their Merc Packs refunded.

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Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 648	Posted - 2013.03.28 10:44:00 - [1] - Quote So I went ahead and did the math. In 1 month your total SP earned should be 761.6 without boosters, assuming you hit the cap each week and not factoring any SP you got after capping. With a booster that becomes 1142.4 SP. The difference between the two is 380.8. So then the question becomes, is getting your Merc pack refunded worth losing 380.8 SP per pack? So I think you should have 2 options. 1. Give up 380.8 SP SP per pack and receive your Merc Packs with the 30-day booster included. 2. Or lose no SP and receive the Merc Pack without the booster. Maybe throw in a three day booster as a gift. Either option should leave your assets untouched, that includes any unused boosters. So you would still have twice the items, just not the extra SP. Option 2 is really only there for those not interested in grinding again.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 648	Posted - 2013.03.28 10:55:00 - [2] - Quote Rupture Reaperson wrote: I like 2, while on that matter, can we distribute the merc pack goodies among characters? kinds sucks to have 2 dragonflies and toxins in my main and none on my alt. I wonder if we will ever be able to "gift" items, so you could just send your alts the items
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 648	Posted - 2013.03.28 11:13:00 - [3] - Quote Calgoth Reborn wrote: I bought all my merc packs during closed beta and choose neither option full refund of all items and aurum is the one I choose as an early supporter of CCP and dust I should reap the benefit's of doing so. I bought 4 of them during the beta just an fyi Early supporter of CCP? You had an EVE account 10 years ago did you? Oh, and everyone who buys stuff is supporting Dust, not sure what makes you think your special. People who buy stuff right now are also supporting Dust and they don't get a refund. Double the items seems like a good enough "reward" for your "support". Claiming you support CCP while trying to take advantage of a technicality? P'shhh
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 648	Posted - 2013.03.28 11:17:00 - [4] - Quote Altina McAlterson wrote: no one's going to get a second booster or anything else. Then they would complain that the terms of sale since the booster was part of the original sale and must therefore also be refunded. The only way refunding without the booster would work is if it was replaced by something of equal value. Is 308.8 SP not of equal value to the 30-day booster?
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 649	Posted - 2013.03.28 18:00:00 - [5] - Quote Altina McAlterson wrote: a reasonable person would draw the conclusion that the promise of items being credited to the player's account was a promise that the items purchased would not be lost during a reset. Clearly you are right, any reasonable would have come to that conclusion, and I fully believe that CCP has already honored the spirit of the original agreement. This is for those who are less reasonable, though I should have figured that they would refuse to compromise.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 649	Posted - 2013.03.28 18:04:00 - [6] - Quote Calgoth Reborn wrote: I am not trying to take advantage of anything the slogan when the merc pack came out was buy them once use them twice BS, unless you foresaw that there would be no more resets before commercial release.. You paid for 1 merck pack, not 2, not 1 that could be used 2. This whole situation arose as a result of CCP deciding to stop resetting characters, since we all assumed there would be another wipe at CR.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 649	Posted - 2013.03.28 18:15:00 - [7] - Quote Calgoth Reborn wrote: If they were going to give you sp in replace of the booster what would be the point just give the booster back and your math is off each 30-day booster is worth 408,000 sp so if they gave me sp instead of my booster's that would be 1,632,000 sp Ughhh... no, they would take the SP from everyone who bought the merc pack back in CR first, and then either give you the SP back or give the booster. And my math isn't off, the current cap is 190.400 unboosted. A booster raises it to 285.6. 1142.4 is what you can get in a month, or 4 weeks with a booster. Not sure where the hell you got 1,632,000 from 1,632,000? Oh, so now you want an entire months, aside from you math being wrong here, worth of SP without having to work for it too? SMH
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 649	Posted - 2013.03.28 18:32:00 - [8] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Pardon me for asking for so much, but can you post your formula? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=527997 Weekly cap is 190.4 (thousand, obviously) Using a booster raises it by 50% or 1.5 That's 285.6 Multiply both by 4, since that's how many weeks are in 30-days or a month The unboosted SP cap for a month is 761.6 With the booster it becomes 1142.4 So I then just subtracted the SP they would have gotten without the booster from the one that they'd get with booster, the difference is 380.8. So with my system they would still keep the SP they worked for, just not any they received from the 30-day boosters. Also bare in mind that I'm not even touching any SP earned after the cap.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 649	Posted - 2013.03.28 18:43:00 - [9] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: am I correct to assume that we are ONLY talking about the merc packs that were purchased during CLOSED BETA and had the "commercial release" clause in the description before the removal of said description? Yes, that is what people are trying to take advantage of, since "refund at commercial release" obviously translates to 2 boosters for the price of 1
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 649	Posted - 2013.03.28 18:56:00 - [10] - Quote Altina McAlterson wrote: Sloth9230 wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: am I correct to assume that we are ONLY talking about the merc packs that were purchased during CLOSED BETA and had the "commercial release" clause in the description before the removal of said description? Yes, that is what people are trying to take advantage of, since "refund at commercial release" obviously translates to 2 boosters for the price of 1 "During beta periods, CCP may need to reset characters, skills and other items included in the DUST 514-« GameStop Mercenary Pack. DUST 514-« GameStop Mercenary Pack will be credited in full to your in-game DUST 514-« account after each character reset and for the commercial release." are the words that in fantasy land mean you get two but only pay for one. Edit: Maken, the Merc Packs for sale at Gamestop still say it. *Runs off to Gamestop

Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 650	Posted - 2013.03.28 19:22:00 - [11] - Quote Baal Roo wrote: It's not vague language, it's extremely clearly written. The Merc pack includes all this stuff to use in the beta, and AGAIN at commercial release. No one is trying to be sneaky here or get anything extra out of this. We just want the very clearly written deal that we purchased. You were indeed promised a refund at release.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 653	Posted - 2013.03.28 19:34:00 - [12] - Quote Baal Roo wrote: its simple language and says nothing about a "refund" or getting your character reset at launch. As in the Merc pack being given back to you, sheesh, do you take everything so literally? Cause I'm pretty sure you understood what I meant -_-
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 653	Posted - 2013.03.28 19:36:00 - [13] - Quote TheMarkOf22 wrote: Who are you to make offers to people? LOL I would have said your papi, but that would fill me with great shame.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 654	Posted - 2013.03.28 19:43:00 - [14] - Quote Baal Roo wrote: Sloth9230 wrote: Baal Roo wrote: its simple language and says nothing about a "refund" or getting your character reset at launch. As in the Merc pack being given back to you, sheesh, do you take everything so literally? Cause I'm pretty sure you understood what I meant -_- no, I didn't understand what you meant, because I don't understand why you think people who bought the merc pack should have their characters reset in order to receive the items we bought. It's a ridiculous argument with seemingly no logical reasoning behind it. There's no reason to change the purchase agreement post facto. At commercial release CCP fulfills the Merc Pack purchases, the end. I don't understand why it needs to be complicated or why players who bought it should be punished for seemingly arbitrary reasons. Did I say SP reset? no dumbshit, I said SP cut, something you had already agreed to in Maken's thread. So why do you continue to argue that nothing else should be done aside from the refund, ohm IDK.. would it have anything to do with keeping the SP? Face it, this has nothing to do with CCP being honest or not, this is about people trying to squeeze free SP from them. maybe that's not what your in it for, but I guarantee you almost everyone else is. Edit: oh, and you aren't being penalized, you would have never had the chance to use the booster a second time in the first place. CCP changed their minds about SP resets, and that's what caused all this, not the wording on the merc pack. yeah, play the victim real mature.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 654	Posted - 2013.03.28 19:50:00 - [15] - Quote Baal Roo wrote: I don't have any problem giving back boosted SP if I get my booster back. Baal Roo's words people. Why is he arguing? I don't kitten know.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 655	Posted - 2013.03.28 20:06:00 - [16] - Quote Calgoth Reborn wrote: You get 95,200 sp each week extra with a booster so 95,2004=380,800 Stop right there, not sure what everything else is about. Calgoth Reborn wrote:* Like I said in the other thread you didn't buy a merc pack in the first place so your opinion doesn't matter as it doesn't concern you. I like how the guy who didn't buy one has an offer for the one's who did like your CCP Sorry but what CCP decides affects everyone, not not just the original buyers. Of course I didn't buy one, I couldn't have bought one, I was told about Dust after it went into OB. And whether I bought one or not is irrelevant anyway.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 655	Posted - 2013.03.28 20:16:00 - [17] - Quote Baal Roo wrote: this thread is a conversation about the principle. And I stand by what I said about the original agreement having already been honored. Any item you bought would have stayed with you into CR if you hadn't used it, that too me is CCP honoring the original agreement. It was dumb for them to include the "commercial release" clause, but people, not saying you necessarily, trying to get something out of a simple mistake is them just being greedy IMO.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 655	Posted - 2013.03.28 20:20:00 - [18] - Quote Knarf Black wrote: Right or wrong, it's not going to happen. It's the internet, talk about things that won't happen is all we do.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 657	Posted - 2013.03.28 21:10:00 - [19] - Quote Calgoth Reborn wrote: 408,000=30 day booster You'd rather loose 408,000 SP instead 380,800? Hey man, w/e ever floats your boat.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 657	Posted - 2013.03.28 21:23:00 - [20] - Quote Calgoth Reborn wrote: Sloth9230 wrote: Calgoth Reborn wrote: 408,000=30 day booster You'd rather loose 408,000 SP instead 380,800? Hey man, w/e ever floats your boat. So once again where do you get this I will lose sp in the first place Idea oh that's right that is your offer to people who bought merc pack's so once again didn't know you work for CCP and can make such offer's on their behalf CCP reads these forums, and I'm pretty sure they'll read this thread. Peoples response to this thread should give them a general idea whether this idea is good or not.

Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 660	Posted - 2013.03.28 23:15:00 - [21] - Quote Baal Roo wrote: they need to take that issue up with CCP. What exactly do you think the purpose of these forums are? next time someone makes a thread about a weapon being UP/Op what are you going to say, take it up with CCP? Jealousy? If I remember right, there was an event where CCP gave out 1 mill SP to CB testers. That's fine, it was gift from CCP. This is different, this isn't a gift nor was it "too good of an offer", because double the SP was never the offer in the first place. Garret is right, If you didn't use the booster then you still have it, if you did you did use it then you still have it but in the form of Sp. Right now all I see is people trying to have their cake and eat it. You bought 1 booster, not 2, not 1 you could use twice, just 1. If you still have the boosted SP then you have been given something of equal value, the sp itself, that fulfills the terms of the sale.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 660	Posted - 2013.03.28 23:24:00 - [22] - Quote Baal Roo wrote: your argument makes no sense if not chalked up to either jealousy or spite. The wording of the Merc Pack is clear, and you are arguing that it does not say what it says... or does not MEAN what it says. They can swap out the booster with something of equal value right? What else is equal in value to a booster other than the SP you would have gained from using the booster? So if you used the booster and gained SP from it, then it's still with you, but in the form of SP not a booster.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 660	Posted - 2013.03.28 23:38:00 - [23] - Quote Calgoth Reborn wrote: If CCP want's to follow the suggestion's of you people then they can expect no more purchase's from me I doubt CCP wants the bushiness of some one who's trying to use a technicality to get more than what he paid for. So taking 380 SP out of your SP pool is somehow alienating you? How have you survived so long in this cruel cruel world? If everyone got reset at CR then it would still be the same thing, but oh no because then "CCP lied about no more resets". Please you people are never happy, and you're just trying to take advantage of the situation by them stating there wouldn't be anymore resets. CCP should just give us all 5 mill SP at CR and be done with this situation.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 660	Posted - 2013.03.28 23:45:00 - [24] - Quote Baal Roo wrote: Sloth9230 wrote: Calgoth Reborn wrote: If CCP want's to follow the suggestion's of you people then they can expect no more purchase's from me I doubt CCP wants the business of someone so eager to exploit their current situation. So taking 380 SP out of your SP pool is somehow alienating you? How have you survived so long in this cruel cruel world? If everyone got reset at CR then it would still be the same thing, but oh no because then "CCP lied about no more resets". Please you people are never happy, and you're just trying to take advantage of the situation by them stating there wouldn't be anymore resets in a greedy little attempt to double down on your purchase. CCP should just give us all 5 mill SP at CR and be done with this situation. yes, us evil paying customers trying to "take advantage" of the multimillion dollar company. Clearly, the people who paid for a product that we haven't received are the greedy ones. You haven't received it? So CCP has admitted that this is CR? But anyway, CCP has given you something of equal value, the SP for having used the booster in the first place. As long as you keep the Sp at CR then they don't have to return the booster, just the items you've spent.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 660	Posted - 2013.03.28 23:47:00 - [25] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Go talk to sony customer service for a refund. Or Gamestop, technically they sold you the merc pack, not CCP.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 661	Posted - 2013.03.28 23:50:00 - [26] - Quote Dr Debo Galaxy wrote: I don't know if this is possible but why don't they just do this. Choice of two options. 1. If you want your Aurum refunded you get a full reset to all your characters. SP/ISK/Aurum everything. 2. If you don't want your Aurum reset you stay were your at and nothing happens. I'm sure this may not be possible from a logistics stand point or from time and man hours stand point. But this would give the people who want here aurum refunded and the people who don't really care to keep what they want. Just an idea. Many people have suggested it, apparently that would "alienate" them and would be "spiteful". Which it might be, but that is also exactly what they're asking for.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 661	Posted - 2013.03.28 23:56:00 - [27] - Quote Calgoth Reborn wrote: CCP's marketing strategy for the Merc pack when it was first released was Buy it once use it twice they said that not me. So you are wrong on the 1 not 2 deal as that was one of the key selling point's CCP was using Nope, it never promised that. That original agreement was under the assumption there would be a rest at CR. I don't have to give you a reason to take my opinion seriously. You aren't CCP and therefore it makes no difference whether you consider my opinion valid or not. But what ever happens here effects everyone, not just those who originally bought the merc pack. I could go to Gamestop though, buy a merc pack and then i could say w/e the hell i want right?
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 661	Posted - 2013.03.29 00:02:00 - [28] - Quote Calgoth Reborn wrote: See your whole solution is to take sp away from only merc pack user's if there was a full reset of everyone at CR then that would be different as it would effect everyone and everyone would be back at square not just merc pack user's who would lose sp with your "solution" which is to take away 4 months of boosted sp in my case with 4 -30day boosters If the booster gets refunded then why should you keep it's effects? That wasn't part of the original agreement. You were promised that the booster would get returned to you at CR, not that you'd get to keep the SP as well.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 661	Posted - 2013.03.29 00:23:00 - [29] - Quote @Calgoth Reborn I'm going to stop responding to you know because your making this about me and not about my proposal. I could go buy a merc pack at Gamestop, since they still say the same description as the old packs before they were changed, but it's not worth spending 20$ just so you'll listen to my opinion on this. Quote: EXACTLY what CCP No, it's not, but since you want to go by exactly what they say, then you should understand that cutting you SP is perfectly within reason, since they never said they wouldn't. Sorry if that makes you feel alienated. Take it up with Sony or Gamestop, they bought the merc pack and then resold it to you. Your transaction was with them, not CCP.
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 663	Posted - 2013.03.29 00:43:00 - [30] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Most of these guys are probably kids who think $20 is worth arguing over. Well apparently he spent $100 on this, but I still don't see why he thinks he's entitled to keep the bonus SP and get the boosters back.

Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 665	Posted - 2013.03.29 03:21:00 - [31] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: The most unfortunate problem of this entire argument. Those who think they deserve something at launch. Don't quote nor consider the ENTIRE Item description page. Are you trying to tell us that a reset is a prerequisite for the items to be credited back? Cause I'll laugh pretty hard if that's the case
Sloth9230 Reaper Galactic 665	Posted - 2013.03.29 03:41:00 - [32] - Quote The way Baal Roo and Altina explained it to me was that what counts are the terms of service at the time of purchase, and that the whole "Terms can be changed" thing doesn't fly in court. So even if the offer was removed, SCEA or CCP is still liable for it. Though I would argue that allowing one to keep the boosted SP counts as an "item of similar value" to the 30 day booster. So as long as there's no reset, the original agreement is fulfilled wthout the need to give people another booster.

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