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Klivve Cussler
Ransoms Incorporated
49
|
Posted - 2013.02.18 21:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
Preface: This idea came to me while thinking about how to better give planets a sense of distinctiveness, while at the same time reducing workload.
Basically, the idea would be to procedurally generate up to four distinct plant species per planet by mixing and matching attributes found in plants on Earth. These species could then be saved with a minimum of overhead and rendered on any map taking place on that planet. That would give each planet a unique ecology without the need to tie up an art team for five years thinking up alien grasses.
So, each plant species would have several attributes:
1. Size 1-4 (Ground Cover, Bush, Small Tree, large Tree) 2. Branching model (use existing earth plants as models:Grass, Bamboo, Pine, Oak, Cactus, Rose, etc) this determines the basic structure of the plant 3. Trunk Texture (Barbed-Rose, Bark-tree, Scale-palm tree, Bamboo, etc) 4. Trunk Color 5. Leaf Model (Palm frond, oak leaf, lilly pad, pine needle, fern frond, etc) 6. Leaf Size 7 Leaf Color
Each planet could randomly generate one plant species of each size and store the attributes. So for example, you could have a tree sized cactus-like plant with a palm-tree-like skin in pale yellow covered with tiny purple fern-type leaves.
Then when the planet is rendered for a battle, the unique species of that planet are rendered and slotted into the maps. This could be further modified by biome (desert maps would maybe only render bush sized planets, or grasslands just large trees and ground cover, for example), lattitude, or whatever.
Basically, this system could produce a uniqueness to each planet that would be easily recognizable without a lot of overhead in the art department. |
Terry Webber
Gothic Wars Consortium
35
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Posted - 2013.02.18 23:37:00 -
[2] - Quote
I like this but I'm pretty sure CCP might have already thought of this.
Edit: By the way, I like how you named your character after a famous writer. |
Klivve Cussler
Ransoms Incorporated
49
|
Posted - 2013.02.22 22:23:00 -
[3] - Quote
CCP may well have thought of this already. But it never hurts to put it out there.
Re character name: Thanks. I usually name my characters after characters, not author's, but ol' Clive writes himself into almost all of his novels, so I guess I'm not really making an exception. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
|
Posted - 2013.02.22 23:21:00 -
[4] - Quote
+1 I was going to make a thread on this when vegetation is added. I want the plants to be more than just green generic Earth-like plants. Presence of fruit along with color, shape, size would be nice as well. On a related note, I would love to fight on a planet with very giant plant-like organisms (not necessarily plants by our definition) that look like huge mushrooms, or other cool fungus. |
Israckcatarac
Opus Arcana Orion Empire
3
|
Posted - 2013.02.22 23:27:00 -
[5] - Quote
Klivve Cussler wrote:Preface: This idea came to me while thinking about how to better give planets a sense of distinctiveness, while at the same time reducing workload.
Basically, the idea would be to procedurally generate up to four distinct plant species per planet by mixing and matching attributes found in plants on Earth. These species could then be saved with a minimum of overhead and rendered on any map taking place on that planet. That would give each planet a unique ecology without the need to tie up an art team for five years thinking up alien grasses.
So, each plant species would have several attributes:
1. Size 1-4 (Ground Cover, Bush, Small Tree, large Tree) 2. Branching model (use existing earth plants as models:Grass, Bamboo, Pine, Oak, Cactus, Rose, etc) this determines the basic structure of the plant 3. Trunk Texture (Barbed-Rose, Bark-tree, Scale-palm tree, Bamboo, etc) 4. Trunk Color 5. Leaf Model (Palm frond, oak leaf, lilly pad, pine needle, fern frond, etc) 6. Leaf Size 7 Leaf Color
Each planet could randomly generate one plant species of each size and store the attributes. So for example, you could have a tree sized cactus-like plant with a palm-tree-like skin in pale yellow covered with tiny purple fern-type leaves.
Then when the planet is rendered for a battle, the unique species of that planet are rendered and slotted into the maps. This could be further modified by biome (desert maps would maybe only render bush sized planets, or grasslands just large trees and ground cover, for example), lattitude, or whatever.
Basically, this system could produce a uniqueness to each planet that would be easily recognizable without a lot of overhead in the art department.
No Ground cover just DUST.
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Klivve Cussler
Ransoms Incorporated
49
|
Posted - 2013.02.22 23:40:00 -
[6] - Quote
Quote:On a related note, I would love to fight on a planet with very giant plant-like organisms (not necessarily plants by our definition) that look like huge mushrooms, or other cool fungus.
Tres cool. That would be awesome. The Disney movie "Treasure Planet" has some good art of a planet like that.
The thing about making something look and feel "alien" is that it needs to feel familiar. If you make something truly foreign to your experience, you don't get a strong feeling about it. But if you make something that's familiar, and yet at the same time, completely wrong, you get a strong "alien" feeling.
Star wars does this fairly well. Every planet, every monster has a familiarity. Hoth, Dagobah, the Wampah, the creature in the garbage dump, the creatures in the Geonosian Arena all of them are familiar, but just different enough to be alien.
Avatar (the James Cameron one) is another example. All of the flora and fauna are very familiar looking, and yet when you look closely, they're completely different from anything on Earth.
So for vegetation, it make sense to use terrestrial plants as a basis. There's such a huge variety of plants on Earth that we get that alien feeling just going to a different continent. We don't actually need to invent something new when we could have:
Red Brocolli shrubs, growing in the shade of giant yellow mushrooms covered in blue flowers, and tiny green pine trees underfoot.
or
Giant leafy cactus trees as far as the eyes can see over fields of knee-high oakleaf ferns.
The familarity makes the differences more stark, and increase the "alien" feeling |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
|
Posted - 2013.02.23 01:12:00 -
[7] - Quote
Klivve Cussler wrote:Quote:On a related note, I would love to fight on a planet with very giant plant-like organisms (not necessarily plants by our definition) that look like huge mushrooms, or other cool fungus. Tres cool. That would be awesome. The Disney movie "Treasure Planet" has some good art of a planet like that. The thing about making something look and feel "alien" is that it needs to feel familiar. If you make something truly foreign to your experience, you don't get a strong feeling about it. But if you make something that's familiar, and yet at the same time, completely wrong, you get a strong "alien" feeling. Star wars does this fairly well. Every planet, every monster has a familiarity. Hoth, Dagobah, the Wampah, the creature in the garbage dump, the creatures in the Geonosian Arena all of them are familiar, but just different enough to be alien. Avatar (the James Cameron one) is another example. All of the flora and fauna are very familiar looking, and yet when you look closely, they're completely different from anything on Earth. So for vegetation, it make sense to use terrestrial plants as a basis. There's such a huge variety of plants on Earth that we get that alien feeling just going to a different continent. We don't actually need to invent something new when we could have: Red Brocolli shrubs, growing in the shade of giant yellow mushrooms covered in blue flowers, and tiny green pine trees underfoot. or Giant leafy cactus trees as far as the eyes can see over fields of knee-high oakleaf ferns. The familarity makes the differences more stark, and increase the "alien" feeling
Killzone 3 did a really great job with alien vegetation as well. Check these out: http://www.ps3blog.net/wp-content/uploads/KZ3-050.jpg http://www.bymonje.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/killzone3_jungle_10471.jpg http://www.gamesthirst.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/killzone-3-jungle1.jpg http://www.monsterup.com/upload/1296068553499.png |
Klivve Cussler
Ransoms Incorporated
49
|
Posted - 2013.02.23 01:19:00 -
[8] - Quote
These are awesome. Reminds me of some of the underwater life here on the Pacific Coast.
The thing is, there aren't enough artists on the planet to render a unique ecosystem of plants for each Temperate planet in New Eden before the PS5 is released. While I'd love to have the professionally created alien life like this in Dust, we'd still have have only a handful of plants across hundreds of planets.
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3068
|
Posted - 2013.02.27 07:37:00 -
[9] - Quote
Great thread is great |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3100
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 05:15:00 -
[10] - Quote
http://images.wikia.com/masseffect/images/9/9d/Ilos_-_eons_old_elevator.png http://images.wikia.com/masseffect/images/1/1a/Ilos_-_behold.png
Cool plant stuff.
It would also be nice if the plant generator also produces vines. |
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Buster Friently
Rosen Association
56
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Posted - 2013.03.04 06:05:00 -
[11] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:+1 I was going to make a thread on this when vegetation is added. I want the plants to be more than just green generic Earth-like plants. Presence of fruit along with color, shape, size would be nice as well. On a related note, I would love to fight on a planet with very giant plant-like organisms (not necessarily plants by our definition) that look like huge mushrooms, or other cool fungus.
Quoting in the hopes that a Dust dev will see this. I'd like some SciFi in my SciFi game please :)
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3132
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 03:07:00 -
[12] - Quote
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/6544_542931495727197_321235899_n.jpg
I would love if such a system could generate this. |
Val'herik Dorn
CrimeWave Syndicate
320
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 03:58:00 -
[13] - Quote
This might sound odd and a bit far fetched but what if some of the maps WHERE gigantic freaking fungi?
I mean in the whole of the crazy eve universe it could happen planet full of massive skyscraper high fungi connected together by man made structures and such.
where jumping backward could easily mean you falling thousands of feet to your untimely squishy end.
just a thought probably not practical but what the hell? SCI for the SCI god FI for the FI throne! |
RINON114
B.S.A.A.
32
|
Posted - 2013.03.10 17:38:00 -
[14] - Quote
+1 for a great idea. |
Terry Webber
Gothic Wars Consortium
47
|
Posted - 2013.03.16 19:53:00 -
[15] - Quote
Maybe as a gameplay mechanic, the plants can be obstacles that can be dangerous to players. A giant Venus Flytrap is one example. |
Terry Webber
Gothic Wars Consortium
52
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Posted - 2013.03.17 21:23:00 -
[16] - Quote
Hey, I posted a similar thread but with animals. Check it out.
Animal Speciation: Procedural Generation of Alien Wildlife |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3208
|
Posted - 2013.03.21 07:09:00 -
[17] - Quote
These organisms, I desire them. |
Klivve Cussler
Ransoms Incorporated
111
|
Posted - 2013.05.01 21:48:00 -
[18] - Quote
Now that I've seen the initial work of the Flowers and Friends team, I'm giving this a bump. I like what I see so far, but I want massive variation planet to planet. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
4014
|
Posted - 2013.05.27 04:46:00 -
[19] - Quote
Evolve faster flowers and friends! |
Shattered Mirage
D.A.R.K Academy D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
88
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 06:21:00 -
[20] - Quote
I like the idea... |
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic
5912
|
Posted - 2013.09.12 21:36:00 -
[21] - Quote
Moar plants! |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance
3159
|
Posted - 2013.09.12 21:47:00 -
[22] - Quote
I'd love to see this. I have a feeling technical limitations would rear their ugly head, but it's a wonderful idea. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic
5941
|
Posted - 2013.09.16 14:22:00 -
[23] - Quote
Just played Bad Company 2 earlier, and Dust looks so dead compared to it, especially when compared to that jungle map. |
Vell0cet
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
224
|
Posted - 2013.09.16 15:18:00 -
[24] - Quote
If it's possible, I think CCP should consider licensing Bethesda's vegetation engine. The games aren't really direct competitors (Fallout maybe a bit). From what I remember reading about the development of Oblivion, it took a huge effort to build their vegetation engine. If CCP could use existing code and seed the generator with their own art assets, it would probably save them a ton of precious development time/resources. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic
5997
|
Posted - 2013.09.17 16:24:00 -
[25] - Quote
Want still |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
6263
|
Posted - 2013.09.27 23:34:00 -
[26] - Quote
Would be the single greatest thing about Dust maps if implemented. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
6308
|
Posted - 2013.09.30 05:32:00 -
[27] - Quote
Do it |
Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S.
258
|
Posted - 2013.09.30 08:49:00 -
[28] - Quote
The thing is, you would only have to use this system for the truly terrestrial planets(the ones that evolved their own life). Any planet that was terraformed to be terrestrial would have very familiar Earth like plants, because they were handpicked by the Empires to be there. The closer a planet is to a Home world, the more likely it is to be like the Home world is.
For instance, all of the Amarrian Family planets would all be very similar to Amarr Prime itself, due to heavy terraforming combined with 1000s of years of human habitation.
Each race should have their own set of plants that would be extremely Earthlike, if not actually from Earth itself.
The Caldari for instance would probably have simple pine trees, maybe Jackpine, because the original settlers from Earth probably noticed that Caldari Prime was cold, and placed hardy and fast growing cold weather trees from Earth so they would have a source of wood on the planet. They would likely have chose trees that can survive what these trees are going through.
The Amarr would probably have palm trees because Amarr prime was probably settled by one of the 3 large monotheistic religions here on Earth(Christianity/ Islam/ Judaism) and all three of those religions originate from the Middle East, which has palm trees. Christianity even has their Palm Sunday. They would have trees like this perhaps.
There are actually more terraformed planets than natural one as well, I imagine, so the ones that are naturally terrestrial could be very Alien and unfamiliar, because the terraformed ones would likely be very familiar.
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Mobius Wyvern
Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY
3852
|
Posted - 2013.11.24 20:56:00 -
[29] - Quote
Klivve Cussler wrote:Preface: This idea came to me while thinking about how to better give planets a sense of distinctiveness, while at the same time reducing workload.
Basically, the idea would be to procedurally generate up to four distinct plant species per planet by mixing and matching attributes found in plants on Earth. These species could then be saved with a minimum of overhead and rendered on any map taking place on that planet. That would give each planet a unique ecology without the need to tie up an art team for five years thinking up alien grasses.
So, each plant species would have several attributes:
1. Size 1-4 (Ground Cover, Bush, Small Tree, large Tree) 2. Branching model (use existing earth plants as models:Grass, Bamboo, Pine, Oak, Cactus, Rose, etc) this determines the basic structure of the plant 3. Trunk Texture (Barbed-Rose, Bark-tree, Scale-palm tree, Bamboo, etc) 4. Trunk Color 5. Leaf Model (Palm frond, oak leaf, lilly pad, pine needle, fern frond, etc) 6. Leaf Size 7 Leaf Color
Each planet could randomly generate one plant species of each size and store the attributes. So for example, you could have a tree sized cactus-like plant with a palm-tree-like skin in pale yellow covered with tiny purple fern-type leaves.
Then when the planet is rendered for a battle, the unique species of that planet are rendered and slotted into the maps. This could be further modified by biome (desert maps would maybe only render bush sized planets, or grasslands just large trees and ground cover, for example), lattitude, or whatever.
Basically, this system could produce a uniqueness to each planet that would be easily recognizable without a lot of overhead in the art department. Now this I like! Would go a long way toward making our environments feel more immersive.
I really hope "Flowers and Friends" gets put back on the table soon.
Amidst the blue skies
A link from past to future
The sheltering wings of the protector
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
7326
|
Posted - 2013.12.07 21:08:00 -
[30] - Quote
This deserves a "sliced bread" award
Gû¦Gû+Supreme emperor god-kingpÇÉKAGEH¦PSHIpÇæ// Lord of the threads // Forum alt Gû¦Gû+
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deepfried salad gilliam
Sanguine Knights
240
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Posted - 2013.12.07 22:02:00 -
[31] - Quote
Klivve Cussler wrote:These are awesome. Reminds me of some of the underwater life here on the Pacific Coast.
The thing is, there aren't enough artists on the planet to render a unique ecosystem of plants for each Temperate planet in New Eden before the PS5 is released. While I'd love to have the professionally created alien life like this in Dust, we'd still have have only a handful of plants across hundreds of planets.
But they could make up different variables then randomly generate a biome and assigne it to a planet
Christ is lord
Sanguine knights , open recruitment, join now.
Fear is a choice, I choose not to let it control me.
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
8365
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Posted - 2014.01.24 07:21:00 -
[32] - Quote
I want still
Gû¦Gû+Supreme emperor god-kingpÇÉKAGEH¦PSHIpÇæ// Lord of threads // Forum alt Gû¦Gû+
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Arx Ardashir
Imperium Aeternum
460
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 07:39:00 -
[33] - Quote
We all know that any "friends" that generate on the map would not survive the match. Poor critters.
Also, Kagehoshi, had no idea you were such a fan of shrooms. At least that explains your posts.
Here you can type your bio.
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Ulysses Knapse
Knapse and Co. Mercenary Firm
1118
|
Posted - 2014.01.24 07:47:00 -
[34] - Quote
Procedural generation can be horrible if done incorrectly. It's usually better, aesthetically and functionally, to create assets on your own rather than have them be procedurally generated. The only reason you should use procedural generation is when dealing with massive amounts of things that absolutely need to be different from each other. I do not think plants fall under this category; aesthetics don't become as repetitive nearly as quickly as gameplay does, not to mention aesthetics are not the primary focus of Dust 514.
What's the difference between an immobile Minmatar ship and a pile of garbage?
The pile of garbage is more lethal.
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
9976
|
Posted - 2014.03.17 22:19:00 -
[35] - Quote
I still want
Gû¦Gû+Supreme emperor god-kingpÇÉKAGEH¦PSHIpÇæ// Lord of threads // Forum alt Gû¦Gû+
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
10357
|
Posted - 2014.04.09 00:56:00 -
[36] - Quote
Still want
Gû¦Gû+Supreme emperor god-kingpÇÉKAGEH¦PSHIpÇæ// Lord of threads // Forum alt Gû¦Gû+
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Klivve Cussler
S.e.V.e.N. General Tso's Alliance
234
|
Posted - 2014.04.10 17:02:00 -
[37] - Quote
Ulysses Knapse wrote:Procedural generation can be horrible if done incorrectly. It's usually better, aesthetically and functionally, to create assets on your own rather than have them be procedurally generated. The only reason you should use procedural generation is when dealing with massive amounts of things that absolutely need to be different from each other. I do not think plants fall under this category; aesthetics don't become as repetitive nearly as quickly as gameplay does, not to mention aesthetics are not the primary focus of Dust 514.
After a year and its own dedicated team, we have a total of 3 types of plants: Grass, tall grass, and a tumbleweed. While there is certainly a likely case of there being some rather odd looking plants with this approach, isn't that the idea? These are supposed to be alien planets.
The differentiator of this game was supposed to be the unique battlefields on thousands of worlds. Focus on Gameplay, console limitations, and god-knows what else have given us five maps with random buildings, soil and sky. If we can't get a decent repetoire of designed plants, I'll take procedural generation, even if we end up fighting under the shade of giant fuscha broccoli plants. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
10618
|
Posted - 2014.04.24 20:14:00 -
[38] - Quote
/me plants a weird spongy purple plant in this thread
Gû¦Gû+Supreme emperor god-kingpÇÉKAGEH¦PSHIpÇæ// Lord of threads // Forum alt Gû¦Gû+
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I-Shayz-I
I----------I
3868
|
Posted - 2014.07.02 21:49:00 -
[39] - Quote
Marked for Index
7162 wp with a Repair Tool!
List of Legion Feedback Threads!
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