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If Heavies Are Supposed To Be Tanks, Limit the Number of Heavies Allowed in a Game

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Moejoe Omnipotent Imperfects Negative-Feedback 241	Posted - 2013.02.03 22:13:00 - [1] - Quote People love to pull out the "heavies are supposed to be infantry tanks and that's why their ridiculous HMG combined with their insane health is somehow justified" argument. Ok, if heavies are tanks then why can you have as many heavies as you want out on the field yet you can't have out more than a few HAVs? If heavies are tanks, then a strict limit should be placed on the number of heavy dropsuits a team can have out at once or use up in a game. If CCP does this, then the "heavies are suppose to be tanks" argument would actually have some ground to stand on. If they don't, then they will forever just be an overpowered and annoying gimmicky assault class on steroids that doesn't belong in this game until they get a nerf. Edit: Allow me to be more specific. The heavy dropsuit itself, despite currently being an annoying gimmick, is for the most part fine. It's the HMG that makes this class so ridiculous.
Moejoe Omnipotent Imperfects Negative-Feedback 241	Posted - 2013.02.03 22:30:00 - [2] - Quote Scheneighnay McBob wrote: That idea is incredibly stupid. Heavies have limits, just like everything else; the limit with heavies is that they depend on a dedicated logibro, or else they'll run out of ammo and low on their hard-to-repair armor. What does this mean? In order for say, 5 heavies to be effective, there needs to be 5 logis. That's 10 players focusing on supporting the slow moving death machines, and therefore 10 players who can't quickly react to anything, or have much versatility. The vehicle limit is to prevent spam and creation of starter-fit roadblocks. Heavies shouldn't be limited because using too many is already a penalty. Really? 5 heavies on a team would be ineffective unless they each had their own logistic player dedicated to healing them and providing them ammo for their 1000+ round machine guns? Do you really believe that?
Moejoe Omnipotent Imperfects Negative-Feedback 241	Posted - 2013.02.03 22:54:00 - [3] - Quote Saj T wrote: HMG is the most underwhelming weapon system bar the nova knife I've come across so far. Is this supposed to be a troll something? Irish Syn wrote: Problem is people are approaching heavies like they are just another soldier. Fact is if you see a heavy in the area and you don't have a good amount of teammates with you then you need to get out of the area. Even if you're targeting someone else, if there's a heavy just forget him and leave. Have you ever played as a heavy? They are extremely slow and can't track well at all. A few rounds ago I ran into a heavy while my squad was back at a different base, I just toyed with for awhile until my squad arrived to back me up. And by toyed I mean ran circles around him. Aww, poor poor heavies and their slow turning speeds. gbghg wrote: Moejoe Omnipotent wrote: People love to pull out the "heavies are supposed to be infantry tanks and that's why their ridiculous HMG combined with their insane health is somehow justified" argument. Ok, if heavies are tanks then why can you have as many heavies as you want out on the field yet you can't have out more than a few HAVs? If heavies are tanks, then a strict limit should be placed on the number of heavy dropsuits a team can have out at once or use up in a game. If CCP does this, then the "heavies are suppose to be tanks" argument would actually have some ground to stand on. If they don't, then they will forever just be an overpowered and annoying gimmicky assault class on steroids that doesn't belong in this game until they get a nerf. This is one of the worst idea's i've ever heard, why on earth would you limit the number of one type of dropsuit. Heavy's are slow and HMG gunners are most effective at CQC. Contrary to what you say heavies aren't overpowered, people are just using the wrong approach against them. As has been repeatedly stated in every nerf heavy thread, you take a heavy on head on expect to die. why do you want to limit a dropsuit for doing it's job? Should we limit the number of assault suit's in a match because everyone uses them and their users are responsible for the majority of the kills in the game? And the ridiculousness of this idea only proves how ridiculous having a tank class in this game is. Using the wrong approach? There is no right approach. HMG range = AR range. Running away from a heavy as you get sprayed upon = death. Running into a heavy's HMG fire to "run circles around them" = death. If you're playing in pubs (you should always assume gameplay is taking in place in pubs and not in a party of 8 in a corp match when you're talking about balance issues) the only reliable tactic is to catch them by complete surprise unless they are a terrible player, and how does this add depth or fun to the game in any shape or form at all? LIFE RIPPER wrote: Why don't we limit the AR guys to 3 then? Because AR guys aren't tanks?
Moejoe Omnipotent Imperfects Negative-Feedback 241	Posted - 2013.02.04 00:38:00 - [4] - Quote smh at the "I see heavies getting killed all the time so they must not be OP" argument. Have you forgotten about the PS Store newbies? They're all blind and play like they're missing an arm. These guys can be killed with no effort by any of us regardless of what dropsuit they're using. Since they make up the majority of the population right now they make up the majority of the heavies you go up against. These are the heavies that you are dying like that. They're completely irrelevant. When you go up against real players using the heavy on the other hand, it's a completely different story. Also I'll be more specific. Yes I agree the HMG is the main problem here and not so much the suit itself.
Moejoe Omnipotent Imperfects Negative-Feedback 241	Posted - 2013.02.24 04:46:00 - [5] - Quote I have spent a lot more time with the HMG since making this thread and I can confirm without a doubt it's the easiest weapon in the game to use. Zero recoil (just bullet spread), no ADS required, L1 tightens the cone so much that you can outmatch AR users at past medium range, insane clip size and extremely low heat build up time so that you can spray your gun forever while everyone else has to get stuck in the reload animation, highest DPS out of all the weapons. All this on top of the already insane health advantage heavies already have. lolHMGs Keeping the hipfire spread constant (so that it doesn't decrease over time) and removing the L1 button's zoom-in function (or patching it so that all it does is zoom-in and doesn't decrease the hipfire spread) would help a lot with balancing this weapon.
Moejoe Omnipotent Imperfects Negative-Feedback 241	Posted - 2013.02.24 04:55:00 - [6] - Quote Logi Bro wrote: Moejoe Omnipotent wrote: I have spent a lot more time with the HMG since making this thread and I can confirm without a doubt it's the easiest weapon in the game to use. Zero recoil (just bullet spread), no ADS required, L1 tightens the cone so much that you can outmatch AR users at past medium range, insane clip size and extremely low heat build up time so that you can spray your gun forever while everyone else has to get stuck in the reload animation, highest DPS out of all the weapons. All this on top of the already insane health advantage heavies already have. url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pf34ZIRC_Lc]lolHMGs[/url] You say this, and yet I can still eat heavies for breakfast in a logistics suit with my AR. And, oh boy, I can't imagine what you would have thought around the time of replication, back when militia heavies could have 1000 armor and the HMG did more or less the same as it does now, you probably would of had a rage stroke. The hit detection in replication was so bad that if you were moving faster than a heavy you were essentially invincible. 9/10 of the current playerbase (and therefore 9/10 heavies) are currently random newbies who play like they're missing an arm. Killing these guys isn't a problem. They would be getting destroyed regardless of whether they chose the scout or the heavy.
Moejoe Omnipotent Imperfects Negative-Feedback 241	Posted - 2013.02.24 20:09:00 - [7] - Quote Jotun Hiem wrote: Moejoe Omnipotent wrote: I have spent a lot more time with the HMG since making this thread and I can confirm without a doubt it's the easiest weapon in the game to use. Zero recoil (just bullet spread), no ADS required, L1 tightens the cone so much that you can outmatch AR users at past medium range, insane clip size and extremely low heat build up time so that you can spray your gun forever while everyone else has to get stuck in the reload animation, highest DPS out of all the weapons. All this on top of the already insane health advantage heavies already have. lolHMGs Keeping the hipfire spread constant (so that it doesn't decrease over time) and removing the L1 button's zoom-in function (or patching it so that all it does is zoom-in and doesn't decrease the hipfire spread) would help a lot with balancing this weapon. So the fact that no one shot at you while you were in optimal firing conditions makes the weapon OP? It's a close quarters room-clearer, it's good at that. You were in close quarters. Three of the six people you killed weren't even looking at you, one tried to melee you, and the other threw a grenade when he should have been gunning you down. Anyone can get a quick kill streak against incompetent blueberries. No, it's not a CQC only weapon. The L1's zoom-in function and the increased accuracy over time gives it close to AR range. I didn't even have sharpshooter skills when I tried it out. The HMG requires the least amount of effort to use out of all the weapons in this game. It's mindlessly easy to pick up and perform well with. If you want to keep its accuracy, add spin up time and significantly raise heat build up (the heat build up is so slow right now it might as well not even be there) so that it can take at least a little bit of brainpower to use. Nobody ever needs to spray 150+ rounds without ever lifting their finger from the R1 button.
Moejoe Omnipotent Imperfects Negative-Feedback 241	Posted - 2013.02.24 20:15:00 - [8] - Quote Soght Toi wrote: Moejoe Omnipotent wrote: Jotun Hiem wrote: Moejoe Omnipotent wrote: I have spent a lot more time with the HMG since making this thread and I can confirm without a doubt it's the easiest weapon in the game to use. Zero recoil (just bullet spread), no ADS required, L1 tightens the cone so much that you can outmatch AR users at past medium range, insane clip size and extremely low heat build up time so that you can spray your gun forever while everyone else has to get stuck in the reload animation, highest DPS out of all the weapons. All this on top of the already insane health advantage heavies already have. lolHMGs Keeping the hipfire spread constant (so that it doesn't decrease over time) and removing the L1 button's zoom-in function (or patching it so that all it does is zoom-in and doesn't decrease the hipfire spread) would help a lot with balancing this weapon. So the fact that no one shot at you while you were in optimal firing conditions makes the weapon OP? It's a close quarters room-clearer, it's good at that. You were in close quarters. Three of the six people you killed weren't even looking at you, one tried to melee you, and the other threw a grenade when he should have been gunning you down. Anyone can get a quick kill streak against incompetent blueberries. No, it's not a CQC only weapon. The L1's zoom-in function and the increased accuracy over time gives it close to AR range. I didn't even have sharpshooter skills when I tried it out. The HMG requires the least amount of effort to use out of all the weapons in this game. It's mindlessly easy to pick up and perform well with. If you want to keep its accuracy, add spin up time and significantly raise heat build up (the heat build up is so slow right now it might as well not even be there) so that it can take at least a little bit of brainpower to use. Okay clearly someone's just bitter, so I want to be the first to say to you. "Welcome to New Eden, noob." Pretty much every EVE player's go-to line when they want to justify a broken game mechanic without having to go through the effort of coming up with a rational thought.
Moejoe Omnipotent Imperfects Negative-Feedback 241	Posted - 2013.02.24 20:35:00 - [9] - Quote Jotun Hiem wrote: Moejoe Omnipotent wrote: Pretty much every EVE player's go-to line when they want to justify a broken game mechanic without having to go through the effort of coming up with a rational thought. Pretty much everyone's reaction when they're butthurt that people don't agree with them. Am I doing it right? Nope. It's the reaction of every FPS vet when a CCP fanboy says something mind-boggling dumb on these forums. Fanboys always find ways to hide themselves from reality but MMO fanboys take it to a whole new level.

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