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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
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Posted - 2013.01.19 11:49:00 -
[1] - Quote
I think it would make the game more fun and intense if we had an increased in speeds: walking, running, reloading. Something like a 20% boost in all these speeds would be nice. Yes these things can be improved by investing in skill points, but I think they should start out faster to be closer to that of other shooters; Dust feels slows compared to much of what players are use to from other shooters. It would also be very useful on large maps. Ideally I would like Dust to have features like vaulting over certain objects, sliding, etc, as well but I really don't see it happening. Realistically, increasing base speeds for all characters would be the best and fastest way to give the game a mobility boost. The sense of speed and mobility is freeing, and ultimately adds to the fun. I experienced this after playing MAG again and realizing how much faster and more fun just moving around is.
EDIT: This is NOT ABOUT STRAFE SPEED.
EDIT2: A standard assault suit 20% faster is 8.4 m/s A standard scout suit 20% faster is 9.36 m/s
This isn't that much more, and won't make vehicles obsolete. |
tribal wyvern
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
675
|
Posted - 2013.01.19 14:26:00 -
[2] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:I think it would make the game more fun and intense if we had an increased in speeds: walking, running, reloading. Something like a 20% boost in all these speeds would be nice. Yes these things can be improved by investing in skill points, but I think they should start out faster to be closer to that of other shooters; Dust feels slows compared to much of what players are use to from other shooters. It would also be very useful on large maps. Ideally I would like Dust to have features like vaulting over certain objects, sliding, etc, as well but I really don't see it happening. Realistically, increasing base speeds for all characters would be the best and fastest way to give the game a mobility boost. The sense of speed and mobility is freeing, and ultimately adds to the fun. I experienced this after playing MAG again and realizing how much faster and more fun just moving around is.
There are skills and modules for movement speed, reload speed etc etc etc. |
Protocake JR
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
22
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Posted - 2013.01.19 14:46:00 -
[3] - Quote
tribal wyvern wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:I think it would make the game more fun and intense if we had an increased in speeds: walking, running, reloading. Something like a 20% boost in all these speeds would be nice. Yes these things can be improved by investing in skill points, but I think they should start out faster to be closer to that of other shooters; Dust feels slows compared to much of what players are use to from other shooters. It would also be very useful on large maps. Ideally I would like Dust to have features like vaulting over certain objects, sliding, etc, as well but I really don't see it happening. Realistically, increasing base speeds for all characters would be the best and fastest way to give the game a mobility boost. The sense of speed and mobility is freeing, and ultimately adds to the fun. I experienced this after playing MAG again and realizing how much faster and more fun just moving around is. There are skills and modules for movement speed, reload speed etc etc etc.
Yeah, but the game is still overall pretty slow. CCP just needs to increase the speed of everything by a little bit and it would feel less clunky, especially for starter players.
I agree that everything needs a slight increase in speed but they need to increase the frames per second before they do that. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
|
Posted - 2013.01.19 19:35:00 -
[4] - Quote
tribal wyvern wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:I think it would make the game more fun and intense if we had an increased in speeds: walking, running, reloading. Something like a 20% boost in all these speeds would be nice. Yes these things can be improved by investing in skill points, but I think they should start out faster to be closer to that of other shooters; Dust feels slows compared to much of what players are use to from other shooters. It would also be very useful on large maps. Ideally I would like Dust to have features like vaulting over certain objects, sliding, etc, as well but I really don't see it happening. Realistically, increasing base speeds for all characters would be the best and fastest way to give the game a mobility boost. The sense of speed and mobility is freeing, and ultimately adds to the fun. I experienced this after playing MAG again and realizing how much faster and more fun just moving around is. There are skills and modules for movement speed, reload speed etc etc etc.
I mentioned in the OP already that I know that there are skills for it, and I am also aware of the modules. Yes you can customize characters and fittings for more speed, but things shouldn't start out painfully slow by default; that isn't the impression the game needs to send to new players. |
Icy Tiger
Universal Allies Inc.
1026
|
Posted - 2013.01.19 19:42:00 -
[5] - Quote
Yeah, I'm not going to spend a million SP to activate something that needs to be available by default. +1 to increased speed of everything. |
Chosokabe Ite
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
72
|
Posted - 2013.01.19 20:46:00 -
[6] - Quote
Icy Tiger wrote:Yeah, I'm not going to spend a million SP to activate something that needs to be available by default. +1 to increased speed of everything.
Agreed.
Even when I'm sprinting in a scout suit (with speed enhancing moduals), it feels like I'm jogging...
Along with fall damage from short drops, It really drives a knife into the immersion of the game. Because it makes these powerful, super suits look more akin to advanced cardboard technology. |
Tidaen
Nova Corps Marines
21
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Posted - 2013.01.19 21:14:00 -
[7] - Quote
Agreed that faster pace gameplay would feel more fun. Speaking as a shotgun scout, speed would certainly help my ability to escape situations but would make hitting people with the shotgun that much more difficult. I think a general boost to sprint speed would be a good start, perhaps less of a boost for walking/strafing. |
James Thraxton
The Exemplars
75
|
Posted - 2013.01.19 22:50:00 -
[8] - Quote
+1 all around for speeding up that stuff, i've always thought with fps games 'nobody can run that fast' with this one i think, 'my -insert crippled relative here- could run faster than these guys' . . . even the slow ass tanks outpace a sprinting recon, arent our characters supposed to be seven foot supersoldiers? |
Ranger SnakeBlood
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
126
|
Posted - 2013.01.20 00:13:00 -
[9] - Quote
Well if speed goes up then i hope acceleration is put in place to avoid a halo type of gameplay, as it stands now if you set of in one direction you are going full speed if you switch direction you are going full speed in other direction speed was slowed down to minamise the dancing or i mean CQC combat if it goes back up then were back to that again and possible back to hit detection issues granted acceleration would fix the dancing potential but i dont know if it would be better for hit detection.
I wouldnt call MAGs movment good to be honest it was to flighty no feel of weight just felt like a hovering camera with a gun, Battlefield is probably one of the only games that made movement feel anyway right (bad company) made you feel human not like a camera. i would prefer dust to go down that route of feeling human, i find this sort of thing can add to the imersivness of the game, but then again some day id like to see a game adding fear to the game as it appears to be something they cant count for yet. |
Hop3LesS
Namtar Elite Gallente Federation
5
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Posted - 2013.01.20 00:32:00 -
[10] - Quote
Protocake JR wrote:tribal wyvern wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:I think it would make the game more fun and intense if we had an increased in speeds: walking, running, reloading. Something like a 20% boost in all these speeds would be nice. Yes these things can be improved by investing in skill points, but I think they should start out faster to be closer to that of other shooters; Dust feels slows compared to much of what players are use to from other shooters. It would also be very useful on large maps. Ideally I would like Dust to have features like vaulting over certain objects, sliding, etc, as well but I really don't see it happening. Realistically, increasing base speeds for all characters would be the best and fastest way to give the game a mobility boost. The sense of speed and mobility is freeing, and ultimately adds to the fun. I experienced this after playing MAG again and realizing how much faster and more fun just moving around is. There are skills and modules for movement speed, reload speed etc etc etc. Yeah, but the game is still overall pretty slow. CCP just needs to increase the speed of everything by a little bit and it would feel less clunky, especially for starter players. I agree that everything needs a slight increase in speed but they need to increase the frames per second before they do that.
Agree, starting out the speed of characters could use a slight tweak.
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Zat Earthshatter
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
304
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Posted - 2013.01.20 00:34:00 -
[11] - Quote
The problem with increasing player speed right now, is that "accelerating" into full speed hasn't been properly implemented yet.
We had these faster speeds in the early builds, and there was good reason for removing it. With no acceleration, even worse hit detection, and assault rifles deadlier than a Precision Strike, the "fights" in those builds were nothing but shuffling dances - the worst I'd ever seen in a game, period. Players would constantly move back and forth while blindly spraying with their AR hipfire, which meant the kills were completely luck-based. It was terrible. And I do not want to go back.
The thing is, other than AR nerfs and slightly-better hit detection, nothing else got fixed. If speeds went back up, we'd eventually see a return to strafe-dancing. Very few weapons aside from the SMG and AR could hit their targets in such a situation. Which means that the situation would return to almost exactly the same gameplay from a far-inferior build. And if that happened during Open Beta... It wouldn't be pretty. |
137H4RGIC
WarRavens
26
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Posted - 2013.01.20 08:28:00 -
[12] - Quote
Zat Earthshatter wrote:The problem with increasing player speed right now, is that "accelerating" into full speed hasn't been properly implemented yet.
We had these faster speeds in the early builds, and there was good reason for removing it. With no acceleration, even worse hit detection, and assault rifles deadlier than a Precision Strike, the "fights" in those builds were nothing but shuffling dances - the worst I'd ever seen in a game, period. Players would constantly move back and forth while blindly spraying with their AR hipfire, which meant the kills were completely luck-based. It was terrible. And I do not want to go back.
The thing is, other than AR nerfs and slightly-better hit detection, nothing else got fixed. If speeds went back up, we'd eventually see a return to strafe-dancing. Very few weapons aside from the SMG and AR could hit their targets in such a situation. Which means that the situation would return to almost exactly the same gameplay from a far-inferior build. And if that happened during Open Beta... It wouldn't be pretty. ^ THat happens a lot. All Halo 4 is, is Battle Rifle, DMR, Carbine fights where you strafe back and fourth. And I hated it, which is why it was so easy for me to leave Halo 4 for DUST
...
...
... Unless there's a rocket launcher involved. |
Thranx1231
CowTek
90
|
Posted - 2013.01.20 09:04:00 -
[13] - Quote
Slow? Assault Suits sprint 7 meters/second.
Have you lost your calculator? ~15mpg, ~22kph.
Heavies are slowest, Logistics are next and Scouts are faster. Faster than 15 mph in a ton of metal with a fusion power pack.
BTW, since you will no doubt want everything else to be faster as well consider this:
LAVs top speed is ~80mpg
HAVs is ~50mph.
You want real speed, fly a Drop Ship or get into EVE and play in space. Now, that is fast.
On sort of the same note KHW: do you realize that a significant number of things you propose are already in Halo variants? Play that. |
KEROSIINI-TERO
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
248
|
Posted - 2013.01.20 09:24:00 -
[14] - Quote
Of course this is slower than Quake, Timesplitters and Serious Sam.
For a reason. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
|
Posted - 2013.01.20 10:04:00 -
[15] - Quote
Zat Earthshatter wrote:The problem with increasing player speed right now, is that "accelerating" into full speed hasn't been properly implemented yet.
We had these faster speeds in the early builds, and there was good reason for removing it. With no acceleration, even worse hit detection, and assault rifles deadlier than a Precision Strike, the "fights" in those builds were nothing but shuffling dances - the worst I'd ever seen in a game, period. Players would constantly move back and forth while blindly spraying with their AR hipfire, which meant the kills were completely luck-based. It was terrible. And I do not want to go back.
The thing is, other than AR nerfs and slightly-better hit detection, nothing else got fixed. If speeds went back up, we'd eventually see a return to strafe-dancing. Very few weapons aside from the SMG and AR could hit their targets in such a situation. Which means that the situation would return to almost exactly the same gameplay from a far-inferior build. And if that happened during Open Beta... It wouldn't be pretty.
That was strafe speed, this is not about strafe speed. I don't need strafe speed to increase. |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
|
Posted - 2013.01.20 10:18:00 -
[16] - Quote
Thranx1231 wrote:Slow? Assault Suits sprint 7 meters/second.
Have you lost your calculator? ~15mpg, ~22kph.
Heavies are slowest, Logistics are next and Scouts are faster. Faster than 15 mph in a ton of metal with a fusion power pack.
BTW, since you will no doubt want everything else to be faster as well consider this:
LAVs top speed is ~80mpg
HAVs is ~50mph.
You want real speed, fly a Drop Ship or get into EVE and play in space. Now, that is fast.
On sort of the same note KHW: do you realize that a significant number of things you propose are already in Halo variants? Play that.
What is it with you? Why is it any time you comment on one of my threads you're always so rude? I never did anything to you. I don't need you to agree with me, that is fine, but your attitude is totally unnecessary. Furthermore, its a bit ridiculous to suggest that I switch my entire playstyle and specialize as a vehicle pilot, or 15 dollars per month for a game whose gameplay doesn't interest me just because I want 20% more speed. I don't play Halo, or even own an Xbox, and that isn't even the point. The point is that regardless of the current speed stats, the game feels slow when you're use to other games; even other large scale tactical shooters. Some lore involving the dropsuits or the clones being enhanced through genetics or special implants could easily explain it if that is a problem. |
Jason Pearson
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
742
|
Posted - 2013.01.20 13:20:00 -
[17] - Quote
I disagree with a speed increase. We already move quite fast (Despite people thinking about the speed being slow, we can traverse the map ina short amount of time and it's not that small) and I think it would hit the strategical aspect of the game slightly. See right now we're slow enough that if we make a mistake and end up surround, 8/10 times we're going to die and it feels like a rush if you manage to escape. Upping the speed so we could constantly run away when we make an error would be boring. |
Protocake JR
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
22
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Posted - 2013.01.20 13:46:00 -
[18] - Quote
Oh wow, forum ate my post. Disregard. |
Firestorm Zulu
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
158
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Posted - 2013.01.20 14:06:00 -
[19] - Quote
My problem is they don't have boosters or skills for walking speeds. Only sprinting and sprinting recharge based things. |
KalOfTheRathi
CowTek
168
|
Posted - 2013.01.21 05:11:00 -
[20] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:What is it with you? Why is it any time you comment on one of my threads you're always so rude? Fine.
My tone is normally exasperated with you because you ask for a great number of things that obviously aren't going to work given the ancient console we are running on and the Game Engine. The game cannot run as fast as it is supposed to now. When Frames Per Second comments are still in the bugs forum increasing speed is not an option. Collision detection will become more of an issue as clients and server are processing 20% faster movement, which will require ~40% more calculations, more network communication, more syncing between server and 32 clients (God forbid 512). You want all these items added to game that is not doing what is must do first.
You compare a lot of items to MAG. It would better if this game succeeded. Zipper Interactive and their ideas, if you will pardon the phrase, are dust. Sony axed that entire game studio. Their superior server architecture died with them. CCP has a server architecture that they are committed to because of EVE. If DUST is too boring then don't play it. Stick with MAG. Why constantly lament MAG on DUST forums? That is the source of my exasperation and rudeness.
I think you have some really good ideas and I was serious when I suggested you get a free copy of Unity and write a game. Or use Steam Source. Some of the limitations of playing on a console can be ignored because a PC is a better development engine. And the PS4, which should be a significantly better gaming console, is due to be announced this year. As the processor is supposed to normal once again the development cycle will not be stalled three years while Sony waits for third party developers to provide the library support they did not deliver.
So log the ideas, post them, just don't think they are all new if you haven't played the other games in which they already exist.
Super Hero powers? Halo, Vanquish and many others. Cloaking, Stealth? Halo, Crysis 1 & 2. Higher speed? Halo. Better graphics? Crysis 1 & 2 Smoother game play? Crysis 1 & 2 More rewards? Borderlands 1 & 2, Dark Souls Better vehicle dynamics? Rage and Borderlands to a lesser degree. Boring, stupid vehicle dynamics with horrible controls? Halo, for the win!
For the record, I don't particularly like Halo. I only have two of them. Even with my complaints regarding DUST I prefer it to Halo.
Read reviews about games you will never play. Read articles/postmortems by the developers of those games as well as the ones you actually prefer. Read and watch every single interview ever with John Carmack. Expand your world view. I don't mean becoming an American Gamer but be aware of what else is already out there. Before posting about a new idea that is from a game several years old.
I will share one final thing with you. An anecdote from the racing world:
I was at a race track about 20 years ago when some young racer was going on about his idea to have the cam not only lift but close the valve, eliminating valve springs. He asked for my reaction and I said the idea was great. Mercedes Benz used it on their Grand Prix racers in 1936. Decades before he was born. Most ideas are not new.
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Bojo The Mighty
Bojo's School of the Trades
435
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Posted - 2013.01.21 05:49:00 -
[21] - Quote
The game feels slow because the maps are so large. In CoD, you could cover distance in no time because those maps were puny. My scout moves at a speed of 7+m/s which would mean that they cover 100 meters in just over 14 seconds which is a kilometer in just over 2 minutes considering that you can pretty much constantly sprint because stamina regens so fast that you're only walking for a fraction of what you're sprinting.
We're moving too fast! Great Scott! |
KalOfTheRathi
CowTek
168
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Posted - 2013.01.21 11:32:00 -
[22] - Quote
Bojo The Mighty wrote:The game feels slow because the maps are so large. In CoD, you could cover distance in no time because those maps were puny. My scout moves at a speed of 7+m/s which would mean that they cover 100 meters in just over 14 seconds which is a kilometer in just over 2 minutes considering that you can pretty much constantly sprint because stamina regens so fast that you're only walking for a fraction of what you're sprinting.
We're moving too fast! Great Scott! You are total Kitten Excrement. Just so you know. |
Ranger SnakeBlood
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
126
|
Posted - 2013.01.21 18:55:00 -
[23] - Quote
I wonder if the feeling of being slow is due to the view point i suspect that faster games may have lower view points perhaps chest height this would add the illusion of going faster as in fairness DUST mercs are far from slow, another thing that may cause this is that DUST mercs are rumored to be around 7 foot tall if you combine this with a helmet view point your view is significantly higher there fore you feel slow but are not actually, on the other hand this could be a turn it into halo speed tread in which case i disagree. |
Bojo The Mighty
Bojo's School of the Trades
435
|
Posted - 2013.01.22 03:16:00 -
[24] - Quote
KalOfTheRathi wrote:Bojo The Mighty wrote:The game feels slow because the maps are so large. In CoD, you could cover distance in no time because those maps were puny. My scout moves at a speed of 7+m/s which would mean that they cover 100 meters in just over 14 seconds which is a kilometer in just over 2 minutes considering that you can pretty much constantly sprint because stamina regens so fast that you're only walking for a fraction of what you're sprinting.
We're moving too fast! Great Scott! You are total Kitten Excrement. Just so you know. Math doesn't lie |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
|
Posted - 2013.01.22 03:28:00 -
[25] - Quote
With enhanced clones, implants, dropsuits, and technology thousands of years ahead of us, we could be faster than Usain Bolt ridiculous top speed (though I'm not asking for nearly as much, only a 20% buff). Sure we're fast, but like Bojo pointed out, its the large maps that contribute to the feeling of slowness, but I think all shooters should scale player speed to the average map size to make players feel fast. |
Bojo The Mighty
Bojo's School of the Trades
435
|
Posted - 2013.01.22 03:30:00 -
[26] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:With enhanced clones, implants, dropsuits, and technology thousands of years ahead of us, we could be faster than Usain Bolt ridiculous top speed (though I'm not asking for nearly as much, only a 20% buff). Sure we're fast, but like Bojo pointed out, its the large maps that contribute to the feeling of slowness, but I think all shooters should scale player speed to the average map size to make players feel fast. alas the maps are only going to get bigger and badder, and honestly there has to be a reason for LAVs and Dropships to exist; to ferry troops across the map with much greater speed |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
|
Posted - 2013.01.22 03:41:00 -
[27] - Quote
Bojo The Mighty wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:With enhanced clones, implants, dropsuits, and technology thousands of years ahead of us, we could be faster than Usain Bolt ridiculous top speed (though I'm not asking for nearly as much, only a 20% buff). Sure we're fast, but like Bojo pointed out, its the large maps that contribute to the feeling of slowness, but I think all shooters should scale player speed to the average map size to make players feel fast. alas the maps are only going to get bigger and badder, and honestly there has to be a reason for LAVs and Dropships to exist; to ferry troops across the map with much greater speed
A 20% speed boost to make things feel faster, but it wouldn't put a dent in LAVs' and dropships' business. |
Breakin Stuff
Immobile Infantry
680
|
Posted - 2013.01.22 03:53:00 -
[28] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Bojo The Mighty wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:With enhanced clones, implants, dropsuits, and technology thousands of years ahead of us, we could be faster than Usain Bolt ridiculous top speed (though I'm not asking for nearly as much, only a 20% buff). Sure we're fast, but like Bojo pointed out, its the large maps that contribute to the feeling of slowness, but I think all shooters should scale player speed to the average map size to make players feel fast. alas the maps are only going to get bigger and badder, and honestly there has to be a reason for LAVs and Dropships to exist; to ferry troops across the map with much greater speed A 20% speed boost to make things feel faster, but it wouldn't put a dent in LAVs' and dropships' business.
yes it will. when CCP introduces an armored APC it doesn't need to be redundant by virtue that the troops can cover the map both easily and swiftly
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
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Posted - 2013.01.22 04:36:00 -
[29] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Bojo The Mighty wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:With enhanced clones, implants, dropsuits, and technology thousands of years ahead of us, we could be faster than Usain Bolt ridiculous top speed (though I'm not asking for nearly as much, only a 20% buff). Sure we're fast, but like Bojo pointed out, its the large maps that contribute to the feeling of slowness, but I think all shooters should scale player speed to the average map size to make players feel fast. alas the maps are only going to get bigger and badder, and honestly there has to be a reason for LAVs and Dropships to exist; to ferry troops across the map with much greater speed A 20% speed boost to make things feel faster, but it wouldn't put a dent in LAVs' and dropships' business. yes it will. when CCP introduces an armored APC it doesn't need to be redundant by virtue that the troops can cover the map both easily and swiftly
Speculation, and an easily fixed scenario.
There has not been any trailer footage, concept art, or announcement of such a vehicle (and it would basically be a more boring slower ground dropship). If it does come, then they could just make it 20% faster than they planned, but actually that wouldn't even be needed:
A standard assault suit 20% faster is 8.4 m/s A standard scout suit 20% faster is 9.36 m/s If an APC comes, then it would probably be around the speed of the HAVs (if not faster), and a Sica HAV is still 24m/s. If a APC has speed similar to an HAV or faster, then it wouldn't even need a speed buff, it would still be significantly faster than infantry.
A 20% speed boost won't turn us into the flash.
Behold the dark power of math. |
Breakin Stuff
Immobile Infantry
680
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Posted - 2013.01.22 04:45:00 -
[30] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Speculation, and an easily fixed scenario.
trimmed to get to the point.
A 20% speed boost won't turn us into the flash.
Behold the dark power of math.
the dark power of math quails in the face of the fact that the grenade timers would need to be shortened again, recoil across the board would have to be reduced and rate of fire upped on a lot of slow weapons to compensate for this magical idea of a 20% speed boost in order to keep the additional rapidity of movement from making it impossible to strike a scout with an assault rifle when they run the kinetic catalyzer fits.
And you would need to double the armor of heavies because they would be flat-out hosed because they cannot turn fast enough otherwise. Also heavy damage would need to be much higher in order to give them a chance to take out fast-movers before being overrun and overwhelmed with little to no recourse.
As it stands it's very easy to overrun an enemy position by focusing fire and using tactics. Allowing people to do the same by virtue of being unable to effectively keep them from reaching engagement range will negate any advantage to using any equipment other than an assault rifle or sniper rifle. You'd be inside a laser's badranges before they had time to even try to heat the gun.
20% speed increase is far more significant an increase than you seem to think, when you turn it into a tactical consideration, because not all of the suits will benefit from this equally. |
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