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Needless Sacermendor
Red Fox Brigade
208
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Posted - 2013.01.07 14:47:00 -
[1] - Quote
No ... simples !
Nothing wrong with the weapon being light ... nothing wrong with using cover ... nothing wrong with the missiles tracking from the user end now.
If there's something wrong with the way they track at the recieving end (ie the fly to the point of target at launch, then turn to follow it) I haven't witnessed this myself ... if I launch at an exposed vehicle and it ducks behind cover mid flight, then at least most of the swarm hits that cover and not the target.
If you want all AV to be standing still directly in front of you without cover before it can do any damage to you ... then I suggest you're not going to enjoy this game.
As a final thought ... Your solution doesnt even address your problem.
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Needless Sacermendor
Red Fox Brigade
208
|
Posted - 2013.01.07 20:11:00 -
[2] - Quote
Mavado V Noriega wrote:steadyhand amarr wrote:Am I the only person who thinks it fine now. Badly built tanks get spanked and will built ones dominated and need teamwork to take down which is how it should be meh lock on weapons are easy mode especially when u can acquire locks behind cover and poke out and fire and get back in Noc made a nice post in the feedback section on how swarms should be re-designed to take some skill cuz right now its ez it does most of the work for u
Can someone tell me where this myth started ... Swarm Launchers CANNOT aquire locks without line of sight.
From the vehicles perspective it might seem like it does ... but the SL is a shoulder mounted weapon so you might only see the head of the user over a wall or hill, but he has line of sight from cover ... in my experience you are much more exposed than that before you can see over the hill and start aquiring a lock.
If you think lock on weapons are easy mode ... then give me the same weapon direct fire but you'd have to double or quadruple the velocity of the missiles or it would never hit anything ... you'd see them coming and have time to make a brew before deciding which direction to go to avoid them.
Have you even tried using them against anything other than a militia LAV ? Next time there's a HAV on the field ... YOU get a swarm out and hunt it till it's dead ... see how "easy mode" you think it is then. |
Needless Sacermendor
Red Fox Brigade
208
|
Posted - 2013.01.08 18:00:00 -
[3] - Quote
I'll try this too ... if it does lock without needing to see a part of the vehicle inside the reticule then it's not working as intended.
I'd have to ask why is this the first time it's been brought up ? Since I've read so many complaints of SL locking from cover, but never seen any explaination of how they're not working. How can the devs fix something if they don't know how to replicate the problem.
To answer whoever asked if I've used swarms ... I've specialised since I got bored of the I win button my maxed Surya was half way through E3 build.
And whoever said how many sp does it take ... 8 mil so far and I've only got proficiency 3 with advanced SMG, lvl 3 dropsuit and an assaupt rifle at proficiency 3 since the SMGs are ineffective these days and you cant perma run swarm/SMG like I did for the past builds since E3 ... ohh and I've got a adv laser to test ... no corp skills, no grenade or demolitions, little Electronics or engineering other than the cpu/pg skill to 5, zero vehicle or turret skills, ohh and I got lvl 1 logistics for the MAG suit.
There's maybe a million that's not invested into the Swarm fitting and most of that is the AR I've had to try to use since SMG couldn't compete, even up close where it should ... I don't know maybe it can since the iron sights change, I'll have to try again. |
Needless Sacermendor
Red Fox Brigade
208
|
Posted - 2013.01.08 19:56:00 -
[4] - Quote
To be honest I'm not in favor of the militia swarm launcher either ... I rarely get the kill shot on HAVs I've invested all my sp in being a problem for ... some scrub with a militia swarm probably gets it, don't mind if it's a fg or invested swarm.
As I said it's the first explaination of how it's broken I've seen ... I read the HAV / dropship / AV threads as it's what I specialise andive seen plenty of whining that swarms can lock through cover ... but Ive never locked a vehicle that was behind a hill or from myself being behind a hill, I break cover and dance for the time it takes to lock and launch as I'm retreating back into cover. Had this idea of being able to lock without line of sight by putting the edge of the reticule round a wall been brought up earlier I could have tested it ... by the way I'd be interested in a link to the thread, as I've said I tend to read the relevant ones.
How much damage things do is irrelevant ... that's a balance issue not a broken mechanics issue.
As I said I'll test this tonight.
Edited : ok the thread is titled balancing, but my discussion has moved on to the locking issue. |
Needless Sacermendor
Red Fox Brigade
208
|
Posted - 2013.01.09 00:31:00 -
[5] - Quote
Ok so I've tested this idea for locking targets without line of sight using a cheap suit and dying a lot, but standing ground to figure this out.
There was only one occasion where it seemed like it happened ... I was looking round a corner and the HAVs icon was there but well below a dip in terrain but I was getting a lock. It wasnt till I scoped in that I could see the main turret was visable over the horizon and what appeared to be locking a covered target in actual fact had a direct line of sight on the HAVs main turret.
I'll keep testing this, but I suspect it's just a lot of crying by HAV drivers who have tried the free swarm a couple of times and are probably still a bit sore that their 'I win' deployable asset is no longer available. |
Needless Sacermendor
Red Fox Brigade
208
|
Posted - 2013.01.09 13:23:00 -
[6] - Quote
Here's a couple of ideas to balance the Swarm Launcher for you to debate ...
1. Buff your HAVs hit points but give the AV weapons a personal shield booster ... increasing your dropsuit shields when that weapon is equipped ... this would need balancing between the forge and swarm for the heavy and assault classes, very carefully because the heavy can use the swarm if you give the swarm a larger shield bonus ... maybe the forge doesn't need it ... I don't know, I don't use it.
Or ...
2. Allow the Swarms to be blind fired again like they used to, but give the missiles an activation range of 5m+ so we don't go back to the SUPER shotgun days of old ... giving it an anti infantry use like the forge has.
Thoughts ... opinions ... other ideas ... |
Needless Sacermendor
Red Fox Brigade
208
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 00:34:00 -
[7] - Quote
1. We have the same problem running swarms ... armor plates slow us down too which means we're easy pickings for other infantry. I certainly have noticed the difference in speed ... it's one of the reasons I switched from my maxed Surya to Swarms half way through E3, Surya was too slow against Sagaris and too weak when there was only 1 viable fitting, top rep, top plate and enough pg mods to fit them, I did have some success stacking the resistance mods but not much use at the time. I'd have gone to Forge but heavy suit isn't for me.
2. Yeah but there's the balance against infantry to be considered aswell ... Forge may have to expose himself to the vehicle but can stand a pounding from it or infantry and deal serious damage to infantry aswell ... Swarm cannot, he has to run and hide and use cover ... he is near useless against infantry but his use of cover works against vehicles and infantry.
You know what I think could be a major factor in this debate ... the fact that dropships aren't much use these days ... they used to be a nuisance to a swarm user cos they could survive a few hits, easily spot the launcher, get to him and take him out with missiles ... maybe there's the solution to all this ... make dropships effective again ! |
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