DUST Search - Balancing Swarm launchers

Mavado V Noriega wrote:

RECON BY FIRE wrote:

Needless Sacermendor wrote:

Mavado V Noriega wrote:

steadyhand amarr wrote:

Am I the only person who thinks it fine now. Badly built tanks get spanked and will built ones dominated and need teamwork to take down which is how it should be

meh lock on weapons are easy mode
especially when u can acquire locks behind cover and poke out and fire and get back in

Noc made a nice post in the feedback section on how swarms should be re-designed to take some skill cuz right now its ez it does most of the work for u

Can someone tell me where this myth started ... Swarm Launchers CANNOT aquire locks without line of sight.

From the vehicles perspective it might seem like it does ... but the SL is a shoulder mounted weapon so you might only see the head of the user over a wall or hill, but he has line of sight from cover ... in my experience you are much more exposed than that before you can see over the hill and start aquiring a lock.

If you think lock on weapons are easy mode ... then give me the same weapon direct fire but you'd have to double or quadruple the velocity of the missiles or it would never hit anything ... you'd see them coming and have time to make a brew before deciding which direction to go to avoid them.

Have you even tried using them against anything other than a militia LAV ? Next time there's a HAV on the field ... YOU get a swarm out and hunt it till it's dead ... see how "easy mode" you think it is then.

This.

You tankers need to stop whining.

lolwhining

i will give FGers props because they actually need to aim and get in position to get a shot off
Swarms take 0 skill just fire and forget
and it def can lock onto u through cover because i do it as well


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NAV HIV The Generals 151	Posted - 2013.01.08 13:34:00 - [1] - Quote Mavado V Noriega wrote: RECON BY FIRE wrote: Needless Sacermendor wrote: Mavado V Noriega wrote: steadyhand amarr wrote: Am I the only person who thinks it fine now. Badly built tanks get spanked and will built ones dominated and need teamwork to take down which is how it should be meh lock on weapons are easy mode especially when u can acquire locks behind cover and poke out and fire and get back in Noc made a nice post in the feedback section on how swarms should be re-designed to take some skill cuz right now its ez it does most of the work for u Can someone tell me where this myth started ... Swarm Launchers CANNOT aquire locks without line of sight. From the vehicles perspective it might seem like it does ... but the SL is a shoulder mounted weapon so you might only see the head of the user over a wall or hill, but he has line of sight from cover ... in my experience you are much more exposed than that before you can see over the hill and start aquiring a lock. If you think lock on weapons are easy mode ... then give me the same weapon direct fire but you'd have to double or quadruple the velocity of the missiles or it would never hit anything ... you'd see them coming and have time to make a brew before deciding which direction to go to avoid them. Have you even tried using them against anything other than a militia LAV ? Next time there's a HAV on the field ... YOU get a swarm out and hunt it till it's dead ... see how "easy mode" you think it is then. This. You tankers need to stop whining. lolwhining i will give FGers props because they actually need to aim and get in position to get a shot off Swarms take 0 skill just fire and forget and it def can lock onto u through cover because i do it as well I think they should allow swarms to be used from the MCC or the spawn. If you dont feel like aiming, they should allow you to aim and lock through the map. Similar to the way you call in a Precision strike. They should also double the damage for it and give you 500 WP for taking out a tank and 250 WP for taking out a LAV. They should also allow you to use it as a MD with 200 Splash damage over 6 meters. Even if thats not good enough, they should make a heavy version of it which should work as a HMG shooting rockets at highspeed. That would make it balanced against Armor tanks :)
NAV HIV The Generals 151	Posted - 2013.01.08 14:48:00 - [2] - Quote SCAT mania wrote: swarms are perfect! DONT MESS WITH THEM!! if there was a somethin like a smoke screen or flare that tanks could use to FLEE from me that would be acceptable... i suppose... How much SP does it require again to do 1200+ damage ?
NAV HIV The Generals 151	Posted - 2013.01.08 16:15:00 - [3] - Quote SCAT mania wrote: Iv advanced swarms with 3 complex damage mods on an assault type B suit.. That's enough sp to do whatever i want. But you didnt answer my question. How much SP & ISK would it cost to do random 1200 + Damage with MT swarms hiding behind covers?
NAV HIV The Generals 151	Posted - 2013.01.08 16:22:00 - [4] - Quote OK great. Let us know about it. I can sure lock from behind covers, all you have to do is find and edge of the cover and keep any corner of the locking screen slightly outside the cover, press and hold R1 and then play peek a boo
NAV HIV The Generals 151	Posted - 2013.01.08 18:12:00 - [5] - Quote This isnt the first time we brought it up. We have been saying this for a while. Just grab a starter suit, MT suit, get a SL and shoot at an expensive tank doing close to 1200 Damage (Extra for armor) with almost no skill. You can do it from hilltops and every other locations. A little box is good enough to cover you from tanks. LAV's are usually a one shot kill. on top of everything else, they take a 90 degree turn, sometimes a S curve to hit a target which hardly made the cover in the first place. FG even though they are more powerful than Rail guns, the player has to do some aiming and has to come out in the open. i dont mind the dancing rockets as long as they have to come out to get a legitimate lock on target.
NAV HIV The Generals 151	Posted - 2013.01.08 20:20:00 - [6] - Quote I have tested it over and over again. I kinda feel bad taking out vehicles from far away. Took a few HAV's by using the Scattermind SL. i got the lucky shot. The HAV didnt even have any defense for it. On the 3 letter Map i was by the Building on top of the hill behind objective C and the Vehicle was all the way near objective A. Its just a little too unfair for the drivers. there should be some sort of middle ground.
NAV HIV The Generals 151	Posted - 2013.01.09 13:55:00 - [7] - Quote RECON BY FIRE wrote: NAV HIV wrote: OK great. Let us know about it. I can sure lock from behind covers, all you have to do is find and edge of the cover and keep any corner of the locking screen slightly outside the cover, press and hold R1 and then play peek a boo So you are admitting, right here, that you cannot lock a target while completely behind cover? You are admitting that some part of the targeting box has to be on the target, correct? That is the way its supposed to be. Get over it already. If you dont know what i'm talking about then dont comment, atleast read what i said and all the other players have said before acting all smart. If you want to be ignorant and in denial then thats your choice. We have been testing the swarm for quite sometime now, and trust me its very easy to lock on from behind the covers without the tanker getting any chance to defend. All the tanker can do is shoot at the damn 2 feet rock that can easily protect the SL user. I run a Type I AR suit + Scattermind swarm + AV gerandes and i can easily make a Surya run. SO you wanna tell me thats balanced? If thats the way its supposed to be, then so be it. Some people need the handicap. No matter how much i hate it, i will still keep trying to balance this unbalanced weapon in my own way. Not butthurt or anything. If they dont fix it or tweak it, i dont care. Not scared to loose tanks to cheap shots. I can afford it.
NAV HIV The Generals 151	Posted - 2013.01.09 14:01:00 - [8] - Quote Needless Sacermendor wrote: Here's a couple of ideas to balance the Swarm Launcher for you to debate ... 1. Buff your HAVs hit points but give the AV weapons a personal shield booster ... increasing your dropsuit shields when that weapon is equipped ... this would need balancing between the forge and swarm for the heavy and assault classes, very carefully because the heavy can use the swarm if you give the swarm a larger shield bonus ... maybe the forge doesn't need it ... I don't know, I don't use it. Or ... 2. Allow the Swarms to be blind fired again like they used to, but give the missiles an activation range of 5m+ so we don't go back to the SUPER shotgun days of old ... giving it an anti infantry use like the forge has. Thoughts ... opinions ... other ideas ... 1. Some base HP boost would be nice. There's penalty for adding armor plates, but no penalties for shield extenders. Armor takes bonus damage from Swarms and are slow as hell. May be they could do something about that. I am sure you have noticed the speed difference between Gunlogi/Sagaris and Madrugar/Surya. 2. They could and should give them more health if they are running AV. Yes Forge does more damage than Railgun but they would still have to come close or come out in the open to fight. Swarms on the other hand doesnt have to. All i'm saying is that, they could make it fair and balanced.