DUST Search - Counter to HMG Shottys, and SMG

Vickers S Grunt wrote:

Vexen Krios wrote:

Vickers S Grunt wrote:

Use range.

Spec in to laser rifle .

Train good grenades .

Heavy with HMG should always face stomp at close range .

exactly, i agree except with the laser rifles. laser rifles should have decent range...not the range they have not. that is totally ridiculous. bullets from assault rifles smg and hmgs and even sniper rifles should fall at a certain distance. The laser rifles should act more like a beam of a head light or flashlight it becomes less effective at longer ranges due to dissipation. A laser is nothing more than a damaging ray of light so why should it have nearly unlimited range? I've been hit by them from across maps.

Also the HMG has exceptional range. I've been shooting at heavies and been just barely out of range with my AR and they still rip me apart. Course my AR sharpshooter is only lvl2.

Sorry but u are wrong here laser rifle has virtually same range as AR some AR even have much grater range take a look at this post for the info which i can verify from first hand experience.

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=40886&find=unread

The laser rife has best damage at range because that is where CCP have decided for balance reasons it should do best damage and i agree with them .

If u need a fluff reason for this maby the beam is not calibrated to achieve full focus untill a certain range .

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Ops Fox ZionTCD Legacy Rising 197	Posted - 2012.10.28 02:20:00 - [1] - Quote well ive tried everything within my means to deal with HMG and shottys and i can confirm their a pain in the *, but they dont need to be nerfed because well its a shotgun and HMG it should be able to tear your face off. however i would like a specialized armor module that gives no HP boost, but instead gives increased protection from small bullets(like those fired from the mentioned guns) something along 5 10 to 15% for each tier would be a simple way to give people a counter to those guns. before you say yadyad about them not being OPed and all i know ok i know, this is not nerf this is a simple module that would take away a slot and CPU/PG to give you a small boost to defense against these weapons. the reward would be having increased survivability against HMG, SMG, and Shottys only**, the risk is running around with out what ever module you sacrificed to have this flak vest( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flak_jacket ) allow players to spec into dealing with these titan just like those players spec into dealing with regular infantry
Ops Fox ZionTCD Legacy Rising 197	Posted - 2012.10.28 05:42:00 - [2] - Quote simple way to get more surviabilty out of a suit if you know your going up agianst them
Cross Atu Conspiratus Immortalis 775	Posted - 2012.10.28 06:36:00 - [3] - Quote As a primary SMG user this makes me sad. That being said I actually think it's a good idea :) (I just don't want to die more lol) the more specific customization and adaptability we have available to us the more rich our overall playing experience will be. On a related note I hope to see more suggestions like this here in feedback, more diversity and role specialization and less nerf/qq. Cheers, Cross
Vickers S Grunt Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 67	Posted - 2012.10.28 10:30:00 - [4] - Quote Use range. Spec in to laser rifle . Train good grenades . Heavy with HMG should always face stomp at close range .
Vexen Krios Doomheim 95	Posted - 2012.10.28 12:20:00 - [5] - Quote Vickers S Grunt wrote: Use range. Spec in to laser rifle . Train good grenades . Heavy with HMG should always face stomp at close range . exactly, i agree except with the laser rifles. laser rifles should have decent range...not the range they have not. that is totally ridiculous. bullets from assault rifles smg and hmgs and even sniper rifles should fall at a certain distance. The laser rifles should act more like a beam of a head light or flashlight it becomes less effective at longer ranges due to dissipation. A laser is nothing more than a damaging ray of light so why should it have nearly unlimited range? I've been hit by them from across maps. Also the HMG has exceptional range. I've been shooting at heavies and been just barely out of range with my AR and they still rip me apart. Course my AR sharpshooter is only lvl2.
Vickers S Grunt Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 67	Posted - 2012.10.28 12:52:00 - [6] - Quote Vexen Krios wrote: Vickers S Grunt wrote: Use range. Spec in to laser rifle . Train good grenades . Heavy with HMG should always face stomp at close range . exactly, i agree except with the laser rifles. laser rifles should have decent range...not the range they have not. that is totally ridiculous. bullets from assault rifles smg and hmgs and even sniper rifles should fall at a certain distance. The laser rifles should act more like a beam of a head light or flashlight it becomes less effective at longer ranges due to dissipation. A laser is nothing more than a damaging ray of light so why should it have nearly unlimited range? I've been hit by them from across maps. Also the HMG has exceptional range. I've been shooting at heavies and been just barely out of range with my AR and they still rip me apart. Course my AR sharpshooter is only lvl2. Sorry but u are wrong here laser rifle has virtually same range as AR some AR even have much grater range take a look at this post for the info which i can verify from first hand experience. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=40886&find=unread The laser rife has best damage at range because that is where CCP have decided for balance reasons it should do best damage and i agree with them . If u need a fluff reason for this maby the beam is not calibrated to achieve full focus untill a certain range .
Vexen Krios Doomheim 95	Posted - 2012.10.28 13:23:00 - [7] - Quote im not downing those who use the laser rifles, im pretty much neutral as far as any buffing or nerfing goes. i could really care less. I go based on the simple fact of if they are trying to implement real life physics and controls for dropships and vehicles along with some weather and sun glares then they should also throw in the realism of weaponry. Laser rifles dissipate at long ranges. there is not a capacitor anywheres that would allow that kind of range and do more damage over time...doesn't make sense. thats like saying a snipers bullet should gain velocity as it travels through air and against friction.... i dont honestly care either way i was just sayin. EDIT: just looked at that thread. and all id does is confirm my own thoughts. You can change between the gek38, the killswitch and the blindfire. The thread says the range is different but lets be honest. since when had CCP had the specific stats actually state fact. I have gone frome the assault rifle to the Gek and back and do no different damage. Enemies fall just as quickly or just as slowly if its a heavy....until final release. specific stats mean nothing to me at this point. My opinion is that they have the stats and specs just for informational purposes just to fill blanks more or less. and dont actually reflect the numbers on the battlefield.
Chunky Munkey Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 285	Posted - 2012.10.28 18:28:00 - [8] - Quote The original poster's suggestion is well meaning, but just pointlessly complicates things. There are counters to these weapons already. People just need a few days to figure out & effectively implement them. As a dedicated heavy, I have to point out just how gutted I am whenever I hear the whirr of nova knives at my back.
Ten-Sidhe Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 414	Posted - 2012.10.28 19:05:00 - [9] - Quote The idea is good I think, basicly a EvE style hardener. In EvE they reduce damage from one damage type, or a little from all. Having infantry armour and shield hardeners in all 5 types would be nice and allow more builds. Lasers of weapon grade would have fairly short range in atmosphere, better in space. I think they need a little more. quote from sci-fi weapons site where they discuss physics of laser weapons "You also need to focus the energy on the target, with a spot size of a millimeter or less. With a laser, that gets kind of tricky. A 5-centimeter mirror, about the largest you can really imagine on a pistol, gives an effective range of perhaps sixty meters, beyond which the weapon starts losing penetration quite rapidly" Liquid salt batteries increase output at high temp, but will destroy themselves if they get to hot. Perhaps Amarr has a liquid salt capacitor technology that doesn't exist in real life(impossible or yet to be discovered, we don't know if it would be possible in real life yet), it would replicate the in game effect.
WHz DS9899 Doomheim 136	Posted - 2012.10.28 19:35:00 - [10] - Quote Vickers S Grunt wrote: Vexen Krios wrote: Vickers S Grunt wrote: Use range. Spec in to laser rifle . Train good grenades . Heavy with HMG should always face stomp at close range . exactly, i agree except with the laser rifles. laser rifles should have decent range...not the range they have not. that is totally ridiculous. bullets from assault rifles smg and hmgs and even sniper rifles should fall at a certain distance. The laser rifles should act more like a beam of a head light or flashlight it becomes less effective at longer ranges due to dissipation. A laser is nothing more than a damaging ray of light so why should it have nearly unlimited range? I've been hit by them from across maps. Also the HMG has exceptional range. I've been shooting at heavies and been just barely out of range with my AR and they still rip me apart. Course my AR sharpshooter is only lvl2. Sorry but u are wrong here laser rifle has virtually same range as AR some AR even have much grater range take a look at this post for the info which i can verify from first hand experience. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=40886&find=unread The laser rife has best damage at range because that is where CCP have decided for balance reasons it should do best damage and i agree with them . If u need a fluff reason for this maby the beam is not calibrated to achieve full focus untill a certain range . actually, all AR's have more range than all AR's...

Ops Fox ZionTCD Legacy Rising 197	Posted - 2012.10.28 19:37:00 - [11] - Quote so Eve has armor hardeners agianst damage types i jsut asking for them to be geared towrads specific bullet types and let shield hardeners spec against damage types. well i already threw all my grenades and range wasnt reasonable sense he was hiding behind cover and mow down teammates, so i walked over there and unloaded my clip into the back of his head, and died however there was a respawn near by so i came back in with my high damage build and once agian put a clip into him, hes tilled turned around and mowed my face off, but he had 2% health left which made me mad becuase if i had 1 sec longer i could have gotten him. this is a simple way for people to make fitting choice based off what they are going agianst the flak armor is worthless against everything else so it would only be worthwhile if you knew you were going up agianst hmg, smg or shottys. i had already used my stock of grenades and range wasnt an option so i had to engage him but i did go at him from behind and he still managed to get me, since i had a change to change fits to something more able to deal with him but theres not a fit that can be geared towards dealing with them this module would allow people to spec into dealing with CQC gear. it would also add to the strategy of the game more like rock paper sicors, AP assault < AP heavy < A-CQC assault < AP assault thats not complexe thats pretty simple.
Scheneighnay McBob Bojo's School of the Trades 1062	Posted - 2012.10.28 20:45:00 - [12] - Quote The problem with that is that they aren't the same weapon type- HMGs and SMGs are projectile weapons (slightly less effective against shields, normal damage against armor), while shotguns are hybrid weapons (equal damage against everything)
Ops Fox ZionTCD Legacy Rising 197	Posted - 2012.10.30 14:50:00 - [13] - Quote Well this kind of armor would be geared towards low damage bullets like smg hmg and shotty pellets once the damage exceeds a threashold the flak is just dead weight. Be pretty good way to deal with shotty and hmgs because yes it gives you those few second of survival but would be dead weight agianst everything else
Ops Fox ZionTCD Legacy Rising 197	Posted - 2012.11.03 04:44:00 - [14] - Quote Just went a match with nothing but heavys having a flak vest agianst the smaller projectiles of thier weapons would have been useful
Ordo Malachai Bragian Order Amarr Empire 21	Posted - 2012.11.03 06:38:00 - [15] - Quote Ops Fox wrote: so Eve has armor hardeners agianst damage types i jsut asking for them to be geared towrads specific bullet types and let shield hardeners spec against damage types. well i already threw all my grenades and range wasnt reasonable sense he was hiding behind cover and mow down teammates, so i walked over there and unloaded my clip into the back of his head, and died however there was a respawn near by so i came back in with my high damage build and once agian put a clip into him, hes tilled turned around and mowed my face off, but he had 2% health left which made me mad becuase if i had 1 sec longer i could have gotten him. this is a simple way for people to make fitting choice based off what they are going agianst the flak armor is worthless against everything else so it would only be worthwhile if you knew you were going up agianst hmg, smg or shottys. i had already used my stock of grenades and range wasnt an option so i had to engage him but i did go at him from behind and he still managed to get me, since i had a change to change fits to something more able to deal with him but theres not a fit that can be geared towards dealing with them this module would allow people to spec into dealing with CQC gear. it would also add to the strategy of the game more like rock paper sicors, AP assault < AP heavy < A-CQC assault < AP assault thats not complexe thats pretty simple. So you are running between cover and being shot at by two guys, one with a .308 and the other a .223. Can your armour tell the difference? No. They are both composed of exactly the same materials. Likewise in DUST, various weapons perform different functions but have the same composition i.e. Plasma/Laser/Rail/Projectile weapons. To try and say, for example, two different Rail Technology based weapons can have different counters based on how much damage they do and from what range is simply ridiculous. Just stick with hardeners that work against Kin/Therm/Expl/Emp. No reality distortion field is needed. You decide what you want to protect against i.e. facing Minnie troops so take Expl resistance hardeners. Get it wrong and pay the price.
Jason Pearson Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 742	Posted - 2012.11.03 11:08:00 - [16] - Quote I feel the OP must learn to use cover and outrange his opponent. Don't charge a heavy head on, outrange him. Heavies have a bad turn speed and bad range for HMGs. Shotguns are primarily used by scouts and they also have terrible range. Keep them at a distance and you'll kill them off.
arimal lavaren L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 186	Posted - 2012.11.03 13:25:00 - [17] - Quote Flux grenades and a mass driver are quickly becoming a favorite of mine for dealing with this kind of situation.
Ops Fox ZionTCD Legacy Rising 197	Posted - 2012.11.03 20:14:00 - [18] - Quote so how do I get range in a more urban enviorment where CQC rull? This would do much just add 5% more resistance
Scheneighnay McBob Bojo's School of the Trades 1062	Posted - 2012.11.03 20:21:00 - [19] - Quote Ops Fox wrote: so how do I get range in a more urban enviorment where CQC rull? This would do much just add 5% more resistance Climb up buildings, get your grenade on, practice using sidearms (particularly scramblers), etc.
Ops Fox ZionTCD Legacy Rising 197	Posted - 2012.11.04 01:30:00 - [20] - Quote When you run into heavies you usally dont have time to get ontop of a building, grenades are at thier worst in urban enviroments and this would bemefit you if you were using your side arm



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