DUST Search - Explain what EXACTLY is wrong with the "Gunplay" that makes Dust so te...

Aighun wrote:

As a non FPS aficionado the thing that I find the most frustrating about the gunplay is waiting for the game to catch up. It feels like there is a total lack of moment to moment gameplay.

Even though my reflexes are slow, the game is slower still. From turn and strafe speed, to throwing a grenade, to switching out weapons, to transitions between sprint and crouching, strafing and sprinting. This to me is a terrible thing on a multiplayer console shooting game because it almost totally negates the possibility of the player reacting to what is going on around them at the speed at which they can push buttons and move the sticks on the controller. So that hand eye coordination aspect of gaming, in this case gunplay, that has been a part of games since at least pong, or missile command, is noticeably absent from moment to moment "gunplay" where you are shooting at stuff and trying to avoid getting shot in return.

It feels more like I am playing a turn based strategy game, or RPG, or something like a Final Fantasy game, where you get your character into position, then the character or the player's fighting forces execute the attacks they are capable of with the gear they have equipped with minimal further input from the player.

This does make for great strategic gaming, but it is almost to the point where you can't even play as just a dude or lady that wants to jump into a game and shoot some stuff and blow some stuff up. It isn't that the game is better when playing as a team, it is almost not possible to play any other way. Your squad's position on the map relative to the enemy, the balance of gear between the members of a squad and a team, are now almost the entire focus of the game.

So I don't feel that like an individual merc, immersed in a war, where my own unique fighting skills actually matter on the battle field, moment to moment. That visceral and palpably physical connection to the game, where every second counts, where every nudge of the controller is meaningful, is not really there in this build.

Or, to put it succinctly, the game is too slow.

The good thing about this build is that so far it feels the most solid and balanced. And the strategic and abstract gameplay is very close to being balanced with the moment to moment physical gunplay. As others have said, if the speed of the game gets turned up a notch, across the board, without changing the speed of any one portion of the game relative to any other, that would be a huge improvement.


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Tony Calif Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 2002	Posted - 2012.10.05 22:30:00 - [1] - Quote My opinion? This build technically very little. Big +1 for CCP on that account. But.. Crimson mentioned we now have high health, low movement speed. Ignatious explained the reason movement sucks, because it's been flattened like the suit HP. It's probably to do with the mass they gave our clones :D Just needs some tweaking. The other major problem is the lack of recoil on even the militia AR. This means anyone with aiming abilities can just shoot your face at 50-100 yards, and put 20 rounds there before you can strafe/run. Similar story with reduced recoil sniper rifle. It's reduced the game to a camping fest. People can farm spawns very easily currently, because they can just sit 50 yards away and own you with recoil free weapons. The damage the laser does compared to the AR is a good example of what a recoil free weapon should be in my opinion. Less skill so less damage. It's just too easy to Alpha strike currently. No-one has said Dust is a CoD clone until this build. It's the combination of these factors which has turned the gameplay around. It's more the fact movement and recoil were better last build. If we had moved from E3 to Precursor, I think there would be far less complaints. But Precursor had so so much going for it's gunplay. It's the contrast between the 2.
Tony Calif Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 2002	Posted - 2012.10.06 14:23:00 - [2] - Quote Quote: Leave the strafe as it is now, this is NOT HALO, or COD, or QUAKE, or friggin DOOM 3!! Some very successful games there. You left out unreal, tribes and borderlands.
Tony Calif Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 2002	Posted - 2012.10.06 16:00:00 - [3] - Quote Steer clear of MAG gunplay simply because headshots were worked out locally, while body shots were worked out server side. Next time you get SUPERLAG while MAGing, shoot the frozen players in the head. You'll come back to a great deal of kills. MAG's game play was great, but it had some major exploitable things. It's not a problem under normal gameplay conditions, only when latency rears it's ugly head.
Tony Calif Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 2002	Posted - 2012.10.06 16:37:00 - [4] - Quote Aighun wrote: As a non FPS aficionado the thing that I find the most frustrating about the gunplay is waiting for the game to catch up. It feels like there is a total lack of moment to moment gameplay. Even though my reflexes are slow, the game is slower still. From turn and strafe speed, to throwing a grenade, to switching out weapons, to transitions between sprint and crouching, strafing and sprinting. This to me is a terrible thing on a multiplayer console shooting game because it almost totally negates the possibility of the player reacting to what is going on around them at the speed at which they can push buttons and move the sticks on the controller. So that hand eye coordination aspect of gaming, in this case gunplay, that has been a part of games since at least pong, or missile command, is noticeably absent from moment to moment "gunplay" where you are shooting at stuff and trying to avoid getting shot in return. It feels more like I am playing a turn based strategy game, or RPG, or something like a Final Fantasy game, where you get your character into position, then the character or the player's fighting forces execute the attacks they are capable of with the gear they have equipped with minimal further input from the player. This does make for great strategic gaming, but it is almost to the point where you can't even play as just a dude or lady that wants to jump into a game and shoot some stuff and blow some stuff up. It isn't that the game is better when playing as a team, it is almost not possible to play any other way. Your squad's position on the map relative to the enemy, the balance of gear between the members of a squad and a team, are now almost the entire focus of the game. So I don't feel that like an individual merc, immersed in a war, where my own unique fighting skills actually matter on the battle field, moment to moment. That visceral and palpably physical connection to the game, where every second counts, where every nudge of the controller is meaningful, is not really there in this build. Or, to put it succinctly, the game is too slow. The good thing about this build is that so far it feels the most solid and balanced. And the strategic and abstract gameplay is very close to being balanced with the moment to moment physical gunplay. As others have said, if the speed of the game gets turned up a notch, across the board, without changing the speed of any one portion of the game relative to any other, that would be a huge improvement. +100 Best post since Codex was released. I appreciate you saying you aren't an FPS aficionado too. Puts perspective on how huge the changes are.