DUST Search - Too much depth and complexity? Dust 514's biggest failing.

Beast Beastlington wrote:

Ieukoplast wrote:

I dunno, as it stands now, I can't imagine the masses adopting to this game very well. There is just too much complexity and complications, most people simply want to relax and have fun when playing online... not to eat, sleep, and breath a game 24 hours a day 7 days a week in order to make even the slightest bit of progress.

I'm sure we all think similarly of the COD games, but we cannot deny the success of such games. A COD game is simple, relatively easy for newcomers to learn, yet deep and complex enough to give dedicated players something to work at and strive for if they feel the need. Gameplay is consistent, and controls are rock-solid and reliable.

Dust 514 just doesn't come off as the type of game that an average-Joe player is going to pick up on and keep playing. I am pretty dedicated when it comes to complex/deep games, I always love a good RPG! But Dust 514 is laying it on a bit thick. You spend 1-2 weeks trying to upgrade one single skill to get that favorite something you have been looking forward to, only to find out that when you do get the 2 million SP to finally upgrade, that now you have 20 other things that need to be specialized, purchased and upgraded in order to successfully put that skill to use.

Here is an example. I wanted to get slightly better shields, so I worked my butt off using nothing but militia gear (starter kits) to get all the proper SP and skills to obtain a shield extender that simply gives me 66 extra HP. Well, turns out that I can't just use that shield extender with a starter kit (not enough PG), so I now have to buy a dropsuit, and equip that dropsuit with purchased weapons/ability's, that I previously GOT FOR FREE. Now each time I die, I have to spend something like 60,000 ISK, all for a measly 66HP extra to my shields, which essentially amounts to nothing. (which is actually only 44 extra HP cause I already had +22HP militia shields). Seriously???

Developers need to learn from the COD platform and improve, not try to reinvent the wheel. If i want to upgrade my skills so I can have a shield that gives me 66 extra HP, I should be able to do that without having to buy a whole new dropsuit, and a plethora of weapons and additional skills in order to use thus new shield upgrade. Quite simply, I should be able to add that new shield to my starter kit layout, and only have to pay for the replacement of that shield. As it stands now, i have to buy a new dropsuit, buy all my weapons, grenades, and anything else that I previously got for free just so I can use one single shield upgrade that is nearly useless and took me 1-2 weeks to acquire.

Bottom line is, this game needs a LOT more permanent blueprints and more starter-kit dropuits that can be upgraded. Having to constantly buy every weapon and every item we use for each time we spawn is horribly inconvenient and annoying. That is not how you do upgrades in a FPS online game.

Couldn't have put it better myself.

People on this forum want the game to be an exclusive club that only they get to play and dominate. Sorry, but it doesn't work this way. F2P games need a big player base that are willing to purchase items and vanity goods to pay for the service and ensure the creators make a profit. Also, to suggest that Dust couldn't learn anything from CoD is madness. People like to deride CoD because it's popular but the simple fact is, it's got the gameplay nailed. It's smooth, takes about 2 mins to get into a game, has fluid, fun gameplay and has the carrot-on-the-stick factor of chasing new equipment down to a fine art. The core gameplay of Dust is no more complicated than any other FPS out there. You point your virtual gun at other people, capture objectives and so on and so forth.

Dust and CoD can be very different, there's nothing wrong with having alot of depth (or alot of skills to sink into). There's also nothing wrong with having a game you can casually sink 20 mins into.

The only thing that troubles me about Dust is how it will manage to cater for newcomers. In every other FPS, newcomers are at no disadvantage, all weapons are pretty much equal. In Dust we have these higher level shields, drop suits, more accurate weapons, players with SP invested into skills etc.

I think this will have to be balanced on release otherwise a large portion of people will be turned off.


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Mavado V Noriega SyNergy Gaming 2283	Posted - 2012.09.18 22:55:00 - [1] - Quote Beast Beastlington wrote: Ieukoplast wrote: I dunno, as it stands now, I can't imagine the masses adopting to this game very well. There is just too much complexity and complications, most people simply want to relax and have fun when playing online... not to eat, sleep, and breath a game 24 hours a day 7 days a week in order to make even the slightest bit of progress. I'm sure we all think similarly of the COD games, but we cannot deny the success of such games. A COD game is simple, relatively easy for newcomers to learn, yet deep and complex enough to give dedicated players something to work at and strive for if they feel the need. Gameplay is consistent, and controls are rock-solid and reliable. Dust 514 just doesn't come off as the type of game that an average-Joe player is going to pick up on and keep playing. I am pretty dedicated when it comes to complex/deep games, I always love a good RPG! But Dust 514 is laying it on a bit thick. You spend 1-2 weeks trying to upgrade one single skill to get that favorite something you have been looking forward to, only to find out that when you do get the 2 million SP to finally upgrade, that now you have 20 other things that need to be specialized, purchased and upgraded in order to successfully put that skill to use. Here is an example. I wanted to get slightly better shields, so I worked my butt off using nothing but militia gear (starter kits) to get all the proper SP and skills to obtain a shield extender that simply gives me 66 extra HP. Well, turns out that I can't just use that shield extender with a starter kit (not enough PG), so I now have to buy a dropsuit, and equip that dropsuit with purchased weapons/ability's, that I previously GOT FOR FREE. Now each time I die, I have to spend something like 60,000 ISK, all for a measly 66HP extra to my shields, which essentially amounts to nothing. (which is actually only 44 extra HP cause I already had +22HP militia shields). Seriously??? Developers need to learn from the COD platform and improve, not try to reinvent the wheel. If i want to upgrade my skills so I can have a shield that gives me 66 extra HP, I should be able to do that without having to buy a whole new dropsuit, and a plethora of weapons and additional skills in order to use thus new shield upgrade. Quite simply, I should be able to add that new shield to my starter kit layout, and only have to pay for the replacement of that shield. As it stands now, i have to buy a new dropsuit, buy all my weapons, grenades, and anything else that I previously got for free just so I can use one single shield upgrade that is nearly useless and took me 1-2 weeks to acquire. Bottom line is, this game needs a LOT more permanent blueprints and more starter-kit dropuits that can be upgraded. Having to constantly buy every weapon and every item we use for each time we spawn is horribly inconvenient and annoying. That is not how you do upgrades in a FPS online game. Couldn't have put it better myself. People on this forum want the game to be an exclusive club that only they get to play and dominate. Sorry, but it doesn't work this way. F2P games need a big player base that are willing to purchase items and vanity goods to pay for the service and ensure the creators make a profit. Also, to suggest that Dust couldn't learn anything from CoD is madness. People like to deride CoD because it's popular but the simple fact is, it's got the gameplay nailed. It's smooth, takes about 2 mins to get into a game, has fluid, fun gameplay and has the carrot-on-the-stick factor of chasing new equipment down to a fine art. The core gameplay of Dust is no more complicated than any other FPS out there. You point your virtual gun at other people, capture objectives and so on and so forth. Dust and CoD can be very different, there's nothing wrong with having alot of depth (or alot of skills to sink into). There's also nothing wrong with having a game you can casually sink 20 mins into. The only thing that troubles me about Dust is how it will manage to cater for newcomers. In every other FPS, newcomers are at no disadvantage, all weapons are pretty much equal. In Dust we have these higher level shields, drop suits, more accurate weapons, players with SP invested into skills etc. I think this will have to be balanced on release otherwise a large portion of people will be turned off. its already balanced. dropsuits got a more normalized HP u only get a slight advantage with upper tier suits the guns are no different tbh, i can kill just fine with standard guns that im still using and im a 11mill char before it was a problem for newbies to kill proto gear with starter stuff cuz proto gods had like 700HP to their like 300 lol