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Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 02:09:00 - [1] - Quote Sleepy Zan wrote: Vexen86 wrote: ok, i may have read that wrong but your saying that you went x-0 but yet your complaining because its OP? I dont see anyone complaining that they are OP cuz they get a good k/d ratio. I switch back and forth between all dropsuits and usually manage to get at least five kills minimum. Snipers aren't OP, if you think about it Military Snipers are trained to one shot. If CCP is going to mimic real physics for the dropships then the Snipers are where they should be. Realisticly.....As far as tanks go they seem to be fair now. they were pretty strong last build but its leveled out now. not too hard to kill but not too easy neither. a good tank with a bunch of SP put into it will still decimate. I was in a militia tank and still got 6 kills before someone killed it. So somone has already said it...... Snipers are annoying, at best. Hard to get too but easy to kill. Skilled snipers are a little more difficult but still lack the shields and armor. If your getting killed as a sniper, throw your sniper rifle on a Frontline Assault. I just went 34/0 the match before a came back to these forums because all I had to do is quickscope everyone who came up the hill after me, they are OP. I just went 20-3 with an AR. Nerf 'em. Before that I went 17-2 with a shotty. Nerf 'em. Before that I went 19-4 with a forge gun. Nerf 'em. Let's just nerf everything because (I count, what, 6 people on this thread who are against?) because 6 people don't like them. Maybe it's 7. Yeah, that seems right. Let's do what 7 people (out of 1000?) want to do. Brilliant. Its hilarious, because we have all these nerf threads, but they're usually the same 7 or 8 people within the respective thread complaining. Get over yourselves. Yes, there are areas of the game that require less skill than others. Deal with it. Stop whining. I kill snipers all the time with an AR. I kill snipers with a sniper rifle. It's not that hard. How many people are actually getting killed by a sniper while they're playing an assault? If you are, you're doing it wrong.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 04:24:00 - [2] - Quote Sleepy Zan wrote: Cross Atu wrote: *FAR* too many threads where folks at the top of the game (in whatever area) show up and post as if they somehow represent a proper balance point. If you are a top ranked player you are not average and AVERAGE is where proper balance needs to focus. Things are only broken or imbalanced if anyone can pick it up and do better than the game wide average of other classes/methods. Or put another way something is OP'ed when the AVERAGE player can use it to dominate outside of it's proper battlefield role. If you're a sniper and you're completely pro going 50-0, and there's a total first month noob who's a sniper going 0-50 the KDR for the class (not the player, the player doesn't matter) is 1:1 Now obviously that's a simplistic example but the point remains that it is the GAME WIDE average which counts not the specific experiences or performance of any handful of players. Posting feedback on your experiences, especially with the details explaining why is of value in a beta. Posting conclusions regarding balance with such an infinitesimal piece of the data... well that's, shall we say, less useful. My 0.02 ISK Cross ps ~ you can't be said to have "only two levels" of skills related to sniping if you've picked up any of the more general crossover skills such as Weaponry, or any of the other broad skills that apply to sniping. You've gained ranks towards the your effective use of a given battlefield role for every skill rank of any kind that applies (i.e. is active/having an effect) to that role (whatever it may be) not just for those skills which happen to contain the name of that role in their title. I'm sorry for not clarifying, but all I want to see is more sway in snipers while standing and return a small amount of sway between each shot. Also I would like to see bullet drop and actually adding time between the sniper firing and hitting the target (which [CCP] nothin has mentioned in irc may possibly be added in the future ). I do understand that there are a range of skill weapons but I'd like to point out that it didn't take long for me to get to were I am. If I can do it anyone can I just don't want to see this game turned into a quickscope fest is all. I guarantee the vast majority of people can't quick scope. Why? Because of sway. You may be able to, but I would categorize you as a good player. Just because you don't play as a sniper doesn't mean you're not naturally talented at gaming. Whether it's a sniper rifle or an AR, shooting is still shooting. For every Sleepy Zan who comes on here to say it's too easy, I guarantee there are another 2 or 3 people who think it's too difficult. I've talked to some. Heck, I'm not that good at it. I don't think it's easy at all. I think sniping is much tougher than using an AR. The point is, just because YOU think it's easier, doesn't mean it actually is for all the other players. That would be like asking Ray Allen if shooting from 3 is too easy. He might say, "yeah, it's too easy. We should move the 3 point line back. I shoot 45%." Obviously that would be ridiculous. Just because you started playing with a sniper rifle two hours ago but have since mastered it, still doesn't mean it's easy. What it means is that it's easy for YOU. Don't make the mistake of thinking everyone plays like you, or has the same abilities as you. Reducing damage for the sniper rifle would completely remove its use in the game. I understand that a lot of people want this to be a game where Assault guys with AR's kill other Assault guys with AR's. But that's boring. It's vanilla. Sniper rifles kill people. So do AR's. It's fine. The only reason you guys want it nerfed is because you won't be using them come launch. It's kind of sad, really. You're just trying to influence CCP so that you're set up to win/be the best/etc. Let the snipers be. Let the tank drivers be. Let the RE guys be. Just play the game and figure out how to win. Stop complaining. I almost NEVER get hit by a sniper when playing an assault or heavy. Really not that difficult.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 04:43:00 - [3] - Quote STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Let re Guy's be? You new to this game right? Haha. I like it. Out of my entire rant, the only comeback you could make was about RE's. Love it. Yes, RE's were OP. I was making a point that people complain too much. Even the dreaded RE's can be countered, and I did it all the time. People are lazy and don't want to think through how something can be countered. Instead, they ask for a nerf. I've been here since E3. If that makes me new, then yes, I'm new.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 04:57:00 - [4] - Quote Jin Robot wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Jin Robot wrote: I agree with the sway being a little light between shots, sniper proficiency II makes the sway minor. It should not be minor until V. As far as tactics against snipers, well there are counter snipers. Also almost every time I get confronted by an AR my paper armor shreds, how about two AR = dead sniper. I like sniper class and will use it even though heads up I am few most times. The reason its worth it is I get range and power instead. I took this thread as a thread asking for snipers to get nothing to balance the deficits they have. Assault rifles rip through me like I am nothing. I would not want to be a sniper if CCP turned my gun into a low rof long range AR, and I dont think many others would either. I dont really see a need for a nerf. If the kills in this game were sorted, tanks and AR would be at the top, not snipers. Really guys its not even that bad. I did just go 12-0, but you know why? Not an op gun. It was because nobody bothered to look up. If they would have done anything at all to counter, it would have been different. Kills tanks and ars but kdrs snipers and shotties Ps nice tricking waiting to post again but I'm an insomniac so you not outlasting me Challenge accepted. Also tanks are tops in K/D, going 25+/0 will do that. And I dont want to talk about shotties, I geuss they have a place in fps but I have always thought them to be cheap, no aim win flingers. They really bugged me in MGO. Maybe I should start a thread about nerfing them... Just kidding please nobody start a nerf shottie thread. Jim, I like the way you think.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 05:06:00 - [5] - Quote STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Jin Robot wrote: You guys want to see how easy it is to hipfire a sniper rifle. Go get yourself chased by a leveled up AR being used by a even just semi-skilled person and try it, after you respawn come back here and fill us in I did and shot him through the sway at less than 20m While using a sniper, I've tried hipshooting guys, and I've done it once out of maybe 20 tries. It's nearly impossible. You are a gaming god if you can do it consistently. If you're in a scout suit, you're dead from an AR before you can get a second shot off from the hip (because let's be honest, no one is going to hipfire and get the first one). Nope. Calling BS on that one.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 05:09:00 - [6] - Quote STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Zan didn't mean hipfire by quickscope, just pressing aim and shooting at the sane time Yes, but with the sway it's very difficult to do. You really can't quick scope in this game.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 05:10:00 - [7] - Quote I like you, Vermaak. This is fun.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 05:13:00 - [8] - Quote STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Chew B0CCA wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Zan didn't mean hipfire by quickscope, just pressing aim and shooting at the sane time Yes, but with the sway it's very difficult to do. You really can't quick scope in this game. Difficult but not impossible It's nearly impossible, which means 98% of the snipers who are playing can't do it. And what does that tells us? That it's not a problem. Game. Set. Match.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 05:18:00 - [9] - Quote STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Chew B0CCA wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Chew B0CCA wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Zan didn't mean hipfire by quickscope, just pressing aim and shooting at the sane time Yes, but with the sway it's very difficult to do. You really can't quick scope in this game. Difficult but not impossible It's nearly impossible, which means 98% of the snipers who are playing can't do it. And what does that tells us? That it's not a problem. Game. Set. Match. Nearly impossible would mean closer to a third being that most would try to learn to do it so this isn't over yet Maybe. I seriously doubt it, but maybe. But as of right this instant, quick scoping is a non-issue. I think we can both agree on that.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 05:20:00 - [10] - Quote STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Chew B0CCA wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Chew B0CCA wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Zan didn't mean hipfire by quickscope, just pressing aim and shooting at the sane time Yes, but with the sway it's very difficult to do. You really can't quick scope in this game. Difficult but not impossible It's nearly impossible, which means 98% of the snipers who are playing can't do it. And what does that tells us? That it's not a problem. Game. Set. Match. Nearly impossible would mean closer to a third being that most would try to learn to do it so this isn't over yet And by the way, I enjoy sneaking up on snipers. Most of the time they try to hip fire or quick scope me. 9 times out of 10 I kill them with my sub. So, no, I don't think it's a third.

Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 05:22:00 - [11] - Quote One more point before I go to bed. To people complaining about a lot of snipers on the diagonal rock map: That map is VERY sniper friendly. Those rocks jutting out that people love to climb. Of course you'll see a lot of snipers there. But if you play one of the maps where everything is contained or inside a building for the most part, you see hardly any snipers. And the ones who are sniping end up with 2 kills and 3 deaths. Don't blame a class or weapon for things that the map dictates.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 05:23:00 - [12] - Quote Sleepy Zan wrote: Jin Robot wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Jin Robot wrote: I agree with the sway being a little light between shots, sniper proficiency II makes the sway minor. It should not be minor until V. As far as tactics against snipers, well there are counter snipers. Also almost every time I get confronted by an AR my paper armor shreds, how about two AR = dead sniper. I like sniper class and will use it even though heads up I am few most times. The reason its worth it is I get range and power instead. I took this thread as a thread asking for snipers to get nothing to balance the deficits they have. Assault rifles rip through me like I am nothing. I would not want to be a sniper if CCP turned my gun into a low rof long range AR, and I dont think many others would either. I dont really see a need for a nerf. If the kills in this game were sorted, tanks and AR would be at the top, not snipers. Really guys its not even that bad. I did just go 12-0, but you know why? Not an op gun. It was because nobody bothered to look up. If they would have done anything at all to counter, it would have been different. Kills tanks and ars but kdrs snipers and shotties Ps nice tricking waiting to post again but I'm an insomniac so you not outlasting me Challenge accepted. Also tanks are tops in K/D, going 25+/0 will do that. And I dont want to talk about shotties, I geuss they have a place in fps but I have always thought them to be cheap, no aim win flingers. They really bugged me in MGO. Maybe I should start a thread about nerfing them... Just kidding please nobody start a nerf shottie thread. Actually not trying to go against you or anything tanks do have the most spots fo the higher KDRs but if you look at the top of the leaderboards the guy with a 50 something KDR is a sniper. Not trying to argue just a fun fact What? Before the tank nerf, it was always a tank guy. That is a fact.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 05:27:00 - [13] - Quote STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Chew B0CCA wrote: One more point before I go to bed. To people complaining about a lot of snipers on the diagonal rock map: That map is VERY sniper friendly. Those rocks jutting out that people love to climb. Of course you'll see a lot of snipers there. But if you play one of the maps where everything is contained or inside a building for the most part, you see hardly any snipers. And the ones who are sniping end up with 2 kills and 3 deaths. Don't blame a class or weapon for things that the map dictates. That's where i went 15 (or so) and 0 and got a close range kill with the rifle You just reinforced my point. The map is sniper friendly. You can't do that on some of the other maps. Some yes, some no. That's balance. You can't base your opinions on one map.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 05:33:00 - [14] - Quote STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Chew B0CCA wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Chew B0CCA wrote: One more point before I go to bed. To people complaining about a lot of snipers on the diagonal rock map: That map is VERY sniper friendly. Those rocks jutting out that people love to climb. Of course you'll see a lot of snipers there. But if you play one of the maps where everything is contained or inside a building for the most part, you see hardly any snipers. And the ones who are sniping end up with 2 kills and 3 deaths. Don't blame a class or weapon for things that the map dictates. That's where i went 15 (or so) and 0 and got a close range kill with the rifle You just reinforced my point. The map is sniper friendly. You can't do that on some of the other maps. Some yes, some no. That's balance. You can't base your opinions on one map. I did similar and beter on other maps as well But again, you're more than likely better than the average player. I can't do that consistently. I see snipers on that map, and at the end of the battle their names are nowhere near the top. All this tells us is that you are OP with a sniper rifle. For that, I say congrats. Not many others are, which is why people complain that snipers don't contribute to the battle. Because they can't do much for objectives.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 05:36:00 - [15] - Quote STB Vermaak Doe wrote: I should snipe in the full game being good "cough MLG PRO cough" Yes, you should.
Chew B0CCA 58	Posted - 2012.09.17 05:40:00 - [16] - Quote Jin Robot wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Jin Robot wrote: STB Vermaak Doe wrote: Chew B0CCA wrote: One more point before I go to bed. To people complaining about a lot of snipers on the diagonal rock map: That map is VERY sniper friendly. Those rocks jutting out that people love to climb. Of course you'll see a lot of snipers there. But if you play one of the maps where everything is contained or inside a building for the most part, you see hardly any snipers. And the ones who are sniping end up with 2 kills and 3 deaths. Don't blame a class or weapon for things that the map dictates. That's where i went 15 (or so) and 0 and got a close range kill with the rifle I used to hate the map that is just that one building. But there is a veeery good sniping spot in that map, not to brag because I am not leet, but I usually end up 10+/0 on that map. Also I didnt know that guy was a sniper, I based my assumption on the fact of seeing so many tanks go 25+/0 in matches I had been in. You though i was a tanker? for awhile before the fix I thought everyone was a tanker. seriously though he was talking about you? I must have been confused because I assumed you ran AR. No, he ran sniper to show people how OP it is. But as we've argued, he would be wrong.